Interesting weight/strength correlation in the gym

[LurkerNoMore]

Ok, I had friends from Atlanta down for the holidays and we all caught a couple work outs last week.    One has a very unusual correlation with the pyramid set training method - increase weight / decrease reps.

To explain, on the bench, he can hit 225 for 20 reps easily not even to failure.  Now based on that, a good guess would be that he could hit 275 for 10-12 and/or probably 315 for 3-5.

But no.  He goes to 245 and struggles to hit 8-10.  265 is about 2-3 and 275 is a complete bomb.

Everyone gets weaker the more weight that is added, but I have never seen such a drastic drop off like this.  And from what he says, it is basically all his exercises and lifts that have this same anomaly.  On paper it sounds like a case of being mostly slow twitch muscle fibers, but I don't think so because his endurance is for shit.

Anyone else have a vast trade off like this?

[Thin Lizzy]

Are you sure those weren’t the CrossFit plates that look like 45s but are really 10.

Back in the day, I could do 3 sets of 10 with 225 which translated into 2 to 3 reps with 315.

Doing a pyramid, I could get 6 with 275.

[bhank]

You get stronger in the rep range you train

[IroNat]

You get stronger in the rep range you train

This.

[LurkerNoMore]

Are you sure those weren’t the CrossFit plates that look like 45s but are really 10.

Back in the day, I could do 3 sets of 10 with 225 which translated into 2 to 3 reps with 315.

Doing a pyramid, I could get 6 with 275.

No, these were the Ivankos.  We all used the same ones. 

[LurkerNoMore]

You get stronger in the rep range you train

I thought of this as well.  But it seems like such a significant drop off for such a small increase.  Very weird.

[SOMEPARTS]

Ok, I had friends from Atlanta down for the holidays and we all caught a couple work outs last week.    One has a very unusual correlation with the pyramid set training method - increase weight / decrease reps.

To explain, on the bench, he can hit 225 for 20 reps easily not even to failure.  Now based on that, a good guess would be that he could hit 275 for 10-12 and/or probably 315 for 3-5.

But no.  He goes to 245 and struggles to hit 8-10.  265 is about 2-3 and 275 is a complete bomb.

Everyone gets weaker the more weight that is added, but I have never seen such a drastic drop off like this.  And from what he says, it is basically all his exercises and lifts that have this same anomaly.  On paper it sounds like a case of being mostly slow twitch muscle fibers, but I don't think so because his endurance is for shit.

Anyone else have a vast trade off like this?

Only trains with 225 so he can bang out 225 all day. If you never train with say 315 you'll have a hard time stabilizing the extra weight over and above.

[Henda]

Ratio of muscle fibre type. He can probably knock out a fair few reps with a high percentage of his 1rm whereas others my need to go with a much lower percentage to achieve same reps

[Rambone]

Gayer than having friends over for the holidays

[LurkerNoMore]

Only trains with 225 so he can bang out 225 all day. If you never train with say 315 you'll have a hard time stabilizing the extra weight over and above.

There is truth in this.  While I said his endurance was for shit, it was basically cardiovascular wise.  He could have greater muscular endurance.  But I would think it would be a greater jump in weight numbers.  Like if you did 225 x number of times when you were benching 315 for five reps.  Once you got to ten reps with 315 it would result in more reps with 225 than you were previously doing.  Maybe it is just a weakness in the tendons and ligaments as you suggest.

Ratio of muscle fibre type. He can probably knock out a fair few reps with a high percentage of his 1rm whereas others my need to go with a much lower percentage to achieve same reps

You got a point here.

[The Scott]

Ok, I had friends from Atlanta down for the holidays and we all caught a couple work outs last week.    One has a very unusual correlation with the pyramid set training method - increase weight / decrease reps.

To explain, on the bench, he can hit 225 for 20 reps easily not even to failure.  Now based on that, a good guess would be that he could hit 275 for 10-12 and/or probably 315 for 3-5.

But no.  He goes to 245 and struggles to hit 8-10.  265 is about 2-3 and 275 is a complete bomb.

Everyone gets weaker the more weight that is added, but I have never seen such a drastic drop off like this.  And from what he says, it is basically all his exercises and lifts that have this same anomaly.  On paper it sounds like a case of being mostly slow twitch muscle fibers, but I don't think so because his endurance is for shit.

Anyone else have a vast trade off like this?

For me, I found that whatever I could do 20 reps with I could do 100 lbs  more for a single. But this was only on the bench.  When I did 20 reps with 250 lbs.  the next time I did chest and simply did some warm up with 135 lbs. then put on 350 lbs  and got a good single, albeit it touch and go but NO bouncing.  That was my best bench but I also weighed 250 lbs. so it really isn't that great. 

But at the time if seemed to be!

[joswift]

Ok, I had friends from Atlanta down for the holidays and we all caught a couple work outs last week.    One has a very unusual correlation with the pyramid set training method - increase weight / decrease reps.

To explain, on the bench, he can hit 225 for 20 reps easily not even to failure.  Now based on that, a good guess would be that he could hit 275 for 10-12 and/or probably 315 for 3-5.

But no.  He goes to 245 and struggles to hit 8-10.  265 is about 2-3 and 275 is a complete bomb.

Everyone gets weaker the more weight that is added, but I have never seen such a drastic drop off like this.  And from what he says, it is basically all his exercises and lifts that have this same anomaly.  On paper it sounds like a case of being mostly slow twitch muscle fibers, but I don't think so because his endurance is for shit.

Anyone else have a vast trade off like this?

I can do high reps with a decent weight but I only need to increase the weight by about 20% and then I struggle hitting 6 reps or so.

