Are people exaggerating about the American Healthcare system or is it that bad?

[el numero uno]

Are people exaggerating about the American Healthcare system or is it that bad if you don't have insurance?

1/3


Answer by Libby Brooks, works at University of Florida
Answered Jan 30

Well, I’ll let you judge for yourself.

A little more than six years ago, my husband and I were both working good jobs. Because it costs so much to add your spouse and/or family members to the insurance you get through your job here (*if* you get insurance through your employer at all), most couples keep their health insurance through their employer. Of course that means that you may have dramatically different plans, coverage, co-pays, in or out of network criteria, and so on, but it keeps it very affordable. So that’s what we did!

In the fall, my husband, who has inherited Type 2 Diabetes (yes, it is a thing - Type 2 just means that it doesn’t manifest at birth or early childhood) got really sick. He went to the doctor who noted some weird stuff going on with his kidneys, but didn’t really follow up on it because the testing on my husband’s insurance plan was REALLY expensive. Unfortunately without those expensive tests, no one realized that he was actually experiencing intermittent kidney failure, not just a prolonged bout of the flu. He was seriously ill off and on for several months, so his employer fired him. He lost his health insurance.

We had already decided that we were going to enroll him in my company’s far superior health insurance anyway, so I had done that during Open Enrollment in October… but the coverage would not go into effect until January 1st. We were offered COBRA coverage (look it up if you don’t know what that is) for an amount slightly larger than his (former) bi-weekly income, so obviously we couldn’t begin to afford it. He was looking for work but that’s a whole other kettle of fish….

Anyway - we decided to go see his family in another part of our state for Thanksgiving. He was very sick at this point and we still didn’t know what was wrong. One the way back home, we stopped at a half-way point to visit our best friends and force my husband to go see a doctor because, quite honestly, he was scaring us.

We got him into one of those Doc-in-a-Box places at a nearby pharmacy and for the $150 (because… no insurance) she took his temperature (high), listened to his heart (pounding but oddly muffled), measured his pulse-ox with a finger clip (severely low) and told us that either she had to call 911, or we had to swear to take him to the emergency department at the hospital down the block.

[el numero uno]

2/3

At the hospital they ran his bloodwork TWICE because it was so horrible that the first time they thought the machine was broken! He was in full kidney failure and was, literally, dying. The doctors told me that they had never seen a “living patient” with bloodwork results like this, much less one who walked in on his own two feet! He was taken away to the ICU where he underwent 24 hours of emergency dialysis. They wouldn’t let me stay with him because they kept having to shock him to keep his heart going. I was told to prepare myself because they were sure he was not going to live through this.

He spent a week in the ICU and then another 2 weeks in a step-down unit preparing to go home. They could not release him until they had him set up for dialysis with a local center, but with no insurance he had to rely on “indigent/charity care” until January 1st… and the local centers did not want to take him! Meanwhile, I’m on extended leave from my job - thank goodness my work cared more about US and my having income and a job to come home to than about my not showing up for a few weeks!

We were finally able to come home about a week before Christmas, but it doesn’t stop there. We applied for every discount, charity, agency funding, government agency, church charity, etc that anyone could think of. The hospital that had taken care of him determined that since the previous year (when we were both working) we made more than the government determined poverty line, we were not eligible for anything but the slimmest of discounts. In fact, that’s pretty much how it went everywhere we turned - your CURRENT financial situation is irrelevant. The only thing that matters to any of these people is what is on your previous year’s tax return. It’s how they get to say they offer all these programs without actually have to give much out at all. In order to even get him looked at in the ER, I had to pay $1500 on my credit card. I paid a number of charges while he was in the hospital as well. Upon leaving the hospital we were presented with a $250,000.00+ bill and were informed that there would be additional bills coming. Oh, and Merry Christmas!

[el numero uno]

3/3

The charity/indigent care dialysis? He had to have it three times a week, every week, or he would die and it was billed at the “highly reduced rate” of $1000 per session. We racked up over $10,000 in diaysis bills before the insurance coverage finally kicked in. Then there was the $1500 worth of no-insurance prescriptions that we had to buy out of pocket.

Of course, the new insurance isn’t going to touch bills from before he had coverage. He automatically qualified for Medicare, but it takes about 6 months before that coverage finally kicks in and they also won’t touch anything from prior to your having coverage. He also automatically qualified for Social Security Disability payments, but they don’t begin paying out until the seventh month AFTER you have been ruled to qualify. Those were only $1200 a month anyway - less than half his prior income. And, of course, as a dialysis patient he’s constantly sick and cannot work. The rest of the bills from the hospital came in and, counting the dialysis bills and the doctors checkups and stuff he had to have now, we were now sitting on over $500,000 of medical debt. I make $45,000 a year. AND they sent it all to collections.

