OLD ARGUMENT: Tren GYNO

[PizzaTrenSlin]

So i know it's an old argument but surfing the net i didn't found any clear answer to that problem.

A friend of mine told me that while on just Test/Tren gyno is caused by imbalance between Test Estrogens and Prolactine, that will cause elevated Progesterone, and the GYNO.
Ok ok, but i'm not an endo...

During my last blast after 5 weeks of: 150mg Test 500mg TrenA. Gyno flare up! Tadaaannn! It was March
I was only on 1 adex ew maybe adex was too low... but a friend of mine on 1 adex eod had the same problem with 350mg TrenA and same Test.

Soooo i ordered Letrozole, upped adex to 1 ed and added 1 pill of Raloxifene. My gyno start going back...  It was April

Then Letrozole arrived and i started it at 5mg Letro a week (2 times a week), my gyno start going back even more.. It was May

Then in June i was pretty tired from Tren and diet (i crashed it too fast), so i decided to cruise on 300mg Test and kept letro to "cure" my gyno.
Now i still have 2 little lumps under my nipple but they are not going away.

What i did wrong?

I'm thinking that i should put at least 2,5mg Jumex (Selegiline) ed from the start of cycle.
(Pramipexole destroys my sleep and Dostinex here is impossible to find and don't have a trusted source for it)

I hope that someone more experienced can give me some good tips. Maybe we can even make a sticky on how to avoid or cure that gyno from tren.

P.S. Never had lactation from nipples.

[equipoise]

I found that when using tren or 19nors like deca my nipples are more sensitive to gyno formation. If using test only and no AI I get high estro but no sensitive nipples. But with same dose test, tren and no AI i get gyno

Solution is AI, ralox and prami. Also lower the test dose if your test dose is too high you will get puffy nipples regardless

[Jizmo]

no estrogen, no gyno.
most people claim no estrogen, no high prolactin either but im not too suer about that.
prolactin itself actually makes you lactate but you wont grow hard lumpy breast tissue in the absence of estrogen...
when i first touched tren i started to lactate within a week, i was just on low test 150-200mg a week and 0.25mg adex DAILY (probably completely crashed my e2), still i got lactation within days... i never ever had any lumps whatsoever though, no gyno issues, nothing. just lactation...

i personally think your problem to begin with was not your test dosage but that you used 1 pill of adex once weekly
most people dont need any AI at all for 150mg of test, but if you add tren to that there can be issues.
the half life of arimidex is way too short to use it once weekly, if you had split up the dosage into 0.25mg eod or so you most likely wouldnt have had any issues.
with 1mg once a week you probably simply destroyed your estrogen levels for 3 days and the other 4 days they went high.
add in tren and genetic sensitivity to prolactin/progesterone or e2 and there you have your gyno.

[PizzaTrenSlin]

With 300mg Test have no estrogen related issues.

Next week i will start my new blast Test Tren NPP Mast + 4iu  HGH.
At this point i will run 2,5mg Letrozole once a week and 5mg Jumex EOD.
Raloxifiene is really pricy i can't run it for an entire therapy...

Btw at this point if Trestolone gives only Estrogen related issues, i'm thinking that this will be the only 19-nor that i can run without troubles...

Another solution can be Gyno Surgery but it can cost 5000$...

[PizzaTrenSlin]

no estrogen, no gyno.
most people claim no estrogen, no high prolactin either but im not too suer about that.
prolactin itself actually makes you lactate but you wont grow hard lumpy breast tissue in the absence of estrogen...
when i first touched tren i started to lactate within a week, i was just on low test 150-200mg a week and 0.25mg adex DAILY (probably completely crashed my e2), still i got lactation within days... i never ever had any lumps whatsoever though, no gyno issues, nothing. just lactation...

i personally think your problem to begin with was not your test dosage but that you used 1 pill of adex once weekly
most people dont need any AI at all for 150mg of test, but if you add tren to that there can be issues.
the half life of arimidex is way too short to use it once weekly, if you had split up the dosage into 0.25mg eod or so you most likely wouldnt have had any issues.
with 1mg once a week you probably simply destroyed your estrogen levels for 3 days and the other 4 days they went high.
add in tren and genetic sensitivity to prolactin/progesterone or e2 and there you have your gyno.

For example my friend today phoned me and explained that he was on 1mg ADEX eod, but his nipples are supersensitive (starting of lactation). Mine no...
Another thing, when i take Pramipexole i feel like shit, maybe because the drug is trying to destroy something that doesn't exist at all. My friend instead has better sleep, better recovery, etc etc so i think that the drug is interacting with prolactine for real!

