Author Topic: Dorian Yates kicks Ronnie's ass Hulkster is a punk Bitch and fuck any truce  (Read 3528177 times)

pumpster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22450 on: January 29, 2007, 11:27:49 AM »


Post a pic of Dorian looking like this:



How does this compare?  :-X

Shockwave

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22451 on: January 29, 2007, 11:43:05 AM »
How does this compare?  :-X

Funny, since Ronnie is doing a side pose, and Dorian is in transition to a back pose.
Sad.  :-\

Big N

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22452 on: January 29, 2007, 12:05:29 PM »
If there is a God, somebody lock this thread up already i think i've been saying that since 2005.....same pictures over and over again


::)
#

delta9mda

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22453 on: January 29, 2007, 12:08:15 PM »
If there is a God, somebody lock this thread up already i think i've been saying that since 2005.....same pictures over and over again


::)
no man let it go. let be blue in the face. everyone knows they are right. its great, we are on our way to 1000.

IceCold

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22454 on: January 29, 2007, 12:20:21 PM »
Thanks for the year and your "extra 2 cents"

no problem. 

could also be 91 though. 
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IceCold

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22455 on: January 29, 2007, 12:21:47 PM »
How does this compare?  :-X


glad to have master of the bowflex back. 
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Iceman1981

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22456 on: January 29, 2007, 12:25:08 PM »
Are Iceman1981 and IceCold related?

Are you crazy? There is no way I'm related to him.

Necrosis

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22457 on: January 29, 2007, 01:00:41 PM »
The definitive answer is that Yates would win, just as he did the 8 times Yates and Coleman met on stage. However, Hulkster refuses to admit this, and posts over and over again, pictures of Yates at his worst against Coleman at his best, that is his MO. Then Camp Yates has to educate this fool and put him in check.

if your going by wins ronnie has more, and more olympias, however this is the pussy way out, they never competed at there best so theres no point on commenting on yates wins when ronnie was less then in his prime.

how do you measure low fat and water levels objectively?

NarcissisticDeity

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22458 on: January 29, 2007, 01:30:57 PM »
For someone who has moaned about the non-existant colour-manipulation of some '99 Ronnie screencaps, it amazes be that you can't understand this basic principle of increased shading. Of course the b/w pics are real in as far as Dorian was there in front of the camera, but he never had all that definition, at least not to the extent of those manipulated pics. In fact apart from lower back he had none at all, lol. For someone who preaches such superiority you demonstrate a fantastic anability to infer correct meaning. As I stated before you're only kidding yourself, but from the number of posts you have on here I guess such self-deception is how you get through the day. :)

See this is where you get exposed for not knowing the facts , I never once ' moaned ' about color manipulation of the 99 screencaps I said there was an obvious difference between the two being presented and I was right and lets say I was saying the 99 screencaps were altered I'd be right and why? because after the other side fought tooth & nail that the 99 screencaps were ' real ' they then come up with the ' real ' ones and the ones they were saying are not fake then turned out to be ' fake ' after all so either way you're wrong

And how the hell did you know Dorian never had all the ' definition ' ? you ever see him in person and in the gym to compared the two? and here is the funny part is its not even a great photo according to the photographer

Kevin Horoton GetBig Dec 30th

The photo is technically terrible, fortunately the physique is awesome.
I'd agree with Kris about Dorian showing up on stage how he looked a few weeks out. There are some shots of him at around 280 - 285 shredded. That conditioning has not been surpassed.


straight from the horses mouth that the shot was ' technically terrible ' and he still looks outstanding so imagine if got the shots under perfect circumstances? he would look even better , or according to you he really wouldn't LOL lets see who's opinion on the topic carries more weight yours of a professional photographer , hmmm thats a tuff one , do some more reserach before you commit to a post because it makes you loom stupid when you type nonsense like the B & W 's aren't real

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22459 on: January 29, 2007, 02:00:10 PM »
Muscularity, to my understanding, is judged on bulk (size) and definition (separations and striations). Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong as I don't claim to be an expert on bodybuilding criteria. Dorian beat Haney in the muscularity round b/c of his bigger legs and superior definition from the back.

Conditioning and definition may go hand in hand, but they are not the same. The purpose of one is to display the other. When a bodybuilder is well conditioned, people say "look at those separations and striations. He must have very low body fat and water levels." They don't say "look at that conditioning. He must have separations and striations."

