Israel strikes Iran - 06-12-25

[Methyl m1ke]

Hate to say the obvious, but AGAIN?! When did America win a war the last time? Iraq and Afghanistan were hardly wins, they are national traumas. What are you referring to? Trump is between a rock and a hard place here, who thinks this will just be some bombing and then it's all over, the US can pivot to Asia?

Yeah, it wasn't going anywhere, you're probably right it was delusional to think that. I've said as much here for a long time. Other posters here said Trump has killed the Deep State, he's really doing it! "Fuck you, you love Biden!" If what you say is true it just means the so-called "MAGA base" is fringe, the "little guy" who Trump depended on for votes, ultimately doesn't matter. Trump has the same fucking neocons and Jews calling the shots now, almost everyone in his circle is actively working against his stated objectives, as Bannon says. I don't know if Bannon matters at all, I don't watch his podcast at all, but I've seen mentions in MSM that Bannon is hugely influential, the "base" listens to him. But it's the same base that is fringe. Not really having watched Bannon previously I was kind of impressed with this podcast. Tucker had the most watched show in the whole of US, did he not?

Trump keeping fucking Lindsey Graham around is absurd!

But I have a question, especially to the ones who support this Iran affair, if US goes on the offensive, should Trump put the question to congress before he does? Should Americans have a say?

We are going to establish some kind of military base in iran watch. To keep russia in check as well as to guarantee Israels long term safety. I would enlist in case of a draft.

[GymnJuice]

I read on BBC that Trump said “we have total control over Iran's skies”. Mimicking what Israel said but then adding that American weapons are superior to irans defense tech. I don’t like that kind of talk.

I don't either but that's just Trump's style. Like when he said he had a bigger button than the North Korean.

Trump isn't perfect but I bet if Hillary or Bush was in charge we'd already have boots on the ground.

[obsidian]

I read on BBC that Trump said “we have total control over Iran's skies”. Mimicking what Israel said but then adding that American weapons are superior to irans defense tech. I don’t like that kind of talk.

Not sure what's propaganda and what's not. But let's assume Iran is completely losing right now.

Western media outlets are proudly framing this as a major success — that Iran, once portrayed as an existential threat to Israel, is now being “defeated” as easily as Iraq was. But if Iran was truly that weak, why was it attacked in the first place?

Let’s put it in perspective:
If a 50-pound boy (Iran) threatens a 300-pound man (the U.S., NATO, Israel), does the man respond by utterly destroying the child — or killing him? Because that’s exactly how the media narrative sounds right now.

The logic doesn’t add up. Either Iran was never the threat they claimed it was, or the disproportionate response reveals something deeper — a show of dominance, not defense.

[obsidian]

We are going to establish some kind of military base in iran watch. To keep russia in check as well as to guarantee Israels long term safety. I would enlist in case of a draft.

Sounds like you suffer from "The Secret Life of Walter Mitty" syndrome. There is little chance of this happening. The US is basically bankrupt. Nobody wants to buy US bonds, except for the US government and I guess stablecoin issuers. Where will all the money come for all these bases?

What if Israel is physically invaded by a few million Muslims? Israel can't nuke itself? I could see people being slaughtered in the streets and in their homes.

Iran is apparently the graveyard of empires.

Empires Try, Iran Endures
From ancient times to the present, Iran has seen wave after wave of conquest and foreign interference, but always manages to resist, recover, and reassert itself:

The Romans couldn’t conquer ancient Persia despite repeated wars.

Genghis Khan’s Mongols burned Persian cities, but Persia survived and eventually absorbed the Mongols culturally.

In the 19th and 20th centuries, Russia and Britain tried to control Iran through puppet monarchs and economic pressure.

In 1953, the CIA and MI6 overthrew Iran’s elected Prime Minister—yet Iran would later overthrow the Shah in 1979 and become staunchly anti-Western.

The U.S. and allies have used sanctions, cyberattacks (like Stuxnet), and proxy wars, yet Iran continues to project power across the Middle East.

Iran Is Hard to Invade and Control
Rugged terrain, vast deserts, and strategic mountains make military invasions logistically difficult.

A deep-rooted national identity that predates Islam gives Iran strong internal cohesion — it isn’t easily broken or remade.

The population is educated, politically engaged, and often rallies in the face of foreign threats, even if critical of their own government.

