Author Topic: gardening thread  (Read 7429 times)

xxxLinda

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gardening thread
« on: September 26, 2006, 12:43:03 PM »
big web







muscleforlife

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2006, 10:55:06 AM »
It is the middle of October.

My Dahlias are still blooming along with my Mums.  A few late Roses and other plants.

The flowers I cut to bring indoors are great Autumn colors, oranges, reds, yellows.

Anyone else's garden still blooming?  What flowers do you have?

Sandra

michael arvilla

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2006, 01:31:23 PM »
     WTF..................... ................ :-X

Euro-monster

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2006, 01:39:59 PM »
     WTF..................... ................ :-X

Well remember.....this is a womens board... ;D
?

Eyeball Chambers

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2006, 02:13:00 PM »
We were planing on building some raised beds next spring for vegetables.  :D
S

CQ

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2006, 04:45:07 PM »
I am pretty obsessed with my yard. I have mostly fruit trees - banana, lemon, loquat, paw paws, cherry etc..I don't have them to eat per se...but for the look. They are dotted around with other plants like aloe and elephant ears. Problem is I am always finding some sniveling little neighbourhood kid trolling into my yard to get to the trees as though it is public property >:(


24KT

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2006, 05:00:47 PM »
I am pretty obsessed with my yard. I have mostly fruit trees - banana, lemon, loquat, paw paws, cherry etc..I don't have them to eat per se...but for the look. They are dotted around with other plants like aloe and elephant ears.

CQ, by paw paws, do you mean papayas?

Quote
Problem is I am always finding some sniveling little neighbourhood kid trolling into my yard to get to the trees as though it is public property >:(


{giggle} That sniveling, trolling little neighbourhood kid would be me.  :D {lol} To this day whenever I get my mail, I can never resist grabbing a cherry or two from my neighbours cherry tree. I mean those cherries are soooo big, and red, and juicy... just bursting with flavour  :P  ...sides, it's his fault for growing a big juicy luscious cherry tree right next to a community mailbox. ...and it's really in the trees best interest that I do. The branches are sooo weighed down with cherries, we wouldn't want them to get unsightly stretch marks would we?   ;D
w

muscleforlife

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2006, 05:58:25 PM »
my garden is small, but I love digging in the dirt.  Half the time I can't remember what I planted until it starts to bloom.

I do love fruit trees.  My house had a cherry tree, but it is quite dead now. 
I don't do veggies in the garden.  I'd rather do flowers.

Sandra

CQ

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2006, 06:11:14 PM »
CQ, by paw paws, do you mean papayas?


No.....

Mydavid

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2006, 06:54:17 PM »
Our yard is full of roses...roses in the front yard, roses on the 2 side yards, roses in the back yard and a few roses that are potted. My hubbie came from a family of green thumbs!!!!!
Our home is very beautiful and i'm lucky.
Lisa

muscleforlife

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2006, 07:19:18 PM »
Ok,  brag on about your Roses!

My roses never do too well.    I have one climber that didn't bloom after june!

Time to move them in the springtime.
Sandra

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2006, 07:26:44 PM »
Ok,  brag on about your Roses!

My roses never do too well.    I have one climber that didn't bloom after june!

Time to move them in the springtime.
Sandra

It's the luck of the hubby!!!!! ;D Second marriages are the best...you start looking for the "other stuff" you can get out of it ;)...although he is a keeper.


Lisa

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2006, 07:30:07 PM »
I am pretty obsessed with my yard. I have mostly fruit trees - banana, lemon, loquat, paw paws, cherry etc..I don't have them to eat per se...but for the look. They are dotted around with other plants like aloe and elephant ears. Problem is I am always finding some sniveling little neighbourhood kid trolling into my yard to get to the trees as though it is public property >:(



I love your garden CQ!

I tried to get my plumeria cutting to grow, but it just died.  My mom and sister have the green thumbs!




Deedee

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2006, 03:05:18 AM »
Everything is still blooming.  Plus, the herbs look like they're going to make it for another month. Damn... now I miss xxxLinda  :-\

CQ

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2006, 05:31:34 AM »
I love your garden CQ!

