clavicle widening

[wes]

I about killed myself on that program.

It wasn`t very much fun ! 

[falco]

Decades ago at a nearby unversity there was a study linking the widening of clavicles and competitive swimming during puberty. Once the athlete aged, that effect got negligible.

[BEEFCAKE]

Decades ago at a nearby unversity there was a study linking the widening of clavicles and competitive swimming during puberty. Once the athlete aged, that effect got negligible.

how do your giant woodchuck teeth affect your swimming ability? do they create Hydrodynamic drag ?

[falco]

how do your giant woodchuck teeth affect your swimming ability? do they create Hydrodynamic drag ?

Who's the gimmick now?

[Van_Bilderass]

Decades ago at a nearby unversity there was a study linking the widening of clavicles and competitive swimming during puberty. Once the athlete aged, that effect got negligible.

A few years ago several doctors complained of parents asking for Anavar, Armidex and GH for their young kids. Estrogen seals the growth plates and Arimidex has been shown to increase adult height when used during puberty. Anavar doesn't convert to estrogen and seemingly doesn't affect adult height, maybe even increases it, and GH could boost adult height as well. Perhaps these might increase the size of the skeleton  in general too, apart from height? So some parents are maybe too willing to experiment on their kids for possible sports glory.

[falco]

A few years ago several doctors complained of parents asking for Anavar, Armidex and GH for their young kids. Estrogen seals the growth plates and Arimidex has been shown to increase adult height when used during puberty. Anavar doesn't convert to estrogen and seemingly doesn't affect adult height, maybe even increases it, and GH could boost adult height as well. Perhaps these might increase the size of the skeleton  in general too, apart from height? So some parents are maybe too willing to experiment on their kids for possible sports glory.

I thought it was test. Hence why kids who juice to soon halt their growth.

[Van_Bilderass]

I thought it was test. Hence why kids who juice to soon halt their growth.

Well yes, depends on how you look at it. Test can seal the plates since a percentage converts to estrogen. I guess you could use test with Arimidex to avoid it but Anavar never increases estrogen, it will drastically reduce it if no other aromatising drugs are used. Anavar shuts down natural test production so now you have no substrate for estrogen since estrogen almost completely comes from testosterone. Tall girls not infrequently want to suppress adult height, because it may be harder for them to find a partner, and they are given estrogen for this.

I don't think it has really been examined how much test use in the teens might affect adult height, there's obvious ethical conerns, but the theory is solid.

[falco]

Well yes, depends on how you look at it. Test can seal the plates since a percentage converts to estrogen. I guess you could use test with Arimidex to avoid it but Anavar never increases estrogen, it will drastically reduce it if no other aromatising drugs are used. Anavar shuts down natural test production so now you have no substrate for estrogen since estrogen almost completely comes from testosterone. Tall girls not infrequently want to suppress adult height, because it may be harder for them to find a partner, and they are given estrogen for this.

I don't think it has really been examined how much test use in the teens might affect adult height, there's obvious ethical conerns, but the theory is solid.

I believe height is mostly genetic determined. Poor nutrition can make people shorter also. Here in Portugal people my age are always taller than their parents, and i am convinced it is due to better nutrition, since my parents grew during extreme poverty, due to shitty political options and the aftermath of 2nd world war.

[Van_Bilderass]

I believe height is mostly genetic determined. Poor nutrition can make people shorter also. Here in Portugal people my age are always taller than their parents, and i am convinced it is due to better nutrition, since my parents grew during extreme poverty, due to shitty political options and the aftermath of 2nd world war.

Definitely genetics and it's thought of as true that better nutrition/more calories accounts for the adult height increase in many countries. It's always taken as true by scientists, also IQ is lowered by lack of adequate nutrition. Or perhaps toxic metal ingestion in some countries.
But you can today manipulate adult height somewhat. Either to stop height growth, mostly in women, or to increase adult height. Arimidex or Letrozole and GH have both been shown to increase adult height. Both in combination have also been looked at but apparently the sample is too small to draw firm conclusions about the combo, if they are additive or even perhaps synergistic. I've also seen articles on the ethics of trying to increase height but they say some doctors continue to provide help with these drugs despite ethics concerns. I'm also positive that some parents obtain these drugs on the black market. There is some concern that estrogen suppression might affect bone mineralisation negatively. As we know estrogen loss may cause bone loss after menopause but what happens when it's suppressed in the teens?

