Disaster after following the TA principles.

[tweeter]

Adonis recommends getting RDA; obviously an all alcohol diet would not provide this, although you would still get leaner as long as you are in a calorie deficit. TA knows you need protein to build muscle, just not 200+ grams per day.

[Matt C]

If an all alcohol diet is not recommended, then doesn't that seem like a direct contradiction to the principles?

Bast, I've been dieting and my delts look slightly rounder and fuller. Now I know I haven't gained mass on a restricted diet, yet my muscles look the same in terms of size and are actually more detailed. That's how I know I haven't lost anything. If Matt feels like he's lost a sufficient amount of size, then he has every right to be concerned.

I may be slightly more conditioned, but not enough to offset that much weight loss.  I'm not saying the principles were completely ineffective but they were definitely not the magic bullet TA said they were and definitely not better than anything conventional.

danielson - thanks!  I might just do that. 

My new training log is here:

http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/webmasterjournal.html

I plan to update it on all workout days.

[Camel Jockey]

Matt if you have any questions regarding training, just PM me I just started training champions and no, I will never charge anyone a dime.

You will give Matt some coke to supress his appetite and to boost his metabolism.  

I may be slightly more conditioned, but not enough to offset that much weight loss.  I'm not saying the principles were completely ineffective but they were definitely not the magic bullet TA said they were and definitely not better than anything conventional.

Do it the old fashioned way.. Cardio, high protein, reduced calories.  Throw in some ECA.

[Matt C]

While TA is right that a caloric deficit is necessary to get cut and while TA is right about magazines promoting an overabundance of protein to sell protein supplements, he is also wrong about some things.  As with everything in life there are shades of grey.  Also, an excellent name for a gay Florida based rock band!!

[danielson]

You will give Matt some coke to supress his appetite and to boost his metabolism. 

Are you saying I am NOT training the eventual winner of this years Mr. Getbig?

[Camel Jockey]

Are you saying I am NOT training the eventual winner of this years Mr. Getbig?

Where did I say that? Someone actually told me that coke is good for weight loss, and hearing about your use, I added 2 and 2 together and made a lousy joke.

Your man's arm shot looks freaky. How's about some more pics to see what we are dealing with?

[Hedgehog]

Adonis recommends getting RDA; obviously an all alcohol diet would not provide this, although you would still get leaner as long as you are in a calorie deficit. TA knows you need protein to build muscle, just not 200+ grams per day.

200+ grams of protein is extreme and I don't see that being recommended here.

I think a Carb/Fats/Protein macro balance of 50/30/20 or 55/30/15.

Which is pretty much what IOC and most sports science have found to be optimal.

I know others agree, some wants to go a little higher on protein, but essentially, 200+ grams isn't beneficial.

What Abeles misses when he recommends his Krispy Kreme and McDonald diet, is the need for a varied diet, based on sound food sources.

Abeles even went so far as to claim that processed food was better than unprocessed food.

Try this: Eat one slice of white bread for one month. Then eat one slice of whole-grain bread for one month.

Much more nutrients in one of them. Guess which.

It's good to know the amount of calories you're eating. But you also need to be eating healthy foods.

-Hedge

[Camel Jockey]

He also calimed vitamins to be worthless.

[danielson]

Where did I say that? Someone actually told me that coke is good for weight loss, and hearing about your use, I added 2 and 2 together and made a lousy joke.

Your man's arm shot looks freaky. How's about some more pics to see what we are dealing with?

Two hours after training shoulders, I did 80's , I made him do the 140's for 6. Six sets! We are taking this very seriously!

[Bast000]

Try this: Eat one slice of white bread for one month. Then eat one slice of whole-grain bread for one month.

Much more nutrients in one of them. Guess which.

-Hedge

minimal difference.  What are all the nutrients in wheat, that are not in white bread?  Just a minimal difference of fiber.

[MisterMagoo]

Adonis recommends getting RDA; obviously an all alcohol diet would not provide this, although you would still get leaner as long as you are in a calorie deficit. TA knows you need protein to build muscle, just not 200+ grams per day.

if he recommends getting RDA, then this directly contradicts "a calorie is a calorie", because that's a strict ratio of macronutrients.

more than that, he's shown pictures of a giant piece of salmon he supposedly cooked for himself. a 100 gram serving of salmon is 20g of protein. a piece of salmon that size easily had 100+ grams. the RDA is 50g. it also far overshot his daily amount of fat.

no matter how you slice it, it's fulla shit.

[Hedgehog]

minimal difference.  What are all the nutrients in wheat, that are not in white bread?  Just a minimal difference of fiber.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkylresorcinols

And also, the part of the grain that is kept when wheat is made for white bread lacks nutrients.

-Hedge

[Knives]

I think a Carb/Fats/Protein macro balance of 50/30/20 or 55/30/15.
-Hedge

Dave Palumbo would have something to say about that....

but in all seriousness, wouldnt it be ok to drop the carbs and add fats in?

[El Guapo]

200+ grams of protein is extreme and I don't see that being recommended here.

I think a Carb/Fats/Protein macro balance of 50/30/20 or 55/30/15.

Which is pretty much what IOC and most sports science have found to be optimal.

I know others agree, some wants to go a little higher on protein, but essentially, 200+ grams isn't beneficial.

What Abeles misses when he recommends his Krispy Kreme and McDonald diet, is the need for a varied diet, based on sound food sources.

