Author Topic: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here  (Read 3604 times)

Tapeworm

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #50 on: July 09, 2021, 05:37:49 AM »
So an article not even written by an Australian on a non Australian site accounts for manipulation ???

You know that I'm here in Aus too and nobody is forcing you to do shit with respect for the vaccine.  There are no benefits in lockdowns.  It is entirely up to you.  Maybe the people you're around are exerting pressure, but that's just the circle you exist in.  Hell, you can only get it if YOU go to a site that fuck all people know about and sign up YOURSELF to eventually get an appointment.  There's nobody saying shit to you if you don't do it.  Utter bullshit that you're being pressured to get it. 

Not so, man. My gf works in aged care. Federal mandate was handed down to the states about a week and a half ago: First shot in by mid September or she's fired.

Yeah, I understand everyone wants mom to be as safe as possible but from the worker's side it's coercing consent to accept something they were offered and declined. If they legislate this in WA, it'll be to protect the elderly, who are already vaccinated, from a virus which isn't here, with a vaccine which doesn't eliminate transmission. Imo, that doesn't meet the threshold of justification for extorting consent from workers and throwing a foundational principal of medical ethics, informed consent, right out the window.

They're going to do real, measurable harm to these workers because it might possibly provide additional protection in the event of a hypothetical situation which could arise if we're willing to indulge in speculation to imagine it.

No. Polls say 86% of Australians surveyed favor mandatory vaccination for aged care workers. I say 86% of Australians favor mandates of which they themselves will not be the object.

We're getting ready to harm a group of people, strip away their rights, so that the rest of us can feel safe. It's fucked. It's savagery. It's the mindset that put Japanese into internment camps and burned women at the stake.

No one will acknowledge the morally precariousness of this. 2 MPs have yet to write back. The Human Rights Commission agrees its a grey area but can't interfere with the legislature. The man at the legislature told me that new laws generally take 3 weeks to pass, but covid legislation goes through in 24 hours. I'm still waiting for ATAGI to point me to the studies upon which the AHPPC has based their recommendation to the national cabinet. Lawyers don't even return my messages.

And I've made a point of saying, every time, that the vaccine is a good thing but coercing consent needs to be examined from a labour law and medical ethics standpoint. You can't get anyone to talk about it, because it's career suicide to breathe a word against the vaccine.

The "you can't be too safe" logic to justify this applies to you and me just as readily. But even if it goes no further than these 200,000 people, it's still indefensible.

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #51 on: July 09, 2021, 05:45:00 AM »
July 7th 2020 - 7 day avg deaths 596
July 7th 2021 - 7 day avg deaths 156

74% reduction in deaths.  Pretty obvious the vaccine is working as deaths are down and for the most part everyone is back to normal.

You provide a piece of data without any links or context and act like you cracked the case. That’s why he’s accusing you of being simplistic.

Is the way the CDC characterizes deaths from COVID the same now as it was a year ago? Are as many people being tested?

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #52 on: July 09, 2021, 05:54:14 AM »
Not so. The pressure and manipulation is presented constantly in the press by the health officials. They say they want the majority of the population vaccinated before we can stop lockdowns and be able to travel.

Reuters is a reliable propaganda outlet. You just have to read between the lines. Your country was behind in slowing down the economy so the risk of hyperinflation is still there. They’ll open up at the end of winter.



https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/australias-slow-vaccination-locked-borders-eclipse-early-virus-success-2021-07-08/

SYDNEY, July 8 (Reuters) - Last year, when much of the world was in coronavirus lockdown, Australia was successfully hosting international cricket matches and tennis tournaments in front of packed crowds in a show of what post-pandemic life could look like.

Taffin

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #53 on: July 09, 2021, 06:05:49 AM »
A nerd fraternity is the nexus of the Lambda variant.

HAHAHAAAAAA!  Brilliant  ;D


A leading US disease expert says there's 'no doubt in my mind' that people are the leading cause of murder


Big Sugar has influence.

That was a great Simpsons episode

T

Body-Buildah

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #54 on: July 09, 2021, 06:06:42 AM »
You provide a piece of data without any links or context and act like you cracked the case. That’s why he’s accusing you of being simplistic.

