Dorian Yates kicks Ronnie's ass Hulkster is a punk Bitch and fuck any truce

[NarcissisticDeity]

when did the IFBB instate Blind judges?

seriously - if Yates most muscular is sooo good why does it look like shit in every video and every pic?

Good poses look good in videos and pics period.

they don't look good in person but then look like shit on video and in pictures.

Despite what the Yates brigade says, it just doesn't work that way...

Yes Hulkster's opinion is better than an I.F.B.B. judge who was there live and in the flesh   and you don't like Dorian's most muscular so hence forward it sucks , bias prevents you from seeing what the I.F.B.B. judges seen .

[Hulkster]

this pic is nasty. wonder what C.C. is gonna say about this?

well, we will say that Ronnie looks nastier, even at 42 years of age!



 

[Praetor Fenix]

Exhaustive Lower-Body Assessment:

Dorian <Calves> Ronnie
(Smaller overall size, but better balance with the quadriceps. Better proportion, condition, and hardness. Superior shape, particularly the medial head of the gastrocnemius. Lower insertions, greater soleus density and separation)

Dorian <Quadriceps> Ronnie
(Not even up for debate ND. Ronnie's quadriceps blow Dorian's away in every respect:
Size, Sweep, Striations, Vascularity, Separation, Density, Maturity, Condition. This muscle complex is infinitely more important to the judges than the calves too because it is so visible. Superior bodybuilders with bad quadriceps [Levrone] are heavily penalized)

Dorian <Hamstrings> Ronnie
(Easy assessment. Ronnie's hamstrings are second to none. Dorian has never had the steelcord hardness and separation that Ronnie exhibits. This is a major bodypart that you repeatedly fail to comment upon. You often hear of bodybuilders falling several places when they can't bring their hamstrings in [Troy Alves, Melvin Anthony]. What bodybuilder has noticeably suffered in their placement due to small calves??)

Dorian <Glutes> Ronnie
(Ronnie has more shred, better striations, immensely greater size. Once again, a huge element of bodybuilding criteria, as evidenced by the 2006 Arnold Schwarzenegger Classic. Peter McGough, your main authority, claims shredded glutes are overrated, but guess what, his opinion doesn't mean jackshit to the judges or any of the officials!)

I'm sorry ND. Judges don't mark down large bodyparts under the guise "overdeveloped".
They mark down adjacent muscles that are underdeveloped, and in Ronnie's case, the only dichotomy is the calves/quadriceps size differential which has been raised. On the otherhand, Dorian's hamstrings/glutes ARE underdeveloped relative to his upper body back development. His quadriceps are too small altogether and they have 0 sweep. Once again, stop citing these stupid quotations that were made well before Ronnie's prime (2003 Mr. Olympia).

Ronnie dominates, lower-body, from the anterior and the posterior position.
You are crazy if you think Dorian's minor advantage in calves is enough to compensate for his appreciable disadvantage in hamstrings/glutes and his irreperable quadricep deficiencies. You can cry that Ronnie's calves are too small for an additional 200 pages, doesn't change the fact that Ronnie would win the lowerbody assessment with unanimous 1st's.

This is just simple arithmetic ND, and if you wish to debate quadriceps, hamstrings, or glutes, I will be more than happy to embarrass you for an additional 100 pages.

(Upper Body Assessment Coming Later This Week)

[NarcissisticDeity]

he won the muscularity round, that is what it is all about.

He won the muscularity round dispite being 10lbs lighter too and he was just 239lbs not his peak weight but Hulkster tends to ignore the details .

[Hulkster]

Yes Hulkster's opinion is better than an I.F.B.B. judge who was there live and in the flesh   and you don't like Dorian's most muscular so hence forward it sucks , bias prevents you from seeing what the I.F.B.B. judges seen .

what good are opinions. Lets see the proof. Thus far, EVERY most muscular shot I have EVER seen of Yates either on video or in pics has been not-so-great (and most agree after having seen the pics and vids on this thread).

And you are trying to tell me that Yates' most muscular is fantastic?

Where?

Show me the pose and make me a believer. Go ahead. I'm waiting..

[Hulkster]

dorian's calves were out of proprotion with the rest of his physique.

They were huge.  too big in fact when seen from certain angles.

Just like Ronnie's record breaking 2003 supersized quads - they made his calves disappear.

[delta9mda]

well, we will say that Ronnie looks nastier, even at 42 years of age!



 

uh right, rons doing high pulls(flexing the back  and delts) and yates is doing calves (not flexing the back).
great comparison.

[delta9mda]

dorian's calves were out of proprotion with the rest of his physique.

They were huge.  too big in fact when seen from certain angles.

