Why Ketone Products are a SCAM!

[JAGO]

[Thin Lizzy]

I agree with his point but how does he know that he's even in ketosis, as he says his version of the keto diet is high protein. So, his brain could still be running on glucose formed by gluconeogenesis.

[JAGO]

This way?

Formation of glucose within the animal body from precursors other than carbohydrates especially by the liver and kidney using amino acids from proteins, glycerol from fats, or lactate produced by muscle during anaerobic glycolysis—called also glyconeogenesis.

J

[Mr Anabolic]

I agree with his point but how does he know that he's even in ketosis, as he says his version of the keto diet is high protein. So, his brain could still be running on glucose formed by gluconeogenesis.

Exactly.  Eat too much protein and you never go into ketosis.  The excess protein gets converted to glucose.

In my experience ketosis is not necessary to lose fat, just as long as you are avoiding foods that cause insulin triggers.

For the last 4 weeks I've had no carbs Monday-Saturday.  Sunday is carb day, but strictly managed with no binge eating.  It works very well... no cardio either.

[milone79]

ketosis is not necessary at all and ketogenic diets are fucking moronic apart for those with a vey few medical conditions....lower calories and/or increase energy expenditure to lose body fat!! Why the fuck would you cut out an entire macronutrient???

[JAGO]

Carbs are not essential nutrients.

J

[MORTALCOIL]

ketosis is not necessary at all and ketogenic diets are fucking moronic apart for those with a vey few medical conditions....lower calories and/or increase energy expenditure to lose body fat!! Why the fuck would you cut out an entire macronutrient???

This. I think basically Ketosis works as a psychological crutch more than an ultra efficient way of dieting. It's easier to jump on something radical and get yourself motivated for it. Just lowering your calories, eating less, etc.....is just too difficult for some as your routine is already set. You have to break it completely to be able to stick with a diet.

[milone79]

Carbs are not essential nutrients.

J

but what was brain function?

http://www.webmd.com/diet/news/20081212/no-carb-diets-may-impair-memory#1

[Thin Lizzy]

One of the reasons ketosis works so well for weight loss is that most high carb foods are also high fat: ice cream, pizza, cakes, cookies etc. So, cutting out carbs is going to result in a dramatic decrease in calories.

The problem with the diet long term is that it's very restrictive and most people don't want to live like that for the rest of their lives.

[MORTALCOIL]

One of the reasons ketosis works so well for weight loss is that most high carb foods are also high fat: ice cream, pizza, cakes, cookies etc. So, cutting out carbs is going to result in a dramatic decrease in calories.

The problem with the diet long term is that it's very restrictive and most people don't want to live like that for the rest of their lives.

You can avoid those very easily and eat carbs from much simpler sources: rice, lentils, chick pea, whole wheat pasta or bread, etc.... Seems  Americans can't avoid junk food. I almost never eat any of the things you've mentioned and I get enough carbs. I'm 42yo and been the same weight, pretty lean for the past 12yo. If I feel like losing 5/6 pounds, I do something crazy. I cut "some" of my calorie intake.

[milone79]

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[Mr Anabolic]

One of the reasons ketosis works so well for weight loss is that most high carb foods are also high fat: ice cream, pizza, cakes, cookies etc. So, cutting out carbs is going to result in a dramatic decrease in calories.

The problem with the diet long term is that it's very restrictive and most people don't want to live like that for the rest of their lives.

It's more biochemical than just calories in/out.  The main reason low carb diets work well is insulin management.

[Thin Lizzy]

It's more biochemical than just calories in/out.  The main reason low carb diets work well is insulin management.

My problem with the insulin hypothesis is that it seems to imply that insulin stays high indefinitely when you're eating carbs. When in reality you eat carbs, insulin goes up and then it levels off. Whether or not the fat that gets stored by insulin is either used for energy or accumulates in the fat cells still comes out down to calories.

[MORTALCOIL]

My problem with the insulin hypothesis is that it seems to imply that insulin stays high indefinitely when you're eating carbs. When in reality you eat carbs, insulin goes up and then it levels off. Whether or not the fat that gets stored by insulin is either used for energy or accumulates in the fat cells still comes out down to calories.

The problem is more the insulin peak and the effects on glycemia. Which will impact your appetite and then your caloric intake. Vicious circle. You can have carbs, reasonably. As with anything else.

