Why are championship boxing matches 12 rounds?

[Tennisballz]

Convince me why it's a good thing that championship boxing matches are a monotonous 36 minutes?  It's dreadful to watch boxers go at 70% because they have to conserve energy.  Why are any fights 10 or 8 or even 6 rounds?  Fighters taking a few rounds to "feel each other out" or fighters "taking a round off" to conserve energy, these are lies the announcers tell you to as an excuse for boring fights with little action.  Boxing should be 5 rounds maximum.  If you can't assert yourself as the better puncher within 5 rounds, maybe dancing is a better sport for you.  Get your ass in the ring, get after it and get out....on with the next fight.

[Griffith]

They used to be 15 rounds but this lead to a higher risk of brain injuries.

Boxing is also a test of conditioning, endurance and strategy.

[Agnostic007]

Convince me why it's a good thing that championship boxing matches are a monotonous 36 minutes?  It's dreadful to watch boxers go at 70% because they have to conserve energy.  Why are any fights 10 or 8 or even 6 rounds?  Fighters taking a few rounds to "feel each other out" or fighters "taking a round off" to conserve energy, these are lies the announcers tell you to as an excuse for boring fights with little action.  Boxing should be 5 rounds maximum.  If you can't assert yourself as the better puncher within 5 rounds, maybe dancing is a better sport for you.  Get your ass in the ring, get after it and get out....on with the next fight.

I remember when they were 15 rounds. I think boxing should be 10 rounds. It's a good round number and it allows for the opponents to use a couple rounds to size up their opponents, looking for openings and flaws.. a couple rounds to recover from a fluke knockdown on the scorecards if that person is the better boxer, and it's long enough to make conditioning an important component. Boxing is called the Sweet Science because it isn't always about which bruiser has a knockout punch or just throwing windmill punches. It's about picking an opponent apart, setting him up for an uppercut when he thinks you will go for that right cross you because have for the last 3 rounds. Lots of people today don't appreciate boxing because they were brought up on the octagon.  
 

[plebian]

counter point

have you ever watched amateurs? 3 x 3 or 4 x 2 is often not enough to establish a clear winner, especially when the skill levels are high. Sure there is a winner regardless, but you, the spectator (and I can confirm a similar feeling as a fighter) are often left with the impression of "that was a fight?")

I dont know that it needs to be 12 rounds, but I do know that attempts to "make boxing more exciting" (there have been many, from the sound to the absolutely bizarre) in the past have generally fallen flat on their faces, because the big secret it is none of these combat sports survive or dont on the merits of their technical rulesets, but actually on the marketing and audience investment. For example, I remember during there was a big push for kickboxing and muay thai, but most particular, K1, because it was "better than boxing" because it featured more techniques, and because it was faster paced. Well trying to sell muay thai in america was a doomed venture, it never caught on at all, and K1 was only marginally more successful in the US (it was mostly a european thing, which is where it really caught on). The difference between K1 and MT is K1 got the fans invested by giving the fighters personalities and lots of media coverage, the production was fantastic quality and so on.

but none of these things have ever come close to toppling boxing. Why is the UFC the only mma promotion anyone talks about today? much the same reasons. Its not about the particular sport or technicalities, its all about marketing.

[Tennisballz]

I remember when they were 15 rounds. I think boxing should be 10 rounds. It's a good round number and it allows for the opponents to use a couple rounds to size up their opponents, looking for openings and flaws.. a couple rounds to recover from a fluke knockdown on the scorecards if that person is the better boxer, and it's long enough to make conditioning an important component. Boxing is called the Sweet Science because it isn't always about which bruiser has a knockout punch or just throwing windmill punches. It's about picking an opponent apart, setting him up for an uppercut when he thinks you will go for that right cross because have for the last 3 rounds. Lots of people today don't appreciate boxing because they were brought up on the octagon. 
 

You make some good points.  I'll meet you in the middle at 7 rounds.

no longer than 7....non negotiable!!!  

