Author Topic: Covid Lab Leak Theory  (Read 74616 times)

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #400 on: August 03, 2026, 07:46:35 PM »
Good commentary.  It's really disturbing how the media is failing to hold him accountable.  I don't know if this is related to TDS, but it just seems like large swaths of otherwise intelligent people have just lost the ability to be reasonable when it comes to things like this.

Nobody likes admitting they were duped.

But now we know folks like Tapper and Dana Bash were texting fauci encouragement, so they're also complicit.

Off topic, but Dana Bash and her husband have done so much damage.  She gave a cream puff interview to Harris and Walz after they hid for 39 days, works for the media entity that has caused so much distrust in the media, and her husband is one of the 51 "experts" in the Russiagate letter.
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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #401 on: August 05, 2026, 03:41:43 PM »
Nobody likes admitting they were duped.

But now we know folks like Tapper and Dana Bash were texting fauci encouragement, so they're also complicit.

Off topic, but Dana Bash and her husband have done so much damage.  She gave a cream puff interview to Harris and Walz after they hid for 39 days, works for the media entity that has caused so much distrust in the media, and her husband is one of the 51 "experts" in the Russiagate letter.

She, like nearly all of the high profile MSM "journalists" are just an extension of the Democrat party.  Real journalism is dead. 

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #402 on: August 05, 2026, 03:42:44 PM »

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #403 on: August 05, 2026, 05:45:09 PM »
Nobody likes admitting they were duped.

But now we know folks like Tapper and Dana Bash were texting fauci encouragement, so they're also complicit.

Off topic, but Dana Bash and her husband have done so much damage.  She gave a cream puff interview to Harris and Walz after they hid for 39 days, works for the media entity that has caused so much distrust in the media, and her husband is one of the 51 "experts" in the Russiagate letter.

How can you not see that fox and the right wing news media is the exact same way? They all fucking suck, it's all polarized.

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #404 on: August 05, 2026, 07:05:30 PM »
How can you not see that fox and the right wing news media is the exact same way? They all fucking suck, it's all polarized.

I wasn't aware Fox network folks were texting Fauci, and that Fox is a conservative network.

Thanks for the heads up.
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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #405 on: August 05, 2026, 08:53:39 PM »
I wasn't aware Fox network folks were texting Fauci, and that Fox is a conservative network.

Thanks for the heads up.

Don't forget that rightwing outlet NPR.

NPR
@NPR

Virus researchers — who are familiar with lab accidents and how research on coronaviruses is conducted — say there is virtually zero chance that the novel coronavirus was released as result of a lab accident, despite misinformation being circulated.
https://trib.al/BqdOxwm
6:03 AM · Apr 23, 2020

https://x.com/NPR/status/1253353708961902596

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #406 on: August 06, 2026, 02:02:51 AM »
I wasn't aware Fox network folks were texting Fauci, and that Fox is a conservative network.

Thanks for the heads up.

Obviously not my point but I am not sure why I expected a good faith response. This is a specific type of logical fallacy. be better.

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #407 on: August 06, 2026, 11:19:21 AM »
Obviously not my point but I am not sure why I expected a good faith response. This is a specific type of logical fallacy. be better.

Do better? - how about you do better than pointing out "fox news" as if that outlet balances out the myriad of other examples on the left?

Anyway I'm done with the "both sides" discussion.

Compare Fox News' accuracy on Covid, Fauci, the border, the Hunter Biden laptop, Russiagate, etc vs CNN.  Fox wins in a landslide.
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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #408 on: August 06, 2026, 11:42:39 AM »
Do better? - how about you do better than pointing out "fox news" as if that outlet balances out the myriad of other examples on the left?

Anyway I'm done with the "both sides" discussion.

Compare Fox News' accuracy on Covid, Fauci, the border, the Hunter Biden laptop, Russiagate, etc vs CNN.  Fox wins in a landslide.


What do you think someone with an obvious bias would say? would it sound like what you just said? perhaps you believe yourself immune to it. Fox is literally an arm of the republican party, msnbc the left, they are the polar opposites with both being propaganda machines.

Not sure why you are so worked up.

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #409 on: August 06, 2026, 12:20:02 PM »
Do better? - how about you do better than pointing out "fox news" as if that outlet balances out the myriad of other examples on the left?

Anyway I'm done with the "both sides" discussion.

