WHY do we support ISRAEL????

[Al-Gebra]

Under Western civilization philosophies and management.  Blacks wouldn't have invented the egg beater, the elevator, or the lawn sprinkler without the nation they lived in being under European ideology.  The only exception I can think of off the top of my hand is small pox inoculation which was used for many years in Africa before there was any European contact. 

All I am saying is race doesn't have much to do with it in as much as the type of civilization that is in place.  I do not see these inventions being invented in Africa at the time.

you do realize that i was being sarcastic? . . . just got a little tired of people whining about how the money could be better used and that supporting israel made no sense.

[drkaje]

you do realize that i was being sarcastic? . . . just got a little tired of people whining about how the money could be better used and that supporting Israel made no sense.

You honestly believe Israel is more of a priority than national health insurance, new school books, college for middle class kids, etc...? There are a ton of ways that money could be better spent at home. They are essentially on permanant welfare and probably the biggest pork-barrell thing going.

Had a long discussion with a close friend on this subject and he admitted looking at the world (in all matters) as a Jew first. Therefore he believes, as a Jew, that the US should do whatever is necessary for Israel because God made a covenant with his chosen people promising them the land. When I mentioned putting it to a vote, he responded that the people aren't knowledgeable enough to know what they're voting on and would make the wrong decision for Israel.

A lot of the neo-cons believe supporting Israel is supporting God's covenant. Mixing religion and politics is always a bad thing.

The "only friend in the Middle East" reason for dumping money over there is 70-80% pure bull. If that's true, we should get cheaper friends.

We support Israel because no one could get/stay elected without promising to send money over there, period. It's the exact reason why the Cuban embargo is unlikely to end anytime soon. Someone getting elected without the votes from Florida, Jersey and the other state with a bunch of Cuban ex-pat descendants is impossible.

Our political process has been corrupted by special intrest groups like this and the whores we call politicians can't make policies in the country's overall best intrest.

The extent to which supporting Israel, or not, is to the benefit of US citizens will never be known. Why? Because we don't have any choice.

One thing that offends me is dishonesty.

[JOHN MATRIX]

You honestly believe Israel is more of a priority than national health insurance, new school books, college for middle class kids, etc...? There are a ton of ways that money could be better spent at home. They are essentially on permanant welfare and probably the biggest pork-barrell thing going.

Had a long discussion with a close friend on this subject and he admitted looking at the world (in all matters) as a Jew first. Therefore he believes, as a Jew, that the US should do whatever is necessary for Israel because God made a covenant with his chosen people promising them the land. When I mentioned putting it to a vote, he responded that the people aren't knowledgeable enough to know what they're voting on and would make the wrong decision for Israel.

A lot of the neo-cons believe supporting Israel is supporting God's covenant. Mixing religion and politics is always a bad thing.

The "only friend in the Middle East" reason for dumping money over there is 70-80% pure bull. If that's true, we should get cheaper friends.

We support Israel because no one could get/stay elected without promising to send money over there, period. It's the exact reason why the Cuban embargo is unlikely to end anytime soon. Someone getting elected without the votes from Florida, Jersey and the other state with a bunch of Cuban ex-pat descendants is impossible.

Our political process has been corrupted by special intrest groups like this and the whores we call politicians can't make policies in the country's overall best intrest.

The extent to which supporting Israel, or not, is to the benefit of US citizens will never be known. Why? Because we don't have any choice.

One thing that offends me is dishonesty.

awesome post. tell us algebra why you feel immense support of israel is so necessary for the united states of america?

[haider]

Yeah I favour Zionism (Israel) over murderous islamic facism (saudi, iran, palest (hamas)).

Would you prefer your finger broken or your hand cut off?

You have no clue what you are talking about. Oh manni old manni, when will you ever change? I'm sorry I even replied to you.

[Camel Jockey]

This is why I highly doubt I see an ethnic descent president of the USA in my lifetime. When white men are running they are simply seen as men, as candidates. When a man who is also running, but simply is a different color - he is not judged on his merits many times - he is being judged on his skin. I find it incredibly sad, sitting where I am, all the media coverage of the mans skin color. It's 2007 - and the most I hear about Obama is his race, not his policies. I notice that I don't hear many news reports about Edwards/Rudy/Thompson and being caucasian, but Obama can barely be covered without it being said he is black. Notable to me as here the people's policies are covered, not their race.

Unless some party rolls a canditate who is bright pink with purple stripes, I can't really see why such a big deal is made.

PS: Thanks for your post Al-Gebra.