[Thin Lizzy]

They used to be 15 rounds but this lead to a higher risk of brain injuries.

Boxing is also a test of conditioning, endurance and strategy.

If I remember correctly, it was the fight between Ray boom boom Mancini and a Korean boxer, Kim, who later died as a result of brain injuries that was the tipping point.

[Dan-O]

If I remember correctly, it was the fight between Ray boom boom Mancini and a Korean boxer, Kim, who later died as a result of brain injuries that was the tipping point.

There were quite a few jokes like this going around at the time:

"Who makes the best Korean vegetables?"

"Boom Boom Mancini!"

[BB]

Yeah it was the Kim fight that changed all of it. Mancini was never the same, Rich Green, the ref killed himself, as did Kim's mother. Also there were a few studies that showed the biggest amount of damage happened to a fighter in the last 3 rounds of a fight, so they scaled it back.

I like the 12  rounders, they go well with the ebb and flow of boxing, lots of great second winds happen in those late rounds.

Here's a good doc on the subject -

.

[BB]

.

Just noticed this is up on Youtube. Good little film, from 43:00 on - deals with the Kim fight.

[ratherbebig]

if after 6 rounds both are standing, the gloves come off

[Tennisballz]

if after 6 rounds both are standing, the gloves come off

Great idea!  Another option is to have boxers use like 4 ounce gloves coupled with 5 or 6 round fights.  These 12 round fights need to go away.

[Griffith]

I remember when they were 15 rounds. I think boxing should be 10 rounds. It's a good round number and it allows for the opponents to use a couple rounds to size up their opponents, looking for openings and flaws.. a couple rounds to recover from a fluke knockdown on the scorecards if that person is the better boxer, and it's long enough to make conditioning an important component. Boxing is called the Sweet Science because it isn't always about which bruiser has a knockout punch or just throwing windmill punches. It's about picking an opponent apart, setting him up for an uppercut when he thinks you will go for that right cross because have for the last 3 rounds. Lots of people today don't appreciate boxing because they were brought up on the octagon. 
 

Exactly!!

[Powerlift66]

They used to be 70+ rounds, bare-knuckle, when men were men, and retarded... (John L. Sullivan).

[Tennisballz]

counter point

have you ever watched amateurs? 3 x 3 or 4 x 2 is often not enough to establish a clear winner, especially when the skill levels are high. Sure there is a winner regardless, but you, the spectator (and I can confirm a similar feeling as a fighter) are often left with the impression of "that was a fight?")

I dont know that it needs to be 12 rounds, but I do know that attempts to "make boxing more exciting" (there have been many, from the sound to the absolutely bizarre) in the past have generally fallen flat on their faces, because the big secret it is none of these combat sports survive or dont on the merits of their technical rulesets, but actually on the marketing and audience investment. For example, I remember during there was a big push for kickboxing and muay thai, but most particular, K1, because it was "better than boxing" because it featured more techniques, and because it was faster paced. Well trying to sell muay thai in america was a doomed venture, it never caught on at all, and K1 was only marginally more successful in the US (it was mostly a european thing, which is where it really caught on). The difference between K1 and MT is K1 got the fans invested by giving the fighters personalities and lots of media coverage, the production was fantastic quality and so on.

but none of these things have ever come close to toppling boxing. Why is the UFC the only mma promotion anyone talks about today? much the same reasons. Its not about the particular sport or technicalities, its all about marketing.

I started watching boxing in 2006 I believe and I can't remember any time they've really done anything to try and make it more exciting.

[BB]

Here's another fight that happened just after Duk Koo Kim, and showed boxing in a bad light -

.

Cobb was a lion, but Holmes whipped on him for 15 rounds, and caused Howard Cossell to quit calling boxing matches, and seldom speak kindly about it again.

[dj181]

Great idea!  Another option is to have boxers use like 4 ounce gloves coupled with 5 or 6 round fights.  These 12 round fights need to go away.

Was watching some of Foreman's 70's heavyweight bouts and they were using 8 oz gloves back then... Damn!