Foreign Powers Overextend Themselves
Empires that mess with Iran often pay a heavy cost:

Iraq, under Saddam Hussein, was backed by the West in the 1980s. After an 8-year war with Iran, it was left bankrupt and unstable — setting the stage for the Gulf Wars.

The U.S. tried to isolate and contain Iran but ended up accidentally increasing its influence by invading Iraq and weakening Iran’s rivals.

Even Israel’s covert attacks (nuclear scientist assassinations, sabotage) haven’t halted Iran’s nuclear program — they’ve arguably hardened it.

Intervening in Iran is a trap. You might win battles, but you’ll lose the war — politically, strategically, or morally.

[GymnJuice]

But I have a question, especially to the ones who support this Iran affair, if US goes on the offensive, should Trump put the question to congress before he does? Should Americans have a say?

Absolutely to both. But it won't happen. If the US strikes it will do so without asking Congress or the people. This was interesting though.

https://www.kaine.senate.gov/press-releases/kaine-announces-the-filing-of-a-war-powers-resolution-to-prevent-war-with-iran

Today, U.S. Senator Tim Kaine (D-VA), a member of the Senate Armed Services and Foreign Relations Committees, introduced a war powers resolution expressing concern about the escalating violence in the Middle East and its potential to pull the U.S. into conflict. The resolution will require a prompt debate and vote prior to using any U.S. military force against Iran.

https://thehill.com/homenews/house/5354540-us-involvement-iran-house-resolution-bipartisan/

A bipartisan group of House members on Tuesday introduced a war powers resolution to prohibit U.S. involvement in Iran as its conflict with Israel intensifies, signaling they may force a vote on the matter.

Rep. Thomas Massie (R-Ky.), who is one of the most outspoken libertarian-leaning Republicans advocating against U.S. military intervention abroad, posted on the social media site X on Monday that he would introduce such a resolution on Tuesday.

[IroNat]

If Israel truly has air superiority and Iranian air defenses are neutralized, the U.S. will send B-2 bombers with 30,000 lb bunker busters to destroy Iranian nuke installations.

No need to invade Iran with troops which would be foolish.

[OlympiaGym]

But I have a question, especially to the ones who support this Iran affair, if US goes on the offensive, should Trump put the question to congress before he does? Should Americans have a say?
[/quote]

They’ll have as much say as they usually do but Congress is fully behind Israel so it really doesn’t matter.

[illuminati]

Haven't these 2 shitty countries removed each other to a step
closer to their respective Gods 

[Van_Bilderass]

We are going to establish some kind of military base in iran watch. To keep russia in check as well as to guarantee Israels long term safety. I would enlist in case of a draft.

No offense intended, but are you Jewish? Are you an evangelical Christian?

Do you also think the Iraq and Afghanistan affairs were "worth it"? Those were also Jewish wars, fought for Israel, not because of some WMDs. Israel and for the military-industrial complex. Vets from those wars are mostly very disillusioned. Some feel Bin Laden was kept alive by the US to feed the MIT. Then he was finally killed to make sure Obama was reelected. If I was a vet, and thought that, I would feel like my government is evil and I was royally fucked in the ass.

If someone isn't a Jew or evangelical, I can't understand how they would support these regime change operations, just to enrich the MIT and for Israel, that hemorrhoid of the middle east. All that blood shed, all those grieving families, all those new and lifelong enemies made. All under guise of The War on Terror.

Anyone see this recent Trump speech in Saudi, I think it was. Wonder who wrote this speech, some think it might have been Vance. He puts the neocons on blast, says the US has no business in telling the ME countries how to govern. But now he's again going down this path 

They’ll have as much say as they usually do but Congress is fully behind Israel so it really doesn’t matter.

Yes, Israel paid for and owns congress. Massie has said almost everyone in congress has an AIPAC handler assigned. There was a panel discussion between Mayoral candidates where they tried upstaging each other on how much fealty they showed Israel. One of them hadn't booked a tour of Israel with the obligatory pics at the wailing wall and this was held against him as this big crime. US lawmakers go to Israel to sign new laws! At the same time, Israel is recognized as the #1 foreign spy. Israel stole atomic secrets from the US, even sold that info to the Soviet Union. How Americans accept this state of affairs is unbelievable to me.

