Author Topic: Countries that allow homosexual people to serve openly in thier military  (Read 25992 times)

militarymuscle69

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2655
  • You can't be a citizen unless you serve
Sure they will, look how far we've come in regards to homosexuality in just 20 years.   Look how far we've come regarding racism in just 50 years. 

Do you realize that White American Doctors actually believed Black people lacked the brain capacity to fly air planes prior to WW2 and it look some whacked out liberals to push this idea on these people?

It's about the progression of a society, not the proliferation of a political ideology.

Conservatives and liberal balance each other.........  going too far one way or the other isn't good.

You are wrong yet again. WE haven't come anywhere on gays. Just because Liberals run the TV networks and put a gay character in every TV show doesn't mean the nation has gone anywhere. It is being forced on the 90% of the population that doesn't have control of these things.
gotta love life

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
You are wrong yet again. WE haven't come anywhere on gays. Just because Liberals run the TV networks and put a gay character in every TV show doesn't mean the nation has gone anywhere. It is being forced on the 90% of the population that doesn't have control of these things.

Whatever the cause is, the general public's attitude towards gays in general has changed over the last 20 years.  That's a fact.   

Dos Equis

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 66495
  • I am. The most interesting man in the world. (Not)
Whatever the cause is, the general public's attitude towards gays in general has changed over the last 20 years.  That's a fact.   

True, but the general public is still largely uncomfortable with this lifestyle.  This is why you have a place like a Hawaii, as liberal as any state in the country, voting against homosexual marriage by a 70 percent margin. 

militarymuscle69

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2655
  • You can't be a citizen unless you serve
Whatever the cause is, the general public's attitude towards gays in general has changed over the last 20 years.  That's a fact.   

That is not a fact, and you have nothing to back your claim that it is fact.
gotta love life

Option D

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 17367
  • Kelly the Con Way
militarymuscle has addressed this extensively...

If I understand his arguments, the troops would be too busy stigmatizing and hiding their genitals from the queers to properly focus on securing our energy future. I mean... spreading democracy.

Hope this helps.


Good one

militarymuscle69

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2655
  • You can't be a citizen unless you serve
Good one

Another case of Ribo putting false words in ones mouth. I have posted my opinion on this subject
gotta love life

ieffinhatecardio

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5202
  • More proof God is a man.
That is not a fact, and you have nothing to back your claim that it is fact.

Do you think the fact that some states have adopted a Civil Union Law is proof that the way homosexuals are viewed has changed in the last 20 years?

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
That is not a fact, and you have nothing to back your claim that it is fact.

Well right now i don;t have time to research on it.  But one easy indication is that people in schools in California 20 years ago, when i went to high school wouldn't dare openly admit they were homosexual, now, it's very common place in schools.  I have teens that go to school currently.   

so with out doing any research just personal experience shows progression.


OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
Do you think the fact that some states have adopted a Civil Union Law is proof that the way homosexuals are viewed has changed in the last 20 years?

there's another indication MM69

fact.


Dos Equis

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 66495
  • I am. The most interesting man in the world. (Not)
Column in our weekly paper:

Gay Marriage And Majority Opinion
By Jerry Coffee
Wednesday - March 14, 2007

A misleading headline in one of last Wednesday’s (March 7) local dailies had me doing a double take: “House reconsiders same-sex benefits.” I had thought for sure the same sex union bill giving same-sex couples the same rights as married couples was dead for this year. As it turns out, apparently it is. The headline should have said: “House reconsiders Reciprocal Benefits (RB) bill.” But at the beginning of the article by Treena Shapiro, she says, “Passage could further Hawaii’s recognition of same-sex relationships,” further muddying the waters.

