The real motivation behind the current tax legislation proposal

[Straw Man]

Rich Republican donors have said give us a tax cut or we're not giving you any more money

At least a few Republicans have been honest enough to admit this

If they had true honesty and a shred of integrity or concern for the the country they would admit this AND find a way to actually pay for it rather than lying that it's going to increase wages, create jobs, etc.... i.e. pay for itself

that's the part that bothers me

at least be fucking honest and find a way to pay for it

“My donors are basically saying, ‘Get it done or don’t ever call me again,’” Rep. Chris Collins (R-N.Y.), himself a millionaire, said on Tuesday.

Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) told reporters on Thursday that a failure to pass tax reform would fracture the Republican Party and lead to more far-right wing primary challengers. “The financial contributions will stop,” he added.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/gary-cohn-tax-cut-ceos-donors_us_5a049571e4b0f76b05c4249e

[Coach is Back!]

I stopped reading from the bottom up after "Huffington Post" try again minion

[Straw Man]

I stopped reading from the bottom up after "Huffington Post" try again minion

why would I bother?

You've already said you're too stupid to understand the facts on this topic

[Primemuscle]

I stopped reading from the bottom up after "Huffington Post" try again minion

-Fact is that large corporations and wealthy people donate to Republicans and to Democrats. The Democratic party is known for their "get out the vote" campaign style with campaign support people walking door to door asking for the vote. The Republican party campaigns rely more on corporate donations. Lobbyist work to establish relationships with candidates who support their issues, regardless of which party they are in.

The corporation I chair favors Democrats because more often than not Democrats in Oregon vote how we would like them to. This does not exclude us donating to Republicans. When working with government, it helps to have "friends" on both sides of the partisan fence. Most election years, it is about a 60 - 40% split favoring Democratic legislators and candidates.

The Portland metro area is predominately Democratic while rural Oregon is clearly Republican dominated.

[Coach is Back!]

Two liberals in this thread talking about “facts” 😂😂😂😂

[Kazan]

I think it's painfully obvious that this proposed bill is to benefit the wealthy.
They could adjust the corporate rate lower without removing the estate tax.
FYI, the estate tax only applies for individual's leaving 5million and
couples 11 million.
This only applies to 11,300 families in the USA.
For Trump , this would save his family at least 1 billion in future taxes.

This is some funny shit, people arguing about how .gov is somehow entitled to get their last pound of flesh after you kick off. Next thing you know you'll be telling me it is my patriot duty  .

[Yamcha]

I think it's painfully obvious that this proposed bill is to benefit the wealthy.
They could adjust the corporate rate lower without removing the estate tax.
FYI, the estate tax only applies for individual's leaving 5million and
couples 11 million.
This only applies to 11,300 families in the USA.
For Trump , this would save his family at least 1 billion in future taxes.

I keep hearing about the 1% owning America, but 1% of our population is over 3 million individuals. Must be some big fucking families then. 

[Kazan]

I keep hearing about the 1% owning America, but 1% of our population is over 3 million individuals. Must be some big fucking families then. 

Well you know class warfare and all, gotta make the poor feel like they are somehow being shafted by the rich. I wonder how many people are actually aware there was no federal income tax until 1913, the 16th amendment giving the government the ability. How did the US survive for about 140 years?

[Kazan]

Fair enough, you're on the side against any "estate taxes".

I'm on the side that think the current provisions are fair.

No I'm on the side that the fucking federal government has long overstepped its bounds and has become the very thing the founders were trying to avoid. See the 10th amendment............... .


I get taxed on my income, I get taxed on everything I buy with what is left from my income. The colonist started a revolution over shit like this, and we sit here and accept it, this country deserves to fail.

[Kazan]

The tax structure is a legit issue and current debate.

However, I believe America revolted because we had taxation WITHOUT representation ( from the King of England).
From its' inception, the citizens of the  United States elect congress and the President, to represent them.
You may not like or agree with your rep in congress, but they are voted in and represent the people in their district.
Therefor , we do have a voice in the GOV that we the people, elect.

I don't know your tax situation and perhaps you pay more then my wife and I?
In property tax alone, we pay a decent amount due to owing various properties.
BUT, we work within the rules and laws to minimize what we pay and use a CPA.

