John Paul Stevens: Repeal the Second Amendment

[chaos]

Stevens is a Republican.. to use him to say Democrats are wanting to take your guns is misleading. Not saying you are doing this but it's being done. And as I said before, saying "no one wants" is probably wrong. Saying the vast majority of Democrats do not want to take your right to own a gun away is probably true.

Nothing to say about the chart above?

[Agnostic007]

Nothing to say about the chart above?

N ANALYSIS OF MASS shootings in the United States of America reveals one variable that has remained remarkably consistent over time: The use of detachable, high-capacity ammunition magazines that hold more than 10 cartridges.
A recent study of mass shootings by the Citizens Crime Commission of New York City identified 30 such incidents from 1984 until the present in which semiautomatic firearms (either handguns or long guns) and high-capacity ammunition magazines were used. This includes Virginia Tech (2007), Northern Illinois University (2008), Fort Hood (2009), Tucson (2011), Aurora (2012), Oak Creek (2012), and Sandy Hook (2012).
[See a collection of political cartoons on gun control and gun rights.]
It is notable that several of these shootings were stopped when the gunman attempted to reload his firearm, including the 1993 shooting on the Long Island Railroad, the 1998 shooting at Thurston High School in Oregon and, of course, Tucson.
In a dramatic statement made in an Arizona courtroom in November, Tucson victim Gabrielle Giffords and her husband Mark Kelly made it clear that politicians who refuse to see the connection between mass murder and high-capacity ammunition magazines are being willfully blind:



Notice how above the chart, it says the Virginia tech shooter had X number of magazines, most of them 10 round. It doesn't include the fact that out of X number, there were also 15 round and they were initially used.

I concede the point if someone is determined to kill people they will do it with a musket if that is what they have available. And handguns aren't going away any time soon, but I think most people whether they are 1st responders or potential victims, will fare much better against a person with a handgun than a long gun. Especially a long gun with a lot of rounds. Why is it that I can't legally hunt a duck with more than 3 rounds in the chamber, but Bubba can have an AR15 with 30 round magazines?

[chaos]

Because the 2nd wasn't written for hunting. And we were comparing rifle deaths to stabbings, not pistols. You're more likely to be beaten to death with a blunt object or stabbed to death, than to be shot with an AR-15 style rifle.
Nobody calling for the ban of blunt objects or knives? Or even handguns?

[Agnostic007]

Because the 2nd wasn't written for hunting. And we were comparing rifle deaths to stabbings, not pistols. You're more likely to be beaten to death with a blunt object or stabbed to death, than to be shot with an AR-15 style rifle.
Nobody calling for the ban of blunt objects or knives? Or even handguns?

and there are way more deaths from auto crashes than with guns but nobody is calling for a ban on cars...

[chaos]

and there are way more deaths from auto crashes than with guns but nobody is calling for a ban on cars...

Why do you think politicians are so adamant about banning something that is involved in so few deaths?

[Kazan]

easier to get you in the box cars

[Las Vegas]

Why do you think politicians are so adamant about banning something that is involved in so few deaths?

And yet they're looking to get those out of the way, first.

Damn fine question.

[Las Vegas]

Stevens is a Republican.. to use him to say Democrats are wanting to take your guns is misleading. Not saying you are doing this but it's being done. And as I said before, saying "no one wants" is probably wrong. Saying the vast majority of Democrats do not want to take your right to own a gun away is probably true.

No, I wasn't trying to make a connection like that (as you so generously noticed).

[Las Vegas]

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.


What does it mean?

Well regulated means well supplied and trained, not what people think regulated means today. Why would the militia be the safe guard against a tyrannical government, yet then allow that government to "regulate" it?  

They felt so strongly that the militia is necessary for the security of the free state, they put it in the bill of rights.

Then they say the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. Why the people and not the militia? Because they did not believe the right to bear arms only applied to members of the militia.

They also say Arms and not muskets or whatever weapon was prevalent at that time. When people say that it only applies to muskets, that is like saying well then only print news is protected by the 1st amendment because freedom of the press, at the time meant the printing press.