Just like Ronnie's record breaking 2003 supersized quads - they made his calves disappear.

rons are not big enough

[Praetor Fenix]

dorian's calves were out of proprotion with the rest of his physique.

They were huge.  too big in fact when seen from certain angles.

Just like Ronnie's record breaking 2003 supersized quads - they made his calves disappear.

The calves are so unimportant in bodybuilding to begin with. Look at Johnny Jackson, he has been doing quite well (what, 2nd place recently?) despite a myriad of physique problems AND the worst calves in the history of bodybuilding.

Chris Cormier has poor calf development as well, but when he nails his conditioning, comes in full, and isn't holding subcutaneous water, he is perhaps Ronnie's #1 threat on any given day. Don't get me wrong, he isn't anywhere near Ronnie's level, but he is infinitely closer than Jay Cutler or Schlierkamp when Cormier is on.

ND really needs to start his own federation so he can prioritize calves to such an extent that they exceed quadriceps, hamstrings, and glutes combined. Hell, the competitors can even come in fully clothed with capri pants on for the pre-judging.

[NarcissisticDeity]

Lower-Body Assessment:

Dorian <Calves> Ronnie
(Smaller overall size, but better balance with the quadriceps. Better proportion, condition, and hardness. Superior shape, particularly the medial head of the gastrocnemius. Lower insertions, greater soleus density and separation)

Dorian <Quadriceps> Ronnie
(Not even up for debate ND. Ronnie's quadriceps blow Dorian's away in every respect:
Size, Sweep, Striations, Vascularity, Separation, Density, Maturity, Condition. This muscle complex is infinitely more important to the judges than the calves too because it is so visible. Superior bodybuilders with bad quadriceps [Levrone] are heavily penalized)

Dorian <Hamstrings> Ronnie
(Easy assessment. Ronnie's hamstrings are second to none. Dorian has never had the steelcord hardness and separation that Ronnie exhibits. This is a major bodypart that you repeatedly fail to comment upon. You often hear of bodybuilders falling several places when they can't bring their hamstrings in [Troy Alves, Melvin Anthony]. What bodybuilder has noticeably suffered in their placement due to small calves??)

Dorian <Glutes> Ronnie
(Ronnie has more shred, better striations, immensely greater size. Once again, a huge element of bodybuilding criteria, as evidenced by the 2006 Arnold Schwarzenegger Classic. Peter McGough, your main authority, claims shreded glutes are overrated, but guess what, his opinion doesn't mean jackshit to the judges or any of the officials!)

I'm sorry ND. Judges don't mark down large bodyparts under the guise "overdeveloped".
They mark down adjacent muscles that are underdeveloped, and in Ronnie's case, the only dichotomy is the calves/quadriceps size differential which has been raised. On the otherhand, Dorian's hamstrings/glutes ARE underdeveloped relative to his upper body back development. His quadriceps are too small altogether and they have 0 sweep. Once again, stop citing these stupid quotations that were made well before Ronnie's prime (2003 Mr. Olympia).

Ronnie dominates, lower-body, from the anterior and the posterior position.
You are crazy if you think Dorian's minor advantage in calves is enough to compensate for his appreciable disadvantage in hamstrings/glutes and his irreperable quadricep deficiencies. You can cry that Ronnie's calves are too small for an additional 200 pages, doesn't change the fact that Ronnie would win the lowerbody assessment with unanimous 1st's.

This is just simple arithmetic ND, and if you wish to debate quadriceps, hamstrings, or glutes, I will be more than happy to embarrass you for an additional 100 pages.
(Upper Body Assessment Coming Later This Week)

You're a delusional super fan you made the claim Dorian's quads & chest suck , I posted a quote from an I.F.B.B. judge that contradicts your claims , and there is no ' debating ' you on anything you're to biased to entertain any other possibility than Ronnie being the best , you're just like a conservative christian , there can never be a debate because you're to convinced you're right and thats that , so feel free to keep typing Camp-Coleman enjoys your threads however I find them boring , repetitive and laced with bias .

[NarcissisticDeity]

The calves are so unimportant in bodybuilding to begin with. Look at Johnny Jackson, he has been doing quite well (what, 2nd place recently?) despite a myriad of physique problems AND the worst calves in the history of bodybuilding.

Chris Cormier has poor calf development as well, but when he nails his conditioning, comes in full, and isn't holding subcutaneous water, he is perhaps Ronnie's #1 threat on any given day. Don't get me wrong, he isn't anywhere near Ronnie's level, but he is infinitely closer than Jay Cutler or Schlierkamp when Cormier is on.

ND really needs to start his own federation so he can prioritize calves to such an extent that they exceed quadriceps, hamstrings, and glutes combined. Hell, the competitors can even come in fully clothed with capri pants on for the pre-judging.