EDIT: When I was young, my 15 year old training partner complained of his short stature all the time. I told him to ask a doc about getting GH. He did and the doc measured his testicles and said too lste for intervention, the thought being his test was already very high, and subsequently estrogen and the growth plates were already sealed. Poor guy has always been self conscious of his height for decades. His GF he made a baby with is a head taller than him lol.

[1Patrick]

Agreed on DNA genes and nutrition .American kids eating shit fast food in poor neighborhoods look like grown men .On the other hand poor South  Americans are short
Also .depends  who you getting your genetics from.
Lebron is 6’7” but Bronny is 6’1”.

[Van_Bilderass]

Agreed on DNA genes and nutrition .American kids eating shit fast food in poor neighborhoods look like grown men .On the other hand poor South  Americans are short
Also .depends  who you getting your genetics from.
Lebron is 6’7” but Bronny is 6’1”.

Overfeeding kids also make them enter puberty earlier, I seem to remember ages like 9 years old but maybe thst is not correct average age. The earlier puberty is not due to hormones in milk or meat as some assume, it's a result of calories.

[1Patrick]

Overfeeding kids also make them enter puberty earlier, I seem to remember ages like 9 years old but maybe thst is not correct average age. The earlier puberty is not due to hormones in milk or meat as some assume, it's a result of calories.

100%
Young girls getting period at 9 is result of it .

[joswift]

Overfeeding kids also make them enter puberty earlier, I seem to remember ages like 9 years old but maybe thst is not correct average age. The earlier puberty is not due to hormones in milk or meat as some assume, it's a result of calories.

is this the reason dj181 has never grown up?

[mops]

Definitely genetics and it's thought of as true that better nutrition/more calories accounts for the adult height increase in many countries. It's always taken as true by scientists, also IQ is lowered by lack of adequate nutrition. Or perhaps toxic metal ingestion in some countries.
But you can today manipulate adult height somewhat. Either to stop height growth, mostly in women, or to increase adult height. Arimidex or Letrozole and GH have both been shown to increase adult height. Both in combination have also been looked at but apparently the sample is too small to draw firm conclusions about the combo, if they are additive or even perhaps synergistic. I've also seen articles on the ethics of trying to increase height but they say some doctors continue to provide help with these drugs despite ethics concerns. I'm also positive that some parents obtain these drugs on the black market. There is some concern that estrogen suppression might affect bone mineralisation negatively. As we know estrogen loss may cause bone loss after menopause but what happens when it's suppressed in the teens?

EDIT: When I was young, my 15 year old training partner complained of his short stature all the time. I told him to ask a doc about getting GH. He did and the doc measured his testicles and said too lste for intervention, the thought being his test was already very high, and subsequently estrogen and the growth plates were already sealed. Poor guy has always been self conscious of his height for decades. His GF he made a baby with is a head taller than him lol.

That's a very interesting point.

Another argument supporting the estrogen thing is the profile of the gene coding for androgen receptors - a phenomenon called genetic polymorphism.

The gene coding for AR is composed of CAG codon repeats that can range from 6 to 39. ( C stands for cytosine ; A for adenine ; G for guanine.)

Men born with AR gene containing shorter CAG repeats (up to 23) tend to be more androgen sensitive. If at puberty you experienced severe acne, hirsutism, oily skin and even noticed early signs of baldness later on, chances are that you were born with short CAG repeats.

On the other hand, longer CAG repeats translate into a much lower sensitivity to endogenous androgens. This population of males produce less test on average, and are partially insensitive to androgens, whereas estrogen production tends to be higher.

P.S. : I hope MajorDomo doesn't call me an idiot if he reads this 

[IroNat]

Please stay on topic in Bhanky's clavicle widening thread.