I tried to get my plumeria cutting to grow, but it just died.  My mom and sister have the green thumbs!


Thanks.

I was like a plant serial killer so eventually I gave up years ago and whipped out my checkbook.

xxxLinda

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2006, 10:18:15 AM »
Ok,  brag on about your Roses!

My roses never do too well.    I have one climber that didn't bloom after june!

Time to move them in the springtime.
Sandra
Hi...  but I wouldn't move roses.  It takes approx 3-5 years for them to re-establish if they even make it.  Did you deadhead after flowering?  Some roses only flower once each year anyways, (May-June in England).  You're lucky if you find a rose which will flower again later in the year.  (But I've got one fabulous red highly scented one still out...

Instead of the massive job of moving them, try pruning them hard.  Take out 33% of the old wood and 66% of the new wood...  Tie in the new growth (next Spring) sideways, climbers flower better if you go horizontal. 

>>>& mulch with good compost.

Also - Don't forget to wear a leather jacket and gloves.
xLinda

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2006, 03:45:56 PM »
w

muscleforlife

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2006, 04:03:30 PM »


Hi...  but I wouldn't move roses.  It takes approx 3-5 years for them to re-establish if they even make it.  Did you deadhead after flowering?  Some roses only flower once each year anyways, (May-June in England).  You're lucky if you find a rose which will flower again later in the year.  (But I've got one fabulous red highly scented one still out...

Instead of the massive job of moving them, try pruning them hard.  Take out 33% of the old wood and 66% of the new wood...  Tie in the new growth (next Spring) sideways, climbers flower better if you go horizontal. 

>>>& mulch with good compost.

Also - Don't forget to wear a leather jacket and gloves.
xLinda

I don't have problem with the pruning, but I know the one climber that didn't bloom at all this year needs to be moved.  Lots of leggy brancesh but no flowers.

I did deadhead, the ones that I move have to be done in the springtime in New Jersey.

Sandra

CQ

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2006, 04:12:38 PM »
What are paw-paws then?

All I know it is a fruit ;D

I think they may be not well known elsewhere because they do not keep well. If you pick them they will go bad a few days later. We do not export them.

Butterbean

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #19 on: October 10, 2006, 06:28:57 PM »
How big is a paw-paw CQ?  They kind of look like mangoes.
R

xxxLinda

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #20 on: October 10, 2006, 06:34:21 PM »
I've not seen PawPaws in England, so I looked them up:

SOUNDS LOVELY !!!



PAWPAW
B/W sketch
Asimina triloba
Annonaceae
Common Name:Pawpaw, Paw Paw, Papaw, Poor Man's Banana, Hoosier Banana, etc. (In Australia the tropical papaya, Carica papaya, is also known as Pawpaw).

Related species: Asimina incarna, A. longifolia, A. obovata, A. parviflora, A. pygmaea, A. reticulata, A. tetramera, A. X nashii. These eight Asimina species grow in the southeastern United States.

Distant Affinity: Cherimoya (Annona cherimola), Soursop (Annona muricata), Custard Apple (Annona reticulata), Sugar Apple, Sweetsop (Annona squamosa), Atemoya (Annona squamosa X A. cherimola).

Origin: The pawpaw is native to the temperate woodlands of the eastern U.S. The American Indian is credited with spreading the pawpaw across the eastern U.S. to eastern Kansas and Texas, and from the Great Lakes almost to the Gulf. Fossils prove the pawpaw is indigenous to the U.S.

Adaptation: The pawpaw is adapted to the humid continental climate of its native habitat. It is seldom found near the Atlantic or Gulf coasts. It requires a minimum of 400 hours of winter chill and at least 160 frost-free days. Pawpaws appear to be sensitive to low humidities, dry winds and cool maritime summers. It has been successfully grown in parts of California and the Pacific Northwest that meet its growing requirements. It has grown well in the San Jose area (USDA Climate Zone 9 or Sunset Climate Zone 15). The climatic conditions of Southern California make growing the pawpaw there more difficult. The deep winter dormancy of the tree makes it highly frost tolerant, withstanding temperatures of -25° F or lower (hardy to USDA Climate Zone 5). Pawpaws can be grown as container specimens, although this is not often practiced. A deep pot is needed to accommodate the root system.
DESCRIPTION
Growth Habit: The pawpaw is a deciduous, often narrowly conical tree growing from about 12 feet to around 20 feet. Pawpaw trees are prone to producing root suckers a few feet from the trunk. When these are permitted to grow, the single-clone pawpaw patch comes into being. The prevailing experiences of many individuals is that the pawpaw is a slow grower, particularly when it is young. However, under optimal greenhouse conditions, including photo-period extension light of approximately 16 hours, top growth of up to 5 feet can be attained in three months.