This comment cements your lack of bodybuilding knowlege Calves are among the most important bodyparts because they can't be hidden and are plainly obvious in every single pose from every single angle but you do have a point that apparently they don't matter anymore back in the good old days the calves were full & round and the stomachs were small and flat .

[Hulkster]

You're a delusional super fan you made the claim Dorian's quads & chest suck , I posted a quote from an I.F.B.B. judge that contradicts your claims

why don't you show us some pics or videos that contradict his claims

what is it with you and quotes lately?

show us some VISUAL evidence.

The way you make it sound, bodybuilding could be judged by a bunch of blind guys talking about physiques without even seeing them..

[NarcissisticDeity]

why don't you show us some pics or videos that contradict his claims

what is it with you and quotes lately?

show us some VISUAL evidence.

The way you make it sound, bodybuilding could be judged by a bunch of blind guys talking about physiques without even seeing them..

" News Break , Ronnie Coleman fans don't find Dorian Yates footage impressive " you're biased bottom line .

[pumpster]

The calves are so unimportant in bodybuilding to begin with

The reality is that while calves and symmetry are important, they're not as important as other areas.

Yates wins in areas that are the least important like calves and washboard abs that are compromised by a blocky, thick waist, to go with good lats that are seriously fouled by those arms. 

Those are the areas where he was good...ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

NOT a superstar, never was. Too many flaws + ugly-ass physique lacking classic BB tapers.

[pumpster]

show us some VISUAL evidence.

What, any of these guys actually proving anything to the contrary of what they've already been humiliated with? hahahahhahahhah

[NarcissisticDeity]

What, any of these guys actually proving anything to the contrary of what they've already been humiliated with? hahahahhahahhah

Same picture I don't know where you got that one but this one looks better anyway Yates won that contest in the process he beat Ronnie and once again you're a biased-internet-judge basing whole contest results on some scans lol

[Praetor Fenix]

This comment cements your lack of bodybuilding knowlege Calves are among the most important bodyparts because they can't be hidden and are plainly obvious in every single pose from every single angle but you do have a point that apparently they don't matter anymore back in the good old days the calves were full & round and the stomachs were small and flat .

Calves are NOT one of the most important bodyparts you god-damned newb!
Funny how you make a such a bold statement then render it incorrect with your second muse.

There isn't even a single pose intended to showcase calves exclusively.
Think ... Side Chest, Side Tricep, Ab & Thigh, Back Double Bicep, Rear Lat Spread.
Calves are a marginal bodypart in each and every pose. They are nowhere near as important as quadriceps, hamstrings, and glutes ... let alone chest, lats, and upper arms.

Small calves do not detract from a physique nearly as much as small arms or a small chest, etc.
I challenge you to cite any recent / relevant examples of bodybuilders that are heavily penalized due to poor calf development or high calcaneal tendons. Troy Alves & Melvin Anthony always drop a few spots due to their soft hamstrings, Levrone & Garrett Downing for lack of quadricep mass, and Lee Priest for glutes. All great examples for the relative importance of these crucial bodyparts. Athletes like Chris Cormier, Johnny Jackson, hell most of the black bodybuilders, do remarkably well despite less-than-stellar calves, in JJ's case, the worst calves in bodybuilding.

Besides, even if calves WERE the most important bodypart, 1 stellar bodypart would NEVER compensate for 3 inferior bodyparts that are inherently larger and more visible.

[LyricTenor]

wow

[Praetor Fenix]

You're a delusional super fan you made the claim Dorian's quads & chest suck , I posted a quote from an I.F.B.B. judge that contradicts your claims , and there is no ' debating ' you on anything you're to biased to entertain any other possibility than Ronnie being the best , you're just like a conservative christian , there can never be a debate because you're to convinced you're right and thats that , so feel free to keep typing Camp-Coleman enjoys your threads however I find them boring , repetitive and laced with bias .

How about you actually address one of my arguments head-on for once? Please??

Yes.
Dorian's quadriceps & chest SUCK ASS compared to 'peak' Ronnie. This is widely-known.
A 12-year old quote is supposed to render this objective analysis invalid?? Get the f*ck out!!

Old & Worthless Quote. Its like arguing the Earth is flat because Ptolemy, an authority in his time, believed it to be so. Things change ... athletes improve.

ND, I am perfectly open to objective debate. Fact is, you do everything and anything other than actually take a moment to analyze the physiques. It is quite clear that Ronnie's quadriceps are incomprehensibly larger than Dorian's (and yes, this is a GOOD thing from the standpoint of modern physique assessment by the IFBB), they are striated and feathered (unlike Dorian), riddled with vascularity (unlike Dorian), have ideal separation (Dorian has poor separation between his rectus femoris and vastus lateralis - hell do you even know what these muscles are without running to google?  ), perfect proportion (Dorian's vastus medialis is too large, his rectus femoris is caved in, and vastus lateralis does not contribute to sweep and is underdeveloped).