I was once doing 1 arm db rows training with someone , we were doing 10/12 reps with 120s.
He pushed hard and did 15 reps and said "beat that"
I managed 31 reps

[Humble Narcissist]

Gayer than having friends over for the holidays

[LurkerNoMore]

I can do high reps with a decent weight but I only need to increase the weight by about 20% and then I struggle hitting 6 reps or so.

I was once doing 1 arm db rows training with someone , we were doing 10/12 reps with 120s.
He pushed hard and did 15 reps and said "beat that"
I managed 31 reps

Do you think it is due to weak tendons and ligaments or lacking muscular endurance or what?

[bhank]

Shocked no one has mentioned maybe he put everything he had into his sets and was simply tired the closer you get to failure on set 1 the more you will fall off on set 2 and 3 etc etc did he do the set of 244lbs after the set of 225lbs for 20 reps because that first set probably wiped him out if he hadn’t done that first he would have gotten 245 for more reps. Those calculators are based on being fresh they don’t really apply to set 2,3 and 4

[beakdoctor]

Ok, I had friends from Atlanta down for the holidays and we all caught a couple work outs last week.    One has a very unusual correlation with the pyramid set training method - increase weight / decrease reps.

To explain, on the bench, he can hit 225 for 20 reps easily not even to failure.  Now based on that, a good guess would be that he could hit 275 for 10-12 and/or probably 315 for 3-5.

But no.  He goes to 245 and struggles to hit 8-10.  265 is about 2-3 and 275 is a complete bomb.

Everyone gets weaker the more weight that is added, but I have never seen such a drastic drop off like this.  And from what he says, it is basically all his exercises and lifts that have this same anomaly.  On paper it sounds like a case of being mostly slow twitch muscle fibers, but I don't think so because his endurance is for shit.

Anyone else have a vast trade off like this?

I was the same way when I was in my 20s and 30's.  I could do high reps with 225 no problem. Never get much of a pump. Usually feel it in my shoulders and triceps more than anything.  But go up to 245 struggle to get 8 and only get 3 or 4 out of 275. I once did 2 of 315. I thought it was 305 and expected to get 2 solid reps but struggled mightily on the 2nd rep. My bud from the gym told me that the particular bar I used was 10 lbs heavier than the standard bar. He was right so 315 it was.

Ive always had poor strength in the bench. Could never understand why and the particular issue of having that steep drop off after 225 was always frustrating.  IDK.. it was an odd feeling. Always felt it in my bones more than my muscles.

[loco]

[Spike]

has a lot to do with body weight/compostition


if your bro is say 215lbs 225lb for reps is nice - but you hit 245 that 30lbs over his bodyweight - its weight that he isn't used to in his regular day life/stresses -


the more accustomed you are to a stimulus the better you can respond

[Henda]

Sorry never saw you already mentioned the fibre type ratio when posted

I was always piss poor at benching but in comparison to your friend prior to getting sick could do 275x6 paused but only 12 reps or so with 225 would have to drop to around 150 to get 20 reps

[robcguns]

Sorry never saw you already mentioned the fibre type ratio when posted

I was always piss poor at benching but in comparison to your friend prior to getting sick could do 275x6 paused but only 12 reps or so with 225 would have to drop to around 150 to get 20 reps

How you doing Henda? Always good to see you posting.

[Henda]

How you doing Henda? Always good to see you posting.

Doing good Rob mate thanks, had echo scan on heart this morning im getting results tomorrow I tried asking the lass doing it how it looks she said it’s still not normal but looks to be not severely impaired but will know better tomorrow after the right people look at the scan but by sounds of it might be out of the severe heart failure category which will be good at least haha

Hope all is good with you and your family my friend

[robcguns]

At my best benching wise I would get 275x30,315x20,365x14,405x10,495x3 and 515x1  That was my best day of benching and I took a good 10 minutes between sets. I weighed 255 and was on 200mgs of boldenone weekly. My tris and shoulders did most the work but that’s how my strength correlated weight to rep wise. Didn’t make much sense.

With that said I can’t bench shit anymore.

[robcguns]

Doing good Rob mate thanks, had echo scan on heart this morning im getting results tomorrow I tried asking the lass doing it how it looks she said it’s still not normal but looks to be not severely impaired but will know better tomorrow after the right people look at the scan but by sounds of it might be out of the severe heart failure category which will be good at least haha

Hope all is good with you and your family my friend

Glad to hear it. Hopefully good news tomorrow. all is good here, same back to you and yours.

[Titus Pullo]

At my best benching wise I would get 275x30,315x20,365x14,405x10,495x3 and 515x1  That was my best day of benching and I took a good 10 minutes between sets. I weighed 255 and was on 200mgs of boldenone weekly. My tris and shoulders did most the work but that’s how my strength correlated weight to rep wise. Didn’t make much sense.

With that said I can’t bench shit anymore.

Sweet raisin danish... that's some awesome benching!

Getting strong in the lower rep ranges (and singles) IS partly fiber type based, but IMHO, getting good at the 1-3 rep range is more about training specificity.  Put simply, if you always work in the 8-10 (or higher) range, yeah:  you're gonna bomb on your potential/likely 1RM.  That's something to train for over the course of many weeks, even a few months, by gradually upping the weight and lowering the reps.  With some practice, anyone can improve and acclimate to the heavier stuff; the key is to take it slow.  Someone who can bench 225x20 is more than capable of a few reps with 315, but if he doesn't train in increasingly lower rep ranges with heavier weight over time, yeah:  that 315 might crush him.