Clen: Two week on/Two week off question

[tommyguns]

I've read in several postings that many of you have been pleased with the 2 week on/2 week off protocol, with an ECA stack during the 2 week off period.  However, I've read that an ECA stack hits the same beta-2 receptors.  If so, are you truly allowing the receptors to upgrade properly during the off period?

Also, I've read that either Ketotifen or Benedryl are sometimes used to inhibit the rate of beta-2 receptor degradation.  Have any of you used these for that purpose, and did you feel as though it helped you extend the period that you could use the clen significantly beyond the 2 weeks?

Lastly, have any of you tried simply measuring a baseline body temp for 1 week prior to using the clen, and then running a continuous ON cycle of the clen until your body temp was no longer sufficiently elevated, and using such a marker to trigger an OFF period of 2 weeks.  If so, would you continue until your body temp came all the way back down to the baseline level or discontinue and some earlier time period?

I look forward to any feedback on these matters.

[DIVISION]

I've read in several postings that many of you have been pleased with the 2 week on/2 week off protocol, with an ECA stack during the 2 week off period.  However, I've read that an ECA stack hits the same beta-2 receptors.  If so, are you truly allowing the receptors to upgrade properly during the off period?

Also, I've read that either Ketotifen or Benedryl are sometimes used to inhibit the rate of beta-2 receptor degradation.  Have any of you used these for that purpose, and did you feel as though it helped you extend the period that you could use the clen significantly beyond the 2 weeks?

Lastly, have any of you tried simply measuring a baseline body temp for 1 week prior to using the clen, and then running a continuous ON cycle of the clen until your body temp was no longer sufficiently elevated, and using such a marker to trigger an OFF period of 2 weeks.  If so, would you continue until your body temp came all the way back down to the baseline level or discontinue and some earlier time period?

I look forward to any feedback on these matters.

No,  ECA and Clen don't work the same way.

Clen stimulate "brown fat" lipolysis, the fat that is burned during heat regulation.  ECA has nothing to do with that.  They work through different mechanisms in the body.

Yes, using Ketotifen can upregulate the beta-2 receptors so you can jump back on the Clen after two weeks.

That's how it runs.





DIV

[tommyguns]

Thanks for the helpful info.

Regarding use of the Ketotifen, if I understand your answer correctly, you would use it during the off period in order to have the receptors fully up-regulated by the end of the 2 week period.

Does anyone ever use it during the clen on period in order to retard the receptor degradation rate in order to extend the on period longer than 2 weeks?

[Princess L]

Thanks for the helpful info.

Regarding use of the Ketotifen, if I understand your answer correctly, you would use it during the off period in order to have the receptors fully up-regulated by the end of the 2 week period.

Does anyone ever use it during the clen on period in order to retard the receptor degradation rate in order to extend the on period longer than 2 weeks?

I think I recall the eph 2 week off recommendation reason is to help alleviate the energy crash and that it really doesn't produce greater results.  DIV ?

As far as taking the two together, I have heard of guys doing that, fact is it used to be pretty standard "back in the day".  Don't know if it's the wise thing to do ....

EDIT:  Sorry 
thought you were talking about Eph & clen together

[DIVISION]

Thanks for the helpful info.

Regarding use of the Ketotifen, if I understand your answer correctly, you would use it during the off period in order to have the receptors fully up-regulated by the end of the 2 week period.

Does anyone ever use it during the clen on period in order to retard the receptor degradation rate in order to extend the on period longer than 2 weeks?

As far as I know it's during the off-time when you are using the ECA.

That was the idea.

Some people probably use Ketotifen during the two weeks and then concurrently with Clen as well.





DIV

[Princess L]

...more

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...777&query_hl=6
Effects of ketotifen on the responsiveness of peripheral blood lymphocyte beta-adrenergic receptors.
"The effects of ketotifen therapy on the responsiveness of lymphocyte beta-adrenergic receptors was evaluated by measuring cyclic AMP elevations caused by isoproterenol [a beta2-agonist] in cells isolated from patients treated with ketotifen for more than 1 year. Binding of 3H-dihydroalprenolol to beta-receptors was also evaluated. The isoproterenol-induced rise in cyclic AMP relative to each individual's baseline level was greater in patients on current ketotifen therapy than in other asthmatic patients or non-asthmatic subjects. Ketotifen therapy increased the apparent equilibrium dissociation constant for specific 3H-dihydroalprenolol binding to the receptors. Receptor numbers in symptomatic asthma patients on standard drug therapy were decreased. The results indicate that long term ketotifen therapy is associated with increased responsiveness of beta-receptors to stimulation by catecholamines and that this alteration may involve changes in the receptors themselves, their membrane environment, adenylate cyclase or components of the adenylate cyclase coupling system."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...319&query_hl=2
Effects of ketotifen and clenbuterol on beta-adrenergic receptor functions of lymphocytes
"Applying ketotifen and clenbuterol together the beta-adrenergic receptor function increased compared to the values obtained after application of clenbuterol alone (intraindividual-control) as well as vs. the group of healthies (control). Data presented support the view that therapeutic doses of selective beta 2-agonists do not lead to damage of the beta-adrenoceptor function. The improvement of receptor function after parallel administration of clenbuterol and ketotifen may be a consequence of the participation of ketotifen in the control of beta-adrenergic receptor system."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...180&query_hl=6
Effects... of ketotifen on beta 2 adrenergic receptor regulation in intact human lymphocytes
"KET alone also induced an up-regulation of cell surface beta adrenergic receptors."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...002&query_hl=6
[Bronchial adrenergic receptors and asthma. Tachyphylaxis and its prevention]
(Tachyphylaxis is rapidly diminishing response to successive doses of a drug, rendering it less effective)
"The majority of the clinical studies in healthy volunteers have shown that chronic inhalation or oral intake of sympathomimetics causes tachyphylaxis of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptors... Several well controlled studies have however shown that chronic administration of sympathomimetics results in a significantly decreased sensitivity of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptor... Corticosteroids, given orally or parenterally, restore the sensitivity of the beta adrenergic receptors. In a double blind, placebo controlled study in healthy subjects we have observed that ketotifen prevents the development of a tachyphylaxis of the bronchial beta adrenergic receptor during prolonged treatment with inhaled sympathomimetics."

[DIVISION]

^Good info, baby Princess.






DIV