Compare Fox News' accuracy on Covid, Fauci, the border, the Hunter Biden laptop, Russiagate, etc vs CNN.  Fox wins in a landslide.
It's funny because the liberals will go on about Fox supposedly being biased/propaganda but won't talk about the hundreds of leftist media propaganda machines that are running 24/7 to make sure the useful idiots are repeating what they say. ::)
Liberals will try to point out others bias while not acknowledging their own. Their hypocrisy knows no bounds.
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #410 on: August 06, 2026, 01:23:21 PM »

What do you think someone with an obvious bias would say? would it sound like what you just said? perhaps you believe yourself immune to it. Fox is literally an arm of the republican party, msnbc the left, they are the polar opposites with both being propaganda machines.

Not sure why you are so worked up.

Not sure why you think I'm worked up.

This is not about my conservative, or moreso, my anti-democrat bias - look at Fox' reporting on everything I listed, then compare it to the facts.  It's not even close on who was correct.

In addition, Fox doesn't hide it's bias, whereas CNN, MSNBC, ABC, NBC, CBS, NPR, etc try to claim they are legitimate unbiased journalists.

And I don't even really watch fox outside of maybe 5 min a week.  However, there is a reason the USA's faith in the media and gov't is eroding at an insane pace.
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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #411 on: August 06, 2026, 02:16:03 PM »
Not sure why you think I'm worked up.

This is not about my conservative, or moreso, my anti-democrat bias - look at Fox' reporting on everything I listed, then compare it to the facts.  It's not even close on who was correct.

In addition, Fox doesn't hide it's bias, whereas CNN, MSNBC, ABC, NBC, CBS, NPR, etc try to claim they are legitimate unbiased journalists.

And I don't even really watch fox outside of maybe 5 min a week.  However, there is a reason the USA's faith in the media and gov't is eroding at an insane pace.

I do not watch the news, I don't know why anyone would want there news given to them by a pundit. The internet provides numerous sources where you can verify the information with some degree of objectivity.

In multiple polls fox was voted the most biased overall, but it was heavily derided by demos and was a net positive for repubs.

https://www.businessinsider.com/most-biased-news-outlets-in-america-cnn-fox-nytimes-2018-8#1-breitbart-news-51-tie-2

You would have to give me specific claims, I was speaking in generalities as I don't watch the news and only see clips here or there. I am not in that ecosystem. However, I find myself disagreeing with fox more and agreeing more with other networks which tells me of the bias inherent on both sides as I am center-left, probably a centrist truly. I see both sides as having equal footing. I am all for law and order, rule of law but also for helping folks down on their luck and unity. Trump is just self-serving and it would seem that the right has to support him just like the left had to support Biden as he was becoming a living corpse. That is stupid imo.

https://www.businessinsider.com/most-biased-news-outlets-in-america-cnn-fox-nytimes-2018-8#1-breitbart-news-51-tie-2


Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #412 on: August 07, 2026, 06:14:06 AM »
I do not watch the news, I don't know why anyone would want there news given to them by a pundit. The internet provides numerous sources where you can verify the information with some degree of objectivity.

In multiple polls fox was voted the most biased overall, but it was heavily derided by demos and was a net positive for repubs.

https://www.businessinsider.com/most-biased-news-outlets-in-america-cnn-fox-nytimes-2018-8#1-breitbart-news-51-tie-2

You would have to give me specific claims, I was speaking in generalities as I don't watch the news and only see clips here or there. I am not in that ecosystem. However, I find myself disagreeing with fox more and agreeing more with other networks which tells me of the bias inherent on both sides as I am center-left, probably a centrist truly. I see both sides as having equal footing. I am all for law and order, rule of law but also for helping folks down on their luck and unity. Trump is just self-serving and it would seem that the right has to support him just like the left had to support Biden as he was becoming a living corpse. That is stupid imo.

https://www.businessinsider.com/most-biased-news-outlets-in-america-cnn-fox-nytimes-2018-8#1-breitbart-news-51-tie-2

Agree with first sentence.

I am not talking about bias.  I am talking about being factually correct.

Biden laptop, Biden's mental acuity, covid, russiagate, etc.  Fox wins easily.
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chaos

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #413 on: August 07, 2026, 07:32:42 AM »
Agree with first sentence.

Settle down Irongrip400. ;D ;D
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #414 on: August 07, 2026, 08:26:25 AM »
Settle down Irongrip400. ;D ;D

My estrogen levels went up 8% after I typed that.