Foliage: The dark green, obovate-oblong, drooping leaves grow up to 12 inches long, giving the pawpaw an interesting tropical appearance. The leaves turn yellow and begin to fall in mid-autumn and leaf out again in late spring after the tree has bloomed.

Flowers: Dormant, velvety, dark brown flower buds develop in the axils of the previous years' leaves. They produce maroon, upside-down flowers up to 2 inches across. The normal bloom period consists of about 6 weeks during March to May depending on variety, latitude and climatic conditions. The blossom consists of 2 whorls of 3 petals each, and the calyx has 3 sepals. Each flower contains several ovaries which explains why a single flower can produce multiple fruits.

Fruit: The pawpaw is the largest edible fruit native to America. Individual fruits weigh 5 to 16 ounces and are 3 to 6 inches in length. The larger sizes will appear plump, similar to the mango. The fruit usually has 10 to 14 seeds in two rows. The brownish to blackish seeds are shaped like lima beans, with a length of 1/2 to 1-1/2 inches. Pawpaw fruits often occur as clusters of up to nine individual fruits. The ripe fruit is soft and thin skinned.
CULTURE
Location: The young plant is very sensitive to full sunlight and requires filtered sun for the first year or two. The use of tree shelters is an ideal solution to the problem, permitting the plant to receive a full day of filtered sunlight. Once established, pawpaws prefer full sun. The large dangling leaves dislike strong winds. Overall the tree is an excellent edible landscape addition.

Soil: Pawpaws do best in deep, fertile soil that is moist, but well-drained and slightly acid (pH 5-7). The addition of compost to most western soils makes them more hospitable to the pawpaw. Avoid heavy, wet, alkaline soil.

Irrigation: The pawpaw needs regular watering during the growing season. The soil should be kept moist but avoid waterlogging.

Fertilization: The pawpaw responds to the application of an organic or granular fertilizer high in potassium twice a year. For container growing, 250 - 500 ppm of soluble 20-20-20 NPK plus soluble trace elements during growth phase is optimal.

Pruning: Ordinarily little pruning is required, except to remove dead, damaged or wayward branches. Periodic pruning may be used to stimulate some new growth each year on older trees, since it is new growth that produces fruit the following season.

Propagation: To break dormancy Pawpaw seed must receive a 90 to 120 day stratification, i.e. exposure to cold temperatures. To accomplish this, the seed should be placed in plastic freezer zipper bag containing a handful of moist sphagnum moss and refrigerated at 32° - 40° F. The over wintering of field planted seeds normally accomplishes this stratification requirement.

Germination of pawpaw seed is hypogeal--the shoot emerges without any cotyledons. Under ideal greenhouse culture, germination can be expected in about seven weeks. Seeds field-planted in the fall will emerge the following July or August. But before the shoot emerges, the seed will have sent down a 10 inch long tap root.

Hardwood cuttings are essentially impossible to root, while root cuttings have been variable to disappointing. Some success has been reported using softwood cuttings under intermittent mist with bottom heat (80° F) and supplemental light (14 hours). All grafting and budding techniques can be performed on the pawpaw, but T-budding is not recommended. Chip-budding has been reported to be successful. Scion wood should be gathered while the tree is dormant and kept refrigerated. Grafting can be done in the spring after vegetative growth begins.

Young pawpaw plants have fleshy, brittle roots with few fine root hairs, making them difficult to transplant. It is important to follow these helpful rules:

   1. Use seedlings, not root suckers.
   2. Move the tree with roots and soil intact. A container grown specimen is best.
   3. Transplant the tree in the spring after bud break.
   4. Give the plant good drainage and keep it well watered the first year.