We ended up having to declare bankruptcy. We lost our home that he had bought years before we were even married, but which we were still paying a mortgage on. We lost one of our cars. We lost our retirement savings. Thankfully my job has a pension plan so they couldn’t touch that, but all the other accounts went. Our friends ran a Go Fund Me to raise enough money for us to move into a small student apartment in one of the older apartment complexes in our area. THAT is a real story of what the American health care system is really like.

A few years later my husband received a kidney transplant from a donor kidney and he has been back at work for a couple years now. We worked hard and were diligent about paying things off and fixing our credit. We just bought a house last summer, and I now have a small, cheap car of my own so we can both drive ourselves to work instead of one of us spending hours each day on buses, or the other person having to do extra driving and sitting around. We are finally back to where we were before all this happened and feel like our lives are finally heading in the right directly again. Sadly, this time it’s at the ages of 51 and 55, so we can never truly catch back up to where we should be at this point in our lives. Retirement seems like more of a fantasy than a reality, but it is what it is.

Source: https://qr.ae/TlwqMp

[deadz]

My health insurance is reasonable. $600 deductible per person in my family then 80/20. God bless Trump and America. Libtards please remove yourselves from this Country.

[el numero uno]

I'm an avid Quora reader, and this topic keeps popping up on my feed almost every day. Sure, Quora is pretty much a liberal website, and algorithms show you what you're more likely to read, but still.

Do most of you feel the same about US healthcare?

[el numero uno]

My health insurance is reasonable. $600 deductible per person in my family then 80/20. God bless Trump and America. Libtards please remove yourselves from this Country.

Don't feel atacked. I just want to hear opinions about this topic.

Have you ever had the need of using your insurance?

[deadz]

Don't feel atacked. I just want to hear opinions about this topic.

Have you ever had the need of using your insurance?

I use it often as I am proactive about my health.

[Griffith]

From what I've seen the prices of a lot of their medication is ridiculously high compared to other countries.

For the exact same product from the same company, with identical packaging in another country.

[Irongrip400]

I pay $2-$10 for generic prescriptions, $3,500 max out of pocket and am pretty much covered on everything. Me my wife and kids are about $1,200 month.

[AllinVain]

That´s pretty cheap for the whole family. 1.7 k goes straight from my paycheck [germany] insurance-wise. It´s healthcare + national insurance, taxes come on top.

[Flexacon]

Does staying healthy reduce costs and does visiting the Doctor more often push up the cost of insurance?

If I was paying those sums for healthcare I think I would feel compelled to seek treatment for every minor ailment.

[AllinVain]

No, it´s a fixed amount that just varies by income. On the bright side, besides some diagnostics, meds, and dental everything is included.

[oldgolds]

Lol....People fly in from all around the World to get procedures done and use American health care...Probably the most advanced in the World.
And the poor and illegal get free healthcare at any emergency room in the country, per our laws...

[Humble Narcissist]

I'm an avid Quora reader, and this topic keeps popping up on my feed almost every day. Sure, Quora is pretty much a liberal website, and algorithms show you what you're more likely to read, but still.

Do most of you feel the same about US healthcare?

I argue with libs on Quora everyday.

[IroNat]

It is possible to get caught with a huge bill like the family in the article if you have no insurance or use hospitals and doctors that do not participate in your current insurance plan.

What happened in this case? No coverage.

Hospital costs are super high in the USA.  You must have health insurance or very deep pockets.

You also need to have funds available for deductibles which can be high depending on your plan.  Some low cost plans have $7,500-$10,000 deductibles.

Here's a real life example of the high cost.  My sister has serious heart problems.  15% function.  There was a advanced treatment available at a specific hospital.  

Cost: $1,000,000+.  I kid you not.  

Unfortunately, my sister's health insurance could not be used at this hospital.  She chose a lower cost plan that could only use hospitals in a specific area.

Regardless, my sister has recovered quite well and her heart has now achieved 30% function.

Have a nice day!

[stuntmovie]

The whole topic has been a good read and has opened my eyes regarding the expense and problems  within the US medical 'situation'.

I are dum about this subject because I served a good part of my younger years in the US military and have only paid for minor medical expenses when I was too damn dumb to realize that I had VA medical privileges which I had not taken advantage of for approximately 25+ years.

Once I signed up and was fully covered by the VA, I came down with pneumonia and remained hospitalize for close to two weeks.

I never did see that bill but I am guessing that someone paid $80,000 + for that two week, hospital vacation.

So if anyone out there is old enough to carry a weapon and shoot at the bad guys .... I recommend that you consider free VA membership and full-on medical coverage by signing up for a three year tour which will more than likely save you a  large amount of cash ... as well as your lively-hood when and if you reach your elder years.

And one last thing .... I know shit about  med insurance until I realized that I now have Medicare insurance after some grey haired lady knocked on my door to explain my Medicare plan ......