Let me message van to see if he has any extra arimidex lying around
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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #415 on: August 07, 2026, 08:38:25 AM »
Agree with first sentence.

I am not talking about bias.  I am talking about being factually correct.

Biden laptop, Biden's mental acuity, covid, russiagate, etc.  Fox wins easily.

Highly disagree based on what little I have seen.

I don't really care about left or right, just mocking trump....

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #416 on: August 07, 2026, 08:39:56 AM »
Settle down Irongrip400. ;D ;D

I am going to have to apologize to you for whatever i did to you mentally. I own a hypergiant lot of space in your mind. Whatever emotional damage occurred I will pay for the therapy. I recommend EMDR for trauma.

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #417 on: August 07, 2026, 09:08:02 AM »
Highly disagree based on what little I have seen.

I don't really care about left or right, just mocking trump....

Without even researching:

Tapper / Morning Joe said Biden was sharp.

Mainstream media treated the covid lab leak as conspiracy / debunked.  Youtube demonetized videos mentioning it

MSNBC / Maddow said the virus ends full stop upon vaccination

Biden laptop stories suppressed / blocked by twitter / facebook

CNN/MSNBC/NYT amplified Steele dossier

None of this is debatable.



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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #418 on: August 07, 2026, 11:40:22 AM »
Cant comment on anything but covid

The lab leak is possible but lacks evidence. This is the latest review that has some access. The references are worth reading.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12040609/

The origin of COVID-19 remains a topic of vigorous scientific debate. The most widely supported theory is the natural spillover hypothesis, which posits that the virus was transmitted to humans through a process of accumulated mutations while circulating among animals. This theory is backed by numerous genomic analyses and evolutionary biology studies that support the natural emergence of SARS-CoV-2,2,3,4,5 with concrete evidence showing adaptation processes through recombination events among various hosts such as bats and pangolins.

The second hypothesis is the so-called “lab-leak theory,” suggesting that a new variant may have accidentally escaped from the Wuhan Institute of Virology (WIV) during serial passage or gain-of-function research on SARS-related viruses. Some circumstantial evidence seems to support this theory, such as reports that some WIV researchers showed COVID-like symptoms early on, records of high-risk coronavirus experiments led by Dr. Shi Zhengli’s team, and the fact that the earliest outbreak occurred in Wuhan.6 However, the viruses used in these experiments were not physically present but rather consisted of synthesized genetic sequences, meaning they were not complete, nor infectious viral particles capable of replication, and the pseudo-virus experiments conducted to test human cell entry lacked the ability to replicate. Dr. Shi Zhengli consistently emphasized from the outset that the virus was unrelated to their laboratory work.7

The third hypothesis is that the virus was deliberately engineered by the Chinese government or military as a biological weapon. This theory, however, lacks scientific credibility for multiple reasons. Most notably, if the virus were indeed developed as a bioweapon, there should have been a pre-developed vaccine or antidote to protect the developer's own population, which is a fundamental principle in biological warfare.8,9 In reality, China suffered massive losses during the COVID-19 pandemic. It is implausible to assume that any government would orchestrate such a self-destructive act."


It's less plausible then natural origin, with less support and evidence. I think concluding it was a lab leak is not parsimonious and I would not come to a conclusion that it was unless I was motivated by something other then evidence and logic essentially.

I am sure I could find equally ridiculous shit from the right but I don't care to, to be honest. I will take your word on the left wing media ecosystem, they both suck imo.

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #419 on: August 07, 2026, 12:42:23 PM »
Cant comment on anything but covid

The lab leak is possible but lacks evidence. This is the latest review that has some access. The references are worth reading.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12040609/

The origin of COVID-19 remains a topic of vigorous scientific debate. The most widely supported theory is the natural spillover hypothesis, which posits that the virus was transmitted to humans through a process of accumulated mutations while circulating among animals. This theory is backed by numerous genomic analyses and evolutionary biology studies that support the natural emergence of SARS-CoV-2,2,3,4,5 with concrete evidence showing adaptation processes through recombination events among various hosts such as bats and pangolins.