Thank you.

[irishdave]

That's a very interesting point.

Another argument supporting the estrogen thing is the profile of the genes coding for androgen receptor - a phenomenon called genetic polymorphism.

The gene coding for AR is composed of CAG codon repeats that can range from 6 to 39. ( C stands for cytosine ; A for adenine ; G for guanine.)

Men born with AR genes containing shorter CAG repeats (up to 23) tend to be more androgen sensitive. If at puberty you suffered from severe acne, hirsutism, oily skin and even noticed early signs of baldness later on, chances are that you were born with short CAG repeats.

On the other hand, longer CAG repeats translate into a much lower sensitivity to endogenous androgens. This population of males produce less test on average, and are partially insensitive to androgens, whereas estrogen production tends to be higher.

P.S. : I hope MajorDomo doesn't call me an idiot if he reads this 

He is a complete and utter retard

[MAXX]

Overfeeding kids also make them enter puberty earlier, I seem to remember ages like 9 years old but maybe thst is not correct average age. The earlier puberty is not due to hormones in milk or meat as some assume, it's a result of calories.

hey is there any truth to there being alot of estrogen in cow milk from the stores?

I gave my kids lots of milk in hope of them growing taller and covering nutritional basis in case they didnt eat well some days. But maybe it will have opposite effect if the milk contains estrogen

[_bruce_]

Why not make his head smaller - just call the Mafia... they sure would love to meet a fellow "tough man".

[falco]

is this the reason dj181 has never grown up?

Self admitted narcisists are children yes, trying to overcome the childhood trauma. They never grew up, just developed a false self to overcome the pain. Sad when you think about it, but their conscious disregard for others makes it hard to feel sympathy for them.

[Van_Bilderass]

hey is there any truth to there being alot of estrogen in cow milk from the stores?

I gave my kids lots of milk in hope of them growing taller and covering nutritional basis in case they didnt eat well some days. But maybe it will have opposite effect if the milk contains estrogen

It depends on if you believe in "them" wilfully "poisoning us." I wouldn't worry about it, I kind of trust the authorities make sure the milk is estrogen free. EDIT: I saw a claim that milk contains "high amounts of estrogen naturally" but I thik if that was true it would lower testosterone and even stunt height growth. Some worry about other "growth hormones" used on cows and I think antibiotics too. I'd like to think all the smart people in the world would have made the link by now of milk and freaky stuff happening. Of course lots of people think cow's milk is "not supposed to be taken by humans." They do give American cattle trenbolone but assure us it's all gone by the time of slaughter. What did happen like on the early 90s is people being clenbuterol poisoned by eating the livers of some animals, ended up in hospital with the clen shakes lol.

I drank a ton of milk as a child but I don't know if it fucked me up. I still love it and drink about 2L a day. I think it's great after training too, in Sweden they promote is as "natures sports drink." It rehydrates you better than water due to the sodium but also due to the protein and fat. A couple of decades ago some nutrition experts like Alan Aragon thought regular chocolate milk was basically the same as what supplement companies sold as post workout drinks, just quick carbs and protein.

There is the claim that milk causes cancers, because it's so anabolic.
It's thought to be related to an increase in IGF-1. Some have claimed that milk contains absorbable IGF-1 but others think the increase in IGF-1 due to the proteins in milk, as well as the fat and carbs, likely increases the risk of lifetime cancers. I personally don't worry about it.

[38 returns]

Guilty...immediately followed by 20 Rep Breathing squats !  LOL 

I remember that

was convinced it worked too!

was it Randall someone super squats!

[Van_Bilderass]

I did the breathing squats, pullover combo too.

Now that I think of it, earlier there was the Reeves deadlift too. It was supposed to widen the clavicles.

[dj181]

Self admitted narcisists are children yes, trying to overcome the childhood trauma. They never grew up, just developed a false self to overcome the pain. Sad when you think about it, but their conscious disregard for others makes it hard to feel sympathy for them.