We were both surprised when we discovered that I personally have the BEST MED PLAN that has ever been offered in the US of A and would be impossible to improve

And all this civilian  med stuff as mentioned above including all and any drugs are gratis because it was paid for years ago and I don't recall paying a cent ... because it must have been so damn cheap.

I could go and have a hew heart transplant today and be celebrating in a casino tomorrow .... and never see a bill of any kind even though I have never given a thought nor had a plan regarding medical insurance of any kind ... Until I needed it .... And only then did I discover that I had it!

Definitely a life-long dumb situation in which 'dum-ness' paid off exceptionally well!

[robcguns]

Lol....People fly in from all around the World to get procedures done and use American health care...Probably the most advanced in the World.
And the poor and illegal get free healthcare at any emergency room in the country, per our laws...

This

[mphgrove]

The US healthcare system is the most advanced in the world and the vast majority of the world's medical advances come out of the US.

BUT: The US has HORRIBLE health care outcomes within our own population, with ENORMOUS COSTS compared to other developed nations. Consider these outcome and cost factors cited in a prior getbig post:

Profits and over complicated administrative procedures of our insurance companies
Fancy hospital construction, all the hospital systems competing with each other for affluent suburban patients
Litigation, we are lawsuit crazy
Obesity and poor eating and no exercise, we go everywhere in our cars
Poverty and associated poor health outcomes and habits in those communities
More procedure response to EVERYTHING, we want to live forever and our doctors go along with it (also because of lawsuit factor above) and television advertising plays a role
Drug prices, we subsidize the whole world. We and our insurers pay top dollars for drugs, while all the other governments around the world force the drug companies to accept lower prices
Addiction, we may have a worse problem than others
Our doctors make more money than other doctors around the world, mainly specialists
Fraud: people in the US are more likely to fraudulently game the system. The government bureaucracies and, to some extent, insurers are not effective in combating fraud.

[Humble Narcissist]

The US healthcare system is the most advanced in the world and the vast majority of the world's medical advances come out of the US.

BUT: The US has HORRIBLE health care outcomes within our own population, with ENORMOUS COSTS compared to other developed nations. Consider these outcome and cost factors cited in a prior getbig post:

Profits and over complicated administrative procedures of our insurance companies
Fancy hospital construction, all the hospital systems competing with each other for affluent suburban patients
Litigation, we are lawsuit crazy
Obesity and poor eating and no exercise, we go everywhere in our cars
Poverty and associated poor health outcomes and habits in those communities
More procedure response to EVERYTHING, we want to live forever and our doctors go along with it (also because of lawsuit factor above) and television advertising plays a role
Drug prices, we subsidize the whole world. We and our insurers pay top dollars for drugs, while all the other governments around the world force the drug companies to accept lower prices
Addiction, we may have a worse problem than others
Our doctors make more money than other doctors around the world, mainly specialists
Fraud: people in the US are more likely to fraudulently game the system. The government bureaucracies and, to some extent, insurers are not effective in combating fraud.

Very true.

[Matt]

Lol....People fly in from all around the World to get procedures done and use American health care...Probably the most advanced in the World.
And the poor and illegal get free healthcare at any emergency room in the country, per our laws...

Exactly.  All our hospital items in Canada are produced by American private for-profit corporations.

But as socialistic Canadians, we need to stop allowing corporations to efficiently work to provide us with healthcare!  Something that is already happening [and benefits us greatly], but we must stop it!

...

It's hilarious to me when leftist Canadians suggest that "socialism" makes our healthcare system great when it is private for-profit corporations that provide everything from the tiniest bar off soap found in  a hospital bathroom, to the largest MRI machine used to scan people for systemic wellness or disease.

Also, on a more specific note, according to the World Health Organization [WHO], in their 2000 survey of quality of healthcare worldwide, IIRC, Canada ranked #32 globally, and the USA ranked #33.  That's not exactly night and day in terms of difference, and keep in mind that the USA has a large Black population with poor health outcomes [caused by their own behaviour] that brings down the entire American average.  And it was still pretty close to the Canadian system in terms of its quality rating.

[Matt]

The US healthcare system is the most advanced in the world and the vast majority of the world's medical advances come out of the US.

BUT: The US has HORRIBLE health care outcomes within our own population, with ENORMOUS COSTS compared to other developed nations. Consider these outcome and cost factors cited in a prior getbig post:

Profits and over complicated administrative procedures of our insurance companies
Fancy hospital construction, all the hospital systems competing with each other for affluent suburban patients
Litigation, we are lawsuit crazy
Obesity and poor eating and no exercise, we go everywhere in our cars
Poverty and associated poor health outcomes and habits in those communities
More procedure response to EVERYTHING, we want to live forever and our doctors go along with it (also because of lawsuit factor above) and television advertising plays a role
Drug prices, we subsidize the whole world. We and our insurers pay top dollars for drugs, while all the other governments around the world force the drug companies to accept lower prices
Addiction, we may have a worse problem than others
Our doctors make more money than other doctors around the world, mainly specialists
Fraud: people in the US are more likely to fraudulently game the system. The government bureaucracies and, to some extent, insurers are not effective in combating fraud.

