Target heart rate?

[Agnostic007]

The Maf method developed by Phil maffetone is used by many elite endurance athletes to use fat as fuel(burn fat).  It’s basically 180 subtract your age and that would be the max heart rate not to exceed. So for an example a 35 year old would not want to exceed 145 bpm. I’m 35 and usually try stay in the 135-145 range.

Seems pretty low. I can hit 145 bpm checking voicemail

[Mayday]

going to my cycling days i used watts but the HR is around the same anywag. 50% HR is recovery and warm up/warm down.

That's where you want to be.

Going harder will jack your hunger. Exercise is for fitness and general health. Diet is for weight control.

[stuntmovie]

MAYDAY, Pls specify the amount of time in minutes that you suggest within each phase .....

Warm Up time ......
Exercise Time (for lack of a better phase) ....
Warm Down Time ....

Thanks!

[stuntmovie]

In an effort to not sound too damn stupid ... I gotta ask this anyway!

During my youunger years (and beyond) I participated within numerous forms of physical activity ... lifting heavy metal things, swimming in cold and dirty water, walking /running for miles on end along fog-bound beaches, climbing trees, climbing ropes with 45 pound weight strapped to my waist, bike riding, etc.

Hell, I even built my own skateboard before the skateboard industry was born.

But I can never recall anything about heart rate activity until way much later.

And only then ... when I hopped on one of these up to date and modern  stationary bikes with all the buttons on it which asked stupid questions such as ... You height?, Your Weight?, Your Age? And other stuff I have forgotten.

And then it would tell you to start peddeling

And soon enough it would start reporting stuff such as calories, mileage, and HR ..... but no one back then had any idea what the hell HR meant.

"What the hell was heart rate?"

We were all pretty damn stupid back in them good old days,  but the smart guys among us knew all about calories consumed and calories expended and Decca, and D-bol, and Anavar.

But HR was a mystery!

So ... Here's the question .... In what year did this important Heart Rate stuff become known and 'used' by individuals involved in athletic activity ... mainly to BURN FAT?

I'm guessing that it was due to some of the aerobic exercise equipment companies who 'invented' these stationary bikes, stairs, treadmills, which 'computed' your HR level (among other things) while you rode, or climbed, or walked on their up to date and modern equipment.

Or am I way off base regarding the history behind HR relating to the loss of body fat?

Who conceived this HR formula and made it knowlwdgeable for the msses?

And what was the year in which this occured!?

And who 'promoted" it?

I may be stupid but I ain't dumb, so your knowledgeabe input would be appreciated.

Thanks!

[IroNat]

This stuff must have started when aerobics was big.  1980s?

[stuntmovie]

IRON, You could be correct concerning heart rate's popularity as a result of the world-wide interest in Aerobics.

Here is a bit of info I found to br of interest regarding Max Heart Rate but I'm having who, what, when, and where problems regardinf THR and fat loss history.

HRmax = 220 − age (Notice ... No mention of THR.)

Although this basic formula is attributed to various sources, it is widely thought to have been devised in 1970 by Dr. William Haskell and Dr. Samuel Fox.

Inquiry into the history of this formula reveals that it was not developed from original research, but resulted from observation based on data from approximately 11 references consisting of published research or unpublished scientific compilations.

It gained widespread use through being used by Polar Electro in its heart rate monitors, which Dr. Haskell has "laughed about", as the formula "was never supposed to be an absolute guide to rule people's training."

So ... It appears that athletes had no knowledge of HR/fat loss before 1970???

[Mayday]

MAYDAY, Pls specify the amount of time in minutes that you suggest within each phase .....

Warm Up time ......
Exercise Time (for lack of a better phase) ....
Warm Down Time ....

Thanks!

I paid one of the top training coach teams $1k/mth to train me. I can afford the better coaches so why not  I was focusing on increasing my 1hr power FTP to assist me with endurance because i am an anaerobic rider (track cycling) and struggle with endurance.

