Author Topic: Long term juicing and health. (Read 9153 times)

Matt C · « **on:** July 05, 2006, 06:35:58 PM »

Discuss.

sarcasm · « **Reply #1 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:39:46 PM »

it can't be good over time and by time i mean 25-30 years, plaque buildup in the arteries, hardening of the arteries, ventricle wall weakening, high blood pressure, stress on the kidneys, etc.

FREAKgeek · « **Reply #2 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:42:47 PM »

when are you planning your cycle matt?

sarcasm · « **Reply #3 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:45:44 PM »

i remember reading about Pete Grymkowski being a human guinea pig as far as massive dosages go and he's still kicking around, onlyme could probably talk about him more.

jaejonna · « **Reply #4 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:46:44 PM »

I already hate NPCOCK....
But this will be easy....
Listen you fuckin redneck piece of vagina residue... The article was for people who are juicing..your not even buying real ish... you come into contest weighing 165, whatever you are buying isnt working so i hope you continue down your destructive path of trying to attain the dream of being a BB, no one needs some GH, slin, deca, primo, winny using redneck with the genetics of steve urkel to be walking into the KIDS R US and bullying the other children in the Boys 9-12 section while looking for new underoos to wear in your next Mr. Tulsa contest. Alot of these people have familes, good hard working familes who care for those who have past. But you wouldnt know anything about that cause you live in a trailer and your sister is your mom who is divorced from your brother who is your pappi. When people come up to you do they mistake you for someone who is retarded...hey its that kid in the video who scored all thos points in the basketball game..he is a special one.

homo

You have been JaeJow3d...(again)

sarcasm · « **Reply #5 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:50:59 PM »

Quote from: jaejonna on July 05, 2006, 06:46:44 PM

I already hate NPCOCK....
But this will be easy....
Listen you fuckin redneck piece of vagina residue... The article was for people who are juicing..your not even buying real ish... you come into contest weighing 165, whatever you are buying isnt working so i hope you continue down your destructive path of trying to attain the dream of being a BB, no one needs some GH, slin, deca, primo, winny using redneck with the genetics of steve urkel to be walking into the KIDS R US and bullying the other children in the Boys 9-12 section while looking for new underoos to wear in your next Mr. Tulsa contest. Alot of these people have familes, good hard working familes who care for those who have past. But you wouldnt know anything about that cause you live in a trailer and your sister is your mom who is divorced from your brother who is your pappi. When people come up to you do they mistake you for someone who is retarded...hey its that kid in the video who scored all thos points in the basketball game..he is a special one.

homo

You have been JaeJow3d...(again)

"NPCOK" is quite the little bitch, is he not?

jaejonna · « **Reply #6 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:57:18 PM »

He is a monster 165 BB / MMA ... I eat those guys on my diet...

sarcasm · « **Reply #7 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:58:03 PM »

Quote from: jaejonna on July 05, 2006, 06:57:18 PM

He is a monster 165 BB / MMA ... I eat those guys on my diet...

he's an MMA fighter? hahahaha.

Palpatine Q · « **Reply #8 on:** July 05, 2006, 07:06:56 PM »

MMA = Mutual Masturbation Association

timfogarty · « **Reply #9 on:** July 05, 2006, 07:12:57 PM »

there is a difference between steroid use and steroid abuse. to say that this bodybuilder had all sorts of health problems and this other seems healthy is meaningless without knowing the amounts, the combinations and what other things they did in their life.

guys who abuse steroids often also abuse stimulants.

if you're going to do steroids, there are some things you can do to protect your health:

1) cycle on and off. equal amount of time off as on. none of these 5 year long cycles.

2) monitor your BP

3) get regular blood tests, including triglycerides, cholesterol, and liver enzymes (liver is only an issue with 17-alpha orals, generally not injectables). avoid saturated fats, add good fats

4) avoid stimulants, including ephedra, large doses of caffiene, and of course cocaine and methamphetamines.

and in my opinion, 5) avoid GH, insulin, and diuretics. a single miscalculated dose of insulin can kill you. misuse of diuretics can kill too.

jaejonna · « **Reply #10 on:** July 05, 2006, 07:15:12 PM »

What about dipshits like NPCOCK who are asking mexicans what he can use to be big like Nacho Libre but have the genetics of Alley McBeal??

Ex Coelis · « **Reply #11 on:** July 05, 2006, 07:16:52 PM »

Quote from: timfogarty on July 05, 2006, 07:12:57 PM

5) avoid GH, insulin, and diuretics. a single miscalculated dose of insulin can kill you. misuse of diuretics can kill too.

I thought it was good to use a mild diuretic to control the water retention caused by some steroids, thus relieving its effect on blood pressure

alexxx · « **Reply #12 on:** July 05, 2006, 07:22:01 PM »

Quote from: Groink on July 05, 2006, 07:06:56 PM

MMA = Mutual Masturbation Association

I though it waas Man on top of Man Action

timfogarty · « **Reply #13 on:** July 05, 2006, 07:25:41 PM »

Quote from: Big Poppa J on July 05, 2006, 07:16:52 PM

I thought it was good to use a mild diuretic to control the water retention caused by some steroids, thus relieving its effect on blood pressure

well, I was talking more about the rather large doses of diuretics people use right before a contest.

however, I also thought that water retention was in response to estrogen, and that an estrogen inhibitor like 6-OXO (from Pat Arnold, see other thread) would limit it.

Gordon_Gekko · « **Reply #14 on:** July 05, 2006, 08:17:11 PM »

Quote from: timfogarty on July 05, 2006, 07:12:57 PM

there is a difference between steroid use and steroid abuse. to say that this bodybuilder had all sorts of health problems and this other seems healthy is meaningless without knowing the amounts, the combinations and what other things they did in their life.

guys who abuse steroids often also abuse stimulants.

if you're going to do steroids, there are some things you can do to protect your health:

1) cycle on and off. equal amount of time off as on. none of these 5 year long cycles.