Apparently I wasn’t alone, because the Hawaii Family Forum (HFF) was quick to clarify the issue on its Web site. The RB bill is designed to provide state workers the same benefits enjoyed by private sector workers, i.e. reciprocal health benefits for two people living together, elderly siblings as one example. The bill has nothing to do with the sexual orientation of the couple. State Rep. Sylvia Luke said the RB issue should not have been mixed in with the proposed civil union legislation, hence, the confusion.

But could the RB issue still be morphed into another civil union bill when it reaches the Senate? According to HFF, Clayton Hee, chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, says “no.” The House bill is too narrowly defined, and the Senate will not consider a civil union bill unless it comes from the House.

HFF actually supports the RB legislation, but says, perhaps ironically, gay activists are against the bill and call it “low class” and a “slap in the face to gay people.” HFF goes on: “For these activists, nothing will satisfy them short of state recognition that their relationships are just like marriage.”

This does indeed seem to be the case, and given the fact that the people of Hawaii voted overwhelmingly (more than 70 percent) to amend the state Constitution to define marriage as between one man and one woman, who among our state representatives consistently introduces legislation contrary to the obvious will of the people they’re supposed to represent?
When I ran for the House myself in 2004 to represent the values and priorities of the people of House District 33, Halawa, Aiea and Waimalu, the overwhelmingly conservative values of his constituents weren’t being represented by my opponent, Blake Oshiro, their young, ultra-liberal (by his own admission) incumbent House “representative.” And he continues to be one of the strongest advocates for the equal recognition of same-sex partnerships.

As voters, we need to constantly ask ourselves, “Is my representative truly representing my values and priorities as I elected her/him to do, or the opposite values of a tiny minority which may or may not even emanate from my district? Or even more pointedly, is she/he putting their personal agenda over their promise to represent mine and my neighbors’?

The annual proposal of legislation to equalize same-sex unions with marriage is a good case in point. This is the context in which we must make our electoral choices. I know, the next election is many months away, but now is the time to be paying attention.

What legislation is my representative initiating, and how is she/he voting? Does it represent my values and priorities?

Don’t be misled by the daily papers’election-season, boiler-plate endorsements. Don’t let the smoke screen of your representative’s quarterly newsletter - superficial photo ops, weekend cleanups and money that would come to your schools anyway - cloud your discernment.

Ask, on the truly important issues, is my representative representing me? 

http://www.midweek.com/content/columns/coffeebreak_article/gay_marriage_and_majority_opinion/

Deedee

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5067
  • They sicken of the calm, who knew the storm.
That is not a fact, and you have nothing to back your claim that it is fact.

Yes it is, and I've already posted the statistics. People under thirty care much less than people over 60 and as the elderly get older and die off, eventually the majority rule will be "don't care."

militarymuscle69

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2655
  • You can't be a citizen unless you serve
Well right now i don;t have time to research on it.  But one easy indication is that people in schools in California 20 years ago, when i went to high school wouldn't dare openly admit they were homosexual, now, it's very common place in schools.  I have teens that go to school currently.   

so with out doing any research just personal experience shows progression.



See yet again you fail to bring any fact to support your original argument that SOCIETY as a whole as more acceptance. What % of the population does the highschool crowd make up? and California is about the poorest example you can use. I still bet in Iowa, Kansas, Missouri,Arkansas etc... highschoolers still don't feel comfortable being open. You make it way to easy to tear apart your "arguments"
gotta love life

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
Yes it is, and I've already posted the statistics. People under thirty care much less than people over 60 and as the elderly get older and die off, eventually the majority rule will be "don't care."

More facts,  perhaps you can post them for MM69

militarymuscle69

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2655
  • You can't be a citizen unless you serve
Yes it is, and I've already posted the statistics. People under thirty care much less than people over 60 and as the elderly get older and die off, eventually the majority rule will be "don't care."

Sorry sweetheart but as I have said before, Polls are not "fact"
gotta love life

militarymuscle69

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 2655
  • You can't be a citizen unless you serve
Do you think the fact that some states have adopted a Civil Union Law is proof that the way homosexuals are viewed has changed in the last 20 years?