Its not that hard to find intent, simply read the Federalist papers. They specifically discuss the right to self defense of the individual

Nice, Kazan.  But don't forget we're talking about "a relic from the 18th century", when people couldn't read into the future as we do today with such ease.  Even our teenagers do it, bro.  What more do you need to feel safe?

Nevermind that human nature hasn't changed one bit.  And please ignore the new reality of information-processing, which has raised the risk for political misdirection through the roof and raises it more every day.

Oh, and if you need to protect yourself from typical crime, don't worry.  Just get in line for your Pea-Shooting Permit.  Your illegal weapons were shipped to China and turned into vacuum cleaners for export.

[Agnostic007]

Nice, Kazan.  But don't forget we're talking about "a relic from the 18th century", when people couldn't read into the future as we do today with such ease.  Even our teenagers do it, bro.  What more do you need to feel safe?

Nevermind that human nature hasn't changed one bit.  And please ignore the new reality of information-processing, which has raised the risk for political misdirection through the roof and raises it more every day.

Oh, and if you need to protect yourself from typical crime, don't worry.  Just get in line for your Pea-Shooting Permit.  Your illegal weapons were shipped to China and turned into vacuum cleaners for export.

Good explanation on Saturday night live about the founding fathers and what they would think about what we think of the 2nd amendment. google it

[Agnostic007]

If there is a problem  cant solve with my Beretta automatic shotgun or my M&P 40 then I give up

[Kazan]

Nice, Kazan.  But don't forget we're talking about "a relic from the 18th century", when people couldn't read into the future as we do today with such ease.  Even our teenagers do it, bro.  What more do you need to feel safe?

Nevermind that human nature hasn't changed one bit.  And please ignore the new reality of information-processing, which has raised the risk for political misdirection through the roof and raises it more every day.

Oh, and if you need to protect yourself from typical crime, don't worry.  Just get in line for your Pea-Shooting Permit.  Your illegal weapons were shipped to China and turned into vacuum cleaners for export.

It all comes down to opinion, not fact. Why do you need an AR-15? Because it is my right, and if I am a law abiding citizen, why do you care? People don't seem to understand the difference between a right and privilege, you don't have to ask permission for a right. Thank God for James Madison, can you image in the mess we would have today without the Bill of Rights......

[Las Vegas]

Good explanation on Saturday night live about the founding fathers and what they would think about what we think of the 2nd amendment. google it

SNL is all about MSM, and MSM is all about deception.  That much has shown itself to be true, imo.

But I'll look at it, based on your recommendation.  Judging by your description, though, I can only say the FF couldn't have imagined how badly we'd destroy society.  If they could look into the future, they'd swear we were retaken by Elitists (to our own stupid peril).

That's why concern for protection was, and still is, the point.  Without that, no such thing as America.

[Las Vegas]

It all comes down to opinion, not fact. Why do you need an AR-15? Because it is my right, and if I am a law abiding citizen, why do you care? People don't seem to understand the difference between a right and privilege, you don't have to ask permission for a right. Thank God for James Madison, can you image in the mess we would have today without the Bill of Rights......

Agreed.  The "why let people do this?" thing has no end, and it runs counter to what we're about.  The worst go-to out there.  It doesn't work without reason, unless a person's screws are loose and extensive brainwashing has taken place.

[Las Vegas]

If there is a problem  cant solve with my Beretta automatic shotgun or my M&P 40 then I give up

But isn't it a capability to allow the opposite to happen, really, that's on the line?

[Kazan]

Agreed.  The "why let people do this?" thing has no end, and it runs counter to what we're about.  The worst go-to out there.  It doesn't work without reason, unless a person's screws are loose and extensive brainwashing has taken place.

Freedom is a strange thing.

[Dos Equis]

Stevens is a Republican.. to use him to say Democrats are wanting to take your guns is misleading. Not saying you are doing this but it's being done. And as I said before, saying "no one wants" is probably wrong. Saying the vast majority of Democrats do not want to take your right to own a gun away is probably true.

In the same way that Joe Scarborough is a Republican. 

