HOMO'S

[Necrosis]

ok so i know homosexuality is condemed in the bible(oh brother)

but people dont choose to be gay. im watching a documentary called "god on my side" and the christian panel says its a sin and a trick by the devil that they are gay. that they are not born gay, but choose it.

is this the common view of christians? that people choose to be gay?

if not, and they are born gay, then why would god make them like that, only to allow them to burn in hell? not very logical in my eyes?

any answers guys?

[Hustle Man]

ok so i know homosexuality is condemed in the bible(oh brother)

but people dont choose to be gay. im watching a documentary called "god on my side" and the christian panel says its a sin and a trick by the devil that they are gay. that they are not born gay, but choose it.

is this the common view of christians? that people choose to be gay?

if not, and they are born gay, then why would god make them like that, only to allow them to burn in hell? not very logical in my eyes?

any answers guys?

Homosexuality is no different than any other sin one would commit, yes God speaks about it and condemns that lifestyle just like any other that goes against what he has deemed to be natural and fruitful! My point is, those that sin (everyone) were born sinners. Some commit this type of sin some commit that type of sin. But to answer your question; they were born with the propensity to commit this sin! Homosexuality is no different this just happens to be one of many sins that they chose to commit!

Romans 1:24-32

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another.
25 They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.
27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done.
29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips,
30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents;
31 they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless.
32 Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

Galatians 5:19-26
19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery;
20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions
21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires.
25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

My question to you is; Are they homosexual in thought or only in deed?

Is someone a homosexual if they have homosexual desires or only if they act on those desires?

[Necrosis]

Homosexuality is no different than any other sin one would commit, yes God speaks about it and condemns that lifestyle just like any other that goes against what he has deemed to be natural and fruitful! My point is, those that sin (everyone) were born sinners. Some commit this type of sin some commit that type of sin. But to answer your question; they were born with the propensity to commit this sin! Homosexuality is no different this just happens to be one of many sins that they chose to commit!

Romans 1:24-32

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another.
25 They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.
27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done.
29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips,
30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents;
31 they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless.
32 Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.

Galatians 5:19-26
19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery;
20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions
21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,
23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires.
25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

My question to you is; Are they homosexual in thought or only in deed?

Is someone a homosexual if they have homosexual desires or only if they act on those desires?

you are homosexual if you are born that way. there are numerous studies that show that the brains of homosexuals are more similar to a womens then a mans with respect to the sexual dimorphic area, the hypo etc... on top of that epidemiological studies have shown that prenatal conditons also effect sexual preference.

so it is incorrect to say they choose to commit this sin, it is false. and is proven so, people are born gay, just like you are  born hetero, no difference. therefore, what your saying is that your LOVING god, made them this way, only to shun them? that doesnt sound logical nor loving. why would god do such a thing?

the only way out of this situation is to propose that gay people choose to find men etc attractive which couldnt be more wrong.

so to your question, you are gay if you are attracted to other men and act upon it. i beleive kinsey showed that gayness is a continum not a binomial system. you have gay tendencies and can find other men attractive etc for instance. very few people are completely straight.

[Hustle Man]

you are homosexual if you are born that way.

I agree everyone is born with the propensity to commit this sin as much as any other. But we came from heterosexuals and sin corrupted our natural sexual desire (in some more than others). You are not Gay (I am assuming) but if you wanted to smokepole as you put it you could make that choice.

so it is incorrect to say they choose to commit this sin, it is false...

Not false at all sin caused this effect.
 

people are born gay, just like you are  born hetero, no difference. therefore, what your saying is that your LOVING god, made them this way, only to shun them? that doesnt sound logical nor loving. why would god do such a thing?

Since the fall everyone is born corrupted by sin.

Adam did not have to eat of the forbidden fruit but he did! Homosexuality is the same

the only way out of this situation is to propose that gay people choose to find men etc attractive which couldnt be more wrong.

so to your question, you are gay if you are attracted to other men and act upon it. i beleive kinsey showed that gayness is a continum not a binomial system. you have gay tendencies and can find other men attractive etc for instance. very few people are completely straight.

Define straight please

very few people are completely straight

Kinsey was gay of course he would say this.


Question: Do you think homosexuality is deviate behavior, i.e. abnormal or morally corrupt?

[Necrosis]

I agree everyone is born with the propensity to commit this sin as much as any other. But we came from heterosexuals and sin corrupted our natural sexual desire (in some more than others). You are not Gay (I am assuming) but if you wanted to smokepole as you put it you could make that choice.
 