Pests and diseases: Pawpaw trees are relatively disease free, including a resistance to Oak Root Fungus (Armillaria). A number of vertebrates such as foxes, opossums, squirrels and raccoons will eat the fruit, although deer, goats and rabbits will not eat the leaves or twigs. The attraction of pawpaw roots to gophers is a somewhat unknown factor, but it seems likely that they would not be the gopher's first choice. The Zebra Swallowtail butterfly's larvae feed exclusively on young, pawpaw foliage, but never in great numbers. On the West Coast, slugs, snails and earwigs can be easily controlled by the application of Tanglefoot to a band around the pawpaw tree trunk. It is important not to apply Tanglefoot directly to the bark, however.

Pollination: Poor pollination has always plagued the pawpaw in nature, and the problem has followed them into domestication. Pawpaw flowers are perfect, in that they have both male and female reproduction parts, but they are not self-pollinating. The flowers are also protogynaus, i.e., the female stigma matures and is no longer receptive when the male pollen is shed. In addition pawpaws are self-incompatible, requiring cross pollination from another unrelated pawpaw tree.

Bees show no interest in pawpaw flowers. The task of pollenization is left to unenthusiastic species of flies and beetles. A better solution for the home gardener is to hand pollinate, using a small, soft artist's brush to transfer pollen to the stigma. Pollen is ripe for gathering when the ball of anthers is brownish in color, loose and friable. Pollen grains should appear as small beige-colored particles on the brush hairs. The stigma is receptive when the tips of the pistils are green, glossy and sticky, and the anther ball is firm and greenish to light yellow in color.

Harvest: Pawpaw fruit ripens during a four-week period between mid August and into October, depending on various factors. When ripe, it is soft and yields easily to a gentle squeeze, and has a pronounced perfumed fragrance. The skin of the green fruit usually lightens in color as it ripens and often develops blackish splotches which do not affect the flavor or edibility. The yellow flesh is custard like and highly nutritious. The best fruit has a complex, tropical flavor unlike any other temperate zone fruit. At present, the primary use of pawpaws is for fresh eating out of hand. The ripe fruit is very perishable with a shelf life of 2 or 3 days, but will keep up to 3 weeks if it is refrigerated at 40° - 45° F.

Commercial potential: Although pawpaw fruit is not yet a commercially viable commodity, the domestication process is well underway. Several academic institutions are setting up seventeen Regional Variety Trial sites. Kentucky State University is the site of Pawpaw National Clonal Germ-plasm Repository. The pawpaw has also found its way to several overseas countries, and a few of these are actively engaged in research. Pawpaw leaves and twigs contain substances with promising anti-cancer and pesitcidal properties.

Plant selection: A number of mail-order sources of pawpaw plants now offer both grafted cultivars and seedlings. Most seedling plants have been propagated from mixed seeds and will eventually end up producing undesirable fruit. Purchasers are advised to graft such plants to a known cultivar or order grafted plants initially. Container grown plants are much more likely to survive transplanting.

When placing an order for a pawpaw plant, it is helpful to have the Pawpaw Selection Option Chart below handy. Phoning in the order gives the opportunity to ask questions and substantiate it.

PAWPAW PLANT SELECTION OPTIONS
    Container Grown (1)     Bare Root (2)
CULTIVAR - on seedling root stock   some sources   most sources
CULTIVAR - from shoot/root on own root stock   rarely available   rarely available
SEEDLING - from seed of mixed seed (risky fruit quality)   some sources   most sources
SEEDLING - from seed of cultivar fruit (usually comes fairly true)   rarely available   rarely available
(1) easier to get established, good survival rate
(2) slower to get established, reduced survival rate
CULTIVARS
Callaway (1990) lists over 60 pawpaw cultivars, many of which are not available in the nursery trade. The Kentucky State list of cultivars, while not as extensive, is more current. The following cultivars are among the best with regard to fruit quality:

