Author Topic: If the PDI didn't exist, would Jay still have won? (Read 3992 times)

donrhummy · « **on:** October 01, 2006, 09:38:20 PM »

Did it make a difference? Was it just attendance dropping? or would the judges have given it to Jay no matter what?

rocket · « **Reply #1 on:** October 01, 2006, 09:40:59 PM »

Theoretically yes. (that it might affect Jays victory)

Practically no

Ronnie had a very poor back. Say what you will about from the front (Ronnie dominates, jay lacks detail) but you shouldn't win an olympia with obvious injury.

Can he turn it around? Who knows, maybe someone with experience of the injury he's had could pipe in?

thisiskeith12 · « **Reply #2 on:** October 01, 2006, 09:51:52 PM »

Quote from: rocket on October 01, 2006, 09:40:59 PM

Theoretically yes. (that it might affect Jays victory)

Practically no

Ronnie had a very poor back. Say what you will about from the front (Ronnie dominates, jay lacks detail) but you shouldn't win an olympia with obvious injury.

Can he turn it around? Who knows, maybe someone with experience of the injury he's had could pipe in?

Ronnie is done. Who knows who will win next year? It may be Jay, it may not, but it won't be Ronnie. I'd put $100 on it.

rocket · « **Reply #3 on:** October 01, 2006, 09:53:36 PM »

Quote from: thisiskeith12 on October 01, 2006, 09:51:52 PM

Ronnie is done. Who knows who will win next year? It may be Jay, it may not, but it won't be Ronnie. I'd put $100 on it.

I wouldn't bet you until I knew whether it was even possible to come back.

And even then I'm not so sure they will award RC a win ahead of a guy who can speak publically and within the first 3 minutes had bashed the PDI.

Seems to me they really lucked out with RC being injured.

thisiskeith12 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 01, 2006, 09:55:42 PM »

Quote from: rocket on October 01, 2006, 09:53:36 PM

I wouldn't bet you until I knew whether it was even possible to come back.

And even then I'm not so sure they will award RC a win ahead of a guy who can speak publically and within the first 3 minutes had bashed the PDI.

Seems to me they really lucked out with RC being injured.

I'm not sure if Cutler will win next year. If Phil Heath and Victor are standing next to him, it could bring him down.

rocket · « **Reply #5 on:** October 01, 2006, 09:57:41 PM »

Phil heath can never win an olympia, he's narrow as hell*. Victor is about 1.5 times wider.

I don't like Jay's physique, its huge but its not freaky. I'm happy that he got it though - he deserved 1 or 2 in previous years.

*exaggeration

thisiskeith12 · « **Reply #6 on:** October 01, 2006, 10:02:08 PM »

Victor needs to bring his quads up, majorly.

donrhummy · « **Reply #7 on:** October 02, 2006, 05:13:58 AM »

I agree on Ronnie being off, but he's been off before and it didn't make a difference. And while his back was down, Jay did not pwn him there. He did equal him (they both had pluses/minuses about their backs), though.

rocket · « **Reply #8 on:** October 02, 2006, 05:17:28 AM »

Quote from: donrhummy on October 02, 2006, 05:13:58 AM

I agree on Ronnie being off, but he's been off before and it didn't make a difference. And while his back was down, Jay did not pwn him there. He did equal him (they both had pluses/minuses about their backs), though.

Yeh I agree but I think we have to be fair on injury and just penalise it.

Jay has never impressed me because the man lacks visible vascularity/striation pretty much everywhere and always looks soft compared to other guys (he's not, he just doesn't have detail). I think bodywise we've gone back a few steps having Jay as Mr Olympia.

But.. he won because Ronnie was down and if you see the video you will know Ronnie knew it beforehand.. bigtime.

Slick Vic · « **Reply #9 on:** October 02, 2006, 05:18:39 AM »

Quote from: donrhummy on October 01, 2006, 09:38:20 PM

Did it make a difference? Was it just attendance dropping? or would the judges have given it to Jay no matter what?

He won 'cause he was the better bodybuilder on that particular day and that particular night. End of story.

donrhummy · « **Reply #10 on:** October 02, 2006, 05:23:07 AM »

Quote from: Slick Vic on October 02, 2006, 05:18:39 AM

He won 'cause he was the better bodybuilder on that particular day and that particular night. End of story.