It shows that in a very minute minority of the states the view has changed. OzmO's argument is that SOCIETY's view has changed, not true.
gotta love life

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
See yet again you fail to bring any fact to support your original argument that SOCIETY as a whole as more acceptance. What % of the population does the highschool crowd make up? and California is about the poorest example you can use. I still bet in Iowa, Kansas, Missouri,Arkansas etc... highschoolers still don't feel comfortable being open. You make it way to easy to tear apart your "arguments"

I told you i didn;t have time to research it,  but DeeDee has.   

what i related to you however was real and is a fact.   Did say it was in those states too?   What i said was it shows progress in just that little area, but it is progress.   

Also, many states have adopted laws protecting gays from discrimination,  that is also progress.  Are you going to refute those also?

Additionally, some TV shows involving Gays get good ratings.....  what was it now?  Debra Messing, didn;t she have a show that was rated high with gays that ran for number of years?   

That kind of thing wouldn't be possible 20 years ago i don;t think.  Because the general public wouldn't allow these shows to become popular.  Advertising revenue wouldn't come in if people weren't watching it.  Isn't capitalism just great?  I love it.  It's the true equalizer IMO.


Now i wonder which part of this response you are going focus to refute while ignoring everything else.

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
Sorry sweetheart but as I have said before, Polls are not "fact"
'
So what is fact MM69?  your opinion?,  because you haven't shown any facts,  just your opinion

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
It shows that in a very minute minority of the states the view has changed. OzmO's argument is that SOCIETY's view has changed, not true.

well back it up with some facts.  I already have.  You haven't

-  state laws
-  polls
-  TV advertising revenue

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
It shows that in a very minute minority of the states the view has changed. OzmO's argument is that SOCIETY's view has changed, not true.

Minority of the sates?  there are 40 million + in California.......alone


ieffinhatecardio

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5202
  • More proof God is a man.
It shows that in a very minute minority of the states the view has changed. OzmO's argument is that SOCIETY's view has changed, not true.

I don't know if anyone can honestly speak with any certainty on whether or not Society has changed it's views on homosexuality in the last 20 years. If they can I'd be interested to see how they prove it.

Civil Unions are not necessarily a reflection of the views of Society as a whole but it is a reflection that times have changed and that perhaps we're not as closed minded as we used to be. In my opinion being open minded doesn't necessarily mean you accept homosexuality it suggests that people aren't as concerned with what two consenting people do in their private lives. 


tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
Minority of the sates?  there are 40 million + in California.......alone



We have a greater GDP than all but 10 countries in the world... If we remove us from the US, can you imagine the economic pain the US would be in?

Hah.

Dos Equis

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 66495
  • I am. The most interesting man in the world. (Not)
Minority of the sates?  there are 40 million + in California.......alone



As of last year, 43 states had laws banning recognition of homosexual marriage.  

http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20050401-114205-2153r.htm

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
I don't know if anyone can honestly speak with any certainty on whether or not Society has changed it's views on homosexuality in the last 20 years. If they can I'd be interested to see how they prove it.

Civil Unions are not necessarily a reflection of the views of Society as a whole but it is a reflection that times have changed and that perhaps we're not as closed minded as we used to be. In my opinion being open minded doesn't necessarily mean you accept homosexuality it suggests that people aren't as concerned with what two consenting people do in their private lives. 



that alone is progress

OzmO

  • Moderator
  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 22846
  • Drink enough Kool-aid and you'll think its healthy
As of last year, 43 states had laws banning recognition of homosexual marriage. 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20050401-114205-2153r.htm

this is more a tax issue that's being fought with religion.   

I undecided myself about it. 

What about the 7 states?


tu_holmes

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 15922
  • Robot
As of last year, 43 states had laws banning recognition of homosexual marriage. 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20050401-114205-2153r.htm

This is true...That's why it should remain a state issue.