I'm not such a dickhead

I took Molly before going to the prostitute last night and I could only get it hard the first 30 minutes so the rest of the 90 minutes we just cuddled

I told her I feel bad about using her and she said so you've come to your senses?

So Molly had my cock get soft and made me more empathetic

Empathy is one trait I'm very weak in

So next time I go to the clubs I'll take half a Molly and I'll know I probably won't be able to get it up but that's not a huge issue coz girls here rarely do ONS both foreigns and Russian guys told me this

Thing is that I get angry and resentful that I have to play the game and I just can't go up and say hey sexy girl let's have some fun it don't go like that you can't be so direct so I just get tense and pissed but Molly does the soften the edge and at that party on Saturday I don't even try to talk with any females as only 3 or 4 of them were sexable for me and they all were with dudes

Id watch these pick up artists in Poland strike out constantly and I'd wonder why they don't get so pissed and offended by it, and I'd think to myself how can you take all this rejection so easily

But the french guy did show some anger and resentment by saying to them you have a fat and stinky pussy which was very uncalled but he was quite a dickhead

Think I told you the coolest guys I met were Spanish and Italian so I bet you'd probably be like them

[irishdave]

I'm not such a dickhead

I took Molly before going to the prostitute last night and I could only get it hard the first 30 minutes so the rest of the 90 minutes we just cuddled

I told her I feel bad about using her and she said so you've come to your senses?

So Molly had my cock get soft and made me more empathetic

Empathy is one trait I'm very weak in

So next time I go to the clubs I'll take half a Molly and I'll know I probably won't be able to get it up but that's not a huge issue coz girls here rarely do ONS both foreigns and Russian guys told me this

Thing is that I get angry and resentful that I have to play the game and I just can't go up and say hey sexy girl let's have some fun it don't go like that you can't be so direct so I just get tense and pissed but Molly does the soften the edge and at that party on Saturday I don't even try to talk with any females as only 3 or 4 of them were sexable for me and they all were with dudes

Id watch these pick up artists in Poland strike out constantly and I'd wonder why they don't get so pissed and offended by it, and I'd think to myself how can you take all this rejection so easily

But the french guy did show some anger and resentment by saying to them you have a fat and stinky pussy which was very uncalled but he was quite a dickhead

Think I told you the coolest guys I met were Spanish and Italian so I bet you'd probably be like them

You have no empathy you are pretending my friend. I know and you know the medications cannot manifest this in your stunted brain

[dj181]

It depends on if you believe in "them" wilfully "poisoning us." I wouldn't worry about it, I kind of trust the authorities make sure the milk is estrogen free. EDIT: I saw a claim that milk contains "high amounts of estrogen naturally" but I thik if that was true it would lower testosterone and even stunt height growth. Some worry about other "growth hormones" used on cows and I think antibiotics too. I'd like to think all the smart people in the world would have made the link by now of milk and freaky stuff happening. Of course lots of people think cow's milk is "not supposed to be taken by humans." They do give American cattle trenbolone but assure us it's all gone by the time of slaughter. What did happen like on the early 90s is people being clenbuterol poisoned by eating the livers of some animals, ended up in hospital with the clen shakes lol.

I drank a ton of milk as a child but I don't know if it fucked me up. I still love it and drink about 2L a day. I think it's great after training too, in Sweden they promote is as "natures sports drink." It rehydrates you better than water due to the sodium but also due to the protein and fat. A couple of decades ago some nutrition experts like Alan Aragon thought regular chocolate milk was basically the same as what supplement companies sold as post workout drinks, just quick carbs and protein.

There is the claim that milk causes cancers, because it's so anabolic.
It's thought to be related to an increase in IGF-1. Some have claimed that milk contains absorbable IGF-1 but others think the increase in IGF-1 due to the proteins in milk, as well as the fat and carbs, likely increases the risk of lifetime cancers. I personally don't worry about it.

Milk is the only animal protein that has carbs so imo it's the absolute top of the animal proteins

I drink a liter a day which gives me 32 grams of protein

The rest of my protein comes from white fish and casein and hamburgers from McDonalds or burger king once or twice a week