Not false at all sin caused this effect.
  Since the fall everyone is born corrupted by sin.

Adam did not have to eat of the forbidden fruit but he did! Homosexuality is the same
 Define straight please

Kinsey was gay of course he would say this.


Question: Do you think homosexuality is deviate behavior, i.e. abnormal or morally corrupt?

so which is it. you are born gay or you choose to be gay? please clearly define what you beleive. you cant choose both.

one exludes the other. using your analogy i can choose to be a women if i want through sex change, therefore im not born a man? just because gay people can choose to perform gay acts doesnt make there gayness a choice, or there attraction to the other sex a choice. cant you see the childishness of this beleif. science has proven that gayness is a trait like eye color. so what if i told you god condems people with brown eyes, where is the love in that?

do you realize that animals also perform gay acts? such as monkeys, dogs, lions etc.. further proof that gayness is inherited natural trait. surely the animals are not choosing to be gay, as most of there hardwiring is instinctual.

im not gay, but for people like haider who are, how do you think it makes then feel to be shuned and condemed by christians when there feelings are not there choice, when they where born GAY.

so god gave adam one chance, and from that one mistake all the gays of the world should suffer in torment for all of existence? this is your idea of a loving god?



NO, i dont think gayness is a deviate  behaviour, some of the nicest people i know are gay, and i know far more heteros that do the world harm. to say that people who are born a certain way are deviates is a form of racism and prejudice. its like asking do i think blacks are deviates and morally corrupt. you see gayness is the same thing as blackness, an inherited trait determined by genetics. i think if we had more gays the world would be in a better state, dont you think so? i mean, look at the population boom forcing children to starve and suffer because people like screwing.

[Dos Equis]

so which is it. you are born gay or you choose to be gay? please clearly define what you beleive. you cant choose both.

one exludes the other. using your analogy i can choose to be a women if i want through sex change, therefore im not born a man? just because gay people can choose to perform gay acts doesnt make there gayness a choice, or there attraction to the other sex a choice. cant you see the childishness of this beleif. science has proven that gayness is a trait like eye color. so what if i told you god condems people with brown eyes, where is the love in that?

do you realize that animals also perform gay acts? such as monkeys, dogs, lions etc.. further proof that gayness is inherited natural trait. surely the animals are not choosing to be gay, as most of there hardwiring is instinctual.

im not gay, but for people like haider who are, how do you think it makes then feel to be shuned and condemed by christians when there feelings are not there choice, when they where born GAY.

so god gave adam one chance, and from that one mistake all the gays of the world should suffer in torment for all of existence? this is your idea of a loving god?



NO, i dont think gayness is a deviate  behaviour, some of the nicest people i know are gay, and i know far more heteros that do the world harm. to say that people who are born a certain way are deviates is a form of racism and prejudice. its like asking do i think blacks are deviates and morally corrupt. you see gayness is the same thing as blackness, an inherited trait determined by genetics. i think if we had more gays the world would be in a better state, dont you think so? i mean, look at the population boom forcing children to starve and suffer because people like screwing.

It's a choice.  There is no science to prove otherwise. 

Acts occurring in the animal kingdom don't make them "natural."  Female praying mantis eats her male counterpart after mating.  Lions engage in infanticide.  I'm sure there are plenty of other examples of what we consider abnormal behavior occurring in the animal kingdom.   

[columbusdude82]

What's the big deal any way?

Maybe guys like Beach Bum are from a different generation than me, but to kids my age, it just doesn't seem to be an issue.

Even if it were a choice (which it isn't), what's the big deal?

[Dos Equis]

Who said it was a big deal? 

I don't think what consenting adults do behind closed doors is a "big deal" and frankly don't care, until they try and use the government to force people to accept what goes on behind closed doors.  Then it becomes everyone's business. 

But I believe the issue he raised in this thread was whether it is a choice or not, rather than whether people care about homosexuality.   

[columbusdude82]

Do you think the religious right has the right to force their sexual morality on the rest of us? Do you think the president has the right to use taxpayer money to fund his faith-based initiative?

Talking to imaginary friends and having gay sex both belong behind closed doors, and I'm fine with both behind closed doors. But when either group try to use the government to force the rest of us to accept what happens behind closed doors, that's wrong!