I said that Ronnie's 01 ASC package looks the best. However, I still feel that he reached his prime in 03. I fail to see how I'm a hypocrite for not agreeing with all of Peter McGough's opinions. You're the one who claims that 99 Ronnie was carrying more water than 98 b/c Peter said so, not me. The only reason I posted his quote about Ronnie having the best back of all-time was to show that if you accept one comment, then you must accept them all otherwise you concede that he could be wrong in his assessments.

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Muscularity, to my understanding, is judged on bulk (size) and definition (separations and striations). Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong as I don't claim to be an expert on bodybuilding criteria. Dorian beat Haney in the muscularity round b/c of his bigger legs and superior definition from the back.

In ALL rounds competitors are judged in terms of conditioning , all rounds are physique rounds in the muscularity round competitors are NOT judged on muscularity as a separate entity , the same way with the symmetry round , and Dorian didn't win the muscularity because he had bigger quads its because he was better conditioned ( among other factors ) , definition and conditioning are part of the same equation

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Conditioning and definition may go hand in hand, but they are not the same. The purpose of one is to display the other. When a bodybuilder is well conditioned, people say "look at those separations and striations. He must have very low body fat and water levels." They don't say "look at that conditioning. He must have separations and striations."

Again striations & separations are a factor of being well conditioned however they're not accurate because Ronnie has been striated & separated and was still holding water , see 2000 Olympia , striations can be visible under a film of water


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I said that Ronnie's 01 ASC package looks the best. However, I still feel that he reached his prime in 03. I fail to see how I'm a hypocrite for not agreeing with all of Peter McGough's opinions. You're the one who claims that 99 Ronnie was carrying more water than 98 b/c Peter said so, not me. The only reason I posted his quote about Ronnie having the best back of all-time was to show that if you accept one comment, then you must accept them all otherwise you concede that he could be wrong in his assessments.

Oh you most certainly are a hypocrite because you're telling me I must accept all his opinions or none of them , now you revised it to I must accept all of them or admit he could be wrong , I would openly admit he could be wrong on subjective matters like who was better at their primes thats subjective but if Ronnie wasn't as hard or dry as he was from one year to the next that isn't a subjective opinion , I mean he either is or he isn't

You adopted a all-or-nothing approach which is just nonsense so using your own warped logic against you ( as a slap in the face ) you by virtue of believing Peter when he says Ronnie had the best back and his best showing was 2001 ASC then have to believe that according to him Ronnie was 244 pounds in 2001 , either you have to accept all of nothing , the part that makes you a hypocrite is YOU can disagree with his opinion but bitch at ME for doing the same

I can disagree with him on whatever topic I want and so can you , just do bitch at me for doing it and then do it yourself  ;)

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22460 on: January 29, 2007, 02:05:06 PM »
how do you determine conditioning without looking at definition? The judges don't use hydrostatic weighing onstage. So they have no way to directly measure a bodybuilder's fat and water levels.

Pubes, I'm still waiting for a response.

Necrosis

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22461 on: January 29, 2007, 02:08:31 PM »
In ALL rounds competitors are judged in terms of conditioning , all rounds are physique rounds in the muscularity round competitors are NOT judged on muscularity as a separate entity , the same way with the symmetry round , and Dorian didn't win the muscularity because he had bigger quads its because he was better conditioned ( among other factors ) , definition and conditioning are part of the same equation

Again striations & separations are a factor of being well conditioned however they're not accurate because Ronnie has been striated & separated and was still holding water , see 2000 Olympia , striations can be visible under a film of water


Oh you most certainly are a hypocrite because you're telling me I must accept all his opinions or none of them , now you revised it to I must accept all of them or admit he could be wrong , I would openly admit he could be wrong on subjective matters like who was better at their primes thats subjective but if Ronnie wasn't as hard or dry as he was from one year to the next that isn't a subjective opinion , I mean he either is or he isn't

You adopted a all-or-nothing approach which is just nonsense so using your own warped logic against you ( as a slap in the face ) you by virtue of believing Peter when he says Ronnie had the best back and his best showing was 2001 ASC then have to believe that according to him Ronnie was 244 pounds in 2001 , either you have to accept all of nothing , the part that makes you a hypocrite is YOU can disagree with his opinion but bitch at ME for doing the same