[Kazan]

And so it begins -

Seattle PD has begun enforcing their "Red Flag" law.
Cloud Act, domestic data aggregation, NDAA allowing the disappearing of folks - what could possibly go wrong...

[Moontrane]

It all comes down to opinion, not fact. Why do you need an AR-15? Because it is my right, and if I am a law abiding citizen, why do you care? People don't seem to understand the difference between a right and privilege, you don't have to ask permission for a right. Thank God for James Madison, can you image in the mess we would have today without the Bill of Rights......

More credit to George Mason that to Madison.

"The Virginia Declaration of Rights, which Mason principally authored, served as a basis for the United States Bill of Rights, of which he has been deemed the father."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Mason

[Las Vegas]

And so it begins -

Seattle PD has begun enforcing their "Red Flag" law.
Cloud Act, domestic data aggregation, NDAA allowing the disappearing of folks - what could possibly go wrong...

Once again, Kazan: Agreed.

It looks exactly as one would expect an attack from outside to be.  Now any old cheapshit nation with its cheapshit laws can be used for cover, to attack us without concern for our own laws.  My word, if this isn't our disintegration in action: WTF are we seeing?

[Moontrane]

And so it begins -

Seattle PD has begun enforcing their "Red Flag" law.
Cloud Act, domestic data aggregation, NDAA allowing the disappearing of folks - what could possibly go wrong...

Is this the story?

<<< Police said they had received multiple calls about McKenzie’s escalating behavior in the past year.

McKenzie voluntarily surrendered a gun in 2017 after he was served with an anti-harassment order, even though he wasn’t required to do so. He acknowledged he was experiencing "stress" and did not want the gun around, Michaud said.

Months later, McKenzie, who lives above a restaurant, had several interactions with the restaurant staff. In one instance, he stood in front of the restaurant and yelled obscenities and accused people of talking to him through the floor.

"No crimes were committed at that time, but his behavior was erratic and unnerving to all; resulting in contact" by police, Michaud said.

McKenzie declined services, but shortly thereafter he called police again to report "taunting and voices" coming from the restaurant below through the floor.

He also told police that he was armed with a gun and wanted a female employee "arrested or shot" by police, Michaud said.

McKenzie was ultimately taken to a medical facility. >>>

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2018/mar/14/liberty-headlines/no-seattle-police-didnt-use-red-flag-law-seize-man/

[Agnostic007]

Is this the story?

<<< Police said they had received multiple calls about McKenzie’s escalating behavior in the past year.

McKenzie voluntarily surrendered a gun in 2017 after he was served with an anti-harassment order, even though he wasn’t required to do so. He acknowledged he was experiencing "stress" and did not want the gun around, Michaud said.

Months later, McKenzie, who lives above a restaurant, had several interactions with the restaurant staff. In one instance, he stood in front of the restaurant and yelled obscenities and accused people of talking to him through the floor.

"No crimes were committed at that time, but his behavior was erratic and unnerving to all; resulting in contact" by police, Michaud said.

McKenzie declined services, but shortly thereafter he called police again to report "taunting and voices" coming from the restaurant below through the floor.

He also told police that he was armed with a gun and wanted a female employee "arrested or shot" by police, Michaud said.

McKenzie was ultimately taken to a medical facility. >>>

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2018/mar/14/liberty-headlines/no-seattle-police-didnt-use-red-flag-law-seize-man/

probably

[chaos]

Good explanation on Saturday night live about the founding fathers and what they would think about what we think of the 2nd amendment. google it

So a "comedy" skit show figured out what our forefathers meant and I'm supposed to take that seriously?

[Agnostic007]

So a "comedy" skit show figured out what our forefathers meant and I'm supposed to take that seriously?

If you want to. I think often times there is truth in comedy. George Carlin is a good example. Have you seen the skit?

[Las Vegas]

Good explanation on Saturday night live about the founding fathers and what they would think about what we think of the 2nd amendment. google it

If it's the "Constitutional Corner" thing you meant, I found it.  Lovely how the underlying theme includes making them too stupid to recognize how invention would naturally progress.  That's the "extra special" dig to it, I suppose, in case anyone thinks they deserve to be seen in any other way but clueless.