So you think Jay was a better bodybuilder than dexter or victor?

donrhummy · « **Reply #11 on:** October 02, 2006, 05:25:20 AM »

Quote from: Slick Vic on October 02, 2006, 05:18:39 AM

He won 'cause he was the better bodybuilder on that particular day and that particular night. End of story.

Oh, and also, you think Jay really deserved to win both the posing round (over Melvin) and the symmetry round?

rocco911 · « **Reply #12 on:** October 02, 2006, 06:01:53 AM »

Quote from: donrhummy on October 01, 2006, 09:38:20 PM

Did it make a difference? Was it just attendance dropping? or would the judges have given it to Jay no matter what?

PDI...what is that? Is it still in existence? Nobody even noticed Lee Priest. His Twin Lab barely got visits and people walked right passed him all weekend. PDI still hasn't paid any athlete. The Olympia had more than 7K people in attendance according the officials associated with the Orleans. PDI is irrelevant

divcom · « **Reply #13 on:** October 02, 2006, 06:08:30 AM »

Quote from: Slick Vic on October 02, 2006, 05:18:39 AM

He won 'cause he was the better bodybuilder on that particular day and that particular night. End of story.

He won because the old man was off. Maybe future champs should learn a lesson Ronnie. Obivously... the injuries came from his heavy lifts across the board. Should have maintained this time around. Anyway...he still has nice rides and a possible future bride. End Story.

body88 · « **Reply #14 on:** October 02, 2006, 06:56:34 AM »

Quote from: donrhummy on October 01, 2006, 09:38:20 PM

Did it make a difference? Was it just attendance dropping? or would the judges have given it to Jay no matter what?

I have already given many reason why the pdi had nothing to do with this. Jay was on. Many pros and industry insiders where picking him to win. He looked incredable while Ronnie was off. When he won the whole place went nuts... No boos. The video shows him clearly beating Coleman. All you guys where banking on the fact Ronnie would take the win over the more deserving Cutler. Hence giving you guys ammunition to rip the ifbb and make a case for people to jump ship. When the contest was judged fair and the better man one it makes it ALOT harder for the PDI now. I hope the PDI succeeds. I hope they can get off the ground.The ifbb did not alter the Olympia because of the pdi lol. Why would they fix the show with the two most succesful guys. Jay has won four asc's. Many contest and makes a ton of money in the ifbb. What the hell would he leave for the pdi lol? If they where going to do things like that they would start with the smaller shows to keep the top guys happy that never win contests or make alot of money. Stop making gimmick accounts to push this nonsense. Jay won because he looked like this. Why is Ronnie not so pissed off at the fixed loss that he will be competing in the pdi? There was no fix. Ronnie was off. Jay was the best he has ever been. The better man won.

Deadpool · « **Reply #15 on:** October 02, 2006, 06:59:59 AM »

very nice picture of Jay

congratulations to Jay

and his professionalism speaks miles about him, win or lose he kept his composure

RHINO290 · « **Reply #16 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:12:54 AM »

Quote from: body88 on October 02, 2006, 06:56:34 AM

I have already given many reason why the pdi had nothing to do with this. Jay was on. Many pros and industry insiders where picking him to win. He looked incredable while Ronnie was off. When he won the whole place went nuts... No boos. The video shows him clearly beating Coleman. All you guys where banking on the fact Ronnie would take the win over the more deserving Cutler. Hence giving you guys ammunition to rip the ifbb and make a case for people to jump ship. When the contest was judged fair and the better man one it makes it ALOT harder for the PDI now. I hope the PDI succeeds. I hope they can get off the ground.The ifbb did not alter the Olympia because of the pdi lol. Why would they fix the show with the two most succesful guys. Jay has won four asc's. Many contest and makes a ton of money in the ifbb. What the hell would he leave for the pdi lol? If they where going to do things like that they would start with the smaller shows to keep the top guys happy that never win contests or make alot of money. Stop making gimmick accounts to push this nonsense. Jay won because he looked like this. Why is Ronnie not so pissed off at the fixed loss that he will be competing in the pdi? There was no fix. Ronnie was off. Jay was the best he has ever been. The better man won.