I can disagree with him on whatever topic I want and so can you , just do bitch at me for doing it and then do it yourself  ;)

you have very poor comprehension skills, you skew everything everyone says and miss the logic of almost every post.

peter could be wrong about ronnies back-yes, and his weight-yes but he could also be wrong about the assesments of dorian-yes if you accept that peter is always right, as you do with his dorian assesments then you'd have to agree that ronnie had the best back. however, peter can and does make mistakes thus making his opinions on dorian and ronnie open for criticism and pointless in the debate. if you accept he is right about dorian, why not conclude he is right about ronnies back? what is the dividing line, you cant and dont know thus showing the lack of cred that should be given to statements and opinions. they are open to bias, bad perception, mood, context, relationship. the pictures are the most objective way to argue this point, they are not subjective like opinions.

you cant pick and choose what statements to accept. like lee stating one thing about dorian and then recently saying ronnie is the best etc.. they are subjective and are the worst type of evidence.

NEO i would hold your breath for an answer as to how to measure water levels, they avoid the question because they know that based on the criteria for conditioning ronnie wins. being dry isnt a criteria, dryness creates seperation, cuts and striations nothign else.

NarcissisticDeity

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22462 on: January 29, 2007, 02:12:34 PM »
Ronnie is destroying Dorian in definition there. His triceps long head also appears to be longer.

Ronnie is absolutely NOT destroying Dorian in definition , how the hell did you come to this conclusion? because he has striations? give me a break , Dorian's triceps are CLEARLY more separated and ' defined ' his side head shows a much more clearer separation from his long head , this is NOT debatable , Dorian also has a better shaped sidehead and long head to his triceps , while you are right about Ronnie's longhead being longer its also noticeable thinner like his side head , Dorian is outclassing Ronnie in that particular shot

Necrosis

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22463 on: January 29, 2007, 02:23:11 PM »
Ronnie is absolutely NOT destroying Dorian in definition , how the hell did you come to this conclusion? because he has striations? give me a break , Dorian's triceps are CLEARLY more separated and ' defined ' his side head shows a much more clearer separation from his long head , this is NOT debatable , Dorian also has a better shaped sidehead and long head to his triceps , while you are right about Ronnie's longhead being longer its also noticeable thinner like his side head , Dorian is outclassing Ronnie in that particular shot

this is correct, first sane thing you've said.

Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22464 on: January 29, 2007, 02:34:26 PM »
looks like 92. 

the same year ronnie finished out of the top 15 with his taper, arms, striations, details, etc.

yes, because ronnie's 1992 physique was every bit as good as his 98/9 one..

 ::)

I can't believe people can be this stupid! :-\
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IceCold

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22465 on: January 29, 2007, 02:35:57 PM »
yes, because ronnie's 1992 physique was every bit as good as his 98/9 one..

 ::)

I can't believe people can be this stupid! :-\


yes, because dorian's 1992 physique was every bit as good as his 93/95 one...

 ::)
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Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22466 on: January 29, 2007, 02:37:35 PM »

yes, because dorian's 1992 physique was every bit as good as his 93/95 one...

 ::)

actually, it was. he was super ripped in 92, with a TOTALLY flat stomach, and had no biceps or quad tear to boot.

he was a little smaller, but had better quality.
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IceCold

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22467 on: January 29, 2007, 02:39:03 PM »
actually, it was. he was super ripped in 92, with a TOTALLY flat stomach, and had no biceps or quad tear to boot.

he was a little smaller, but had better quality.


he didnt have any quad or bi tear in 93 either.

but if that's your opinion.......
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Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22468 on: January 29, 2007, 02:39:31 PM »
LMFAO for all the guys who keep claiming Dorian lags behind in separation , check out this tricep , better shape , better separation  ;)

the triceps (from the side only) do not make up for the disadvantage in seperation in the pecs, glutes, quads, hams, delts and biceps..
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Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22469 on: January 29, 2007, 02:40:55 PM »

he didnt have any quad or bi tear in 93 either.

but if that's your opinion.......

dorian's 92 stomach was was flat and had no obliques.

dorian's 93 gut was huge when relaxed with obliques spilling out over his trunks.

to me, this makes a big difference.
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NarcissisticDeity

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22470 on: January 29, 2007, 02:41:17 PM »
you have very poor comprehension skills, you skew everything everyone says and miss the logic of almost every post.

