Author Topic: Why isn't religion banned?  (Read 10033 times)

JasonH

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Why isn't religion banned?
« on: November 09, 2006, 06:06:48 AM »
Let's face it - in the modern society we live in today, religion has no place. Controversial I know, but no matter what religion you look at, it's policies, laws, doctrines and other rules simply have no relevance to modern life.
What good does religion do? It's been the cause of more wars, anger, deaths, bitterness, racism, arguments, and civil unrest than any other factor in human history. The very existence of God has never been proven so why do people believe in something which simply isn't there?
My point is, shouldn't something be done to make the world a better place for all and make any form of false idol worship illegal - that way, there should be no excuse for any more deaths as a result of religion.

There. I've said my piece.

Ban religion.  8)

Butterbean

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2006, 06:18:47 AM »
Here are a few commandments from the Christian bible.  You don't think they have "relevance to modern life?"


Respect your father and your mother

Do not commit murder.

Do not commit adultery.

Do not steal.

Do not accuse anyone falsely.

Do not desire another man's house; do not desire his wife, or his possessions
R

JasonH

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2006, 06:34:14 AM »
Yes, those are the basics and that's all fine - I agree with that but what about all the other non-fundamental things that people twist for their own benefits.
Also, that's only the bible you're referring to - a man-made book, just the same as all the other religions have books made by men.
Not worth the paper they're written on.

OzmO

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2006, 07:30:14 AM »
Here are a few commandments from the Christian bible.  You don't think they have "relevance to modern life?"


Respect your father and your mother

Do not commit murder.

Do not commit adultery.

Do not steal.

Do not accuse anyone falsely.

Do not desire another man's house; do not desire his wife, or his possessions

Those directives can be found in just about any religion.

Nordic Superman

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2006, 07:50:11 AM »
Those directives can be found in just about any religion.

From 2 to 5 in the list, islam only respects in relation to other muslims. To non-muslims these "rules" can be broken.

Before going off on one, prove me wrong, or don't reply at all.
الاسلام هو شيطانية

OzmO

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2006, 08:23:18 AM »
From 2 to 5 in the list, islam only respects in relation to other muslims. To non-muslims these "rules" can be broken.

Before going off on one, prove me wrong, or don't reply at all.

Prove your self right first  :P

Nordic Superman

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2006, 08:32:57 AM »
Prove your self right first  :P

Dhimmitude is the status that Islamic law, the Sharia, mandates for non-Muslims, primarily Jews and Christians. Dhimmis, "protected people," are free to practice their religion in a Sharia regime, but are made subject to a number of humiliating regulations designed to enforce the Qur'an's command that they "feel themselves subdued" (Sura 9:29). This denial of equality of rights and dignity remains part of the Sharia.

Sharia being the law dictated in the koran. Toxic once incorrectly stated that Sharia law has nothing to do with the koran, until Hedge shot him down.

I could go into each further later on if you wish for me to do so, but I'm busy ATM.
الاسلام هو شيطانية

Clubber Lang

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2006, 08:35:05 AM »
western  dogmatic religions(ie xtians, jews, muslims) can be great cause 95% of the worlds population breaths through their mouth and needs a cause/effect scenerio (ie heaven/hell) to motivate them not to be shit heads

eastern religions are more concerned with spirituality, that is stripping the mind of subjectivity to see truth more clearly, to me this is the highest pursuit one can have

JasonH

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2006, 08:50:30 AM »
Yes, if there was any religion I were to follow, it would be one of the more intrinsic, spiritual ones - one that doesn't place a god at it's helm.

Nevertheless, I still think religion should be banned.

Clubber Lang

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2006, 08:51:48 AM »
you shouldnt follow anything, thats why we refer to religious people as sheep

Butterbean

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2006, 09:39:25 AM »
Baaa.



And Frank, don't think I didn't notice that I did not make your "list" >:( >:( >:(
R

Dos Equis

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #11 on: November 09, 2006, 09:56:16 AM »
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." 

HTH 

Clubber Lang

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #12 on: November 09, 2006, 10:35:07 AM »
Baaa.



And Frank, don't think I didn't notice that I did not make your "list" >:( >:( >:(

thats not true you are on the top of my todo list :D


lol .... seriously what list?

loco

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #13 on: November 09, 2006, 10:51:24 AM »
Let's face it - in the modern society we live in today, religion has no place. Controversial I know, but no matter what religion you look at, it's policies, laws, doctrines and other rules simply have no relevance to modern life.
What good does religion do? It's been the cause of more wars, anger, deaths, bitterness, racism, arguments, and civil unrest than any other factor in human history. The very existence of God has never been proven so why do people believe in something which simply isn't there?
My point is, shouldn't something be done to make the world a better place for all and make any form of false idol worship illegal - that way, there should be no excuse for any more deaths as a result of religion.

There. I've said my piece.