Two other things that never get mentioned while comparing the USA to other "advanced countries" [i.e., White-majority countries: the countries of Europe, Australia/NZ, and Canada]:

The USA has a massive Black and Hispanic population in its midst that inevitably gets outcomes much like these two groups get when they are in their respective homelands.

It's not like Canada's Blacks do better under the Canadian healthcare system - it's merely that we don't have a large Black population bringing down the overall average, the way the USA does.  It's the same as when people say that the USA has low high school test scores, or high rates of gun violence - yeah, since you are including the Black score in the average, which ultimately has a massive effect on it - bringing DOWN the average high school test score, and bringing UP the gun violence rate.

If you take away the massive Black and Hispanic population, and just look at the result of the healthcare system among WHITE PEOPLE, you will see that the average White person is better off under the American system.

I think there may be an exception to this for the working poor.

I also heard that the American healthcare system is far more expensive than the Canadian healthcare system.

So without a doubt, both systems have their costs and benefits, but the question is somewhat more complicated than one with a black or white answer.  For example, a person sitting on welfare in Canada is probably better off than a similarly situated person in the USA.  But a person who is middle class like myself, who can afford an insurance policy for myself and my family, is probably better off in the USA.

Any time some dumb Canadian says "Thank God for universal healthcare" in response to another friend getting a biceps tear requiring surgery, or something like that, I'm always like "Uhh...yeah, there's this thing called "insurance" you know..."

[Humble Narcissist]

Exactly.  All our hospital items in Canada are produced by American private for-profit corporations.

But as socialistic Canadians, we need to stop allowing corporations to efficiently work to provide us with healthcare!  Something that is already happening [and benefits us greatly], but we must stop it!

...

It's hilarious to me when leftist Canadians suggest that "socialism" makes our healthcare system great when it is private for-profit corporations that provide everything from the tiniest bar off soap found in  a hospital bathroom, to the largest MRI machine used to scan people for systemic wellness or disease.

Also, on a more specific note, according to the World Health Organization [WHO], in their 2000 survey of quality of healthcare worldwide, IIRC, Canada ranked #32 globally, and the USA ranked #33.  That's not exactly night and day in terms of difference, and keep in mind that the USA has a large Black population with poor health outcomes [caused by their own behaviour] that brings down the entire American average.  And it was still pretty close to the Canadian system in terms of its quality rating.

Blacks bring our numbers down in every category.  It's the dirty little secret never discussed.  Without the sizable black population the U.S. would be a giant Switzerland.

[el numero uno]

Jesus Christ.

You can't make a thread on Getbig without our native idiots turning it into a race thing.

[Matt]

Jesus Christ.

You can't make a thread on Getbig without our native idiots turning it into a race thing.

The personal choices of Blacks and Hispanics, which result in poorer health outcomes, drastically brings down the impression of quality of the American healthcare system.

Compare that to Canada, where we have a 74% White population, and had a 96% White population in 1971, and 86% White population in 2001, and where most of the data about our healthcare system only assesses the White population.  OBVIOUSLY our results are going to look better, without a negative outcome from a massive Black and Hispanic population to drag it down.

Is there a part of these factual statements that you don't understand?

Leftist: "Oh look at the USA, which has a huge Black population.  *GASP*: OMGZ, LOOK AT HOW HIGH THE MURDER RATE IS!!!"

Person with common sense: "Yeah...the two are actually related, since young Black males are 3.5% of the American population, but commit 52% of the murder.  Young Black males actually commit more murder than the rest of the population of all other races COMBINED.  But if you take the Black population out of the picture [and Hispanic population], the USA has the same murder rate as Denmark."

Leftist: "OMGZEvilRacistWhoWants2K ill6MillionJooz!!!11"

Person with common sense: "Oh...meanwhile, I just thought I was stating facts.  Sorry!"

[Matt]

Blacks bring our numbers down in every category.  It's the dirty little secret never discussed.  Without the sizable black population the U.S. would be a giant Switzerland.

Exactly.  Bang on.

Check out the stats of my city anywhere online - Thunder Bay, Ontario, Canada.

We are consistently the "murder capital of Canada", due solely to murders caused by Indigenous people and, more recently, Black gangs from Toronto and Ottawa.

Meanwhile, if you look at only the White homicide rate, we have roughly the same homicide rate as Denmark, sitting at under 2.0 per 100,000 population per year.

Toronto has recently exceeded New York City in terms of its homicide rate, and this is once again due to "diverse" murders.