Dow Crash Coming To Your 401k

[IroNat]

Up? Down? Steady?

Yes.  Absolutely.

[IroNat]

 

[loco]

LOL...looks like Neurotoxin's and Prime's strategy

[Coach is Back!]

Fire Powell

[IroNat]

Fire Powell

 

[Necrosis]

Fire Powell

The man is a ego maniac lol!!

Nice tweet to cause the market to crash further, what a mess. Fire everyone!!! it's not him it's everyone else. He doesn't seem to care about the impact the things he is saying have, as long as he can protect his huge ego.

[Neurotoxin]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-treasury/top-trump-official-calls-bankers-will-convene-plunge-protection-team-idUSKCN1OM0LJ

“Plunge Protection Team” is called in to save Markets during CRASHES.

Who knew?  

Coincidence?

Luck?

Insider?


-NT

https://www.marketwatch.com/

Market Crashing?

Coincidence?

Luck?

Insider?

LARP?



Dow DOWN -653 points

Nasdaq DOWN -150 points

Merry Christmas!


-NT

[Straw Man]

Fire Powell

Why would he need to do that
Don't Trumptards think everything is going great?
Would Trump firing his hand picked Fed Chief after 10 months be a good thing for the markets or which it just make they even greater?

[IroNat]

Call the Plunge Protection Team ASAP!

[SOMEPARTS]

Honestly anyone in equities that didn't hedge and sell some off for a profit had it coming.  You have had months of day after day all time highs in this ancient bull market during 2018. Regardless of politics the down cycle is due. Whether or not things stabilize it's still due.

The smart money wanted out at all time highs and before Dems spent 2 years investigating Trump. They also know the tax changes have taken effect and are unlikely to add any more to the market in 2019. The 401k fools get their usual beating chasing the golden carrot stuck in a market they don't understand.

[Coach is Back!]

Why would he need to do that
Don't Trumptards think everything is going great?
Would Trump firing his hand picked Fed Chief after 10 months be a good thing for the markets or which it just make they even greater?

The economy is great which is why it’s beyond anyone but Libs to wonder why the fed would raise rates in a thriving economy.

[loco]

Honestly anyone in equities that didn't hedge and sell some off for a profit had it coming.  You have had months of day after day all time highs in this ancient bull market during 2018. Regardless of politics the down cycle is due. Whether or not things stabilize it's still due.

The smart money wanted out at all time highs and before Dems spent 2 years investigating Trump. They also know the tax changes have taken effect and are unlikely to add any more to the market in 2019. The 401k fools get their usual beating chasing the golden carrot stuck in a market they don't understand.

Is that what you did?  How exactly did you do this, when, how much did you sell?  How did you know when was the right time to sell?  How did you know how much to sell?  

You don't have to answer, because nobody knows.  If you try, you're just gambling.

Who are these "401K fools"?  Most self made millionaires in America in recent times reached millionaire status through their employer-sponsored retirement plan.

Many of these 401K participants already re-balance their portfolio about once per year.  However, they do this on a preset schedule to make sure their allocations stay on target, and not out of panic based on what the market is doing.

[SOMEPARTS]

Is that what you did?  How exactly did you do this, when, how much did you sell?  How did you know when was the right time to sell?  How did you know how much to sell?  

You don't have to answer, because nobody knows.  If you try, you're just gambling.

Who are these "401K fools"?  Most self made millionaires in America in recent times reached millionaire status through their employer-sponsored retirement plan.

Many of these 401K participants already re-balance their portfolio about once per year.  However, they do this on a preset schedule to make sure their allocations stay on target, and not out of panic based on what the market is doing.

No, I'm not a gambler...quite the opposite. I've been out for a while except for a fixed income fund that doesn't make sense to cash and get taxed on... I rely on real estate and businesses instead of equities, and while they are not as passive I do have far more control and tax advantages in the now rather than the tax deferred promises.

Historically by a wide margin most become millionaires through real estate, then by a business they own...after that are W-2 wages, savings, paper investments, etc.

Many 401k types let their stuff sit in their own company stock and never check on it until they've already gotten a haircut. How exactly do you "stay on target" when the DOW goes down 54% like it did in 2009? Yes, you can stay in for 40 years and hope you age out at the right point in the cycle...but to me, that's counterparty risk I just can't handle. Then again, I actually deploy my own capital rather than hope somebody works in my best interest so my approach differs from most and I don't think it's for everyone.

[loco]

No, I'm not a gambler...quite the opposite. I've been out for a while except for a fixed income fund that doesn't make sense to cash and get taxed on... I rely on real estate and businesses instead of equities, and while they are not as passive I do have far more control and tax advantages in the now rather than the tax deferred promises.