Ban religion.  8)

This has been attempted before, with disastrous consequences.  Communist Russia banned religion.  Where are they now? 

loco

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #14 on: November 09, 2006, 10:59:33 AM »
you shouldnt follow anything, thats why we refer to religious people as sheep

According to the Satanic bible, Satan does not want us to follow him, or to follow anything at all, or to do his(Satan's) will. 

Satan says "Do as thy will"

Clubber Lang

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2006, 11:02:09 AM »
with the exception of the retarded cult rituals, satanism is one of the most utilitarian ways to live

Necrosis

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2006, 07:41:59 PM »
this doesnt prove god, but no proof is depending on what proof you want, empiracal is what your seeking. meta-physics has the best arguments. but for your entertainment here are some quotes from well known scholars who are obviously ignorant because they beleive in a deity. and i never even mentioned einstein.

Fred Hoyle (British astrophysicist): "A common sense interpretation of the facts suggests that a superintellect has monkeyed with physics, as well as with chemistry and biology, and that there are no blind forces worth speaking about in nature. The numbers one calculates from the facts seem to me so overwhelming as to put this conclusion almost beyond question." (2)

George Ellis (British astrophysicist): "Amazing fine tuning occurs in the laws that make this [complexity] possible. Realization of the complexity of what is accomplished makes it very difficult not to use the word 'miraculous' without taking a stand as to the ontological status of the word." (3)

Paul Davies (British astrophysicist): "There is for me powerful evidence that there is something going on behind it all....It seems as though somebody has fine-tuned nature’s numbers to make the Universe....The impression of design is overwhelming". (4)

Paul Davies: "The laws [of physics] ... seem to be the product of exceedingly ingenious design... The universe must have a purpose". (5)

Alan Sandage (winner of the Crawford prize in astronomy): "I find it quite improbable that such order came out of chaos. There has to be some organizing principle. God to me is a mystery but is the explanation for the miracle of existence, why there is something instead of nothing." (6)

John O'Keefe (astronomer at NASA): "We are, by astronomical standards, a pampered, cosseted, cherished group of creatures.. .. If the Universe had not been made with the most exacting precision we could never have come into existence. It is my view that these circumstances indicate the universe was created for man to live in." (7)

George Greenstein (astronomer): "As we survey all the evidence, the thought insistently arises that some supernatural agency - or, rather, Agency - must be involved. Is it possible that suddenly, without intending to, we have stumbled upon scientific proof of the existence of a Supreme Being? Was it God who stepped in and so providentially crafted the cosmos for our benefit?" (8)

Arthur Eddington (astrophysicist): "The idea of a universal mind or Logos would be, I think, a fairly plausible inference from the present state of scientific theory." (9)

Arno Penzias (Nobel prize in physics): "Astronomy leads us to a unique event, a universe which was created out of nothing, one with the very delicate balance needed to provide exactly the conditions required to permit life, and one which has an underlying (one might say 'supernatural') plan." (10)

Roger Penrose (mathematician and author): "I would say the universe has a purpose. It's not there just somehow by chance." (11)

Tony Rothman (physicist): "When confronted with the order and beauty of the universe and the strange coincidences of nature, it's very tempting to take the leap of faith from science into religion. I am sure many physicists want to. I only wish they would admit it." (12)

Vera Kistiakowsky (MIT physicist): "The exquisite order displayed by our scientific understanding of the physical world calls for the divine." (13)

Robert Jastrow (self-proclaimed agnostic): "For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries." (14)

Stephen Hawking (British astrophysicist): "Then we shall… be able to take part in the discussion of the question of why it is that we and the universe exist. If we find the answer to that, it would be the ultimate triumph of human reason - for then we would know the mind of God." (15)

Frank Tipler (Professor of Mathematical Physics): "When I began my career as a cosmologist some twenty years ago, I was a convinced atheist. I never in my wildest dreams imagined that one day I would be writing a book purporting to show that the central claims of Judeo-Christian theology are in fact true, that these claims are straightforward deductions of the laws of physics as we now understand them. I have been forced into these conclusions by the inexorable logic of my own special branch of physics." (16)

Alexander Polyakov (Soviet mathematician): "We know that nature is described by the best of all possible mathematics because God created it."(17)

Ed Harrison (cosmologist): "Here is the cosmological proof of the existence of God – the design argument of Paley – updated and refurbished. The fine tuning of the universe provides prima facie evidence of deistic design. Take your choice: blind chance that requires multitudes of universes or design that requires only one.... Many scientists, when they admit their views, incline toward the teleological or design argument." (18)

Edward Milne (British cosmologist): "As to the cause of the Universe, in context of expansion, that is left for the reader to insert, but our picture is incomplete without Him [God]." (19)

Barry Parker (cosmologist): "Who created these laws? There is no question but that a God will always be needed." (20)

Drs. Zehavi, and Dekel (cosmologists): "This type of universe, however, seems to require a degree of fine tuning of the initial conditions that is in apparent conflict with 'common wisdom'." (21)