Obama uses his race as a means of winning supporters. He said he was black because he didn't couldn't catch a cab in NYC or something along those lines.. Actually, he'd have a better of catching a taxi in NYC than anywhere in America due to the strict regulations. But no one dared to call out Obama on these comments..

Yeah, it's okay to peg NYC cabbies and limo drivers as racist.. Perfectly okay when you're black. Perfectly okay to belittle bluecollar working men, who drive 50 hours a week with no benefits. I don't think he'd dare be critical of the MTA in the same fashion.

I don't think Obama would actually got out of his way to give favortism to blacks if he were to be elected; rather it would be pressure from disgruntled blacks who think they're entitled to everything.. You KNOW, people like Al Sharpton and others.


We stopped giving to Israel.. Think what would happen.. A large pool, but select part of our workforce who are jews would be pissed. It would hurt our economy. Don't hack off a portion of the apex, you idiots.

[Al-Gebra]

We stopped giving to Israel.. Think what would happen.. A large pool, but select part of our workforce who are jews would be pissed. It would hurt our economy. Don't hack off a portion of the apex, you idiots.

well, at least some people on here are using their brains . . . we scratch the backs of those who scratch ours . . . and if there's some more back-scratching left, we'll scratch the backs of those who have no limbs.

[Camel Jockey]

well, at least some people on here are using their brains . . . we scratch the backs of those who scratch ours . . . and if there's some more back-scratching left, we'll scratch the backs of those who have no limbs.

You are not at all surprised that I have adopted this approach of thinking?? Have you seen other bengalis like myself? If yes, then don't reply.

[Al-Gebra]

You are not at all surprised that I have adopted this approach of thinking?? Have you seen other bengalis like myself? If yes, then don't reply.

it's a prudent way of thinking . . . and no, I haven't met many bengalis, so I can't really answer.    is ghosh a bengal name?  If it is, the guy was the biggest douche i have ever met.  FOB.

I'm not opposed to helping out Americans. I just don't get our resident foreign policy geniuses' binary approach.

[Camel Jockey]

it's a prudent way of thinking .

Adopted after I read about Milton Friendman and his libertarian ideals.. Seemed like the perfect political philosophy, and everything else in my head just sort of contoured into my own ideals based on Friedman's philosophy, weird, but this style of thinking isn't politically correct. A year ago, I would have been attacking you and backing John Matrix, but now I can't mind myself doing that.

I have his book Free to Choose on PDF, but too lazy..

ps, reading about John Locke changed me too.

[drkaje]

well, at least some people on here are using their brains . . . we scratch the backs of those who scratch ours . . . and if there's some more back-scratching left, we'll scratch the backs of those who have no limbs.

What unadultereted bullshit, LOL!

Like I wrote, the discussion is pointless because the American public has no choice due to the way the political process is structured. If pork like Israel or the war went to a referendum it would be all over.

Our policies should put America first. 

[Al-Gebra]

What unadultereted bullshit, LOL!

Like I wrote, the discussion is pointless because the American public has no choice due to the way the political process is structured. If pork like Israel or the war went to a referendum it would be all over.

Our policies should put America first. 

if you're going to use a polysyllabic word, at least spell it right: unadulterAted.

[drkaje]

if you're going to use a polysyllabic word, at least spell it right: unadulterAted.

Did I mention your dumbassedsness today?

I guess criticizing spelling (in lieu of arguments) is all you have left on this matter.

[Camel Jockey]

What unadultereted bullshit, LOL!

Like I wrote, the discussion is pointless because the American public has no choice due to the way the political process is structured. If pork like Israel or the war went to a referendum it would be all over.

Our policies should put America first. 

Structured so that it's merit based.. You know how to change a merit based society?

Not saying they're superior, but they are certainly on top and think about knocking them off instead of bitching like a limp dicked pansy.

[drkaje]

Structured so that it's merit based.. You know how to change a merit based society?

Not saying they're superior, but they are certainly on top and think about knocking them off instead of bitching like a limp dicked pansy.

Why are you suggesting knocking off Jews.

[Camel Jockey]

Why are you suggesting knocking off Jews.

Yes, by better and improving our own kind. That is the only real solution.

I belittle idiots who think driving cab = the height of civilization..

You should do the same with the hip-hop clowns, unless you are one yourself, which in that case you should pump a shotgun shell into your cranium.

The valium and wine is dragging me down.. I cannot continue much longer.

[Al-Gebra]

Did I mention your dumbassedsness today?

I guess criticizing spelling (in lieu of arguments) is all you have left on this matter.

perhaps your unwillingness to see any pov other than your own is influencing my responses.

[drkaje]

perhaps your unwillingness to see any pov other than your own is influencing my responses.

