Dorian Yates kicks Ronnie's ass Hulkster is a punk Bitch and fuck any truce

[suckmymuscle]

we've already discussed this. I guess you enjoy getting verbally raped up the ass.

  I have owned you more times than I can count. You are not in my league, sport.

 Dorian wins the side triceps NOT b/c of his triceps, but b/c he presents an overall better package in this pose.

  That's exactly what I said. That despite his supposedly better bigger triceps, pecs, delts, etc, Dorian wins because his muscles work better for him in most angles and in most poses. So thanks for agreeing with me!

 As for the back double biceps, it comes down to personal preference. Even Pobrecito agreed.

  Who cares? I don't. It is not a preference because although both Dorian and Ronnie have great backs, Dorian has lessymetry problems in this pose, which would tip the scales in his favor. people say that

I've heard several people remark that Ronnie's conditioning at the 01 ASC represents the pinnacle of what's humanly possible.

  I have heard several people say that Intelligent Design is real science, but that doesen't make it so.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[suckmymuscle]

I didn't ask who you think looks harder overall. I asked who looks more shredded and harder in the comparisons b/c I knew you would try to weasel your way out of giving a direct answer. I dare you to ask people who don't follow bodybuilding "who looks harder in these pics?" My bet is they will pick Ronnie. The only reason you chose Dorian is to save face.

  No, Dorian looks harder, and I have already told you that. The issue furthermore is that Dorian looks harder overral, and since that isd an indication of low subcutaneous water content, then it is safe to assume that he had less of it than Ronnie. In conclusion, what i wanted to prove is that your thesis that muscle definition is only caused by subcutanous fat and water is wrong, and I accomplished that.

Ronnie at the 01 ASC had a sunken face, grainy skin, and definition in areas that Dorian lacked.

  His face was not as sunken as Dorian, and the fact that he had more definition in some areas only goes to show that I am right, becasue Dorian couldn't possibly be any lower than in subcutaneous fat and water.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[logical?]

Has either side offered the other a draw yet in this thread?


Is some kind of mutually agreeable compromise out of the question?

[realkarateblackbelt]

The Coleman camp has been getting pummeled lately.

[suckmymuscle]

for someone who claims to hold a degree in exercise physiology, I'm surprised that you would ask such a dumb question.

  It was a rhetorical question, because I already knew the answer: none.

the more muscle that a person carries, the more fat that is displaced as a result.

  Thanks for stating the obvious. I am talking about percentages. A 6' guy at 3% bodyfat will have roughly the same muscular definition of a 7' guy with 3% bodyfat. An increase or decrease in stature does not increase separations by itself, if bodyfat remains stable as a percentage. Conversely, a decrease in bodyfat as a percentage will always produce an increase in separations if stature remains the same across two individuals. In other words, stature is unable to chage separations as an independent variable.

Here's a simple analogy to help you better understand.

  I think you don't understand who stupid your argument is. You, of all people, trying to explain things to me...

Imagine a deflated balloon with a bunch of dots on the exterior. The inside of the balloon represents muscle while the dots represent body fat. Now slowly inflate the balloon. You'll notice the dots begin to drift farther apart. In effect, the fat is being 'spread thin' over the muscle. This is why height and lean mass are relevant to definition.

  That's because an increase in height leads to a decrease in bodyfat as a percentage, which is exactly my point. If stature remains a constant, decrease in bodyfat percentage will produce more muscle definition; if bodyfat percentage remains a constant, stature is unable to change degree os muscle separations. Game over.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

[pumpster]

bump

His most intelligent post so far

[pumpster]

  His face was not as sunken as Dorian, and the fact that he had more definition in some areas only goes to show that I am right, becasue Dorian couldn't possibly be any lower than in subcutaneous fat and water.

SUCKMYMUSCLE

His face wasn't as sunken therefore..?  Monster leap in logic batman

[pumpster]

The Coleman camp has been getting pummeled lately.

Ya that's pretty much it. 

[NeoSeminole]

That's what? 92 Yates. He hadn't reached his full size there. Same as me comparing 96 Yates to 98 Ronnie. It's apples and oranges. Geez, you guys are all over the place.

try 93 Dorian when he weighed 257 lbs. - considered by many his best package.

[NeoSeminole]

Also, in the instance that was shot, Ronnie clearly knows he's being looked at directly as indicated by the smile on his face...
of course he's going to flex in the relaxed pose.

Yates' mind is off somewhere else because all the attention is not focused on him when the picture was taken.

bwahahahahaha, lame excuse. That shot was taken during the symmetry round. Here is the full pic.

[NeoSeminole]

another reality check:

not really. I'm pretty sure that pic is from the 92 Mr. Olympia where Dorian got dwarfed on stage. Ronnie at the same weight with better conditioning, smaller joints and a narrower waist, would destroy him.

[NeoSeminole]

I have owned you more times than I can count. You are not in my league, sport.

you mean your self-proclaimed 'ownings?' ha ha ha ha.