Davis
    Fruit small. Flesh yellow, green skin. Seeds large. Flavor good.
Mary Foos Johnson
    Similar to Sunflower.
Mitchell
    Fruit medium. Flesh golden, slightly yellow skin. Flavor excellent.
Overleese
    Fruit large. Fewer seed but large. Flesh yellow. Flavor excellent.
Prolific
    Fruit large. Flesh yellow. Flavor excellent.
Sunflower
    Fruit medium large. Flesh golden, yellowish skin. Few seeds. Flavor good. Purported to be self-fertile.
Sweet Alice
    Fruit medium large. Prolific bearer. Flesh yellow. Flavor good.
Taylor
    Fruit small. Flesh yellow, green skin. Flavor mild, excellent.
Taytoo
    Fruit medium. Flesh yellow, light green skin. Flavor excellent. Prolific bearer.
Wells
    Fruit quite large. Flesh orange, green skin. Flavor superb.

FURTHER READING

    * Callaway, M. Brett. Pawpaw (Asimina triloba): a "Tropical" Fruit for Temperate Climates. New Crops. 1993.
    * Callaway, M. Brett. The Pawpaw (Asimina triloba). Kentucky State University, Frankfort, KY. 1990.
    * Callaway, M. Brett and Dorothy J. Callaway. Our Native Pawpaw: The Next New Commercial Fruit? Arnold Arboretum, Harvard University. Fall 1992, pp 20-29.
    * Layne, D. R. Pawpaws. In: Register of Fruit and Nut Varieties, 3d ed. A.S.H.S. Press, Alexandria, VA, 1996.
    * Layne, D.R. The Pawpaw [Asimina triloba (L.) Dunal]: A New Fruit Crop for Kentucky and the United States. HortScience vol. 31, 1996, pp. 15-22.
    * Peterson, R. Neal. Pawpaws in the Garden, and Pawpaws in the Nursery Trade. Pawpaw Foundation, 1990.
    * Peterson, R. Neal. Pawpaw (Asimina). Acta Horticulture, ISHS. Feb.1991, pp. 569-600.
    * Reich, Lee. Uncommon Fruits Worthy of Attention. Addison-Wesley, 1991. pp. 3-13.
    * Kentucky State University Pawpaw Research Project

See Index of CRFG Publications, 1969 - 1989 and annual indexes of Fruit Gardener for additional articles on the pawpaw. Here is the list of additional CRFG Fruit Facts. © Copyright 1996,1999, California Rare Fruit Growers, Inc.
Questions or comments? Contact us.

24KT

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2006, 09:53:54 PM »
Gee... Thanks everybody. That's alot of pawpaw information.
w

xxxLinda

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #22 on: October 11, 2006, 02:51:50 AM »
It's fascinating...  It sounds to be a gorgeous tree.  I haven't found a colour pic of the flowers in Spring though.  The bit about PawPaw having anti-cancer properties is interesting. 

And I can go to see one - they've got one at Kew Gardens.  I've looked it up and it's in the Palm House, although I don't quite understand, since that greenhouse is kept at a tropical climate.  And now that I've learned all about PawPaw, I know that it requires coldish winters.  So I'm very curious to find out how they grow it at Kew. 

I've got a season ticket and go about once a month.  It's awe-inspiring, year-round.

So next visit, I'll spend a while looking for it to see whether I can recognise it without help and if
I can't find it, I'll go ask the nicest of the horticultural hunks that work there where they move the PawPaw for the winter...


Thanks for teaching me.
Linda
xxx

michael arvilla

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2006, 08:28:07 AM »
Well remember.....this is a womens board... ;D


Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.. ................... ;)

xxxLinda

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Re: gardening thread
« Reply #24 on: October 11, 2006, 08:32:24 AM »
Gardening is not really just a womans thing.  But it is, for sure, a thing of beauty.

Firstly you need to have one.  That took me many years (I live in Central London).  Then you need the time and the energy. 

It's fab exercise.

It's also a singleton, solitary pursuit (like reading and messing on the www).


But it's a subject about which one can talk for hours and hours without arguing.  Without very much one-up-manship.


Also, the photos on the seed packets and bulb wrappings are better than travel brochures.  The plants actually come out better than the pix.


My garden loves me back.
xL