Is the way the CDC characterizes deaths from COVID the same now as it was a year ago? Are as many people being tested?

"Coffee spitting" LOL reported...  :D

rocket

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #55 on: July 09, 2021, 03:53:56 PM »
Not so. The pressure and manipulation is presented constantly in the press by the health officials. They say they want the majority of the population vaccinated before we can stop lockdowns and be able to travel.

I don't hear that sentence and feel any pressure at all.  I might be a mutant though.  I am certainly no sheep.




AbrahamG

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #56 on: July 09, 2021, 04:54:27 PM »
You provide a piece of data without any links or context and act like you cracked the case. That’s why he’s accusing you of being simplistic.

Is the way the CDC characterizes deaths from COVID the same now as it was a year ago? Are as many people being tested?

That's because this is pretty simple.  Unvaccinated are dying.  Vaccinated are not. 

Body-Buildah

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #57 on: July 09, 2021, 04:56:33 PM »
A virus that is 99.99% curable, with a "fix" (Vax) that has killed people.  ::)

Tapeworm

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #58 on: July 09, 2021, 05:03:35 PM »
I don't mind the naggers. Ok, they annoy you but it's not the end of the world.

But firing people feels like crossing a line. There are other ways they can handle this which won't cause a labour crisis and wouldn't step on rights and the medical code of practice.

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #59 on: July 09, 2021, 05:11:26 PM »
That's because this is pretty simple.  Unvaccinated are dying.  Vaccinated are not.


The median age is NYC is 35. Most of the population is between 25-45. There was never a first wave among healthy working aged people.

You see this is called data. You’ve contributed exactly zero of it. What are the demographics of these unvaccinated people dying? My guess is that they’re junkies.




Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #60 on: July 09, 2021, 05:27:49 PM »
I don't mind the naggers. Ok, they annoy you but it's not the end of the world.

But firing people feels like crossing a line. There are other ways they can handle this which won't cause a labour crisis and wouldn't step on rights and the medical code of practice.

Nice spelling, foreigner.

Agree that people who annoy you are naggers.
Y

Tapeworm

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #61 on: July 09, 2021, 06:00:06 PM »
 :) For how much longer? The accent makes bitching about government policy kinda hard.

The people are generally "hesitant" here. Meaning resistant. Uptake is the lowest in any Western nation, I would guess. Not sure but I think it's under 10%.

booty

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #62 on: July 09, 2021, 06:25:44 PM »
:) For how much longer? The accent makes bitching about government policy kinda hard.

The people are generally "hesitant" here. Meaning resistant. Uptake is the lowest in any Western nation, I would guess. Not sure but I think it's under 10%.
Yes it’s 9% I think. Another death in Western Australia, linked to AstraZeneca…. A 61 year old woman. With Pfizer adding heart inflammation as a possible side affect, I can’t see Australia even getting to 40% vaccinated.

booty

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #63 on: July 09, 2021, 06:29:47 PM »
Reuters is a reliable propaganda outlet. You just have to read between the lines. Your country was behind in slowing down the economy so the risk of hyperinflation is still there. They’ll open up at the end of winter.



https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/australias-slow-vaccination-locked-borders-eclipse-early-virus-success-2021-07-08/

SYDNEY, July 8 (Reuters) - Last year, when much of the world was in coronavirus lockdown, Australia was successfully hosting international cricket matches and tennis tournaments in front of packed crowds in a show of what post-pandemic life could look like.
Thank you and I do often read Reuters.com
I can’t see lockdowns ending at the end of winter as we are half way through and it’s getting worse as far as Covid cases and even more stricter measures.

rocket

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #64 on: July 09, 2021, 07:18:21 PM »
Not so, man. My gf works in aged care. Federal mandate was handed down to the states about a week and a half ago: First shot in by mid September or she's fired.