That's exactly what I said. That despite his supposedly better bigger triceps, pecs, delts, etc, Dorian wins because his muscles work better for him in most angles and in most poses. So thanks for agreeing with me!

I didn't agree with you. I never said that Dorian wins the side triceps b/c his lateral head looks better. I said he wins this pose b/c he presents an overall better package. So don't misconstrue my words to mean I agree with you. Ronnie still wins the front double biceps, front lat spread, side chest, and most muscular due to his superior pecs, delts, biceps and triceps.

Who cares? I don't. It is not a preference because although both Dorian and Ronnie have great backs, Dorian has lessymetry problems in this pose, which would tip the scales in his favor. people say that

you should care if someone from your own side says you're wrong.

I have heard several people say that Intelligent Design is real science, but that doesen't make it so.

don't be a hypocrite. You referenced the hearsay of others to support your opinion. I can do the same.

[NeoSeminole]

No, Dorian looks harder, and I have already told you that.

you are such a pathetic liar. The only reason you choose Dorian is b/c to not pick him is to admit that he carried body fat and water. I dare you to ask 10 people that don't follow bodybuilding who looks harder and more shredded in these pics. My bet is they will all pick Ronnie.

His face was not as sunken as Dorian

yes, it was.

and the fact that he had more definition in some areas only goes to show that I am right, becasue Dorian couldn't possibly be any lower than in subcutaneous fat and water.

that's where you're wrong. If Dorian was 3% body fat sans water, then 01 ASC Ronnie was 2% body fat sans water. Now matter how low Dorian was, Ronnie still had better conditioning that day and it showed.

[pumpster]

bwahahahahaha, lame excuse. That shot was taken during the symmetry round. Here is the full pic.

Your brilliant example clearly shows Yates' waist about the same width as the other two guys' waists combined; self-ownage at it's best.

[NeoSeminole]

I am talking about percentages. A 6' guy at 3% bodyfat will have roughly the same muscular definition of a 7' guy with 3% bodyfat. An increase or decrease in stature does not increase separations by itself, if bodyfat remains stable as a percentage.

Height plays an important role in determining muscular separations and striations between 2 individuals if body fat is equal. One guy could be 5'8" while the other is 7' tall, and both have 200 lbs of lean mass. The shorter person will display more definition than the taller individual. Don't forget that body fat is expressed as a percentage of total body weight. Just b/c they both have the same % doesn't mean they have the same non-lean mass. The 7' guy carries extra weight in his bones, connective tissue, organs, etc. So even though they may both be 3% body fat, the taller person is carrying more lbs of fat.

[Hulkster]

WATER LOGGED MASS... 



...REVERSE TAPER 

LOL! When this shot first came out people thought it was a photoshop it's so bad!
Ronnie's gut is SO bad in fact, for the first time the IFBB had to warn the contestants that they would be marked off for it. They warned everyone, but we all know who it was directed at!!! Yates' gut was never this bad.

that one IS photophopped you complete and utter fool!
 
compare:

[Hulkster]

Yates' gut was never this bad.

but you fail to take into account that dorian's gut was 99% as bad but at a bodyweight of 40 pounds LESS!

[pobrecito]

Nice reverse taper LOL

[Hulkster]

is still a lot better than this taper at only 263 pounds.

[pobrecito]

Actually, Dorian looks a hell of a lot better than Ronnie there....notice Yates looks just like Levrone in that shot.

Plus, who gives a shit about a gut when you can tense it up and have a better midsection than a 205lb Ray 

[pobrecito]

Man, Ronnie NEVER had cheekbones like that at any competition - indicating that Yates truly was in almost a living dead state of almost holding zero subcutaneous fat or water 

[NeoSeminole]

Actually, Dorian looks a hell of a lot better than Ronnie there....notice Yates looks just like Levrone in that shot.

no, he doesn't. Ronnie at least has massive pecs, arms, and lats in that shot to compensate for his gut. Dorian just looks like an obese person.

Plus, who gives a shit about a gut when you can tense it up and have a better midsection than a 205lb Ray

Dorian wishes his midsection were this tiny.

[pobrecito]

no, he doesn't. Ronnie at least has massive pecs, arms, and lats in that shot to compensate for his gut. Dorian just looks like an obese person.

Dorian wishes his midsection were this tiny.

Ronnie's midsection is flat out ugly  Plus, what good is a small midsection when it's holding one or two gallons of water 

As well, having the small waist is not an advantage in the eyes of the judges, it never has been. The greatest bodybuilder of all-time, Arnold, had an even wider waist that Dorian. Did that hurt him against Sergio, the man with probably the greatest taper of all-times? No!


This is what a taut midsection should look like 

[pumpster]

Nice reverse taper LOL

Coleman looked horrible from the side later on. Then again so did the original GH gut Yates, who was wide both side AND front.

[pobrecito]

Pump,

Did you begin your diet and if so how is it going? Did you ever use ephedrine? I am about to start up dieting once again. Should be fun.