Historically by a wide margin most become millionaires through real estate, then by a business they own...after that are W-2 wages, savings, paper investments, etc.

Many 401k types let their stuff sit in their own company stock and never check on it until they've already gotten a haircut. How exactly do you "stay on target" when the DOW goes down 54% like it did in 2009? Yes, you can stay in for 40 years and hope you age out at the right point in the cycle...but to me, that's counterparty risk I just can't handle. Then again, I actually deploy my own capital rather than hope somebody works in my best interest so my approach differs from most and I don't think it's for everyone.

I never said that you are a gambler.  I said that if you try to sell or buy based on predictions of what the stock market will do next, then you are gambling because nobody knows what the stock market will do next.  You'll end up selling or buying too soon or too late, and if you make a profit it's purely luck.

The same goes for the housing market, since you are in real estate.  And there are no tax deferred "promises."  It's either tax deferred or it isn't.

And you should know, since you are in real estate, that you can defer taxes in real state too.  You can deposit the profit from a real estate sale into an escrow account and declare that you will use that profit for another real estate investment in the near future, and that you would like to defer paying taxes on that profit.  If you aren't doing this, you should.

"Historically by a wide margin most become millionaires through real estate, then by a business they own...after that are W-2 wages, savings, paper investments, etc.

Many 401k types let their stuff sit in their own company stock and never check on it until they've already gotten a haircut."

Where did you get that from?  Did you read that somewhere? Do you know of studies that back this up?

Yes, you can retire a millionaire investing only in bonds, or only in real estate, or only in stocks, or only by owning a successful business, or a combination of these.  You can also make mistakes investing in any of these.  It's not only 401K participants who make investment mistakes.  There are no guarantees in any type of investment either.

[IroNat]

Real estate investment is far from a sure thing.  Just ask the people who were upside down with their mortgages after the last R/E crash.

As far as the "sure thing" of having your own business...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2014/01/27/do-9-out-of-10-new-businesses-fail-as-rand-paul-claims/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0150e1a3b935

'The Small Business Administration, in its informative frequently asked questions on small businesses, provides this answer on the survival rate of new businesses:

    “About half of all new establishments survive five years or more and about one-third survive 10 years or more. As one would expect, the probability of survival increases with a firm’s age. Survival rates have changed little over time.”'

My own philosophy about this is that everyone is in  their own business whether they work for someone else or not.

If you are an employee your "own" business is building your personal wealth through the investment of your savings from your earnings.  That is your business and you indeed can become wealthy at it if you are successful in earning a good income and set aside a portion of that income for investment.

[SOMEPARTS]

"The same goes for the housing market, since you are in real estate.  And there are no tax deferred "promises."  It's either tax deferred or it isn't."

I'm not generally a flipper, so the income from my RE is highly tax advantaged.


"Where did you get that from?  Did you read that somewhere? Do you know of studies that back this up?"

That most millionaires became so through real estate? The last 100 years of history....or just google it.

The idea that most 401k people don't look at their 401k until it's too late. My own anecdotal evidence over the last 25 years....or again just google it, haha.


"You can also make mistakes investing in any of these."

Yes, but again I'd rather it be under my control rather than getting screwed by an institution or account manager. The equities markets do not exist mainly to benefit investors, it's to raise capital for companies. Whether or not you gain from it is about 3rd place in importance in the system.

[SOMEPARTS]

Real estate investment is far from a sure thing.  Just ask the people who were upside down with their mortgages after the last R/E crash.

As far as the "sure thing" of having your own business...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2014/01/27/do-9-out-of-10-new-businesses-fail-as-rand-paul-claims/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.0150e1a3b935

'The Small Business Administration, in its informative frequently asked questions on small businesses, provides this answer on the survival rate of new businesses:

    “About half of all new establishments survive five years or more and about one-third survive 10 years or more. As one would expect, the probability of survival increases with a firm’s age. Survival rates have changed little over time.”'

My own philosophy about this is that everyone is in  their own business whether they work for someone else or not.

If you are an employee your "own" business is building your personal wealth through the investment of your savings from your earnings.  That is your business and you indeed can become wealthy at it if you are successful in earning a good income and set aside a portion of that income for investment.

Nobody said anything was a sure thing. Never been upside down on a property and been in my primary business for 20 years. At this point I have a lot of control over my money with little counterparty risk.

I have done the corporate soul-sucking thing. I hated it. It's difficult to become wealthy that way and the last thing I want to do is day trade while working for somebody else....hoping the market goes my way and that the company I work for does well. That's not my idea of security.