I agree with everyhting you have said...But....You hope the PDI gets off the ground? Dude, with a successful NOC, sold out, 2 shows in Europe in October, 6 shows scheduled for next year, and anothe six to be scheduled...I think we are past that now. This is not an ifbb vs. PDi thing, we will coexist. Truth is, I'm not sure the types of guys who are successful in the ifbb would be in the PDI. I recently spoke with Wayne about a certain ifbb pro, and the general opinion, as that he was not right for the PDI. And trudt me, this is no 3rd tier pro I'm talkin about.

PDI judges on shape, conditioning, and symmetry, period......oh, and entertainment value.

body88 · « **Reply #17 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:14:23 AM »

Quote from: RHINO290 on October 02, 2006, 10:12:54 AM

I agree with everyhting you have said...But....You hope the PDI gets off the ground? Dude, with a successful NOC, sold out, 2 shows in Europe in October, 6 shows scheduled for next year, and anothe six to be scheduled...I think we are past that now. This is not an ifbb vs. PDi thing, we will coexist. Truth is, I'm not sure the types of guys who are successful in the ifbb would be in the PDI. I recently spoke with Wayne about a certain ifbb pro, and the general opinion, as that he was not right for the PDI. And trudt me, this is no 3rd tier pro I'm talkin about.

PDI judges on shape, conditioning, and symmetry, period......oh, and entertainment value.

I ment that I hope the pdi becomes very successful. I have been a fan of a new federation since day one. I am just calling it like I see it.

RHINO290 · « **Reply #18 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:22:01 AM »

Quote from: body88 on October 02, 2006, 10:14:23 AM

I ment that I hope the pdi becomes very successful. I have been a fan of a new federation since day one. I am just calling it like I see it.

Yes, I know you meant well, I was making a general statment to the naysayers. I no you are not one of them. I consider you one of the knowledgeable ones..

240 is Back · « **Reply #19 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:22:52 AM »

Quote from: Slick Vic on October 02, 2006, 05:18:39 AM

He won 'cause he was the better bodybuilder on that particular day and that particular night. End of story.

Jay was the better BBer in 2001. Why didn't he win then?

body88 · « **Reply #20 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:24:34 AM »

Quote from: RHINO290 on October 02, 2006, 10:22:01 AM

Yes, I know you meant well, I was making a general statment to the naysayers. I no you are not one of them. I consider you one of the knowledgeable ones..

Gotcha

body88 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:25:31 AM »

Quote from: 240 is Back on October 02, 2006, 10:22:52 AM

Jay was the better BBer in 2001. Why didn't he win then?

Was not as close as it was last night imo. Where they the same judges in 01? Where there the exact same people in charge of everything in 01? If not cant really compare the two. 240 do you have some information? I am being serious. You seem to be in the know.

MisterGX · « **Reply #22 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:44:23 AM »

Quote from: 240 is Back on October 02, 2006, 10:22:52 AM

Jay was the better BBer in 2001. Why didn't he win then?

Because Ronnie wasn't as off/as heavy as he was the other night. Plus, in 2001--Ronnie still killed Jay from the rear.. This year, Jay beat him in just about every shot except maybe the front double-bi.

onlyme · « **Reply #23 on:** October 02, 2006, 10:45:19 AM »

Quote from: rocco911 on October 02, 2006, 06:01:53 AM

PDI...what is that? Is it still in existence? Nobody even noticed Lee Priest. His Twin Lab barely got visits and people walked right passed him all weekend. PDI still hasn't paid any athlete. The Olympia had more than 7K people in attendance according the officials associated with the Orleans. PDI is irrelevant

Monster delusion and wrong on every statement. Now you are funny.

RHINO290 · « **Reply #24 on:** October 02, 2006, 11:31:34 AM »

Quote from: rocco911 on October 02, 2006, 06:01:53 AM

PDI...what is that? Is it still in existence? Nobody even noticed Lee Priest. His Twin Lab barely got visits and people walked right passed him all weekend. PDI still hasn't paid any athlete. The Olympia had more than 7K people in attendance according the officials associated with the Orleans. PDI is irrelevant

Wow, talk about not being in the know!!!!

Dude, you better check your sources.......wow!!!!!!!!!!