2) monitor your BP

3) get regular blood tests, including triglycerides, cholesterol, and liver enzymes (liver is only an issue with 17-alpha orals, generally not injectables). avoid saturated fats, add good fats

4) avoid stimulants, including ephedra, large doses of caffiene, and of course cocaine and methamphetamines.

and in my opinion, 5) avoid GH, insulin, and diuretics. a single miscalculated dose of insulin can kill you. misuse of diuretics can kill too.

Great post!

Regarding #3, would you say (hypothetically) that a healthy mid-thirties advanced trainer who might use a couple hundred mgs each of testosterone and deca, with perhaps a small amount of GH thrown in (all in order to slow down aging and increase quality of life - NOT to try to win the Olympia or anything) would likely not be stressing his liver then?

What is your opinion of veternary drugs like winstrol and EQ? Would drinking winstrol (if taken at all) as opposed to injecting it cause liver stress?

As for #5, I definitely agree regarding insulin and diuretics, but what about low-dose GH cycling for "anti-aging"? do you see any problems with this... This is all purely hypothetical, and assumes anyone doing any of this does so under medical supervision, and without breaking any laws of course...

mrbham · « **Reply #15 on:** July 05, 2006, 08:28:18 PM »

Everyone should get blood work, because a small % of people can't handle them and their blood pressure skyrockets or liver values go crazy, so it would be nice to know if that is you.

Drinking winny or any pill will cause much more liver stress than injecting.

I personally don't think the problems are gh, it is the insulin (which if you are not a moran you are not going to mess up, but don't anyone take it because I say that) diurectics are a big problem in higher doeses, and stimulents are real bad, espically clen, when you have high blood pressure already from the steroids you are asking for heart problems or a heart attack.

timfogarty · « **Reply #16 on:** July 05, 2006, 08:43:07 PM »

I am not an expert on biochemistry, but...

17-alpha-alkylate steroids are the ones that cause the most stress on the liver. these include most orals, including dianabol, winstrol, anadrol, anavar. it's not that they are injested orally that is the issue. but it is their chemical structure that allows them to be taken orally that is also harsh on the liver.

17-alpha steroids require multiple passes through the liver to become active. some people believe that the liver is most stressed when combining orals and injectables.

Van_Bilderass · « **Reply #17 on:** July 05, 2006, 08:46:37 PM »

Quote from: timfogarty on July 05, 2006, 07:12:57 PM

there is a difference between steroid use and steroid abuse.

The term abuse itself is meaningless because it means different things to different people. It also changes over time. What was generally considered steroid abuse in the 80s is not the same as it is today.

timfogarty · « **Reply #18 on:** July 05, 2006, 11:21:46 PM »

Quote from: Van_Bilderass on July 05, 2006, 08:46:37 PM

What was generally considered steroid abuse in the 80s is not the same as it is today.

perhaps its is the same. perhaps just more steroid users are abusing them

brianX · « **Reply #19 on:** July 05, 2006, 11:23:35 PM »

Quote from: sarcasm on July 05, 2006, 06:39:46 PM

it can't be good over time and by time i mean 25-30 years, plaque buildup in the arteries, hardening of the arteries, ventricle wall weakening, high blood pressure, stress on the kidneys, etc.

sarcasm speaks from experience hahahahahahahahahaha brutal steroid abuse hahahahahahahahaha

dzulboy · « **Reply #20 on:** July 05, 2006, 11:55:21 PM »

Quote from: brianX on July 05, 2006, 11:23:35 PM

sarcasm speaks from experience hahahahahahahahahaha brutal steroid abuse hahahahahahahahaha

god this guy is a joke

Samourai Pizzacat · « **Reply #21 on:** July 06, 2006, 01:46:36 AM »

New research has shown that AS users have a bigger chance of not surviving heartattacks.

small amounts of steroids can be beneficial for your gums and teeth, it also widens the jaw, increasing the space between teeth, making flossing easier hehe.

It's a bit of a mixed bag, small amounts can be benificial for some ailments, larger amounts have way to many side-effects.

UK Gold · « **Reply #22 on:** July 06, 2006, 05:12:00 AM »

Its all down to your genetics. Arnold and Lou were juicing [on and off] for upwards of twenty years - and they're fine. Judging from his pics i'd say that Dorian started in 85 and finished in 97 - and hes fine. Same [or thereabouts] for Kev and Shawn. Some people are just unlucky, simple as that.

With moderate use you should be fine, as long as you're not hitting coke, pills, speed etc [and many are]. I'm still amazed everytime i see a bodybuilder smoking. And it disgusts me everytime someone posts a "can i drink whilst on the gear" over on the steroid board. NO! Be sensible! Enjoy the gear, enjoy the benefits it brings - but protect your health.

HUGEPECS · « **Reply #23 on:** July 06, 2006, 05:16:49 AM »

The Psychological effect is always hard to deal with. When most pro's career is over, I'm sure they realized that all these strenght and size were borrowed. They must dealt with what they had naturally. but in my opinion, the physical effect, sometime is inevitable.

honest · « **Reply #24 on:** July 06, 2006, 06:32:19 AM »

Bodybuilding safely = Regular bloodwork, Calcium score test on heart every three years to see if arteries maybe hardening, dont use orals unless pre contest, dont use clen unless pre contest and 4 weeks max, dont compete more than once every two years, no professional aspirations, look around most pros earn less than a wall mart employee and he doesnt have to stick his wages in his butt every week.
Cycle once to twice a year, max, Eat healthy, dont eat the junk just to be big on the scales.