If someone is into conspiracy theories, take a look at this. Israeli fingerprints, arguably, all over JFK, 9/11, recent drone attacks in Russia and much much more. Of course USS Liberty attack proven.

https://www.unz.com/runz/the-israeli-strike-on-iran-the-jfk-assassination-and-the-9-11-attacks/

[French]

Hadi Choopan was born in Abnow, Fars Province, Iran. He currently lives in Shiraz, where he runs Choopan Classic Gym.

Shiraz has been directly affected by the ongoing Iran–Israel war, including airstrikes in the past few days.
During Operation Rising Lion, launched by Israel on June 13, 2025, multiple Iranian cities—including Shiraz—were struck by air raids.

Iranian media confirmed explosions around Shiraz, notably near its airport, indicating the city was indeed “hit” in the escalation.

[Van_Bilderass]

The Israelis are highly competent and the Iranians have shown shocking incompetence. They replaced a general with a new one and immediately he was killed too, very humiliating. Shocking amount of previous infiltration inside Iran. I guess the Israelis couldn't get to the Supreme Leader and you'd think the Iranians have him secured inside a mountain right now. Will be interesting to see if the Americans can destroy the underground nuclear sites as well as take out the leader. In the Nasrallah killing the IDF used 80 "bombs," unclear to me how many of them were the monster bunker busters, but there were many dropped on top of each other. The nuclear sites are very deep/inside mountains. It's said Iranians are a relatively high IQ population, but these events don't exactly show it. I have personal beefs with Iranians but I'm on their side in this. Someone in my family was hoping for an attack on Iran because it would destroy his nemesis' real estate holdings in Tehran Trump really screwed them but it may have eroded his diplomatic power even more as other countries see how Trump's promises are fake. Russia and China are watching; Putin said the attack goes against all international law and UN resolutions the US is signatory to. I know posters here will say, well fuck the UN, but the fact of the matter is that the US is in the UN too.

Tulsi Gabbard said in march that Iran is NOT developing a nuclear bomb. She compiled all the info from all the intel agencies. She was hand picked and appointed by Trump, and now when Trump was asked about Tulsi's assessment, he goes, "I don't care what Tulsi said!" Tulsi has been a favorite of the MAGA crowd and the general dissidents and Deep State opposers, from what I can tell.

[obsidian]

If Israel truly has air superiority and Iranian air defenses are neutralized, the U.S. will send B-2 bombers with 30,000 lb bunker busters to destroy Iranian nuke installations.

No need to invade Iran with troops which would be foolish.

The U.S. MOP (GBU‑57A/B) can penetrate ~60 m (~200 ft) of reinforced concrete/soil

Given both Fordow and new Natanz complexes are deeper than this, they likely lie beyond the MOP’s full penetration capability.

That’s why analysts emphasize these sites are particularly hard to destroy via airstrike or conventional bunker-busting munitions.

Iran’s most fortified nuclear sites are buried well below the effective reach of even the most powerful U.S. bunker-busters—making them highly resilient to air attacks. The depth of these underground facilities underscores the challenge of neutralizing them without extraordinary means.

[Flexacon]

Hate to say the obvious, but AGAIN?! When did America win a war the last time? Iraq and Afghanistan were hardly wins, they are national traumas. What are you referring to? Trump is between a rock and a hard place here, who thinks this will just be some bombing and then it's all over, the US can pivot to Asia?

They don't go into those "wars" trying to win. The conflicts are to feed the military industrial complex and there is also a lot of dirty money laundering goes on.

It's beyond Trumps sphere of influence.

[obsidian]

The Israelis are highly competent and the Iranians have shown shocking incompetence.

So was Iran never really a threat? If that’s the case, then Israel’s attack becomes even more indefensible. You can’t simultaneously claim Iran was an existential danger and then gloat about how easily they're being defeated. That contradiction only exposes this war as yet another Western regime-change operation—no different from what we saw in Iraq, Libya, or Syria: topple a sovereign state and replace it with a compliant puppet.

Iran supported Russia against Ukraine, so why didn’t Russia or even Pakistan help deter this war by providing Iran with nuclear weapons? After all, the constant justification from the U.S. and Israel has been that Iran is “weeks away” from acquiring a nuke. But no one dares touch North Korea—for exactly that reason.

I wish I could sit down with Putin or Xi and ask them what they're waiting for. The U.S. and Israel continue making bold, aggressive moves, and their supposed geopolitical rivals just watch it happen.