All I want is a logical, non-religious reason for our unflagging financial support. Surely someone can do that without calling suggesting I'm ignorant or an anti-semite. Since we apparently have no choice, I'd kind of like a rational reason. The equivalent to an intellectual reach around.

I'm against all outside spending with the exception of disaster aid and whatever international welfare level that keeps immigration to a minimum.... but that's it.

[haider]

Al-gebra isnt american?

[Al-Gebra]

All I want is a logical, non-religious reason for our unflagging financial support. Surely someone can do that without calling suggesting I'm ignorant or an anti-semite. Since we apparently have no choice, I'd kind of like a rational reason. The equivalent to an intellectual reach around.

I'm against all outside spending with the exception of disaster aid and whatever international welfare level that keeps immigration to a minimum.... but that's it.

you leave yourself open to being called an anti-semite/ignorant when you spend pages talking about how much aid our govt has given Israel and how terrible that is . . . while not mentioning other aid programs our govt is involved in.  And insisting that aid to Israel be cut off so that we can do other things . . . Do you know how much aid we give S. Arabia?  Do you know the size of our annual budget in relation to the amount of aid Israel has received over the 60 years of its existence? Do you know that it's possible for the govt to give aid to more than one party at a time? You act like the money came out of some inner city kid's pocket and went into some israeli's pocket.

oh, and please don't bring in off-the-books aid as some do . . . that's like saying Santa Claus delivered more toys to jewish kids.  

[Al-Gebra]

hahahahaha . . . i just read the last two lines of your post.

what century are you living in?

[drkaje]

you leave yourself open to being called an anti-semite/ignorant when you spend pages talking about how much aid our govt has given Israel and how terrible that is . . . while not mentioning other aid programs our govt is involved in.  And insisting that aid to Israel be cut off so that we can do other things . . . Do you know how much aid we give S. Arabia?  Do you know the size of our annual budget in relation to the amount of aid Israel has received over the 60 years of its existence? Do you know that it's possible for the govt to give aid to more than one party at a time? You act like the money came out of some inner city kid's pocket and went into some israeli's pocket.

oh, and please don't bring in off-the-books aid as some do . . . that's like saying Santa Claus delivered more toys to jewish kids.  

So you don't have a reason.

Any other takers?

[Al-Gebra]

So you don't have a reason.

Any other takers?

how do you reason w a chiropractor who apparently knows more than people who work on foreign policy?

[drkaje]

how do you reason w a chiropractor who apparently knows more than people who work on foreign policy?

Attacking my credentials is a great idea but not a reason.

You're sooooo much smarter than me it's a true surprise you can't provide a logical reason.

[G o a t b o y]

Is there a rational, self-interested reason to support Israel to the extent we do? (in other words, do we get anything out of it?)     No.


Why do we do it?  Because there are more Jews in the US than in Israel, and as mentioned numerous times, they tend to be very politically connected. Our support of Israel will not be changing anytime soon.

But is this the root of our problems with the Muslims?  Actually, no...  it's just the excuse.  Our issues are the result of a clash of cultures.  They're still living with a theocratic mindset that more properly belongs in the middle ages than it does in the 21st century. Our culture and way of life is simply incompatible with theirs.  And in our interconnected world, with American-dominated multinationals leaving our cultural footprints everywhere, they will always see us as a threat to their way of life, the "great satan" if you will.  We could leave Iraq and Afghanistan, and withdraw all aid to Israel tomorrow, and our relations with these people would not improve much in the long term.

[Thin Lizzy]

Is there a rational, self-interested reason to support Israel to the extent we do? (in other words, do we get anything out of it?)     No.


Why do we do it?  Because there are more Jews in the US than in Israel, and as mentioned numerous times, they tend to be very politically connected. Our support of Israel will not be changing anytime soon.

But is this the root of our problems with the Muslims?  Actually, no...  it's just the excuse.  Our issues are the result of a clash of cultures.  They're still living with a theocratic mindset that more properly belongs in the middle ages than it does in the 21st century. Our culture and way of life is simply incompatible with theirs.  And in our interconnected world, with American-dominated multinationals leaving our cultural footprints everywhere, they will always see us as a threat to their way of life, the "great satan" if you will.  We could leave Iraq and Afghanistan, and withdraw all aid to Israel tomorrow, and our relations with these people would not improve much in the long term.

Big time post.

As far as the aid, you guys aren't reading between the lines. The "aid" given to Israel has to be used for weapons, as does the aid given to Egypt. From whom do you think they buy those weapons? It's really just a backdoor kickback to American weapons manufacturers. That's who ends up with the money, and, from what I understand, those folks have lobbyists, too.