The second hypothesis is the so-called “lab-leak theory,” suggesting that a new variant may have accidentally escaped from the Wuhan Institute of Virology (WIV) during serial passage or gain-of-function research on SARS-related viruses. Some circumstantial evidence seems to support this theory, such as reports that some WIV researchers showed COVID-like symptoms early on, records of high-risk coronavirus experiments led by Dr. Shi Zhengli’s team, and the fact that the earliest outbreak occurred in Wuhan.6 However, the viruses used in these experiments were not physically present but rather consisted of synthesized genetic sequences, meaning they were not complete, nor infectious viral particles capable of replication, and the pseudo-virus experiments conducted to test human cell entry lacked the ability to replicate. Dr. Shi Zhengli consistently emphasized from the outset that the virus was unrelated to their laboratory work.7

The third hypothesis is that the virus was deliberately engineered by the Chinese government or military as a biological weapon. This theory, however, lacks scientific credibility for multiple reasons. Most notably, if the virus were indeed developed as a bioweapon, there should have been a pre-developed vaccine or antidote to protect the developer's own population, which is a fundamental principle in biological warfare.8,9 In reality, China suffered massive losses during the COVID-19 pandemic. It is implausible to assume that any government would orchestrate such a self-destructive act."


It's less plausible then natural origin, with less support and evidence. I think concluding it was a lab leak is not parsimonious and I would not come to a conclusion that it was unless I was motivated by something other then evidence and logic essentially.

I am sure I could find equally ridiculous shit from the right but I don't care to, to be honest. I will take your word on the left wing media ecosystem, they both suck imo.

The fact that the bolded part is an actual accepted debate only strengthens my point.

During Covid, even mentioning the lab leak theory got people demonetized on Youtube, Twitter accounts suspended, called a crazy conspiracy theorist, etc...

Discussions were thwarted on mainstream media, or completely ignored, censorship enacted, etc.

Big tech and  the gov't were controlling the narrative.

This did not happen on Fox in this context.

And the other examples I posted are easy to find.
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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #420 on: August 07, 2026, 01:18:39 PM »
The fact that the bolded part is an actual accepted debate only strengthens my point.

During Covid, even mentioning the lab leak theory got people demonetized on Youtube, Twitter accounts suspended, called a crazy conspiracy theorist, etc...

Discussions were thwarted on mainstream media, or completely ignored, censorship enacted, etc.

Big tech and  the gov't were controlling the narrative.

This did not happen on Fox in this context.

And the other examples I posted are easy to find.

I didn't say it wasn't possible, no rational person would, it does not appear like it was though from all the available concrete evidence. China was obfuscating as they always do which complicates the issue and the proximity etc are all interesting.

It's more plausible is was natural, that's what the current science says- do you not concede that fact?

I am sure there were ulterior motives for going hard after the lab leak people, many nefarious.

I think it was handled poorly, but that's in retrospect. I certainly wasn't compliant with the masks when I didn't have to be( I had to for work etc) and I didn't get a booster. That wasn't some political stance, I was just too lazy and didn't give a fuck tbh. I think ruining people's economic situations was ridiculous but I wasn't looking at the modeling and don't know enough about epidemiology to have my opinion count. I think these are all very sober stances tbh.

If you cannot conceive of the possibility that is was most likely natural then it's hard to debate the topic.

Grape Ape

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #421 on: August 07, 2026, 02:43:22 PM »
I didn't say it wasn't possible, no rational person would, it does not appear like it was though from all the available concrete evidence. China was obfuscating as they always do which complicates the issue and the proximity etc are all interesting.

It's more plausible is was natural, that's what the current science says- do you not concede that fact?

I am sure there were ulterior motives for going hard after the lab leak people, many nefarious.

I think it was handled poorly, but that's in retrospect. I certainly wasn't compliant with the masks when I didn't have to be( I had to for work etc) and I didn't get a booster. That wasn't some political stance, I was just too lazy and didn't give a fuck tbh. I think ruining people's economic situations was ridiculous but I wasn't looking at the modeling and don't know enough about epidemiology to have my opinion count. I think these are all very sober stances tbh.

If you cannot conceive of the possibility that is was most likely natural then it's hard to debate the topic.

I really didn't want to debate the topic.  I haven't read anything more than a cursory glance, and was more coming from the angle that the lab leak was amplified on fox, ignored or dismissed on other mediums, and it's still in play.

I've always Occam's razor'd this one:  Corona virus originated in a place that had a lab studying Corona viruses, and possibly gain of function research, so that would be most plausible.

Does any of the below bother you?