Abeles even went so far as to claim that processed food was better than unprocessed food.

Try this: Eat one slice of white bread for one month. Then eat one slice of whole-grain bread for one month.

Much more nutrients in one of them. Guess which.

It's good to know the amount of calories you're eating. But you also need to be eating healthy foods.

-Hedge

hedge your not being very clear. 200 grams might be enough for a smaller person, but not anyone with some height to them.

[The Master]

200+ grams of protein is extreme and I don't see that being recommended here.

I think a Carb/Fats/Protein macro balance of 50/30/20 or 55/30/15.

Which is pretty much what IOC and most sports science have found to be optimal.

I know others agree, some wants to go a little higher on protein, but essentially, 200+ grams isn't beneficial.

What Abeles misses when he recommends his Krispy Kreme and McDonald diet, is the need for a varied diet, based on sound food sources.

Abeles even went so far as to claim that processed food was better than unprocessed food.

Try this: Eat one slice of white bread for one month. Then eat one slice of whole-grain bread for one month.

Much more nutrients in one of them. Guess which.

It's good to know the amount of calories you're eating. But you also need to be eating healthy foods.

-Hedge

Layne Norton recommends above 1 grams of protein per grams of bodyweight while dieting for the natural bodybuilder.

Some people might claim it is a lot, but Layne sure knows his shit, he's currently earning a Ph.D in protein metabolism or something (think he specializes on the amino acid Lucine).

[Hedgehog]

hedge your not being very clear. 200 grams might be enough for a smaller person, but not anyone with some height to them.

That's true.

If you eat 4000 calories per day, you will be eating cerca 200 grams of protein.

200*4 = 800 calories

20% of 4000.

If you eat 2000 calories per day, you would need 100 grams of protein.

3000 calories = 150.


(I think I've counted all this right now )

-Hedge

[MisterMagoo]

it doesn't matter what anyone says about this shit. there's no case studies to prove it. tweeter quit, as did everyone else, and there was hardly any improvement.

i dropped 37 pounds, about 4+ inches off my stomach, nearly no strength once i started eating normally (some, yes), all in the span of roughly nine weeks. i ate clean as can be, did cardio three times a week, one weekly cheat meal.

adam is fucking with everyone, everyone touting the brilliance of the principles is in on the joke except for possibly tweeter and the people duped into actually trying it. simple as that.

[Stavios]

Matt, you actually followed the adonis principles.... 

[Mat]

How gullable would you have to be to follow TA's principles - I think you just wanted a easy way out Matt. If it was that easy to get ripped don't you think everyone will be walking around with a 6 pack and spiderweb veins all over their arms, while holding a Kripsy Kremes donout. Nothing comes that easy.

[Matt C]

How gullable would you have to be to follow TA's principles - I think you just wanted a easy way out Matt. If it was that easy to get ripped don't you think everyone will be walking around with a 6 pack and spiderweb veins all over their arms, while holding a Kripsy Kremes donout. Nothing comes that easy.

I think you're right.  I wanted to believe it was that easy despite my better judgment.  I figured it could both be easy and I could get results.  I was dead wrong.  Even my face is skinnier than it used to be. 

[240 is Back]

I haven't read all of this thread closely Matt - what was your training like during the time you altered your diet?

[The True Adonis]

I just look like a downsized version of myself...I think 15 or more pounds should result in looking a little leaner than I am should it have actually been done properly.

Question: if TA is right, why does virtually everyone in the industry do it differently?

www.essentialnutrition.o rg

So you are saying these Scientists are wrong and Muscletech is correct?  You are an idiot.  Why not read some real scientific journals? This is where all my info comes from.

Members of the Partnership for Essential Nutrition are:

Alliance for Aging Research
American Association of Diabetes Educators
American Council on Science and Health
American Institute for Cancer Research
American Obesity Association
Harvard Medical School
MedStar Research Institute
National Consumers League
National Women's Health Resource Center
Nutritional Sciences Program at the University of Washington
Pennington Biomedical Research Center
Shape Up America!
Society for Women's Health Research
University of California at Davis Department of Nutrition
UCLA Center for Human Nutrition
Yale-Griffin Prevention Research Center

[Stavios]

www.essentialnutrition.o rg

So you are saying these Scientists are wrong and Muscletech is correct?  You are an idiot.  Why not read some real scientific journals? This is where all my info comes from.

Members of the Partnership for Essential Nutrition are:

Alliance for Aging Research
American Association of Diabetes Educators
American Council on Science and Health
American Institute for Cancer Research
American Obesity Association
Harvard Medical School
MedStar Research Institute
National Consumers League
National Women's Health Resource Center
Nutritional Sciences Program at the University of Washington
Pennington Biomedical Research Center
Shape Up America!
Society for Women's Health Research
University of California at Davis Department of Nutrition
UCLA Center for Human Nutrition
Yale-Griffin Prevention Research Center

delusional

[Matt C]

I haven't read all of this thread closely Matt - what was your training like during the time you altered your diet?

A five day, Mon-Fri program where all body parts were hit once per week, with arms hit twice.  Similar to the splits found here:

http://www.bodybuildingpro.com/5dayaweek.html

However, I will admit that I missed training legs for four weeks in a row during that time.

[BroadStreetBruiser]

However, I will admit that I missed training legs for four weeks in a row during that time.

This is where you failed