Long-Term TRT – Safe and Healthy?

[LurkerNoMore]

TRT was great but LH and FSH crashed and rendered the whole TRT thing useless for me

FSH can be managed with HCG or the alternative.  Which is why that is included in the protocol blueprint for all the HRT/TRT/anti aging clinics down here.

[BigRo]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/taking-testosterone-doesn-t-increase-heart-disease-risk-why-researchers-are-still-wary/ar-AA1cDtNW?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=322d166c59574625b60f202b371f2cc2&ei=115

Been on for 15yrs and 0 problems. Scared of Test and want to be an estrogen soaked middle aged guy , go for it. I have a better physique than the majority of guys in my gym in their 20's and 30's and I'm 52.

good for you, I will probably be on it at your age.

[Thin Lizzy]

So, do we have a sweet spot dosage where you see some bodybuilding gains without commensurate downside risk?

[Gym Rat]

So, if you stopped your TRT you would still be just as strong as you are now on TRT, even though your test level would go from 700-800 down to 250?

Your ability to train hard and recover would not change?

That is interesting but seems to defy logic.

I'm the same strength (I gained zero strength on it). I was stronger when younger of course (and natty).
You dont "feel" TRT, except maybe well-being and libido (if lacking). Everyone thinks Test is be-all, end-all... It's really not (at TRT doses).
Like when a teen has a high test-level, doesnt mean he'll bench 300 or put on tons of muscle, its very unique for all..

Recovery is much more than test, many get insomnia and shitty sleep on TRT (anxiety, etc)
Everyone reacts differently. The "logic" being spewed everyone thinks they'll turn into a huge BB being in-range, just on "TRT".
The vets who do it, laugh and know otherwise. Tons drop it because they see no changes, and dont want to up the dose to the dark-side.

ProHormones are 20X stronger than TRT (maybe more).

[ThisisOverload]

So, do we have a sweet spot dosage where you see some bodybuilding gains without commensurate downside risk?

I think it depends on a lot of things, but for me i didn't have any noticeable sides until 400-500mg per week, and the sides were minimal like elevated blood pressure and oily skin.

I'd say the benefits start around 250mg per week, but if you want real gains, 500mg per week.

There is always a risk, but i never had any issues using 500 or less.

I got in the best shape (not size) of my life using 200mg Test and 300mg Deca per week for a Summer cycle, started with some Anavar for 6 weeks i think.

Test isn't that hard on your body, but i would stay very far away from Tren and other heavy androgens.

These days i'd only recommend Test with a little Deca or Dbol.

Pretty docile cycle to be honest.

[ThisisOverload]

I'm the same strength (I gained zero strength on it). I was stronger when younger of course (and natty).
You dont "feel" TRT, except maybe well-being and libido (if lacking). Everyone thinks Test is be-all, end-all... It's really not (at TRT doses).
Like when a teen has a high test-level, doesnt mean he'll bench 300 or put on tons of muscle, its very unique for all..

Recovery is much more than test, many get insomnia and shitty sleep on TRT (anxiety, etc)
Everyone reacts differently. The "logic" being spewed everyone thinks they'll turn into a huge BB being in-range, just on "TRT".
The vets who do it, laugh and know otherwise. Tons drop it because they see no changes, and dont want to up the dose to the dark-side.

ProHormones are 20X stronger than TRT (maybe more).

Only thing i noticed on real TRT is libido increase.

You aren't going to gain shit on TRT.

My 74 year old dad is on TRT at a whopping 155 pounds.

He can hit a mean 7 iron though...

[38 returns]

Only thing i noticed on real TRT is libido increase.

You aren't going to gain shit on TRT.

My 74 year old dad is on TRT at a whopping 155 pounds.

He can hit a mean 7 iron though...

is your dad b Hankins?

[mwbbuilder]

It's 2023.

We still believe in "studies" by Big Pharma?

[IroNat]

It's 2023.

We still believe in "studies" by Big Pharma?

It's only a true study if you want it to be.

[Thin Lizzy]

I think it depends on a lot of things, but for me i didn't have any noticeable sides until 400-500mg per week, and the sides were minimal like elevated blood pressure and oily skin.

I'd say the benefits start around 250mg per week, but if you want real gains, 500mg per week.

There is always a risk, but i never had any issues using 500 or less.

I got in the best shape (not size) of my life using 200mg Test and 300mg Deca per week for a Summer cycle, started with some Anavar for 6 weeks i think.

Test isn't that hard on your body, but i would stay very far away from Tren and other heavy androgens.

These days i'd only recommend Test with a little Deca or Dbol.

Pretty docile cycle to be honest.

Thanks. My cycle back in the day was a little Deca and Anavar.

A guy in the gym said it was like drinking 2 beers a day. That was the winning sales pitch.😂

[ProudVirgin69]

It's 2023.

We still believe in "studies" by Big Pharma?