peter could be wrong about ronnies back-yes, and his weight-yes but he could also be wrong about the assesments of dorian-yes if you accept that peter is always right, as you do with his dorian assesments then you'd have to agree that ronnie had the best back. however, peter can and does make mistakes thus making his opinions on dorian and ronnie open for criticism and pointless in the debate. if you accept he is right about dorian, why not conclude he is right about ronnies back? what is the dividing line, you cant and dont know thus showing the lack of cred that should be given to statements and opinions. they are open to bias, bad perception, mood, context, relationship. the pictures are the most objective way to argue this point, they are not subjective like opinions.

you cant pick and choose what statements to accept. like lee stating one thing about dorian and then recently saying ronnie is the best etc.. they are subjective and are the worst type of evidence.

NEO i would hold your breath for an answer as to how to measure water levels, they avoid the question because they know that based on the criteria for conditioning ronnie wins. being dry isnt a criteria, dryness creates seperation, cuts and striations nothign else.

You still here? lol I'm surprised

Let me simplify this for you because you are simple , opinions are subjective and for all intents & purposes the only opinions that matter are the judges so its a matter of authority who's opinion I'm more winning to believe , yours , Neos , Hulksters , who is basing their opinions on bias , preference and pictures and videos or a well established authority in the bodybuilding community who was live an in person and you will lose every time

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you cant pick and choose what statements to accept. like lee stating one thing about dorian and then recently saying ronnie is the best etc.. they are subjective and are the worst type of evidence.

I don't have to pick and choose I only have one quote on the topic , and the quote was from a time when Ronnie looked much better than he does now , and it directly addresses the topic at hand , who would beat whom at their respective bests and Lee flat out said Dorian would beat Ronnie 1998/1999 with ease and you said Priest says Ronnie's the best thats your claim you never posted the quote or the magazine it was from , and I'm not willing to take your account on it , you've been proven biased already I always post the magazine , month , date and the quote so people can check on my claims if they don't take my word for it

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NEO i would hold your breath for an answer as to how to measure water levels, they avoid the question because they know that based on the criteria for conditioning ronnie wins. being dry isnt a criteria, dryness creates seperation, cuts and striations nothign else.

Ronnie does NOT win in terms of conditioning thats a fallacy , he may have come close in 98/01 but to say he wins is garbage , and being dry isn't a criteria but its the same as being defined , how does one get their muscles defined? by removing their bodies of water I.E. being DRY and fat I.E being HARD when a bodybuilder is off they say he was soft & holding water his conditioning was off , one can still have defined muscles and be holding water , one can have separated muscles and still be soft , know this , learn this.

Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22471 on: January 29, 2007, 02:44:05 PM »
Please explain what "detail" Dorian is "missing" in his arms compared to Ronnie. Take away Ronnie's veins and they will look the same as Dorian's arms.

this is so stupid I'm not even going to dignify it with a response...


 ::)


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Hulkster

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22472 on: January 29, 2007, 02:47:32 PM »
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Ronnie does NOT win in terms of conditioning thats a fallacy , he may have come close in 98/01 but to say he wins is garbage

why is it garbage?

just because you are too close minded and stubborn to see the that it might actually be true?

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NarcissisticDeity

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22473 on: January 29, 2007, 02:52:44 PM »
if your going by wins ronnie has more, and more olympias, however this is the pussy way out, they never competed at there best so theres no point on commenting on yates wins when ronnie was less then in his prime.

how do you measure low fat and water levels objectively?

Dorian beat Ronnie at less than his prime  ;) Dorian beat Ronnie with a torn bicep/tricep and quad it shows you how far ahead he was , and Ronnie was closer to his prime than Dorian was to his lol great logic

And its not quantity of Olympia wins its quality , Dorian won all of his Mr Olympias with straight firsts in the prejudging and to the best of my knowledge the both posing rounds with the exception of once , however he never lost ANY round , unlike Ronnie who had FOUR close calls and lost the Olympia to Jay , lost the S.O.S. to Gunther and lost the challenge round to Gustavo , Dorian was untouchable like Flex raved and Ronnie wasn't  ;)

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Re: Hulkster I'm calling for a Truce
« Reply #22474 on: January 29, 2007, 02:54:10 PM »
the triceps (from the side only) do not make up for the disadvantage in seperation in the pecs, glutes, quads, hams, delts and biceps..

keep telling yourself that  ;)