Yeah these fuck heads in Washington really represent the American people  , we get a choice of Rep or Dem, they have monopolized the election process. You get 2 piles of shit and get to vote for the one that smells the least.  So don't fucking tell me I'm represented in government. You fucking people will sit on your fucking hands, and thank .gov that they let you keep some of their money, that is until you start to feel the pain. A bunch of corrupt cock suckers who rig the game so they don't have to play by the same rules as the peons. They have gained control of health care, its just a matter of time before they control enough aspects of enough peoples lives, then its all over the experiment that was America will be go out with a whisper

[Kazan]

IF you feel that passionate , you should run for office or get involved with local/state party politics. 100% serious.

I don't agree with everything going on , but I'm happy and content overall.
My wife and I have worked within "the system" and done ok.

As sappy as it sounds, I honestly believe the American system allows for anyone who works hard to have a decent life.

Why would I want to become the very thing I despise? The deep state is so entrenched,  at this point the only way to "drain the swamp" is revolution.

[Kazan]

Sorry, but I'm happy with the current system.

If course you are, until you feel the pain, which at some point you will,

[Straw Man]

Well you know class warfare and all, gotta make the poor feel like they are somehow being shafted by the rich. I wonder how many people are actually aware there was no federal income tax until 1913, the 16th amendment giving the government the ability. How did the US survive for about 140 years?

As I'm sure you know we had no military industrial complex before WWII.
We also didn't have social security until 1935.  Can't recall when Medicare/Medicaid started
We didn't have a nation highway system until 1950's (?) and on and on
I'm sure you're well aware of all this and more

My point in this thread is that these package of tax cuts will not produce higher wages or job growth and will only increase the deficit

If we're going to give tax cuts to corporations and the rich we should at least find a way to pay for it

Wealthy people are corporations are doing just fine right now.  They don't need this giveaway but rich Republican donors have basically demanded it and apparently Republican politicians are more concerned about losing donations than doing what is right for the country

[Kazan]

Ya know, I've endured my share of pain and set backs.
I'm not rich , famous or talented and consider myself an avg Joe.

I got the best education I could, and had a decent , solid ( albeit average) career.
My wife and I feel blessed for what we have .
I did the best I could with the hand life dealt me .
I have my opinions on politics, but never depended on government policies to make me happy.

No offense , but you seem bitter and resentful about "something" in your life.
If I'm wrong, I apologize but I only know you from posts on this forum.

Ask yourself an honest question:
Just how much better would life actually be if the GOV ran things more to your liking?
I suspect you and many others have personal  frustrations that go well beyond political issues?
I suspect your biggest frustrations have very little to do with health care or taxes.

Again, if I'm wrong on this , I apologize and it wasn't my intention to offend you.

You suspect wrong as usual, there is a reason this country was established the way it was, it has taken decades but the whole frame work has been bastardized to a centralized governing body, which was never intended. Maybe you don't care that .gov would just assume wipe their ass with the constitution, but I believe it is the law of the land. So when you can show what power was granted to the Federal Government to have anything to do with healthcare, create a ponzi scheme (social security) or any of the other "programs" feel free. Why all states have their own governments? Because the states were intended to have the power not the federal government. You are all about what is .gov going to "give me", but at what cost?

[Kazan]

As I'm sure you know we had no military industrial complex before WWII.
We also didn't have social security until 1935.  Can't recall when Medicare/Medicaid started
We didn't have a nation highway system until 1950's (?) and on and on
I'm sure you're well aware of all this and more

My point in this thread is that these package of tax cuts will not produce higher wages or job growth and will only increase the deficit

If we're going to give tax cuts to corporations and the rich we should at least find a way to pay for it

Wealthy people are corporations are doing just fine right now.  They don't need this giveaway but rich Republican donors have basically demanded it and apparently Republican politicians are more concerned about losing donations than doing what is right for the country

Give me a fucking break, the Dems aren't any better, unless you consider doing a bunch of unconstitutional shit "for the good of the country"

[Straw Man]

Give me a fucking break, the Dems aren't any better, unless you consider doing a bunch of unconstitutional shit "for the good of the country"

can you remind me again when Dems proposed a tax cut to the rich and claimed it would pay for itself with higher wages and job growth?

[Kazan]

My judgement isn't perfect and I'm no constitutional scholar.
I'm just a regular slob who did the best he could in life.
I vote and voice my opinion, but don't expect to do anything to change our GOV.
Call me naïve, but I'm happy and fulfilled with the opportunity my nation provided me.

I feel lucky to have the life we've built and a loving woman at my side.
I also love my country and was proud to have served in the USMC .

I'm nothing special BUT, I'm proud of the life I lived.

Perhaps you should be thankful for what you have instead of feeling bitter .
I sincerely wish you all the best for a full and happy life.

