Author Topic: Why does the IFBB..  (Read 11256 times)

LuciusFox

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #25 on: May 01, 2006, 04:43:56 PM »
Bob, I'm sorry I have been a prick in the past. But I'm being stone serious at the moment.

There are men with plane tickets to shows which are now worthless.  Athletes and their families are now stuck with worthless tickets.  Thousands spent on show prep is now wasted.  This would NOT fly in any other athleteic event.  If Tiger pulls out of a show he's signed up to do, he takes a financial penalty.  If Clinton agrees to speak at a University (and pulls out), there are financial penalties.  After all, advertising and prep goes into preparing for these events.

The athletes should not spend ONE DIME on show prep until they are guaranteed a contract.

Contracts, contracts, contracts!  This is a business, and men are losing money on this show as a result of incompetence!

 Bodybuilding is not a sport and should not be compared to sports or other legitimate activities.

onlyme

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #26 on: May 01, 2006, 04:46:41 PM »
I'm assuming you mean IFBB pros should get to do both divisions?

No actually both should be able to do both.  There will be plenty of PDI pros that will be as good as any of the IFBB pros.  Maybe not of COleman or Cutlers caliber of size but definitely any other

Chick

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #27 on: May 01, 2006, 04:49:14 PM »
I'm sure if this is a important issue with the athletes...they'll have no hesitation in letting me know.

BTW, ironically... this was a bullet point to be gone over at the last athletes meeting, along with other business matters.


thisiskeith12

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #28 on: May 01, 2006, 04:51:06 PM »
I'm sure if this is a important issue with the athletes...they'll have no hesitation in letting me know.

BTW, ironically... this was a bullet point to be gone over at the last athletes meeting, along with other business matters.



Don't you love it when people throw stones before reading the newspaper?

LuciusFox

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #29 on: May 01, 2006, 04:55:13 PM »
I'm sure if this is a important issue with the athletes...they'll have no hesitation in letting me know.

BTW, ironically... this was a bullet point to be gone over at the last athletes meeting, along with other business matters.



 I wish more pros would come to meetings. :-\

onlyme

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #30 on: May 01, 2006, 04:56:54 PM »
Don't you love it when people throw stones before reading the newspaper?

I only look at the pictures

Lift Studios

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #31 on: May 01, 2006, 05:05:07 PM »
No actually both should be able to do both.  There will be plenty of PDI pros that will be as good as any of the IFBB pros.  Maybe not of COleman or Cutlers caliber of size but definitely any other
HAHAAH that's hilarious Keith. Really, that's a good one. You're telling me there is a PDI Pro or will be that could stand next to Dexter Jackson, Branch Warren, Victor Martinez, etc and hold their own? Aside from Lee and Vince who are already an IFBB Pros - I'd love to see it.  Guess we'll have to see who these "plenty of PDI Pros" are - so far all you have is a nice theory.





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sarcasm

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #32 on: May 01, 2006, 05:06:46 PM »
Bob, I'm sorry I have been a prick in the past. But I'm being stone serious at the moment.

There are men with plane tickets to shows which are now worthless.  Athletes and their families are now stuck with worthless tickets.  Thousands spent on show prep is now wasted.  This would NOT fly in any other athleteic event.  If Tiger pulls out of a show he's signed up to do, he takes a financial penalty.  If Clinton agrees to speak at a University (and pulls out), there are financial penalties.  After all, advertising and prep goes into preparing for these events.

The athletes should not spend ONE DIME on show prep until they are guaranteed a contract.

Contracts, contracts, contracts!  This is a business, and men are losing money on this show as a result of incompetence!
most honest post i've seen on here.
Jaejonna rows 125!!

bigdumbbell

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #33 on: May 01, 2006, 06:05:11 PM »
they are all independent contractors

knny187

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #34 on: May 01, 2006, 06:11:07 PM »
You guys are giving Chick shit (wow that rhymes) like he's the one responsible for cancelling the show.    ???





Chick

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #35 on: May 01, 2006, 06:15:11 PM »
Hell all of a sudden a promoter is concerned about losing money.  The prize money is guaranteed by Manion.  When they do these shows the sposnsors are paying for a good part of the show.  Also, this is an established show isn't it, they have sponsors.  I wonder if Manion decided to cancel the show becasue he didn't see it being worth putting up the money for the prizes cause it was to close t possibly losing money and not covering the prize purse.  Also, Shawn will have to do the calculations over for how much an IFBB pro could have made from the Toronto, Ny and his show.  The numbers just went down. 