What’s stopping Iran from responding in kind? Israel carried out covert attacks inside Iran, including sabotage and assassinations. What's preventing Iran from sending special forces into Israel to light fires, destroy infrastructure, or cause chaos in return?

[Flexacon]

So was Iran never really a threat? If that’s the case, then Israel’s attack becomes even more indefensible. You can’t simultaneously claim Iran was an existential danger and then gloat about how easily they're being defeated. That contradiction only exposes this war as yet another Western regime-change operation—no different from what we saw in Iraq, Libya, or Syria: topple a sovereign state and replace it with a compliant puppet.

For decades Iran funded proxies across the middle east. In Syria, Iraq, Yeman, Hamas, Hezbollah etc. They were all systematically dismantled. All that's left now is Iran.

As for Khamenei. I'm pretty sure they could have taken him out, but they left him alive as they want him to surrender. They don't want to make him a martyr and encourage the crazies to fight on.

[Grape Ape]

So was Iran never really a threat? If that’s the case, then Israel’s attack becomes even more indefensible. You can’t simultaneously claim Iran was an existential danger and then gloat about how easily they're being defeated

You easily can and they did: Iran is CLOSE to a bomb, so we have to take them out now BEFORE they become more formidable.

[obsidian]

They don't go into those "wars" trying to win. The conflicts are to feed the military industrial complex and there is also a lot of dirty money laundering goes on.

It's beyond Trumps sphere of influence.

Trump is captured by them, and he may have no choice. He may have been told behind closed doors that he or his children will be killed if he does not play along with the Deep State.

The US empire is facing financial collapse. Few buyers remain for US bonds—except the government itself. The US is turning pro-crypto because stablecoin issuers are now buying these bonds. However, it seems that the government wants to outlaw allowing interest to be paid directly to stablecoin holders, reserving yield exclusively for their prized bonds or traditional financial institutions.

[obsidian]

You easily can and they did: Iran is CLOSE to a bomb, so we have to take them out now BEFORE they become more formidable.

They've been close to a bomb for 25 years. That's a tired old argument. And Russia or Pakistan should have just given them one and allowed them to test it in the desert somewhere for Proof-of-Nuke. I am still wondering why Russia did not do this. Perhaps they don't trust the Iranians 100%? The US has nuclear weapons in numerous nations. They even had some on Okinawa in the 60s, even though Japan technically did not allow it. I know someone that actually worked there.

[loco]

Trump is captured by them, and he may have no choice. He may have been told behind closed doors that he or his children will be killed if he does not play along with the Deep State.

The US empire is facing financial collapse. Few buyers remain for US bonds—except the government itself. The US is turning pro-crypto because stablecoin issuers are now buying these bonds. However, it seems that the government wants to outlaw allowing interest to be paid directly to stablecoin holders, reserving yield exclusively for their prized bonds or traditional financial institutions.

The stock market's secret weapon: Insatiable demand from American retirement accounts

Mon, June 16, 2025

For US households, there’s still no alternative to the stock market.

The TINA trade in stocks — which stands for There Is No Alternative — was thought to be waning in recent years as rising interest rates since 2022 boosted bond yields for the first time in years, giving investors another option to lock in steady returns.

However, TINA appears to be back in full swing, and the impulse is particularly strong in US retirement accounts like 401(k)s, Goldman Sachs analysts wrote in a recent note.

Strategists at the bank pointed to red-hot demand for stocks in US retirement accounts, with total 401(k) allocations to equities in the US swelling to $8.9 trillion in 2024.

Altogether, roaring demand from retirement accounts and retail brokerage accounts paints a healthy backdrop for the stock market. US household demand is a key pillar of strength for the market, the bank said.

US households have raised their total stock allocation to 49% in recent years, the highest level on record, and the bank said it expects households to directly purchase $425 billion in equities this year.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/stock-markets-secret-weapon-insatiable-233829513.html

[obsidian]

For decades Iran funded proxies across the middle east. In Syria, Iraq, Yeman, Hamas, Hezbollah etc. They were all systematically dismantled. All that's left now is Iran.

As for Khamenei. I'm pretty sure they could have taken him out, but they left him alive as they want him to surrender. They don't want to make him a martyr and encourage the crazies to fight on.

But they were never an existential threat.

