Author Topic: range of motion question  (Read 1620 times)

NoCalBbEr

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range of motion question
« on: June 06, 2007, 02:57:56 PM »
I know to really work a muscle you have to use a  full range of motion? I've seen a lot more videos of pros training.  almost all of them use a limited range of motion. is going  a limited range of motion,  the best way to  work the muscle to grow?? I'm not just taling about ronnie but jay,branch and etc. is keeping  the muscle under stress and not going up to full ext.. the key??

pumpster

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2007, 03:51:55 PM »
Do you really feel like you've mastered that weight if your doing 3/4 of an exercise? I never cheat. It makes me feel bad about myself. Also I like to take pride in the fact that I have better form than most.

The thing is BB isn't about mastering the weight or holding to some moral code of honor, it's about improving development. Less strict or partials can often work the muscle more thoroughly to exhaustion by allowing the set to continue beyond the failure point involved with strict reps. And loser form or partials can be less stressful on the joints and ligaments if used under control. Exactly why Arnold liked cheat curls, and why Scott liked partials after he couldn't do any more full reps. On cheats i'm not talking about wild swings with the weight, just a nudge to get the weight moving the first few inches before the muscles take over using a heavier weight than strict reps allow, either all the way through the set or just at the end when fatigue sets in.

Case-by-case; decide for yourself with the bottom line which (1) works the muscle better and just as importantly if not more so (2) which allows you more effectively to increase the reps/weight when it's crunch time and you have to keep going-In order to improve you have to go beyond what you can already do sometimes, fully burn out the muscle by continuing the set beyond what strict reps allow using intensity techniques like cheats, partials, etc.

Slight cheating is to me much more effective when you're about to fail but have to keep going in order to improve, whereas if you keep it completely strict you can actually have something left in other areas of ROM but can't get past the sticking point with strict reps. If you get past the sticking point with cheats, burns, etc. to the area of ROM where the muscle's stronger & still has something left, the muscle can be further exhausted.

The Squadfather

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2007, 04:17:30 PM »
robotically strict form is very overrated.

lilwoday09smb

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2007, 04:40:05 PM »
i agree with pumpster, I'm starting to learn you have to try everything and do what works for you. I heavy on almost all body parts except back. i started using lighter weight and really squezzing and ive noticed huge change

jpm101

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2007, 09:47:15 PM »
Most lifters, and other athletes, will be more concerned with their form and range of motion. They want an equal balance of strength and joint/muscle (among many other things) ROM needed for a select sport. Also as a preventive against spot related  injury.

Hardcore BB'ers just want the most size any way they can get it. BB'ers have always been the pioneers of new and unique training methods. Way ahead of the curve. This would also include diet and of course drug experiments (sorry to say). They step out of their own reality box and away from what is thought the proper way to train. That is, strict form and full ROM. I am sure there are some advance BB'ers who do train by the book with perfect form. But for the last 15 years, or so, just about every Pro or top BB'er I have seen or heard about in SoCal, depends on mostly middle range reps, done a a very fast pace. The tension is kept upon the muscle area throughout the exercise. The BB curl for example, once started, is never raised to a full contracted top position or lowered (extended) fully to the bottom of the lift.  Always with-in the 2/3's range. Reps are around the 6 to 10 range, usually.

A limited style of heavy training reps/sets is not meant for everyone. Some guy's will prefer  stricter ROM form and moderate weights and make good progress that way. Others, a slightly looser style with a little cheat on the last few reps. Or pure light pumping movements with extra reps of burns thrown in..The injury rate, surprisingly,  does not seem that much of a worry, if proper warm-ups are not taken, with those 2/3's or limited ROM's for some people. I do believe that a 6 to 8 week protocol of serious heavy mid-rep range workouts can give a boost in muscle size and strength to a lot of guy's, from time to time. Good Luck.
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pumpster

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dizzleman06

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2007, 12:34:14 PM »
robotically strict form is very overrated.

agreed... 

Redwingenator

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2007, 01:44:33 PM »
The thing is BB isn't about mastering the weight or holding to some moral code of honor, it's about improving development. Less strict or partials can often work the muscle more thoroughly to exhaustion by allowing the set to continue beyond the failure point involved with strict reps. And loser form or partials can be less stressful on the joints and ligaments if used under control. Exactly why Arnold liked cheat curls, and why Scott liked partials after he couldn't do any more full reps. On cheats i'm not talking about wild swings with the weight, just a nudge to get the weight moving the first few inches before the muscles take over using a heavier weight than strict reps allow, either all the way through the set or just at the end when fatigue sets in.

Case-by-case; decide for yourself with the bottom line which (1) works the muscle better and just as importantly if not more so (2) which allows you more effectively to increase the reps/weight when it's crunch time and you have to keep going-In order to improve you have to go beyond what you can already do sometimes, fully burn out the muscle by continuing the set beyond what strict reps allow using intensity techniques like cheats, partials, etc.

Slight cheating is to me much more effective when you're about to fail but have to keep going in order to improve, whereas if you keep it completely strict you can actually have something left in other areas of ROM but can't get past the sticking point with strict reps. If you get past the sticking point with cheats, burns, etc. to the area of ROM where the muscle's stronger & still has something left, the muscle can be further exhausted.

 ;D Great post!

Charlys69

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2007, 03:39:23 PM »
robotically strict form is very overrated.

that`s a simple fact....and sometimes i have the feeling that "super-strict-Trainer" don`t like to put 100 %
effort into there sets, "but" why not use a variety of different types of moving a weight around. Super-Strict training in 99 % percent don`t build massive & strong physiques, but to finish a workout it`s an option, to work parts of the muscles who are not easy to target.
With Heavy "semi-strict-Training" one problem many trainer have is to find "the thin line" between controlling the weight and stimulate the muscles, or "to get controlled by the given weight", which increase injury risks, and not so good results.
(sorry for my semi-strict english, i left school 26 years ago, i`m german....)

 



Beener

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Re: range of motion question
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2007, 04:07:28 PM »
But y'all gotta remember theres a difference between cheating and non-strict form. As well asthere being a difference with starting out strict and cheating just at the end to get the last couple reps out, and cheating all the way through.

its not always about the weight, but how ya lift it. all the biggest guys at my gym have the best form, coincidence? Good form will also help to keep you injury free..