Yeah, I understand everyone wants mom to be as safe as possible but from the worker's side it's coercing consent to accept something they were offered and declined. If they legislate this in WA, it'll be to protect the elderly, who are already vaccinated, from a virus which isn't here, with a vaccine which doesn't eliminate transmission. Imo, that doesn't meet the threshold of justification for extorting consent from workers and throwing a foundational principal of medical ethics, informed consent, right out the window.

They're going to do real, measurable harm to these workers because it might possibly provide additional protection in the event of a hypothetical situation which could arise if we're willing to indulge in speculation to imagine it.

No. Polls say 86% of Australians surveyed favor mandatory vaccination for aged care workers. I say 86% of Australians favor mandates of which they themselves will not be the object.

We're getting ready to harm a group of people, strip away their rights, so that the rest of us can feel safe. It's fucked. It's savagery. It's the mindset that put Japanese into internment camps and burned women at the stake.

No one will acknowledge the morally precariousness of this. 2 MPs have yet to write back. The Human Rights Commission agrees its a grey area but can't interfere with the legislature. The man at the legislature told me that new laws generally take 3 weeks to pass, but covid legislation goes through in 24 hours. I'm still waiting for ATAGI to point me to the studies upon which the AHPPC has based their recommendation to the national cabinet. Lawyers don't even return my messages.

And I've made a point of saying, every time, that the vaccine is a good thing but coercing consent needs to be examined from a labour law and medical ethics standpoint. You can't get anyone to talk about it, because it's career suicide to breathe a word against the vaccine.

The "you can't be too safe" logic to justify this applies to you and me just as readily. But even if it goes no further than these 200,000 people, it's still indefensible.

Sorry, did mean to respond to this.  Genuine gripe you have.  Not sure what to say really.  Can't really see how either side is in the right.  That is a real example of pressure.  Pressure that the average citizen is absolutely not under.

Regretful situation to say the least.

The only thing I will say is that I don't really agree with the frame of mind of 86% comment.  I don't think it's fair to say that they're able to make that call because it's not them - I think that's mostly a standard that they would hold to themselves, were they in that situation too.  Anybody who gets vaccinated is pretty much making a statement to say that they wish to have a diminished chance of passing covid to someone*  If anything, I'd much rather that it was me getting the vaccine than my parents, who are now both 60+. 

Second shot has sucked though, bit under the weather.  Regardless, do I want my mother, who has had blood clots after surgery getting a vaccine?  Fuckkkk no.

*don't need to hear people's conjecture on how effective. 

AbrahamG

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #65 on: July 09, 2021, 07:22:11 PM »

The median age is NYC is 35. Most of the population is between 25-45. There was never a first wave among healthy working aged people.

You see this is called data. You’ve contributed exactly zero of it. What are the demographics of these unvaccinated people dying? My guess is that they’re junkies.

Hard to argue with those facts.   ::)

Tapeworm

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #66 on: July 09, 2021, 07:25:23 PM »
Yes it’s 9% I think. Another death in Western Australia, linked to AstraZeneca…. A 61 year old woman. With Pfizer adding heart inflammation as a possible side affect, I can’t see Australia even getting to 40% vaccinated.

At this stage, in the total absence of outbreak in WA, I don't see any reason not to let more data come in.

There's a big contrast between online complaints versus official statements telling us how safe it is. I might opt for the shot if risk of infection rises and the outcome looks perilous but I don't see the authorities as credible at the moment. There are lots of teething problems with these shots and no acknowledgment being given. That bugs me.

A government woman who will be tasked with seeing to the vaccination of aged care workers in the WA Wheatbelt told me, "You might as well take it now while it's still voluntary."

I said



But then I was all



And now I be like


rocket

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #67 on: July 09, 2021, 07:25:43 PM »
The people are generally "hesitant" here. Meaning resistant. Uptake is the lowest in any Western nation, I would guess. Not sure but I think it's under 10%.

As I said before - it's not well known how you actually get it here.  Most people I know had no idea you could sign up for it.  Demand obviously has spiked since the lockdowns have appeared, though.  Prior to the recent lockdowns, you could often turn up and get a shot with no appointment.  No chance now.