How likely do you think a steady invasion of Israel by millions of Muslims willing to die for their cause is? Remember Brad Pitt's World War Z? With all the Zombies climbing over the walls? I guess Muslims are not that fanatical. But it made me think how Israel would deal with a mass infiltration and literal war in the streets, door to door. The population is concentrated in small areas, and they can't bomb themselves. Seems to me if the Muslims were hell bent on taking out Israel that they could eventually take that approach?

[GymnJuice]

They've been close to a bomb for 25 years. That's a tired old argument. And Russia or Pakistan should have just given them one and allowed them to test it in the desert somewhere for Proof-of-Nuke. I am still wondering why Russia did not do this. Perhaps they don't trust the Iranians 100%? The US has nuclear weapons in numerous nations. They even had some on Okinawa in the 60s, even though Japan technically did not allow it. I know someone that actually worked there.

Russia and Iran might have some interests aligned at this time but historically they have not been allies.

I'd be surprised if one country willingly gave nukes to another unless it was a very "special relationship" like USA and England, or Russia and Belarus. I don't think Iran and Russia or Iran and Pakistan are on that level.

[obsidian]

But they were never an existential threat.

How likely do you think a steady invasion of Israel by millions of Muslims willing to die for their cause is? Remember Brad Pitt's World War Z? With all the Zombies climbing over the walls? I guess Muslims are not that fanatical. But it made me think how Israel would deal with a mass infiltration and literal war in the streets, door to door. The population is concentrated in small areas, and they can't bomb themselves. Seems to me if the Muslims were hell bent on taking out Israel that they could eventually take that approach?

Strong stock demand doesn't solve the US debt crisis.
401(k)s pouring into equities might be bullish for the market, but it does nothing to finance the federal deficit. The government funds itself through bond sales, and taxes, not stock prices. If there's weak demand for Treasuries, the US either raises yields, prints money via the Fed, or defaults by stealth through inflation.

Capital gains taxes from rising stocks are a temporary revenue bump — they vanish in a downturn. Meanwhile, spending keeps outpacing revenue by trillions annually. A booming stock market might help investor sentiment, but it doesn’t fix a broken fiscal foundation. If nobody wants to buy the government’s debt, we have a real problem — no matter how high the S&P goes.

[Flexacon]

But they were never an existential threat.

How likely do you think a steady invasion of Israel by millions of Muslims willing to die for their cause is? Remember Brad Pitt's World War Z? With all the Zombies climbing over the walls? I guess Muslims are not that fanatical. But it made me think how Israel would deal with a mass infiltration and literal war in the streets, door to door. The population is concentrated in small areas, and they can't bomb themselves. Seems to me if the Muslims were hell bent on taking out Israel that they could eventually take that approach?

Why do you think Iran funded groups like Hamas and Hezbollah? If Iran was attacked as they are being now then those Iranian proxies were meant be mobilised onto the streets, door to door and fighting in those small areas of Israel.

[obsidian]

Russia and Iran might have some interests aligned at this time but historically they have not been allies.

I'd be surprised if one country willingly gave nukes to another unless it was a very "special relationship" like USA and England, or Russia and Belarus. I don't think Iran and Russia or Iran and Pakistan are on that level.

Ukraine and Russia were at one point, and now look where they are. Russia manufacture and gave nuclear warheads to Ukraine during the Soviet Union era, and was smart enough to take it back when the USSR collapsed. Perhaps that could influence their decision with Iran. Or they could use Iran to deplete more of the US' weapons supply, reducing Ukraine's resistance. Then there's the US / China / Taiwan issue. These BRICS nations are obviously gaming scenarios behind the scenes. I don't see how a pro-Western puppet regime in Iran is in the best interest of Russia, China, or BRICS. And they have the means to prevent it.

[obsidian]

Why do you think Iran funded groups like Hamas and Hezbollah? If Iran was attacked as they are being now then those Iranian proxies were meant be mobilised onto the streets, door to door and fighting in those small areas of Israel.

Those were small numbers. I am wondering what if it becomes a mass mobilization. In the movie "The Day After", nuclear weapons are detonated over advancing Soviet Troops.

I envision see a scenario like that. If Iran mobilized a million plus army, it is likely that they would be nuked before they reached Israel. That could involve Turkey at that point, and they have the largest army in NATO.

I would think an invasion would have to be spread out, to minimize taking out a large number of troops via nuclear blasts before they reach their target.

Disgruntled Syrian, Lebanese, and Hoothis soldiers could join the party.