HOW THE HELL IS THAT BIASED ND?
NOT A SINGLE STATEMENT IN THE PARAGRAPH ABOVE IS A MATTER OF OPINION!

Chest? Once again, Ronnie's is larger, he has amazing density with stacked striations (Dorian has few - not nearly enough to match Ronnie), considerably better outer/inner pectoral development, Dorian has a sternocostal attachment deficiency that is painfully obvious, whereas Ronnie has thick muscular development all along his sternum. Ronnie's chest looks 100% better, relaxed AND flexed. It isn't even a noteworthy comparison because the dichotomy is so extreme.

THESE AREN'T BIASED OPINIONS! It is crystal clear assessment - these are statements of fact.
You accuse me of bias yet you refuse to address my statements in an objective manner.
You don't attempt to refute or interject into any of the relevant analysis, you only dismiss it.

[LyricTenor]

Calves are NOT one of the most important bodyparts you god-damned newb!
Funny how you make a such a bold statement then render it incorrect with your second muse.

There isn't even a single pose intended to showcase calves exclusively.
Think ... Side Chest, Side Tricep, Ab & Thigh, Back Double Bicep, Rear Lat Spread.
Calves are a marginal bodypart in each and every pose. They are nowhere near as important as quadriceps, hamstrings, and glutes ... let alone chest, lats, and upper arms.

Small calves do not detract from a physique nearly as much as small arms or a small chest, etc.
I challenge you to cite any recent / relevant examples of bodybuilders that are heavily penalized due to poor calf development or high calcaneal tendons. Troy Alves & Melvin Anthony always drop a few spots due to their soft hamstrings, Levrone & Garrett Downing for lack of quadricep mass, and Lee Priest for glutes. All great examples for the relative importance of these crucial bodyparts. Athletes like Chris Cormier, Johnny Jackson, hell most of the black bodybuilders, do remarkably well despite less-than-stellar calves, in JJ's case, the worst calves in bodybuilding.

Besides, even if calves WERE the most important bodypart, 1 stellar bodypart would NEVER compensate for 3 inferior bodyparts that are inherently larger and more visible.

LOL, thats awesome.  Did you say levrone's lack of quad mass?  urf?

I may be the only one, but I think that coleman's chest looks horrible. Relaxed it sags and whenever he raises his arms it flattens out.

Its clear that his structure isnt very good either.  His shoulders are relatively very narrow

[LyricTenor]

Please dont start crying about how ronnie isnt at his peak in the last pic I posted.  Please, I cant count the number of times you posted pics of dorian at his worst.

[Praetor Fenix]

LOL, thats awesome.  Did you say levrone's lack of quad mass?  urf?

I was referring primarily to the 2002 Mr. Olympia. Levrone could have beaten Coleman if his quadriceps were better. Fact is, they were small and lacked crisp separation. I think Levrone blamed it on a hernia that prevented him from carrying forward with his squat regimen. Regardless, he has lost more than 1 show due to his thighs.

[suckmymuscle]

what good are opinions. Lets see the proof. Thus far, EVERY most muscular shot I have EVER seen of Yates either on video or in pics has been not-so-great (and most agree after having seen the pics and vids on this thread).

And you are trying to tell me that Yates' most muscular is fantastic?

Where?

Show me the pose and make me a believer. Go ahead. I'm waiting..

  How about this shot, dumbass? Roonie siply can't mach this combination of thickness and hardness, with such superb balance! Ronnie's delts do jump more than Dorian's on the most muscular. But that is it. That's his only advantage. Dorian clearly wins the pose overall.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[suckmymuscle]

The calves are so unimportant in bodybuilding to begin with. Look at Johnny Jackson, he has been doing quite well (what, 2nd place recently?) despite a myriad of physique problems AND the worst calves in the history of bodybuilding.

Chris Cormier has poor calf development as well, but when he nails his conditioning, comes in full, and isn't holding subcutaneous water, he is perhaps Ronnie's #1 threat on any given day. Don't get me wrong, he isn't anywhere near Ronnie's level, but he is infinitely closer than Jay Cutler or Schlierkamp when Cormier is on.

ND really needs to start his own federation so he can prioritize calves to such an extent that they exceed quadriceps, hamstrings, and glutes combined. Hell, the competitors can even come in fully clothed with capri pants on for the pre-judging.

  Yes, it seems that, to you, everything other than sheer size is irrelevant. To you, having small calves is as much a liability as a distended stomach.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[suckmymuscle]

  Both Cutler and Dexter SOUNDLY defeating Ronald Coleman. Ronnie is a solid third, though.

SUCKMYMUSCLE