The sponsors didn't pony up any money to Winston. manion doesn't cancel shows...the promoter does. The sanction fee and purse was put up some time ago, in advance as per the rules. If the promoter failed to pay the athletes...manion and the IFBB would guarantee the athletes get paid.

bigdumbbell

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #36 on: May 01, 2006, 06:17:13 PM »
at least they guys got over 24 hour notice

timfogarty

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #37 on: May 01, 2006, 07:59:13 PM »
IFBB guarantees no shows- but requires that athletes can only compete in their federation.

BBING is not a team sport.

Nor is the IFBB a federation.  It is a privately held for-profit company.  Just like the World Wrestling Federation.  Except the WWF (or now WWE) is publicly traded.

onlyme

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #38 on: May 01, 2006, 10:20:44 PM »
Nor is the IFBB a federation.  It is a privately held for-profit company.  Just like the World Wrestling Federation.  Except the WWF (or now WWE) is publicly traded.

The IFBB is a non-profit organization regsitered in Canada is it not?

240 is Back

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #39 on: May 01, 2006, 10:22:36 PM »
I thought the IFBB was a Canadian NPG, correct.

PDI is a sports corporation, so they can do what they want.

timfogarty

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #40 on: May 01, 2006, 10:36:24 PM »
the amateur IFBB may be a real sports federation, a federation of national amateur sports organizations.  they formed in 1964 with their first international congress.

but the pro IFBB is clearly a for-profit corporation

other fun facts:

the IFBB claims that it was founded in 1946.  but the December 1947 Your Physique is where they first propose forming a federation of bodybuilders.   In June 1948 Your Physique they announce their first contest will be the Mr Eastern North America. 

Dan Lurie used the name International Federation of Body Builders first for his January 1948 Mr New York show.  The Weiders had nothing to do with that show.  He claims he registered the name with the city of New York in Brooklyn in May 1947.   But a recent record search was not able to find anything, as a large number of city records from that time were lost from water damage from a fire in a nearby building.

The January 1950 Your Physique announces that the IFBB has reached an agreement with the AAU and will no longer hold amateur contests.  All future IFBB contests will be professional only.  However, they only hold one or two more contests (not sure of the timing), including the 1952 Mr California, then nothing until the 1959 IFBB Universe.   The IFBB Universe was clearly a professional contest its first few years, but was probably a true amateur event by 63 or 64.  It became the World Amateur Championships in 1978.

The IFBB is calling this year's World Amateur Championships the 60th.  That implies that there have been 59 others.   But at most it's the 47th, but even that includes the first few pro events.

gordiano

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #41 on: May 02, 2006, 12:07:22 AM »
Bob, all flaming aside, if I was an IFBB athlete who had planned my year around doing the Toronto Pro, I'd be pretty upset right now.

It is time to unionize the athletes.  neither IFBB nor PDI affiliations.  But Pro BBer affiliation.  Guys should be able to do both divisions, promoters should require contracts so they can secure sponsors, and athletes should be guaranteed a payout should a show go belly-up once they're prepping for it.



Fuck, the competitors won't even attend meetings to better the IFBB. How can you unionize it, when they don't care?
Let's face it, most pros are not very smart. They have been taken advantage of for decades and will continue to be taken advantage of.
HAHA, RON.....

LuciusFox

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #42 on: May 02, 2006, 08:05:55 AM »
f**k, the competitors won't even attend meetings to better the IFBB. How can you unionize it, when they don't care?
Let's face it, most pros are not very smart. They have been taken advantage of for decades and will continue to be taken advantage of.

 This is the truth. Why whine about things if the pros aren't bothered by things?

Juilette

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #43 on: May 02, 2006, 02:19:51 PM »
Please...the NYPro is a week away from the Toronto...any athlete can compete there as well.

But when an athlete signs the contract to compete and decide not to they have to pay a fine. Now the promotor decides not to have the contest but the not invited athletes already paid there airfare to Toronto and hotel etc. The hotel they can cancell but the airfare you cannot, because most of the athletes who have to pay for there airfare choose for the cheapest ticket.

The athlete has to pay a fine for not competing so will they be reimbursed for the cost they already made and if this is not possible and they like to compete in New York will there airfare be reimbursed for this show as compensation?

I ask this because one of my friends, from the Netherlands, was going to compete in Figure in Toronto and now she paid for nothing.

I also know that the IFBB cannot be blamed for this, the promotor is the blame but is it not possible that the IFBB, when they already received the sanction fee, deduct these cost made by athletes from this fee before they pay this back to the promotor. When they do not pay this back they can use a part of this money for these athletes.

240 is Back

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #44 on: May 02, 2006, 02:23:55 PM »
The Athletes KNOW Bob is a company man who shows his bias.  Remember him bashing Mustafa on the mic?  First on the radio show, then AT the show, then AFTER the show.