My max HR is 181. I used a $5k power meter and rode using watts. Watts are a leading indicator, HR is a lagging indicator. Using watts manages your HR but in a nutshell 50% of your FTP is 50% HR, 75% of FTP is 75% HR etc.

With my data i can see the HR brackets are influenced by your genetic makeup. for example, if you are an endurance person you can ride for 4hrs @ 80% of your FTP (80% of HR pretty much). I am anaerobic (not a pure sprinter but i am fast) and i am closer to 72% which over 4hrs is a massive difference.

An example block is below of what i would do in that week. Each block was 4 weeks then 1 week of resting consisting of 2 x 1hr rides @ 50%. Then i'd start the next block.
2 x 1.5hr training sessions --> 15min warmup @ 50% / 4 x 12min sets @ 70% with 3 x 5min rests between @ 50% / 15min cooldown @ 50%
1 x 2hr doing hill repeats at 95% FTP
1 x 2hr doing an endurance rider @ 70% FTP

Prior to this specific training my FTP with 6hr riding a week was around 250w which is shit. With this focused training i got to 265w in about 6 weeks and ended at 285w at 12 weeks which is enough to drop any weekend warriors and be an ok C grade type rider for endurance.

The lessons learned:
1) Focusing on this type of fitness made me great for sustained efforts only.
2) I felt fucking fit on a bike yet all that improvement made no improvement to my anaerobic power which is my genetic strength. My sprint was worse, my 30s was worse, my 1min /3min / 5min zero change. My 10min power and up improved.
3) 285w is still shit in the cycling world. I weighed 82kg and guys at 73kg put out that same power with 8hrs/wk. You can't beat your muscle makeup.
4) I am the first to blowup and the first to cramp on any ride around the 3hr mark. With this riding i was cramping at the end of a hard 4hr ride. Big whoop.
5) Hunger was out of control. I struggled to hold my weight at 81kg and was constantly hungry and overeating. Cyclists are all fat for a reason, the riding makes you insanely hungry.
6) Focus on your strengths and become better at what you are already good at.
7) HR brackets are determined by your genetic aerobic capacity. If you are endurance you can follow the guidelines easily. If you are like me you need to drop them lower otherwise you burn up, overtrain, fatigue then ultimately you get sick.
The overwhelming rule in training is go much easier than what you think and then go much harder than what you think, never train in the middle ground.

Point 6 & 8 are really the main lessons.

After the above 12 week program was completed, i went back to riding to my genetic strength. I rode 3hrs/wk which is bugger all but i'd hit shit hard and then ride like a slug.

It's the illusion of being fast. I'd do no work in a pack. I would get dropped on climbs and cruise to the top (the pack waits). Then in sections of 20s-30s long hills i would go full gas and hit hill after hill all out and burn all of them up because they can't keep up with the power/weight ratio i can dish out. So to their surprise they saw me attack on short hills and sprint away. It was all an illusion. I was quick for maybe 2 minutes out of a 2.5hr ride but they all thought i was a weapon LOL.  

[stuntmovie]

HYPER, Thanks for yor earlier response and the 'metabolism' link.

Great info but I'll need to read it more than twice and take notes in order to comprehend it enough to even make an attempt at discussing it intelligently.

I think that the QUIZ that was included may be of interest to those few GetBiggers who may be interested in this subkect, so I'll say "Thanks!" and post that Metabolism Quiz here ....

Common Metabolism Quiz.  Answer True or False?

1. Exercising first thing in the morning increases all-day energy expenditure and metabolism more than a workout later in the day would.
2. Spicy foods elevate metabolism.
3. The fitter a person is, the faster their metabolism.
4. “Yo-yo dieting” will permanently diminish your metabolism.
5. Certain medications can slow metabolism.

