Flat Bench Press

[monsterman500]

Parallel bar dips . End off thread 

[wes]

The bottom line on benches is this......if you have the genetic propensity to build a huge/heavy bench press then you most likely will if you train hard and long enough to do so.

On the other hand,I`m pretty sure that when we or a friend we know started training,one of our/their long range goals was to bench 405 (or whatever......you pick the poundage),but sadly enough most of us never get anywhere near 405 or even 315..................it`s all genetics,the way your joint,tendons,ligaments,insertions,etc.etc. are set up.

If you can bench a lot you will,if not,then you more than likely will never do so..... as a rule............of course there are a few exceptions to that rule, but not often because a shoulder or elbow will be fucked up long before you get past a certain amount of weight.

Some people are just not destined to bench a lot of weight due to genetic limitations.

[monsterman500]

The bottom line on benches is this......if you have the genetic propensity to build a huge/heavy bench press then you most likely will if you train hard and long enough to do so.

On the other hand,I`m pretty sure that when we or a friend we know started training,one of our/their long range goals was to bench 405 (or whatever......you pick the poundage),but sadly enough most of us never get anywhere near 405 or even 315..................it`s all genetics,the way your joint,tendons,ligaments,insertions,etc.etc. are set up.

If you can bench a lot you will,if not,then you more than likely will never do so..... as a rule............of course there are a few exceptions to that rule, but not often because a shoulder or elbow will be fucked up long before you get past a certain amount of weight.

Some people are just not destined to bench a lot of weight due to genetic limitations.

I always have development in mind not how much i press. i am lucky i do not need huge weights to get size. how much i bench does not interest me.

[MCWAY]

The bottom line on benches is this......if you have the genetic propensity to build a huge/heavy bench press then you most likely will if you train hard and long enough to do so.

On the other hand,I`m pretty sure that when we or a friend we know started training,one of our/their long range goals was to bench 405 (or whatever......you pick the poundage),but sadly enough most of us never get anywhere near 405 or even 315..................it`s all genetics,the way your joint,tendons,ligaments,insertions,etc.etc. are set up.

If you can bench a lot you will,if not,then you more than likely will never do so..... as a rule............of course there are a few exceptions to that rule, but not often because a shoulder or elbow will be fucked up long before you get past a certain amount of weight.

Some people jut are not destined to bench a lot of weight due to genetic limitations.

Is the emphasis merely lifting poundages or pec development? I've benched 405, over 15 years ago. But, I haven't really been obsessed with it since then.

If the goal is pec development, then it's about lifting the most weight via the movement that hits the pecs the most. If it's the flat bench, then the wider grip appears to be the best way to do it. Again, Serge Nubret (though reported to do a lot of working sets with 225) can put up 405 or more with that wide grip. His pec development speaks volumes.

I do flats last, so poundages aren't an issue for me.

[wes]

I always have development in mind not how much i press. i am lucky i do not need huge weights to get size. how much i bench does not interest me.

That` the best way to look at it if you are not into powerlifting.

 Leave your ego at the door and remember why you or most of us started training in the first place.........to look better........... or to look godlike in my case   LOL 

[wes]

Is the emphasis merely lifting poundages or pec development? I've benched 405, over 15 years ago. But, I haven't really been obsessed with it since then.

If the goal is pec development, then it's about lifting the most weight via the movement that hits the pecs the most. If it's the flat bench, then the wider grip appears to be the best way to do it. Again, Serge Nubret (though reported to do a lot of working sets with 225) can put up 405 or more with that wide grip. His pec development speaks volumes.

I do flats last, so poundages aren't an issue for me.

I`ve done them last on chest day also..........works great.

BUT,you cannot say a wide grip is bet for pec development because it will vary from person to person.

A 6 foot 5 guy will use a far different hand spacing than a guy who is 5 foot 7.

In the old magazines they always pushed using a wide grip,but it`s hyperbole.........just will not work for everyone cuz we are all built differently.

Find out what works for you,and train your balls off.

[wes]

Disagreed. Remember: "a stronger muscle is a bigger muscle". I'm a "go heavy or go home" guy. Got my start in a dingy basement gym with rusty plates and a single flickering light bulb. First 3 months there the only exercise you were allowed to do were ass to grass full squats. Then the deadlift was added. Once respectable numbers were reached on those exercises, then and only then were you allowed near the bench.

There are 123 pound powerlifters who have deadlifted well over 600 pounds with comparable squats and bench presses,so a stronger muscle is not necessarily a bigger muscle,not by a long shot.

[Dave D]

Disagreed. Remember: "a stronger muscle is a bigger muscle". I'm a "go heavy or go home" guy. Got my start in a dingy basement gym with rusty plates and a single flickering light bulb. First 3 months there the only exercise you were allowed to do were ass to grass full squats. Then the deadlift was added. Once respectable numbers were reached on those exercises, then and only then were you allowed near the bench.

Mike you only bench 405 for reps, where is that considered heavy? Your basement gym? You're obviously trolling.

