Author Topic: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.  (Read 2833 times)

Vince B

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Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« on: September 07, 2006, 10:25:51 PM »
Amendment of section 1.7   of the IFBB Pro League rules. Athletes WILL be allowed to make appearances on behalf of companies they represent and/ or as individuals to: (including but not limited to) non –sanctioned events, expo’s, guest posing, appearances, seminars, openings, etc. As IFBB athletes are listed as “independent contractors” by our own IFBB by laws and therefore cannot be limited in their ability to make a living from being a professional.

Seems to me athletes as independent contractors should be able to earn money by also competing in non-sanctioned events. If they cannot then they surely are not independent contractors. Isn't competing in those events covered by the "etc." in the statement?

Is Lee Priest's concern about this matter on the agenda?

Miss Karen

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2006, 10:30:03 PM »
More interesting to know how much every IFBB pro is going to be paid monthly.Makes it worth paying Pro fees.Anyone no how much??.Chick you out there?.

Vince B

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2006, 10:35:07 PM »
I can understand that the group of professional bodybuilders would like a steady income. However, when athletes are under contract to the organization it takes a bit of impartiality away from the whole enterprize. The IFBB is trying to woo athletes to remain loyal to them. That is understandable but I wonder if it is good for bodybuilding. Seems to me all those paid athletes will have to continue to kiss butt forever if they become paid employees. Something just doesn't seem right about this sport. It seems corrupt and no amount of patching things up is going to solve the problems.

Miss Karen

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2006, 10:38:10 PM »
They kiss butt now for free so why not give all of them monthly income.That's a good thing.Most of these guys don't get a dime.

IFBBwannaB

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2006, 10:54:47 PM »
More interesting to know how much every IFBB pro is going to be paid monthly.Makes it worth paying Pro fees.Anyone no how much??.Chick you out there?.

This have been talked about before.
NO other federation in the world pays the athletes.
They get paid by thier team,country,sponsers.

Athletes dont work 9-5 so why would they get paid 9-5?

gordiano

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2006, 11:06:33 PM »
"Athletes"



LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HAHA, RON.....

Vince B

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2006, 12:43:56 AM »
Well, the IFBB is desperate to keep the lads in the fold or is that a pen? If bodybuilders are truly independent contractors they should be free to do as they please and choose which contests to enter and so on. Seems to me the IFBB is trying to have their cake and eat it, too. I suppose they know how easy to lead the desperate guys are who haven't won a contest. Instead of inviting competition they try to discourage it. They forget that the Mr Olympia was not the biggest contest when it was started in 1965. For several years many of the top guys competed in the NABBA Universe. Now that the shoe is on the other foot the IFBB is trying to make rules that govern all bodybuilders of worth. That is typical of a guy who is a world authority on Napoleon. Whatever is there of any worth in bodybuilding? Well, except for the few enthusiasts who are keen about the sport/demonstration/art.

Let bodybuilders compete where they like. They will be there to try to win the Olympia and Arnold's contest plus anything else they have a chance at doing well in. The IFBB wants to have the lads and girls in a sort of union but don't compensate them for their loyalty. The IFBB has always been something of a patronizing outfit and with a life president we now know there is little flexibility there. Why not return the sport to the bodybuilders and fans and let them sort out who deserves what?

jwb

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2006, 01:33:46 AM »
I'm personally convinced the IFBB would actually EXPAND if they let guys compete wherever they wanted to.

If some lower tier guys entered nabba, wabba or whatever contests in markets not currently served by ifbb shows they'd build up a greater fan base in those markets and also the athletes they'd compete against would be even MORE inclined to try to qualify for IFBB pro status and beat those guys in ifbb shows.

It can work the same way in business sometimes. I was just reading the IRHSA journal about some brothers who own a gym in chicago and a crunch gym opened RIGHT ACROSS THE ROAD. They were obviously afraid of going bust but their business actually expanded since having 2 gyms in the area drew more people there than just one gym ever could...

 

Vince B

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2006, 02:06:42 AM »
As a gym owner for 35 years I can tell you it would be a nightmare if another big gym opened up nearby. It can happen and I suppose as long as the gyms offer different services then it might be okay for both. I have alway believed the idea gym would have heaps of machines and a free weights gym across the road for the heads. Might work. The trouble is the modern bodybuilders like gyms which have plenty of spunky women to look at.

jwb

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2006, 02:48:16 AM »
As a gym owner for 35 years I can tell you it would be a nightmare if another big gym opened up nearby. It can happen and I suppose as long as the gyms offer different services then it might be okay for both. I have alway believed the idea gym would have heaps of machines and a free weights gym across the road for the heads. Might work. The trouble is the modern bodybuilders like gyms which have plenty of spunky women to look at.
well these guys were an upmarket setup with personal training only. the crunch didn't cost them any customers but in fact brought in many new trainers and their clients who got sick of the hussle and bussle of the crunch across the road.

the ifbb can be kinda similar IMO. right now it is WAY too easy to become an ifbb pro in many parts of the world and there are way too many pros who might be great in 5 years but will probably quit because they can't make the money right now exclusively in the ifbb. think richard jones and plenty of others.