Arthur L. Schawlow (Professor of Physics at Stanford University, 1981 Nobel Prize in physics): "It seems to me that when confronted with the marvels of life and the universe, one must ask why and not just how. The only possible answers are religious. . . . I find a need for God in the universe and in my own life." (22)

Henry "Fritz" Schaefer (Graham Perdue Professor of Chemistry and director of the Center for Computational Quantum Chemistry at the University of Georgia): "The significance and joy in my science comes in those occasional moments of discovering something new and saying to myself, 'So that's how God did it.' My goal is to understand a little corner of God's plan." (23)

Wernher von Braun (Pioneer rocket engineer) "I find it as difficult to understand a scientist who does not acknowledge the presence of a superior rationality behind the existence of the universe as it is to comprehend a theologian who would deny the advances of science." (24)

Carl Woese (microbiologist from the University of Illinois) "Life in Universe - rare or unique? I walk both sides of that street. One day I can say that given the 100 billion stars in our galaxy and the 100 billion or more galaxies, there have to be some planets that formed and evolved in ways very, very like the Earth has, and so would contain microbial life at least. There are other days when I say that the anthropic principal, which makes this universe a special one out of an uncountably large number of universes, may not apply only to that aspect of nature we define in the realm of physics, but may extend to chemistry and biology. In that case life on Earth could be entirely unique." (25)

Antony Flew (Professor of Philosophy, former atheist, author, and debater) "It now seems to me that the findings of more than fifty years of DNA research have provided materials for a new and enormously powerful argument to design." (26)

and one last one would be from steve weinberg regarding some of the atheists "most people are not entitled to be atheists because they havent thought enough about the matter". you must provide evidence that atheism is correct for it to be a suple counterargument, saying matter is all that is without adressing some of the arguments is ridiculous.


Necrosis

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2006, 10:27:34 AM »
the problem i see is that science deals with efficient causes while meta-physics, philosophy and thinking deals with final causes in which arguments can be made. i view science as a part of gods plan, so knowing god fully is to know his creation. athiesm is an abberation of the highest order, you must fight your general inclinations to be one, god is imprinted in your body, maybe as a grieving or coping mechanism but the general thought that someone "else" exsists is inherent, as cultures of varying geography show deity worship with no coercion. you must ask ontological questions to arrive at god or no god, something i dont think many people have done so they dont have the right to claim association with a particular sect. like christians who dont read the bible but say they are christian but dont know the ideals, they have no right to dilute the culture, much like alot of people. you may be qualified to speculate but to say there is no evidence when atheism sole mechanism for creation is chance has been shown to be improbable. both require faith, but alot of people dont see this, no proof for god but science, but yet why is the world rational and able to be deciphered at all? why do psychical researchers point to the supernatural? and many other questions. quantum physices shows that this world is mere probabilties until the obersever selects a particular one 'non-locality". many things point to god and many dont, i guess it boils down into what you accept as accurate and what you accept as untrue.

neo, if you would what are you thoughts on non-locality and quantum entanglement(not what it is, i know this, but what is your interpretation of the results). if no one wants to hear this shit i wont respond to the thread again. i have hijacked a few threads of religion with science so i apoligize to the people who want to argue christianity etc.

i dont know much about the bible, but isnt there alot of facts of science in it that are astounding, for instance doenst it imply that the earth is held by nothing and is round much before the discovery etc. loco might know something about this, i think prophecy is the best way to verify the bibles veracity overall.

Clubber Lang

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2006, 11:23:07 AM »
if you cant make your point in a few lines youre probably rationalizing some bullshit :)

Necrosis

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2006, 12:06:17 PM »
one point doesnt hold much water, but a bunch of points do. couldnt make it any shorter.

Bigger Business

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #20 on: November 11, 2006, 08:27:36 AM »
Here are a few commandments from the Christian bible.  You don't think they have "relevance to modern life?"


Respect your father and your mother

Do not commit murder.

Do not commit adultery.

Do not steal.

Do not accuse anyone falsely.

Do not desire another man's house; do not desire his wife, or his possessions

people new this before the bible was written  ::)

Butterbean

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #21 on: November 11, 2006, 08:34:17 AM »





people new this before the bible was written  ::)



but no matter what religion you look at, it's policies, laws, doctrines and other rules simply have no relevance to modern life.

This is what I was referring to BB.  Did you read BigJ's first post?
R

Bigger Business

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2006, 08:40:11 AM »
This is what I was referring to BB.  Did you read BigJ's first post?

no


if a post is more than 3 lines and i just guess what it's about  :D

Butterbean

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #23 on: November 11, 2006, 08:42:05 AM »
no


if a post is more than 3 lines and i just guess what it's about  :D

OK then, I won't have to thrash you for using the rolling eyes smiley against me  >:(
R

Bigger Business

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Re: Why isn't religion banned?
« Reply #24 on: November 11, 2006, 08:49:33 AM »
OK then, I won't have to thrash you for using the rolling eyes smiley against me  >:(

 ;D
























































::)