(at least in QLD)

Tapeworm

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #68 on: July 09, 2021, 07:39:05 PM »
Sorry, did mean to respond to this.  Genuine gripe you have.  Not sure what to say really.  Can't really see how either side is in the right.  That is a real example of pressure.  Pressure that the average citizen is absolutely not under.

Regretful situation to say the least.

The only thing I will say is that I don't really agree with the frame of mind of 86% comment.  I don't think it's fair to say that they're able to make that call because it's not them - I think that's mostly a standard that they would hold to themselves, were they in that situation too.  Anybody who gets vaccinated is pretty much making a statement to say that they wish to have a diminished chance of passing covid to someone*  If anything, I'd much rather that it was me getting the vaccine than my parents, who are now both 60+. 

Second shot has sucked though, bit under the weather.  Regardless, do I want my mother, who has had blood clots after surgery getting a vaccine?  Fuckkkk no.

*don't need to hear people's conjecture on how effective.

Right on. My basic position is that it's the individual's choice because it's their own body and we can't go squeezing people. They need to find other solutions. More carrot, less stick.

Fwiw and afaik, the data does show partial prophylaxis, so you are making things safer for your mom. It's still possible to carry and spread, however, so you still have to be careful. Sure I'm not saying anything you don't already know.

Mayday

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #69 on: July 10, 2021, 07:13:45 AM »
Yes it’s 9% I think.

8.8% of the population is Covid vaccinated.

21% of total Covid hospital patients are vaccinated.

Meaning we have an over representation of vaccinated people being hospitalised which is the exact opposite of what we should be seeing.

There was an initial concern over how the vaccine altered RNA which would make a person more susceptible in the future to catch a mutated variant and become more sick.

Today we have large vaccinated population overseas. Look at the Uk as an example. Majority is vaccinated yet the new mutated version is ripping through their population. Coincidence?

Fortress

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #70 on: July 10, 2021, 07:36:47 AM »
Since day one I’ve suggested that the vaccinated will become the “engines” driving the modifications of the initial virus.

Just makes sense to me.

From the start if we’d just allowed our natural immunities to negotiate the virus, at this point it’s very likely it would no longer even really be a thing.

Minimal social contact, masks, and now the big thing, experimental drug potions, have rendered us particularly vulnerable.

People will always die from sickness, born from any number of channels. It’s reality.

Our species HAS to interact intimately with our environment. To adapt. To survive.

And along the way there will be casualties.

One day the other guy. One day perhaps, me.

Truly living is not for cowards.

As a collective, we’ve become a race of cowards.


Thin Lizzy

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #71 on: July 10, 2021, 08:06:31 AM »
8.8% of the population is Covid vaccinated.

21% of total Covid hospital patients are vaccinated.


Meaning we have an over representation of vaccinated people being hospitalised which is the exact opposite of what we should be seeing.

There was an initial concern over how the vaccine altered RNA which would make a person more susceptible in the future to catch a mutated variant and become more sick.

Today we have large vaccinated population overseas. Look at the Uk as an example. Majority is vaccinated yet the new mutated version is ripping through their population. Coincidence?

Paging Dr. Abe G, please explain this😂

Megalodon

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #72 on: July 10, 2021, 08:22:24 AM »
TV doctor gets made a fool of on "his" own show and "his" only defense is to weep soy:

https://twitter.com/goodblackdude/status/1413706371434835968

Thin Lizzy

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #73 on: July 10, 2021, 08:55:41 AM »
Hard to argue with those facts.   ::)

“Funny” how we rarely get any any details about the so-called Covid deaths and when we do, it’s this:


Rockabilly Star Sanford Clark Dead at 85 After Battling COVID-19

https://tasteofcountry.com/rockabilly-sanford-clark-dead-dies/

Vallis tells the AP that Clark had been undergoing treatment for cancer at Mercy Hospital before contracting COVID-1.



Thin Lizzy

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Re: Covid Vaccine | Nothing to See Here
« Reply #74 on: July 10, 2021, 09:37:20 AM »
TV doctor gets made a fool of on "his" own show and "his" only defense is to weep soy:

https://twitter.com/goodblackdude/status/1413706371434835968

This was great. Complete meltdown😂😂😂