Bob, you're just too close with Manion, IFBB, etc to be taken seriously as a man who will stand up for change. 

Seriously, the athletes need a lawyer who will unionize them into a professional service organization with rights.  Someone stand up already.  The Straight 1's in the Masters Pro shows that Bob CHick is a golden boy.  And golden boys can never make change in the house where they are spoiled.

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #45 on: May 02, 2006, 02:34:09 PM »
Gotta admit Bob , they are all valid pionts the guys are making here !!!!! :-\

Don't expect any answers other than "make lemonade". Which is exactly the response you want from your representative.

onlyme

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #46 on: May 02, 2006, 04:21:51 PM »
There really isn't any explanation or reason why the IFBB does not pony up the money to cover the Toronto Pro.  They are in fact involved becasue they have been promoting the show and had it on their schedule (it is gone now).  If they agree to take the money from the promoter and put it on the official schedule then they are responsible for supporting it 100%.  The IFBB gets $400,000 a year from AMI for next 6 years plus the sanction fees and membership dues.  Why can't they just support the promoter for once and the athletes and put up the money to continue the show.  You knwo why cause they DON'T GIVE A SHIT.  It is truly that simple.  They have all kinds of money yet refuse to actually get involved with a show.  Doesn't that tell you something about them and their integrity. Why people continue to support this organization is beyond me.  Who knows what's going to happen to the Ironman and San Fran Pro. 

It is looking better and better everday for the PDI.

LuciusFox

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #47 on: May 02, 2006, 05:25:31 PM »
The Athletes KNOW Bob is a company man who shows his bias.  Remember him bashing Mustafa on the mic?  First on the radio show, then AT the show, then AFTER the show.

Bob, you're just too close with Manion, IFBB, etc to be taken seriously as a man who will stand up for change. 

Seriously, the athletes need a lawyer who will unionize them into a professional service organization with rights.  Someone stand up already.  The Straight 1's in the Masters Pro shows that Bob CHick is a golden boy.  And golden boys can never make change in the house where they are spoiled.

 I'm sure the athletes appreciate your concern ::)

onlyme

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #48 on: May 02, 2006, 10:00:34 PM »
the amateur IFBB may be a real sports federation, a federation of national amateur sports organizations.  they formed in 1964 with their first international congress.

but the pro IFBB is clearly a for-profit corporation

other fun facts:

the IFBB claims that it was founded in 1946.  but the December 1947 Your Physique is where they first propose forming a federation of bodybuilders.   In June 1948 Your Physique they announce their first contest will be the Mr Eastern North America. 

Dan Lurie used the name International Federation of Body Builders first for his January 1948 Mr New York show.  The Weiders had nothing to do with that show.  He claims he registered the name with the city of New York in Brooklyn in May 1947.   But a recent record search was not able to find anything, as a large number of city records from that time were lost from water damage from a fire in a nearby building.

The January 1950 Your Physique announces that the IFBB has reached an agreement with the AAU and will no longer hold amateur contests.  All future IFBB contests will be professional only.  However, they only hold one or two more contests (not sure of the timing), including the 1952 Mr California, then nothing until the 1959 IFBB Universe.   The IFBB Universe was clearly a professional contest its first few years, but was probably a true amateur event by 63 or 64.  It became the World Amateur Championships in 1978.

The IFBB is calling this year's World Amateur Championships the 60th.  That implies that there have been 59 others.   But at most it's the 47th, but even that includes the first few pro events.

Sorry the IFBB is a tax-exempt federation.  The pay no US taxes on the money it recieves.  You would think that with all this money they could help out a promoter who is trying to promote an IFBB event.  They have plenty of money just not the balls.  It will be intersting to see what happens to the Ironman and the San Fran. Pro.  Slowly but surely IFBB shows are going down.  Pretty soon they will only have the Olympia.  And with it losing money now maybe that not much longer.  How long do you think promoters are going to keep losing money and sponsors are going to sponsors shows that aren't even close to selling out.  The Colorado Pro at most will have an audience of 1500 with many of them sponsors, comped or VIP.  To bad Shawn is such an up and up guy.

timfogarty

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Re: Why does the IFBB..
« Reply #49 on: May 02, 2006, 11:02:30 PM »
Sorry the IFBB is a tax-exempt federation.  The pay no US taxes on the money it recieves.

First, it's a Canadian company.  Second,  the amateur IFBB may be a federation.  my dictionary says a federation is an organization or group within which smaller divisions have some degree of internal autonomy.  That could describe the amateur IFBB, a group of national amateur bodybuilding organizations.   But the pro division is neither a federation or a non-profit.  Could Major League Baseball or any other pro sports organization be a non-profit?

finally, "federation" has no legal meaning in the US regarding corporations, for- or non- profit.