This time like i said i will take 2,5mg Letrozole per week, and jumex eod (jumex does nothing bad to me, i have even more memory when i take it..).
I will run 300mg TEST E 300mg TrenA 300mg NPP 400 Mast E, then i will up the dose of tren and NPP every 6 weeks. (50mg).

I hope that Masteron and HGH will help a bit with TEST sides.

[Jizmo]

For example my friend today phoned me and explained that he was on 1mg ADEX eod, but his nipples are supersensitive (starting of lactation). Mine no...
Another thing, when i take Pramipexole i feel like shit, maybe because the drug is trying to destroy something that doesn't exist at all. My friend instead has better sleep, better recovery, etc etc so i think that the drug is interacting with prolactine for real!

lol thats some epic broscience
pramixpexole interacts with dopamine. its a neurotransmitter.
you cant jump into high doses with the shit right away. you have to ramp up SLOWLY and i mean SLOWLY to how much you wanna use
start with 0.1mg and increase by 0.05mg increments or so if you can... take it an hour or so before bed. most people only "need"  MAX 0.5mg or so a day anyway and thats kinda high already

[VEDMED]

The prami made you feel like shit because a. Ya went too high too fast, or b. Some people just can't handle prami, makes em all kinds of crazy.

And the gyno flare, like jizmo said was probably from the once a week adex, where the hell you get that from? So you crash your estro all the way down, and let it rebound all the way up, just to crash it all the way down again?? Shit, I'd flare too. Its so easy to just blame it on the tren ainnit?

[PizzaTrenSlin]

With Prami at 0.1 had vivid nightmares for 3 weeks...
Once i was sitting on my bed watching my room.. i was seeing It illuminate but was completly dark... other night was seeing a man all Black like a shadow running at me..

On Jumex i feel 10times better.

And yes Adex dose was bad... too low.

I should have started at 1mg eod then up It if had gyno synthoms.
Btw gyno Is still there with 2 little soft nuts... but nothing that i can notice...

I think that before next Blast i will have new blood tests...

[lilhawk1]

Why not just drop the tren?  Are you competing?  You can look fantastic without tren, too many people are hung up on tren.  It's good, but it's not magical, or unicorn like.  You want to look better, up the GH.

[PizzaTrenSlin]

The look that Tren gives Is insane....

What else should i use?
More Test and Masteron and HGH?

[Weedlejuice]

Ime the only thing to cause actual breast tissue growth is estrogen related and comes on during the initial introduction of hormones or dramatic lowering of a heavy dose causing an imblance, very noticeable when using fast acters, hcg and orals pre workout when you're getting big hikes in concentration that then drop off because you arent keeping it stable.

Progestin related gyno seems to be cosmetic only ime and puffyness is not indicative of actual tissue growth its never accompanied by irritation or itching and when i come off any water/puff goes with it.

Eod injects of anything and i dont need ancillaries at all no matter the dose due to blood level stability.

But thats just me, told a guy on tren/test who was fuckig about with nolva and arimidex to just start injecting eod and come off everything and it fixed everything for him.

[pestosterone]

The look that Tren gives Is insane....

What else should i use?
More Test and Masteron and HGH?

You'll have to run double on something else test ,mast, with npp is good to try to mimick the look...I've used that to hold the look from tren after stopping it for a while. Can't comment on GH

[PizzaTrenSlin]

Ime the only thing to cause actual breast tissue growth is estrogen related and comes on during the initial introduction of hormones or dramatic lowering of a heavy dose causing an imblance, very noticeable when using fast acters, hcg and orals pre workout when you're getting big hikes in concentration that then drop off because you arent keeping it stable.

Progestin related gyno seems to be cosmetic only ime and puffyness is not indicative of actual tissue growth its never accompanied by irritation or itching and when i come off any water/puff goes with it.

Eod injects of anything and i dont need ancillaries at all no matter the dose due to blood level stability.

But thats just me, told a guy on tren/test who was fuckig about with nolva and arimidex to just start injecting eod and come off everything and it fixed everything for him.

YES! YES! If i touch the nipple there isn't any tissue on it.
Just the glands were inflamed and a bit hard.
So i think that this is just progesterone issue.

You'll have to run double on something else test ,mast, with npp is good to try to mimick the look...I've used that to hold the look from tren after stopping it for a while. Can't comment on GH

I'll give it last try on Tren with my blast that will start on Monday.