[Thin Lizzy]

Lots of things affect appetite, watching television, walking past a pizza parlor, boredom.

Still comes down to calories.

[MORTALCOIL]

Lots of things affect appetite, watching television, walking past a pizza parlor, boredom.

Still comes down to calories.

What's your obsession with pizza?

[The Keto Kid]

I agree with his point but how does he know that he's even in ketosis, as he says his version of the keto diet is high protein. So, his brain could still be running on glucose formed by gluconeogenesis.

The best testing measure of ketosis, is buying a glucometer and the keto test strips, you prick your finger and put the blood sample on the test strip and enter it into the glucometer, this will show you if infact you are in ketosis and your blood ketone level, just like diabetics do for insulin these strips will test ketones. My problem with Palumbo is that he says he's been advocating this diet for 25 years, yet he himself never uses the diet. That's like someone being a huge advocate for a Vegan diet, create an entire supplement line with Vegan based products yet that person himself is not a Vegan, it's just weird to me. How can someone be so gung-ho about a diet but not adhere to the diet himself.

[Thin Lizzy]

The best testing measure of ketosis, is buying a glucometer and the keto test strips, you prick your finger and put the blood sample on the test strip and enter it into the glucometer, this will show you if infact you are in ketosis and your blood ketone level, just like diabetics do for insulin these strips will test ketones. My problem with Palumbo is that he says he's been advocating this diet for 25 years, yet he himself never uses the diet. That's like someone being a huge advocate for a Vegan diet, create an entire supplement line with Vegan based products yet that person himself is not a Vegan, it's just weird to me. How can someone be so gung-ho about a diet but not adhere to the diet himself.

That's the fitness and nutrition industry in a nutshell. Everything is a scam, even when it's a guy exposing a scam.

[The Keto Kid]

That's the fitness and nutrition industry in a nutshell. Everything is a scam, even when it's a guy exposing a scam.

Lol, it just doesn't make sense, honestly he should jump on this exogenous ketone band wagon and make even more money. And I really like Dave, but the keto advocate thing is just a big contradiction.

[Straw Man]

It's more biochemical than just calories in/out.  The main reason low carb diets work well is insulin management.

and I think that leads to suppression of appetite (or normalization of appetite)

it's just easier to eat less calories on a keto diet

[Kwon]

Lol, it just doesn't make sense, honestly he should jump on this exogenous ketone band wagon and make even more money. And I really like Dave, but the keto advocate thing is just a big contradiction.

Thusly, the Scambag-moniker.

[Thin Lizzy]

Lol, it just doesn't make sense, honestly he should jump on this exogenous ketone band wagon and make even more money. And I really like Dave, but the keto advocate thing is just a big contradiction.

I don't really follow Palombo, but after watching the clip you would certainly come to the conclusion that this was the diet that he was on.

Apparently, there is a multilevel marketing campaign involved with Exogenous ketones and they're promoting a few vague athletic performance benefits.

The reality is that once you get up to about marathon pace running, fat burning falls off a cliff and the body switches to carbs. The keto Warriors are saying that Ketones can delay the switchover but that doesn't mean increased athletic performance.

[Mr Anabolic]

My problem with the insulin hypothesis is that it seems to imply that insulin stays high indefinitely when you're eating carbs. When in reality you eat carbs, insulin goes up and then it levels off. Whether or not the fat that gets stored by insulin is either used for energy or accumulates in the fat cells still comes out down to calories.

[Thin Lizzy]

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When I was up at Saratoga racetrack, I saw this table full of fat guys pigging out. One guy had these two giant hotdogs smothered in Chilli , cheese and God knows what else, plus a frisbee sized plate of fries swimming in ketchup.
 
I have to admit there was a part of me that admired their ability to just not give a fuck.

[Mr Anabolic]

When I was up at Saratoga racetrack, I saw this table full of fat guys pigging out. One guy had these two giant hotdogs smothered in Chilli , cheese and God knows what else, plus a frisbee sized plate of fries swimming in ketchup.
 
I have to admit there was a part of me that admired their ability to just not give a fuck.

Funny thing is, I always observe people eating like this when I am on a strict diet.  I feel like doing what those guys did in that "Fatso" scene I posted above.  It can be hard to stay on track with all the temptations out there, but it's worth it when you realize that the majority of the people in the US are clinically obese.