First of all I'm not bitter, so you can stop with your nonsense. If you want to see everything past generations fought for flushed down to toilet, by all means keep your head down and be a good peasant

[Kazan]

can you remind me again when Dems proposed a tax cut to the rich and claimed it would pay for itself with higher wages and job growth?

 

Well that would be impossible, I don't think the Dems have ever cut taxes on anyone.

[tonymctones]

Rich Republican donors have said give us a tax cut or we're not giving you any more money

At least a few Republicans have been honest enough to admit this

If they had true honesty and a shred of integrity or concern for the the country they would admit this AND find a way to actually pay for it rather than lying that it's going to increase wages, create jobs, etc.... i.e. pay for itself

that's the part that bothers me

at least be fucking honest and find a way to pay for it
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/gary-cohn-tax-cut-ceos-donors_us_5a049571e4b0f76b05c4249e

Hahahaa this is ignorant as fuck.

First you say that it was to cut rich people tax break and then cite a NY rep.

News flash straw boy rich people in NY and other states with income taxes will end up paying more with the current bill...maybe they come out better with the estate tax but that doesn’t benefit them now.

[Straw Man]

 

Well that would be impossible, I don't think the Dems have ever cut taxes on anyone.

You want to take a guess what happened when Clinton raised taxes?

[Straw Man]

Hahahaa this is ignorant as fuck.

First you say that it was to cut rich people tax break and then cite a NY rep.

News flash straw boy rich people in NY and other states with income taxes will end up paying more with the current bill...maybe they come out better with the estate tax but that doesn’t benefit them now.

that doesn't even make any sense dispshit

I provided two Republicans who were honest enough to admit that their patrons have told them give us a tax cut or we're not giving you any more money

that is the true motivation behind this tax legislation

Truly rich people (people with incomes of 2 million +) will end up paying MUCH less

People who make 150k to 250k will wind up paying more (not sure if you think that's "rich" or not)

My main issue is that this tax bill will increase the deficit by 1.7 trillion (most recent estimate)

[tonymctones]

that doesn't even make any sense dispshit

I provided two Republicans who were honest enough to admit that their patrons have told them give us a tax cut or we're not giving you any more money

that is the true motivation behind this tax legislation

Truly rich people (people with incomes of 2 million +) will end up paying MUCH less

People who make 150k to 250k will wind up paying more (not sure if you think that's "rich" or not)

My main issue is that this tax bill will increase the deficit by 1.7 trillion (most recent estimate)

Here’s the issue fucknuts, rich people in states with income taxes like NY will end up paying more...You’re talking point is just that it doesn’t take into account all situations. People in liberal ran states like NY and yea California will not be able to deduct their state income taxes so how is that leading to them paying less?

HENCE THE BULLSHIT!!!

Hey I agree with you on the deficit, i wish you felt the same way about Obamacare when it was passed and front loaded with funding measures and expenses put off for years to get passed the Hyde ammendment.

[Straw Man]

Here’s the issue fucknuts, rich people in states with income taxes like NY will end up paying more...You’re talking point is just that it doesn’t take into account all situations. People in liberal ran states like NY and yea California will not be able to deduct their state income taxes so how is that leading to them paying less?

HENCE THE BULLSHIT!!!

Hey I agree with you on the deficit, i wish you felt the same way about Obamacare when it was passed and front loaded with funding measures and expenses put off for years to get passed the Hyde ammendment.

Not sure what your problem is with reading comprehension

The premise of this article is not about who pays more or less in various states

The premise is that Republicans have admitted they are basically being extorted by rich donors (we're talking about billionaires) to give them the tax cut they paid for with their donations

Also not sure why you feel the need to show up and TYPE IN ALL  CAPS !!!!

[tonymctones]

Not sure what your problem is with reading comprehension

The premise of this article is not about who pays more or less in various states

The premise is that Republicans have admitted they are basically being extorted by rich donors (we're talking about billionaires) to give them the tax cut they paid for with their donations

Also not sure why you feel the need to show up and TYPE IN ALL  CAPS !!!!

And again not sure why you’re not understanding...

You are assuming the NY rep was referring to rich donors, THAT IS BULLSHIT b/c rich people in NY will pay more as a result of not being able to deduct their state and local taxes.

Understand now? You’re saying that a NY Rep had “rich” donors contact him to tell him to get it done...getting it done means they pay more...

[tonymctones]

Or are you still defending state and local tax deductions in the face of all the proof that they actually benefit the rich?