I will run:
Test E: 300mg
Tren A: 300mg
NPP: 300mg
Masteron E: 400mg
(i will up Tren and NPP with time)

1mg Adex ed (then after 8 weeks i will drop it to 0,5ed if i see no gyno synthomps)
5mg Jumex/Deprenyl ed (until i will get my Dostinex, then i'll run it at 1mg Dostinex ew)
T3: 50mg ed
HGH: 8iu HGH ed

I don't think that i really need Letrozole on cycle it's really to HIGH.
With Jumex i will try to have Prolactine at 0, so this gyno won't flare at all!
If i will have problems with Tren i will drop it totally and run Test NPP Mast (will up NPP with time)

[Jizmo]

YES! YES! If i touch the nipple there isn't any tissue on it.
Just the glands were inflamed and a bit hard.
So i think that this is just progesterone issue.

that exactly IS gyno.
hard glands under nipple = gyno. the hard lumps get bigger over time.
puffy looking nipples (NIPPLE, not underneath) = no gyno (just temporary prolactin issues)
progesterone is a whole different thing than estrogen and prolactin and nobody really knows how it interferes. were talking about prolactin here.

[PizzaTrenSlin]

Today is my 4th day on 5mg Jumex/Deprenyl ed.

I'm still on 300mg Test E. I'm much more lean! And my gland inflammation are disappeared completly!!

Gosh i think that my prolactine was really high. Blood test here cost like 1 year of HGH  for the fuck sake...


Anyway now i have understood my errors. NO PROLACTINE CONTROL, too low AI.

Ready to blast! Monday i will start 200 Test 300 Tren 300 NPP 400 Mast. I'm tempted to put 1mg Methyltrienolone ed 2w on 2 off.....
I will start low dose on Tren and NPP then i'll up them don't want to fuck up. i'll raise dose every 6 weeks.

Jizmo what do you think about Methyltrienolone used like that on cycle?

[Jizmo]

no need for MTren if youre already on tren and npp imo, but ive done it (same cycle just higher dosages) and mtren always works wonderful
2mg injectable mtren pre workout is the sweet spot... never used it in oral form, people say 1mg oral is enough...
 used up to 4mg injectable, but 2-3mg is the sweet spot to me... its probably my favorite AAS ever

[PizzaTrenSlin]

For how much time did you use Methyltren? 4 weeks?

I have TUDCA ready to run with it at 250mg.

[Jizmo]

usually only 2-3 weeks to break plateaus...
id use liver regeneration (its not protection) after using orals, not at the same time, but thats just my opinion

[PizzaTrenSlin]

It makes sense usually i use Inositole and Tudca...
First time using Tudca with orals and i can say that on my last Methyltrienolone run (+300mg Test) had no liver issues after 2 weeks.

This time i'll try 3 weeks + TUDCA, with 4 weeks stop.

I think that Methyltrienolone,Anadrol,Winstrol are only oral worth using....

[Mranabolic]

It makes sense usually i use Inositole and Tudca...
First time using Tudca with orals and i can say that on my last Methyltrienolone run (+300mg Test) had no liver issues after 2 weeks.

This time i'll try 3 weeks + TUDCA, with 4 weeks stop.

I think that Methyltrienolone,Anadrol,Winstrol are only oral worth using....

Anadrol is my favorite oral , i will use only this now . I blow up lean , with water in the muscle , it just make me look huge but tight , not bloated

Gone cruise for 6 weeks with test + gh and low carbs to get slin sensivity back , then gone blast test/tren/drol/gh and high carb

I like winie oral too , simply cause i hate water based injects

[Tedim]

i run Mast with tren....0 estr issues

250 tren 100 mast....500 tren 200 mast

[pestosterone]

It makes sense usually i use Inositole and Tudca...
First time using Tudca with orals and i can say that on my last Methyltrienolone run (+300mg Test) had no liver issues after 2 weeks.

This time i'll try 3 weeks + TUDCA, with 4 weeks stop.

I think that Methyltrienolone,Anadrol,Winstrol are only oral worth using....

I think anadrol is probly king of orals for benefits to side effects.

[PizzaTrenSlin]

Anadrol is my favorite oral , i will use only this now . I blow up lean , with water in the muscle , it just make me look huge but tight , not bloated

Gone cruise for 6 weeks with test + gh and low carbs to get slin sensivity back , then gone blast test/tren/drol/gh and high carb

I like winie oral too , simply cause i hate water based injects

Add winnie to Anadrol... friends told me It's insane...

Test Tren Anadrol Winstrol

They were running them all orals..