[loco]

SOMEPARTS, you're all over the place.

"Google it"? "getting screwed by an institution or account manager."?  "corporate soul-sucking"?  "day trade while working for somebody else"?  "401K fools"? "tax deferred promises?"  WTF?

You seem to know very little to nothing about investing early on and long term in a portfolio allocated to a US total stock market index fund, a US total bond market index fund, and an international total stock market index fund, making regular contributions to it rain or shine, then re-balancing once a year.  Just set it, forget it, don't look at it until it's time to re-balance, no need to stress over it.

It's probably a good choice for you to stay away from investing in stocks and bonds.

Based on what you've posted, you seem to have made a very poor career choice early on, then finally found what works for you, investing in your own business and in real-estate.  Nothing wrong with that.  To each its own.  Congratulations in finally finding what works for you!

Many people do make the right career choice early on and they do enjoy their careers.  Their goal is not to retire early, but to accumulate wealth and reach financial independence ASAP, and continue working in the career which they enjoy, because they want to and not because they have to.  To them, starting a business or investing in real-estate is far more risky than earning, saving, and passive investing.

For all these people, true passive investing in stocks and bonds is a very good choice, probably the best.  And they can start a side business and/or invest in real estate too, if they wish to and have the time to do so.

Not everyone is an entrepreneur, a landlord, or a real-estate investor, or wish to ever be.  Your posts come across as if you believe that these are the best choices, or the only choices for everyone to reach financial independence.  You come across as trying to convince yourself more than anybody else that your choice is the best one, or the only one for both you and everyone else.

You keep making all these false blanket statements with nothing to back them up.  No doubt you believe them.  You seem to have this sense that you are in control, and that there is far less risk in owning a business and investing in real estate than there is in passive investing long term in stocks and bonds.  If all this makes you feel better about your life choices, then more power to you.  Whatever makes you happy and whatever makes you sleep better at night.

I'm not going to argue with you or try to convince you otherwise.

[loco]

History of U.S. Bear & Bull Markets Since 1926

"Although past performance is no guarantee of future results,we believe looking at the history of the market’s expansions and recessions helps to gain a fresh perspective on the benefits of investing for the long-term.

• The average Bull Market period lasted 9.1 years
with an average cumulative total return of 480%.

• The average Bear Market period lasted 1.4 years
with an average cumulative loss of -41%"

https://www.ftportfolios.com/Common/ContentFileLoader.aspx?ContentGUID=4ecfa978-d0bb-4924-92c8-628ff9bfe12d

[SOMEPARTS]

I'm not going to argue with you or try to convince you otherwise.

Right...after that massive wall of text, haha. You don't have to make up fictional stories about somebody you don't agree with.

Take a deep breath and relax - DOW is up 500 today. 

[IroNat]

Someparts has made some good points.

Some people do neglect their 401k investments and some do have all their own company stock (remember Enron) in it.

Some people blindly trust advisors who put them in high expense mutual funds so they can earn big commissions.

Some people won't put any money into a 401k and will instead spend the money on consumer goods.

Then these same people who chose to remain ignorant or abdicate responsibility will blame others for their poor results.

[loco]

Right...after that massive wall of text, haha. You don't have to make up fictional stories about somebody you don't agree with.

Take a deep breath and relax - DOW is up 500 today. 

That was the short version.     I was responding to both your post to me and your post to IroNat.  Like I said, you're all over the place and I wasn't even sure where to start.

You must have not read it, which is fine.  Long story short, based on your posts it's a good choice for you to stay away from investing in stocks and bonds.

And if I really needed to take a deep breath and relax now, then I too should stay away from investing in stocks and bonds and find something else.

[loco]

Someparts has made some good points.

Some people do neglect their 401k investments and some do have all their own company stock (remember Enron) in it.

Some people blindly trust advisors who put them in high expense mutual funds so they can earn big commissions.

Some people won't put any money into a 401k and will instead spend the money on consumer goods.

Then these same people who chose to remain ignorant or abdicate responsibility will blame others for their poor results.

Agreed, yet it does not follow that you can't reach financial independence via a decent career and your employer-sponsored retirement plan.

[IroNat]

Agreed, yet it does not follow that you can't reach financial independence via a decent career and your employer-sponsored retirement plan.

Correct.

[loco]

Why has Neurotoxin not posted anything on this thread today?

Oh, that's right:

BOOM: Stocks soar 5%, Dow adds a record-breaking 1,086 points

The S&P 500 and the Dow each clocked their biggest single-session point gains on record on Wednesday.

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/stock-futures-rise-christmas-eve-sell-off-134312777.html