Answers
1. False: Regardless if it is in the morning, afternoon, or evening, the same amount of calories will be expended by the body according to the intensity and duration of the workout.
2. True: Foods like peppers and chili do elevate body temperature slightly, which will increase the metabolism by small increments. Still, this elevation is not enough to make a difference in the body’s ability to expend enough calories to aid in weight loss.
3. True and False: As a person becomes fitter and gains muscle mass, it is correct that he or she burns more calories at rest. However, some exercise enthusiasts have insufficient energy intakes, which do not meet the demands of their exercise programs. This imbalance may eventually reduce resting metabolic rate.
4. False: Diets that cause people to lose weight and then put it on again repeatedly are referred to as “yo-yo” diets. Research does not indicate that this will permanently slow down any component of metabolism.
5. True: There are certain prescription drugs (like depression medication) that have been shown to lower metabolism.

[stuntmovie]

MAY, Thanks, but most of what you stated is new to me  including a lot of terms which I will have to look up in a dictionary.

[Mayday]

MAY, Thanks, but most of what you stated is new to me  including a lot of terms which I will have to look up in a dictionary.

Sorry man, i trained with watts so the HR is a little different. I've looked at some of my data and pretty much this is where my HR sat.

My Max HR is 181, the same as it was 17yrs ago (that destroys the age thing right there lol). It does get lower as you get older and you see it when you hit hard against 45yr old guys who can't keep up on a sprint or all out effort.

Anyway by breakdown for 8hrs/wk into each range was pretty much the below in HR zone.

60% - 2hr
75%-80% - 5hrs 10mins
85% - 50mins

60% HR is recovery. A pace i could do indefinitely. You can easily talk. Pro cyclists spend a huge chunk in this range but that's because once you log 10hrs or so you are fatigued to hell so to do more it has to be recovery otherwise you get sick.
75%-80% HR is tempo. You don't really talk in this range as you feel yourself working. A pace i could do for 4hrs in one hit.
85% HR is threshold. A tempo i can do for an hour.

I didn't train in zones above that with my coach because i was focused on bringing up my 1hr threshold power.

The more hours you do the more important it is to manage the HR range.
If i was training to get my power up i'd do around 3min-5min in that specific zone. The rest of the time i would ride at recovery and maybe tempo a little on climbs.
People who go nuts for 40 minutes multiple times a week are asking for fatigue, burnout, illness. Unless you are genetic elite you won't handle the workload. And yes, i have seen genetic elite handle spastic workloads.... hence they are always the best.

1) If you go slow you will be slow --> True if that's all you focus on. I did the above and lost my top end power.
2) If you go fast you will be fast --> True providing you log maybe 5mins a week of all out efforts to stop getting sick. The rest you would ride at recovery.

IMO pick an area of HR where you are strongest and focus on that. At least that way you will be good at something vs mediocre at everything.

[MAXX]

Whevener i did bicycling I was at 180-190 bpm for 1 hour.

Nowdays I do HIIT and then I do 200+bpm in 1.5 minute intervals with 4 minute rest where i go down to 170 bpm or so. Then up again. Repeat this 5-8 times depending on mood.

[IroNat]

This is all too complicated.

Just go and run a few miles and throw in a few sprints.

[Mayday]

the actual HR is meaningless. You need the %.

1hr power is a threshold.level which is around 85% MHR so 190 means 223bpm max but no way you'd be doing a true threshold which would mean you are saying you have a 235bpm max.

1hr threshold efforts are WAY to hard and fatiguing.


There has been great.discussions about how the cross country skiers train. 95% of training is done at 50% MHR i believe.

[RJ DRIVER]

Whevener i did bicycling I was at 180-190 bpm for 1 hour.

Nowdays I do HIIT and then I do 200+bpm in 1.5 minute intervals with 4 minute rest where i go down to 170 bpm or so. Then up again. Repeat this 5-8 times depending on mood.

180-190 for 1 hour seems impossible.   You must be gentically elite.