Only on getbig would some post a 405 bench as heavy....

[Griffith]

Disagreed. Remember: "a stronger muscle is a bigger muscle". I'm a "go heavy or go home" guy. Got my start in a dingy basement gym with rusty plates and a single flickering light bulb. First 3 months there the only exercise you were allowed to do were ass to grass full squats. Then the deadlift was added. Once respectable numbers were reached on those exercises, then and only then were you allowed near the bench.

Sometimes it's better to keep constant tension on the muscle with less range of motion.

Most of the current ranges are used because that's what qualifies as a full lift in competitions, but is not necessarily the best for building muscle.

[Hulkotron]

Especially declines to the throat/neck area.

Poundages will suffer but your pecs will scream if training intense with short rest period.

Just my 2 cents.

Would be great if OP would do a bunch of heavy bench press lowered to the throat, taken "to the failure" in the words of Great Kyomu.

[wes]

Would be great if OP would do a bunch of heavy bench press lowered to the throat, taken "to the failure" in the words of Great Kyomu.

We can dream...............terr ible gimmick. 

[MCWAY]

Disagreed. Remember: "a stronger muscle is a bigger muscle". I'm a "go heavy or go home" guy. Got my start in a dingy basement gym with rusty plates and a single flickering light bulb. First 3 months there the only exercise you were allowed to do were ass to grass full squats. Then the deadlift was added. Once respectable numbers were reached on those exercises, then and only then were you allowed near the bench.

I agree that a stronger muscle is a bigger one. That's why I believe Nubret had such a great chest. He did heavy bench presses, in a way that made sure the CHEST did most of the work.

Again, if you can do 405 with that wide of a grip, how can you NOT feel it in the pecs?

I got my start in middle/high school.  At least you had rusty plates and an actual bench. I had a scrawny bench with the narrow uprights and the cement weight covered in plastic. When the plastic dry-rots, the cement starts chipping away. Ever been rapping and had a cement particle fall in your eye? I have.

There were two benches at my school, a blue one and a brown one. My best friend got the blue one; I got the brown one, that had a leg extension (that only went halfway down) and two pulleys for doing some type of pushing/punching exercises.

[pkaz]

I agree that a stronger muscle is a bigger one. That's why I believe Nubret had such a great chest. He did heavy bench presses, in a way that made sure the CHEST did most of the work.

Again, if you can do 405 with that wide of a grip, how can you NOT feel it in the pecs?

I got my start in middle/high school.  At least you had rusty plates and an actual bench. I had a scrawny bench with the narrow uprights and the cement weight covered in plastic. When the plastic dry-rots, the cement starts chipping away. Ever been rapping and had a cement particle fall in your eye? I have.

There were two benches at my school, a blue one and a brown one. My best friend got the blue one; I got the brown one, that had a leg extension (that only went halfway down) and two pulleys for doing some type of pushing/punching exercises.

There may be pictures of Serge Nubret under a heavy bench press. But I watched him train in Brocks Gym in CA years ago and never saw him go over 225lbs in the bench. He did endless reps at least 12 and very short rest between sets. Maybe 30/40 seconds. And up to ten sets of bench. His physique was incredible at the time. He apparently had great genetics plus a few other things going.   

[Bevo]

I agree that a stronger muscle is a bigger one. That's why I believe Nubret had such a great chest. He did heavy bench presses, in a way that made sure the CHEST did most of the work.

Again, if you can do 405 with that wide of a grip, how can you NOT feel it in the pecs?

I got my start in middle/high school.  At least you had rusty plates and an actual bench. I had a scrawny bench with the narrow uprights and the cement weight covered in plastic. When the plastic dry-rots, the cement starts chipping away. Ever been rapping and had a cement particle fall in your eye? I have.

There were two benches at my school, a blue one and a brown one. My best friend got the blue one; I got the brown one, that had a leg extension (that only went halfway down) and two pulleys for doing some type of pushing/punching exercises.

Would it really matter if he did wide grip bench or dumbbell only presses? He was going to get great chest regardless. His genetics already dictated he was going to have a great chest. He could have done anything and still built the same chest. Whether it be “narrow grip” wide grip, dips, dumbbells, etc.

Same for arnold, Franco, etc... a guy like Lee priest or Craig Titus could do the same thing and still have a shitty chest.

Dexter and johnnie Jackson can do the same calf exercises as arnold and still have their shitty calves

If you don’t have the genetics, you can improve on them but it won’t be world class like others do

[MCWAY]

Would it really matter if he did wide grip bench or dumbbell only presses? He was going to get great chest regardless. His genetics already dictated he was going to have a great chest. He could have done anything and still built the same chest. Whether it be “narrow grip” wide grip, dips, dumbbells, etc.

Same for arnold, Franco, etc... a guy like Lee priest or Craig Titus could do the same thing and still have a shitty chest.