Quote
In early 2020 diary entries (released by Sen. Rand Paul in 2026 as part of “Tony’s Diary”), Fauci privately noted that the Wuhan wet market was not the origin of the first COVID-19 infections and that scientists on a key call largely viewed deliberate lab insertion of features (like the furin cleavage site) as possible—while he later publicly emphasized a natural animal-to-human spillover and downplayed or dismissed lab-leak ideas as unlikely or conspiracy-adjacent.
Key diary details often cited:

January 26, 2020: Fauci wrote that epidemiological and genomic data indicated the first infection occurred in early December 2019 and “was not connected to the market.” China had initially claimed no human-to-human transmission and that the original cases all linked to the market. He continued: “Now we know the market was not the source, it was the amplifier. Having said that, somewhere the virus jumped from animals to humans.”
Late January / February 1, 2020: He recorded a conference call with experts after scientists raised concerns about the virus’s features (including the furin cleavage site). Per the notes, most participants (accounts vary slightly but commonly describe 9 of 11, or all but two) felt deliberate insertion was possible; accidental release was viewed as more likely than intentional. He referenced Shi Zhengli’s years of work on coronaviruses (described in the entry in gain-of-function terms allowing spike-protein adaptation to human receptors) and wrote that “we could not let this go.”

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #422 on: August 12, 2026, 04:20:13 PM »
I really didn't want to debate the topic.  I haven't read anything more than a cursory glance, and was more coming from the angle that the lab leak was amplified on fox, ignored or dismissed on other mediums, and it's still in play.

I've always Occam's razor'd this one:  Corona virus originated in a place that had a lab studying Corona viruses, and possibly gain of function research, so that would be most plausible.

Does any of the below bother you?

I will read it now and respond spontaneously

In early 2020 diary entries (released by Sen. Rand Paul in 2026 as part of “Tony’s Diary”), Fauci privately noted that the Wuhan wet market was not the origin of the first COVID-19 infections and that scientists on a key call largely viewed deliberate lab insertion of features (like the furin cleavage site) as possible—while he later publicly emphasized a natural animal-to-human spillover and downplayed or dismissed lab-leak ideas as unlikely or conspiracy-adjacent.
Key diary details often cited:
January 26, 2020: Fauci wrote that epidemiological and genomic data indicated the first infection occurred in early December 2019 and “was not connected to the market.” China had initially claimed no human-to-human transmission and that the original cases all linked to the market. He continued: “Now we know the market was not the source, it was the amplifier. Having said that, somewhere the virus jumped from animals to humans.”Late January / February 1, 2020: He recorded a conference call with experts after scientists raised concerns about the virus’s features (including the furin cleavage site). Per the notes, most participants (accounts vary slightly but commonly describe 9 of 11, or all but two) felt deliberate insertion was possible; accidental release was viewed as more likely than intentional. He referenced Shi Zhengli’s years of work on coronaviruses (described in the entry in gain-of-function terms allowing spike-protein adaptation to human receptors) and wrote that “we could not let this go.”

No that doesn't bother me, that's a normal discussion amongst scientists. When they say possible, it's possible for sure. I probably feel it was from a lab but the current evidence does not support that.

I see a man questioning his beliefs and being skeptical which is what scientists are above anything else, they are trying to disprove things, not prove things essentially. Studies are designed to break beliefs.

The furin stuff isnt' a smoking gun, there are plenty of viruses that have it. From that perspective it's not any more likely it's a bioengineered virus.

The proximity of the lab, where it was first detected, being China, all very suspicious but very weak overall. It does paint a picture but it could be coincidence.

I don't care where it came from. If it was a lab, I don't care, I only care about the facts and truth. I don't see Fauci as a man who would purposely cause this and the deaths of millions, I don't think he was trying to spring a vaccine upon people and knew the consequences in advance. Nothing he did seems suspect if you put it in context and think about the situation. In hindsight it's easy to say this or that should have been done.

If we knew it would get weaker and weaker (which is a safe bet but one you can't make of course, it's peoples live) then yes we likely should of let it roll on through.

The vaccine is safe- it's safer than getting covid for the complications- and it was effective until the mutations occurred.



What are you suggesting Fauci did? knowingly lie for personal gain?


chaos

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Re: Covid Lab Leak Theory
« Reply #423 on: August 13, 2026, 06:17:19 AM »
Fauci = liar
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!