Is there a specific issue you have with the study or how it was conducted?  Or are you just posting your personal feelings?

[benchmstr]

FSH can be managed with HCG or the alternative.  Which is why that is included in the protocol blueprint for all the HRT/TRT/anti aging clinics down here.

I have used anywhere from 180mg to 600mg test e, p, and c a week for years and am still having kids..but I’ve done HCG 3x a week the whole time as well.

Bench

[Humble Narcissist]

It's 2023.

We still believe in "studies" by Big Pharma?

FOLLOW THE SCIENCE!!!

[LurkerNoMore]

I honestly do not think you can bodybuild or even retain decent muscle mass / hypertrophy on true TRT amounts. 

[Thin Lizzy]

I honestly do not think you can bodybuild or even retain decent muscle mass / hypertrophy on true TRT amounts.

From my understanding, when you take test exogenously, your body shuts down some production. So, you would have to  take a pretty high dosage to make a big difference from a bodybuilding standpoint.

[Primemuscle]

Reat TRT Brian, not a gram or two... Thats a cycle, not TRT...

https://www.t-nation.com/pharma/tip-long-term-trt-safe-and-healthy/

The German drug company Bayer just released a study on the effects of 11 years of testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) on a large group of men and the results might make even the most needle-phobic among us want to drop trou.

The study found that men who received TRT not only got healthier in a lot of ways, but they also lived longer, too.

Granted, there were a couple of things about the study that deserve a little extra scrutiny. For one, the specific TRT drug they used for the duration of the study was Nebido, an injectable version of a comparatively little-known testosterone ester named testosterone undecanoate (TU). (BUT, "test is test" as they say).

This drug has some interesting pharmacodynamics that differentiate it from other testosterone esters, but I'll get into that later. More importantly, Bayer, who manufactures Nebido, paid for the study and just about everyone involved in the study including Axel, the guy whose job it was to keep track of whether to inject in the right butt cheek or the left butt cheek, was on their payroll.

Still, the results don't really seem to conflict with the results of smaller TRT studies so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. Bottom line, the results appear to be good news for men.

Most studies also use gen-pop (AKA "Fat stinking kvnts") very unhealthy people...

I have been on a low dose TRT for decades now with no ill side effects. Currently taking between .75 and 1ml a week per doctor's orders.  For a geezer turning 79 years in a couple of months, I am incredibly (physically) healthy. Did labs for an upcoming physical and everything is right where it should be which means it is well within range. Obviously, I am not needle-phobic after all this time of sticking a 22g into muscle tissue... currently upper thighs because contortions aren't needed like when I pinned my glutes.   

[Rambone]

I have been on a low dose TRT for decades now with no ill side effects. Currently taking between .75 and 1ml a week per doctor's orders.  For a geezer turning 79 years in a couple of months, I am incredibly (physically) healthy. Did labs for an upcoming physical and everything is right where it should be which means it is well within range. Obviously, I am not needle-phobic after all this time of sticking a 22g into muscle tissue... currently upper thighs because contortions aren't needed like when I pinned my glutes.

22 gauge? Damn. Why not a 27g insulin pin?

[robcguns]

22 gauge? Damn. Why not a 27g insulin pin?

I remember using 22g most the time years ago and an 18g sometimes that was brutal. It is crazy how smoothly test flows thru a insulin pin these days cause back in the day I remember trying to use an insulin pin and the pin would just blow off the syringe form the pressure.

[Rambone]

I remember using 22g most the time years ago and an 18g sometimes that was brutal. It is crazy how smoothly test flows thru a insulin pin these days cause back in the day I remember trying to use an insulin pin and the pin would just blow off the syringe form the pressure.

18g? Holy hell!

[TheGrinch]

18g? Holy hell!

[Cook]

18g? Holy hell!

I accidentally did that once. I use an 18 to draw the test out of the bottle and forgot to change it over. I hit that thing and new immediately what happened. I went through with it though

[AbrahamG]

I've used a couple 23g's in the glutes back in the 90's.  Absolutely not necessary.  25g's work great for quads and delts.  Slin pins are great and can pretty much go into any body part within reason.  FFS Prime, I cannot imagine a 22g going into my quad.  Ouch. 

[robcguns]

I accidentally did that once. I use an 18 to draw the test out of the bottle and forgot to change it over. I hit that thing and new immediately what happened. I went through with it though

Yeah 18 is brutal, I bled like a stuck pig each time.

[ThisisOverload]

I've used a couple 23g's in the glutes back in the 90's.  Absolutely not necessary.  25g's work great for quads and delts.  Slin pins are great and can pretty much go into any body part within reason.  FFS Prime, I cannot imagine a 22g going into my quad.  Ouch.

I've been using slin pins for years.

21g was the largest i used.

I'd never use anything larger than 25g.

[Humble Narcissist]

Yeah 18 is brutal, I bled like a stuck pig each time.

Jeezus! I freak out over small needles. I think I'd pass out over an 18g.