Dexter and johnnie Jackson can do the same calf exercises as arnold and still have their shitty calves

If you don’t have the genetics, you can improve on them but it won’t be world class like others do

The key is improvement. The problem is that too people don't use the bench as a tool to build up the pecs. It's about putting up poundages, regardless of which bodyparts move the weight. That's fine if you're powerlifter, not so much if you're about building the chest as a bodybuilder.

Would Nubret have had the same pec development, had he be benching powerlifter-style? Maybe not. From my own personal experience, doing wide-grip bench presses have helped me improve my chest. With wide-grips, I don't need dumbbells anyway. I used them when I was younger, because people hogged the benches all the time, especially on international-chest-day (Mondays).

There may be pictures of Serge Nubret under a heavy bench press. But I watched him train in Brocks Gym in CA years ago and never saw him go over 225lbs in the bench. He did endless reps at least 12 and very short rest between sets. Maybe 30/40 seconds. And up to ten sets of bench. His physique was incredible at the time. He apparently had great genetics plus a few other things going.   

Yep. I've read pretty much the same thing, as mentioned earlier. But, on the occasions he did go heavy, he could put up some serious weight, especially for someone in the low-to-mid 200s.

[Bevo]

The key is improvement. The problem is that too people don't use the bench as a tool to build up the pecs. It's about putting up poundages, regardless of which bodyparts move the weight. That's fine if you're powerlifter, not so much if you're about building the chest as a bodybuilder.

Would Nubret have had the same pec development, had he be benching powerlifter-style? Maybe not. From my own personal experience, doing wide-grip bench presses have helped me improve my chest. With wide-grips, I don't need dumbbells anyway. I used them when I was younger, because people hogged the benches all the time, especially on international-chest-day (Mondays).


Yep. I've read pretty much the same thing, as mentioned earlier. But, on the occasions he did go heavy, he could put up some serious weight, especially for someone in the low-to-mid 200s.

I agree with you on that. I can definitely see if you are trying to build your chest, I find a little wider grip I can feel on my chest more. Same with doing a lot of decline benching. If ones goal is a big bench press then more emphasis on triceps and back is a must since big numbers on a bench is primarily all triceps and back with little to do with actually using your pecs

I remember seeing Ronnie use a very wide grip while Levrone had the narrow grip, def can see how Levrone had the massive triceps. He was perfect for benching big numbers

[monsterman500]

I agree with you on that. I can definitely see if you are trying to build your chest, I find a little wider grip I can feel on my chest more. Same with doing a lot of decline benching. If ones goal is a big bench press then more emphasis on triceps and back is a must since big numbers on a bench is primarily all triceps and back with little to do with actually using your pecs

I remember seeing Ronnie use a very wide grip while Levrone had the narrow grip, def can see how Levrone had the massive triceps. He was perfect for benching big numbers

i use a closer grip not too wide. I think it´s good to involve Triceps, front delts with the chest as i see it as a compound lift. can isolate with cables or DB flyes. shorter range of motion with a wide grip. Bottom line is if it works it works.

[MCWAY]

i use a closer grip not too wide. I think it´s good to involve Triceps, front delts with the chest as i see it as a compound lift. can isolate with cables or DB flyes. shorter range of motion with a wide grip. Bottom line is if it works it works.

Indeed. People bag on the flat bench press these days, because they claim it doesn't develop the pecs well. To me, that has more to do with lousy form and over-obsession with poundages than the exercise itself.

For some people, a traditional/powerlifter bench press puts too much stress on the shoulders and triceps. If you're one of them, wide-grip bench press may be the ticket to making sure the pecs do the lion's share of the work. If the pecs get stronger, they'll get bigger (especially if you're ingesting enough quality calories).

[pamith]

The bench is for the chest what the squat is for the legs, srs

[MCWAY]

The bench is for the chest what the squat is for the legs, srs

Indeed. Done correctly, those exercises put mass on the respective bodyparts. Done incorrectly, those exercises put you in the hospital.

[IroNat]

The bench is for the chest what the squat is for the legs, srs

Interesting.

[Hypertrophy]

The bench is for the chest what the squat is for the legs, srs

https://www.ironmanmagazine.com/arthur-jones-and-the-upper-body-squat/

[monsterman500]

https://www.ironmanmagazine.com/arthur-jones-and-the-upper-body-squat/

If you think this will build a chest like a Bench press..be my guest  sure it will work lats too but get real

[Humble Narcissist]

https://www.ironmanmagazine.com/arthur-jones-and-the-upper-body-squat/

Sergio looks like he could smash that machine to pieces.

[Hypertrophy]

If you think this will build a chest like a Bench press..be my guest  sure it will work lats too but get real

Do some research and get back to me, lol




https://www.researchgate.net/publication/51695295_Effects_of_the_Pullover_Exercise_on_the_Pectoralis_Major_and_Latissimus_Dorsi_Muscles_as_Evaluated_by_EMG


"In fact, according to our results, the pectoralis major presented a higher activation than the latissimus dorsi during all movement cycles, and the IEMG of the latissimus dorsi was approximately 10% of the IEMG of the pectoralis major (Figure 3)"