Author Topic: Jon Jones. How much superior skills vs superior size (Read 11384 times)

pellius · « **on:** July 30, 2017, 12:34:25 AM »

No doubt Jones is a gifted fighter and imo the best the UFC has ever produce. But when he
squared off with Cormier he makes Daniel look like a little boy. Jones just towers over him and
the reach advantage seemed impossible to over come. Cormier got in his licks but Jones just
controlled the fight from the get go.

I remember the trouble Jones had with the Swede who matched his height but I thought maybe it
had more to do with ring rust and personal issues. Jones has taken the skill aspect to another level with moves we haven't seen before but still so much of his success I think has to do with incredible height advantage he has over his opponents.

After Gustafsson what's left for Jones at LHW?

Royalty · « **Reply #1 on:** July 30, 2017, 02:44:12 AM »

Nobody. So Jones will fight Lesnar.

Bevo · « **Reply #2 on:** July 30, 2017, 03:33:16 AM »

U don't think a prime Anderson can beat him?

Slapper · « **Reply #3 on:** July 30, 2017, 04:59:14 AM »

Quote from: pellius on July 30, 2017, 12:34:25 AM

No doubt Jones is a gifted fighter and imo the best the UFC has ever produce. But when he squared off with Cormier he makes Daniel look like a little boy.

He's not that superior of a fighter.

He just happens to be a 6 trick clown in a 1 trick circus.

I still, to this day, think a solid leg game will be his demise.

polychronopolous · « **Reply #4 on:** July 30, 2017, 05:02:17 AM »

Quote from: Slapper on July 30, 2017, 04:59:14 AM

He's not that superior of a fighter.

He just happens to be a 6 trick clown in a 1 trick circus.

I still, to this day, think a solid leg game will be his demise.

Either Gus vs. Jones or Lesnar vs. Jones

Both really intriguing matchups.

Jones really helped his future prospects with that decisive ko victory last night.

oldschoolfan · « **Reply #5 on:** July 30, 2017, 05:02:59 AM »

Quote from: Bevo on July 30, 2017, 03:33:16 AM

U don't think a prime Anderson can beat him?

maybe if he caught him, but i am pretty sure jones would have taken silva down , and kept him there

ratherbebig · « **Reply #6 on:** July 30, 2017, 05:49:57 AM »

jones talked about moving up to heavy weight.

jones dc is just a bad matchup for dc because of jones reach and height advantage.

kinda like how flex lewis would never win against phil heath.

Kwon · « **Reply #7 on:** July 30, 2017, 05:53:44 AM »

Jones with the same skillset but at 5'9" wouldnt be as successful.

His range and reach helps alot.

Slapper · « **Reply #8 on:** July 30, 2017, 05:57:36 AM »

Quote from: Kwon on July 30, 2017, 05:53:44 AM

Jones with the same skillset but at 5'9" wouldnt be as successful.

His range and reach helps alot.

DC closed the range this time around and, until he got caught, was fighting a good fight.

When fighting people like Jones, with so much reach advantage and his annoying proclivity to poke people out, getting his attention to his legs is primordial.

If someone can develop a solid leg game against him, really fuck up his lower legs, I can see him getting knocked the fuck out.

ratherbebig · « **Reply #9 on:** July 30, 2017, 05:57:47 AM »

if there were less money in basketball the ufc would have 20 jon jones. all fighting eachother.

and then there would be a BUF - black ultimate fighting and don king would run it

Slapper · « **Reply #10 on:** July 30, 2017, 06:13:18 AM »

Quote from: ratherbebig on July 30, 2017, 05:57:47 AM

if there were less money in basketball the ufc would have 20 jon jones. all fighting eachother.

and then there would be a BUF - black ultimate fighting and don king would run it

MMA right now is at a cross roads. 30,000-foot view shows we've gone from mainly stand up (early years) to some stand up + some BJJ to mostly BJJ and a little stand up to some wrestling + some bjj + some stand up to now... I have no fucking idea. What I do know is that some of the coaching utterly sucks. I see fighters getting overpowered like amateurs, which tells me that their camp didn't even bother to adapt their fighter's skill set to those of the opponent.

I see Muay Thai becoming more relevant in MMA. People will eventually have to start closing the distance against the likes of Jones or Woodley because the later generate most of their explosiveness from that distance.

Thin Lizzy · « **Reply #11 on:** July 30, 2017, 06:23:01 AM »

He might have a broken jaw. During the post fight show interview, the left side of his face looked pretty swollen and he was having trouble speaking.

ESFitness · « **Reply #12 on:** July 30, 2017, 06:07:21 PM »

Id take frank Mir over Jones at heavy weight.

The heavyweight div has gone to shit because of usada.

Mir's out of The UFC. Brocks not even done with his suspension but he's also not tested until he "unretires" then he'll have like 6months testing after that.

Who's left? Stipe? LoL guys like Rogan I trying to include him as one of the best heavyweights of all time? What a fucking joke. That leaves who? Mark hunt and Overeem?... Of likely take overreen over Jones. But huntnwill getboutclassed skill wise.