And speaking of heavies Micheal Dokes had phenomenal hand speed for a heavy

[Moontrane]

I remember when they were 15 rounds. I think boxing should be 10 rounds. It's a good round number and it allows for the opponents to use a couple rounds to size up their opponents, looking for openings and flaws.. a couple rounds to recover from a fluke knockdown on the scorecards if that person is the better boxer, and it's long enough to make conditioning an important component. Boxing is called the Sweet Science because it isn't always about which bruiser has a knockout punch or just throwing windmill punches. It's about picking an opponent apart, setting him up for an uppercut when he thinks you will go for that right cross because have for the last 3 rounds. Lots of people today don't appreciate boxing because they were brought up on the octagon. 
 

10 rounds would be enough, but the biggest change boxing needs is for the scores to posted after each round.  With the exceptions of contests like diving and ice skating, a competitor knows exactly what the score is.  If a boxer is actually winning the bout but incompetent or corrupt judges have him behind, he'll know he needs to do more or KO his opponent.

I also like the idea of a tie-breaking round if there's a draw.  With the scores displayed real time, at tie-breaking round could start a minute after the last regular round.

[plebian]

I started watching boxing in 2006 I believe and I can't remember any time they've really done anything to try and make it more exciting.

not mainstream, established boxing, but theres been plenty of failed business ventures that tried to make boxing more exciting, from minor changes such as less rounds, to the absolutely bizarre like chess boxing.

[Agnostic007]

I started watching boxing in 2006 I believe and I can't remember any time they've really done anything to try and make it more exciting.

That may be the issue. I was a boxing fan from the mid 70's.I stopped watching around 2010. But the 70's and early 80's right up until Buster Douglas and Tyson was spectacular. I actually owe part of my early retirement to the Douglas Tyson fight

[Desolate]

They used to be 15 rounds but this lead to a higher risk of brain injuries.

Boxing is also a test of conditioning, endurance and strategy.

This.^

[Agnostic007]

This.^

A great boxing match combines strategy, skill, endurance and recovery. I was gifted to watch some of the greatest matches in history. Age brings back pain but it also means you got to witness some real time history

[Agnostic007]

I remember early 90's watching George Foreman's wading through the journeymen. But his knockout jab was something to be respected. The man had the potential to knock anyone out with a left jab which was not that common

[Darren Avey]

That may be the issue. I was a boxing fan from the mid 70's.I stopped watching around 2010. But the 70's and early 80's right up until Buster Douglas and Tyson was spectacular. I actually owe part of my early retirement to the Douglas Tyson fight

You bet on Douglas?!!

[Agnostic007]

10 rounds would be enough, but the biggest change boxing needs is for the scores to posted after each round.  With the exceptions of contests like diving and ice skating, a competitor knows exactly what the score is.  If a boxer is actually winning the bout but incompetent or corrupt judges have him behind, he'll know he needs to do more or KO his opponent.

I also like the idea of a tie-breaking round if there's a draw.  With the scores displayed real time, at tie-breaking round could start a minute after the last regular round.

The suspense is part of it for me.. although we typically know what the scores are these days as the bout progresses. What I would like to see is more effort on judges being qualifed. There have been some horrendous decisions over the decades because Suzy or Becky or Brett were one of the 3 judges and although they had no real knowledge of what constitutes a point, they knew someone who knew someone and got the job. Anytime a judge is so far off from the other two that it makes you wonder if they were watching the same fight, they should be banned.

[Agnostic007]

You bet on Douglas?!!

I bet on Douglas. $300 at 38 to 1. I missed out on the 41 to 1 odds that it finally got up to. I think I made around $11K before taxes. That was a LOT of money for me back in 1990 but I had just spent 5 years in Okinawa and had saved a lot of money prior to getting stationed at Beale AFB. invested most of it and it helped me  reach my goals a bit faster than I would have been able o achieve. There were only one or two places in Vegas that would even take bets on the fight it was deemed so lopsided.