Why not let any ifbb pro compete wherever he wants but make becoming an ifbb pro even harder and more exclusive? The elite aren't going anywhere else because the money isn't there for them but the rookies can compete in smaller shows and build up a name for themselves all over.

the current nabba, wabba or whatever guys will still want to qualify to become ifbb pros and compete against the best.

the ifbb needs to nurture the future of the sport but the top guys are so far ahead right now it is getting to the point where guys will be 35 before they are top pros now and the 25 year olds need a way of staying in the sport until they are good enough.


Tre

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2006, 07:28:53 AM »

There's no way that the performers operating within the IFBB could ever be 'employees' of the organization. 

You operate individually like independent contractors, but there is no guaranteed compensation for any of the work that you perform. 

You can seek paid gigs outside the umbrella of the federation, but the courteous thing to do is to give Jim Manion a call and let him know what you're up to.  I don't think that's such a huge or impossible task.  Just call the man! 

With respect to competing under a different federation's flag, well, that gets a little more dicey and it may require an agreement to be worked out between the IFBB and whichever other federation an athlete might be considering. 

Does anyone know how it works in golf? 

mrsirjojo

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2006, 09:58:38 AM »
"by law" is one word...bylaw. What kind of nickle and dime lawyer has the IFBB hired who doesn't even know that word?

buffbodz

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2006, 12:13:39 PM »
Independent contractors are a way of  having the employer not have to pay taxes, workers comp or any other benefits that go along with being on the payroll.  Many states are doing away with the IC because it stiffs the worker, who must pay their own taxes, health insurance ect...  If they're independent, than what is stopping them from competing outside of the IFBB?  It clearly states this in their own by-lays.  I hope Lee challenges them in court, if it comes to it.  He should win, which is a win for all bodybuilders.  Even the ones with no balls will benefit from Lee hanging it all out at his expense.  I hope the guys who always finish "also at 16th.......know this.
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onlyme

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2006, 03:01:39 AM »
I am pretty sure legally they cannot be independant contractors.  Very stiff laws against this now because employers trying to cheat the system.  Especially if the IFBB plans on paying the members a monthly salary.  This is a dumb and worthless proposal.  Plus how can the IFBB provide insurance for their members when they are contractors.  To be included in a blanket they must be part of the company I thought. 

lonewolf

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #14 on: September 12, 2006, 01:39:44 PM »
Well, the IFBB is desperate to keep the lads in the fold or is that a pen? If bodybuilders are truly independent contractors they should be free to do as they please and choose which contests to enter and so on. Seems to me the IFBB is trying to have their cake and eat it, too. I suppose they know how easy to lead the desperate guys are who haven't won a contest. Instead of inviting competition they try to discourage it. They forget that the Mr Olympia was not the biggest contest when it was started in 1965. For several years many of the top guys competed in the NABBA Universe. Now that the shoe is on the other foot the IFBB is trying to make rules that govern all bodybuilders of worth. That is typical of a guy who is a world authority on Napoleon. Whatever is there of any worth in bodybuilding? Well, except for the few enthusiasts who are keen about the sport/demonstration/art.

Let bodybuilders compete where they like. They will be there to try to win the Olympia and Arnold's contest plus anything else they have a chance at doing well in. The IFBB wants to have the lads and girls in a sort of union but don't compensate them for their loyalty. The IFBB has always been something of a patronizing outfit and with a life president we now know there is little flexibility there. Why not return the sport to the bodybuilders and fans and let them sort out who deserves what?

Vince , you have summed up everything anyone could say about what Pro bodybuilding should be. Unfortunately the Pros are sheep being led by a herder who will lead them to the slaughter rather that the green pasture to feed

onlyme

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2006, 02:13:36 PM »
This is a wasted proposal and will not fly.  Accordingly to Chic the members already have an insurance policy for the IFBB members.  Now they want to be independant contractors, yet reap benefits generally granted to employees.  They also want a salary generally granted to employees.  How will they jusitfy this to the IRS.  The IFBB sure has the dumbest group of legal eagles on the planet.  But, then again they are Canadian so maybe everything is different up there.  But, then if the members recieve a salary they will get taxed for both Canadian and US taxes.

Chick

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2006, 04:34:25 PM »
Please...try and read between the lines, gentlemen...it's not rocket science.

Topskin69

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #17 on: October 09, 2009, 03:46:18 PM »
Please...try and read between the lines, gentlemen...it's not rocket science.

Well then...why dont you spell it out for us...we being the lowly peanut gallery and all...


Coach is Back!

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2009, 04:22:26 PM »
Bodybuilders arn't athletes!

ManBearPig...

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2009, 04:25:09 PM »
i'm remodeling my upstairs and these fucking mexican contractors are the biggest pieces of shit.
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Topskin69

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Re: Independent contractors proposal for IFBB athletes.
« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2009, 05:51:49 PM »
Bodybuilders arn't athletes!
\

Thanks for the tip.. Coach Instone!  :D