Jones has been saying he's focusing more on grappling and jiu-jitsu but I don't see that working with brock, overreem, or stipe.. Or even hunt.

oldtimer1 · « **Reply #13 on:** July 30, 2017, 06:38:12 PM »

Jones is explosively powerful and a master at the martial arts. His brother plays in the NFL so he has good genes for athletics. He is right now the best in MMA pound for pound. He seems to have an answer for anything. On the ground and stand up he is top shelf. Like all MMA fighters they have short shelf lives in this brutal game. His time will come but for right know he is at the top of the mountain.

polychronopolous · « **Reply #14 on:** July 30, 2017, 07:29:18 PM »

Quote from: oldtimer1 on July 30, 2017, 06:38:12 PM

Jones is explosively powerful and a master at the martial arts. His brother plays in the NFL so he has good genes for athletics. He is right now the best in MMA pound for pound. He seems to have an answer for anything. On the ground and stand up he is top shelf. Like all MMA fighters they have short shelf lives in this brutal game. His time will come but for right know he is at the top of the mountain.

Cyborg, DJ, Joanna, Connor > Bones Jones in terms of P4P rankings

TRIX · « **Reply #15 on:** July 30, 2017, 09:25:11 PM »

He has no punching power

AbrahamG · « **Reply #16 on:** July 30, 2017, 09:54:55 PM »

Quote from: Bevo on July 30, 2017, 03:33:16 AM

U don't think a prime Anderson can beat him?

Fuck no. Not even a competitive fight. Anderson was great for his era, but the sport has evolved
and dare I say passed him by. Everything Silva could do, Jones does better. Plus, he's bigger, stronger
and faster.

honest · « **Reply #17 on:** July 31, 2017, 01:06:15 AM »

DC was doing a lot better in this fight than the first before getting caught, I think he could be worthy of a third attempt and should consider it.

Strongmanfan · « **Reply #18 on:** July 31, 2017, 01:27:51 AM »

Quote from: AbrahamG on July 30, 2017, 09:54:55 PM

Fuck no. Not even a competitive fight. Anderson was great for his era, but the sport has evolved
and dare I say passed him by. Everything Silva could do, Jones does better. Plus, he's bigger, stronger
and faster.

The body weight disparity makes a difference too. Anderson could likely do great even today in the middleweight class. But Jones is light-heavyweight.

Funny how average welterweights today could beat the 2002 version of Matt Hughes.

The talent pool is much steeper.

I read that Jones has a 650 deadlift and 350 bench press. That bench press is amazing for a fighter, especially when you consider his reach. His strength is likely part of the advantage he has over other competitors too.

Bevo · « **Reply #19 on:** July 31, 2017, 01:35:38 AM »

Quote from: AbrahamG on July 30, 2017, 09:54:55 PM

Fuck no. Not even a competitive fight. Anderson was great for his era, but the sport has evolved
and dare I say passed him by. Everything Silva could do, Jones does better. Plus, he's bigger, stronger
and faster.

I don't think so, Silvia prime would take him

pellius · « **Reply #20 on:** July 31, 2017, 01:38:37 AM »

Quote from: Strongmanfan on July 31, 2017, 01:27:51 AM

The body weight disparity makes a difference too. Anderson could likely do great even today in the middleweight class. But Jones is light-heavyweight.

Funny how average welterweights today could beat the 2002 version of Matt Hughes.

The talent pool is much steeper.

I read that Jones has a 650 deadlift and 350 bench press. That bench press is amazing for a fighter, especially when you consider his reach. His strength is likely part of the advantage he has over other competitors too.

Even Cormier, a very strong dude, remarked that he was surprised at how strong Jones felt in their first fight. Jones was the only guy that has ever taken Cormier down and he did so several times the first time around.

Strongmanfan · « **Reply #21 on:** July 31, 2017, 01:52:39 AM »

Quote from: pellius on July 31, 2017, 01:38:37 AM

Even Cormier, a very strong dude, remarked that he was surprised at how strong Jones felt in their first fight. Jones was the only guy that has ever taken Cormier down and he did so several times the first time around.

Wow.

I believe GSP was never taken down more than twice in a fight. Apparently GSP didn't train for strength, and said it didn't matter that much. Johny Hendricks was about the same strength as Matt C - benching 140 pound dumbbells for 5 reps. Could be BS though. That said, since USADA testing came in, Johny has never been the same. I can't recall if Hendricks took GSP down more than two times. He was a strong wrestler with heavy hands. A world class wrestler, and even he couldn't take down GSP very easily. Contrast that with the GSP and Diaz fight - GSP took down Diaz over and over with ease.

ratherbebig · « **Reply #22 on:** July 31, 2017, 01:59:43 AM »

lets not forget that jon jones turned 30 a couple of weeks ago where as dc is 38. jones is in his prime, dc is at the end of his career.

jones been in ufc since 2008 where as dc got in late at 2013.

Strongmanfan · « **Reply #23 on:** July 31, 2017, 04:41:49 AM »

Quote from: ratherbebig on July 31, 2017, 01:59:43 AM

lets not forget that jon jones turned 30 a couple of weeks ago where as dc is 38. jones is in his prime, dc is at the end of his career.

jones been in ufc since 2008 where as dc got in late at 2013.

Jones started at age 21, but DC at 34?

ratherbebig · « **Reply #24 on:** July 31, 2017, 05:13:15 AM »

Quote from: Strongmanfan on July 31, 2017, 04:41:49 AM

Jones started at age 21, but DC at 34?

he started earlier in strike force but ufc in 2013

jones started in 2008 and had 6 fights before going to the ufc same year so thats 7 fights in 2008 alone pretty crazy