[OzmO]

This has been discussed and discussed.....lol


If people choose to commit gay acts there has to be something that is tempting them to do so, something that makes their body and mind crave the pleasure of it.

But for most heterosexuals they see or get no pleasure from it, the very idea is revolting.   If it's not revolting to begin with then there must be something that makes feel like something they desire.  We figure this out around puberty all on our own.

So yes,  some people choose to act on a desire they are born with.   

[Dos Equis]

Do you think the religious right has the right to force their sexual morality on the rest of us? Do you think the president has the right to use taxpayer money to fund his faith-based initiative?

Talking to imaginary friends and having gay sex both belong behind closed doors, and I'm fine with both behind closed doors. But when either group try to use the government to force the rest of us to accept what happens behind closed doors, that's wrong!

Both groups have the right to use the political process.  I'm not opposed to that at all.  If you disagree, then go vote. 

[Hustle Man]

This has been discussed and discussed.....lol


If people choose to commit gay acts there has to be something that is tempting them to do so, something that makes their body and mind crave the pleasure of it.

But for most heterosexuals they see or get no pleasure from it, the very idea is revolting.   If it's not revolting to begin with then there must be something that makes feel like something they desire.  We figure this out around puberty all on our own.

So yes,  some people choose to act on a desire they are born with.   

Wow Ozmo, that is exactly what I was trying to say thanks bro!

P.S. Don't think we are friends now just because I agreed with you, we are still spiritual enemies lol!

P.P.S. Don't forget that sin caused that corrupted desire and yes homosexuality is perverted anyway you slice it. I don't have anything against gays but like beach bum said "frankly I don't care, until they try and use the government to force people to accept what goes on behind closed doors."

[OzmO]

P.S. Don't think we are friends now just because I agreed with you, we are still spiritual enemies lol!

Yeah i figured   

Wow Ozmo, that is exactly what I was trying to say thanks bro!

P.S.  We actually agree on something.....imagine.     I was actually surprised that was your take on it.  But it's very true.

[Necrosis]

Wow Ozmo, that is exactly what I was trying to say thanks bro!

P.S. Don't think we are friends now just because I agreed with you, we are still spiritual enemies lol!

P.P.S. Don't forget that sin caused that corrupted desire and yes homosexuality is perverted anyway you slice it. I don't have anything against gays but like beach bum said "frankly I don't care, until they try and use the government to force people to accept what goes on behind closed doors."

so your saying that people are infact born gay(god makes them that way) then either commit the acts(gayness) that will send them to burn for all times

OR

live a life in denial, perhaps being equally as miserable. your god disgusts me, no joke, what a selfish, petty thing it is, if it made this massive universe only to punish those who cannot rebel against the nature they where born with.

[Hustle Man]

so your saying that people are infact born gay(god makes them that way) then either commit the acts(gayness) that will send them to burn for all times

OR

live a life in denial, perhaps being equally as miserable. your god disgusts me, no joke, what a selfish, petty thing it is, if it made this massive universe only to punish those who cannot rebel against the nature they where born with.

Again sin caused folk to act on those desires, not God! God created man to be with woman sexually and within the confines of marriage, not banging whomever crosses your path when you get that urge. Sexual intimacy was created for husband and wife to enjoy one another! Infact the Apostle Paul spoke on this:

1 Corinthians 7:2-5 & 8-9
2 But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband.
3 The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband.
4 The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife.
5 Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

8 Now to the unmarried and the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I am.
9 But if they cannot control themselves they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.,

HMIC

[ieffinhatecardio]

What's the big deal any way?

Maybe guys like Beach Bum are from a different generation than me, but to kids my age, it just doesn't seem to be an issue.

Even if it were a choice (which it isn't), what's the big deal?

To anyone not bound to a mythical religious belief it's no big deal. To those bound to ridiculous religious dogma it is a big deal. Those people hate homosexuals and want to control what they can and can't do.

I've asked this question a million times and I've never gotten anything other than rhetoric about children as an answer.

What does it matter if two consenting adults of the same sex want to get married? What effect does it have on the life of anyone else except the two people that want to get married?

If certain people want to live their lives based on a fairy tale good for them but to force everyone else to do the same is shameful.

[tu_holmes]

Again sin caused folk to act on those desires, not God! God created man to be with woman sexually and within the confines of marriage, not banging whomever crosses your path when you get that urge. Sexual intimacy was created for husband and wife to enjoy one another! Infact the Apostle Paul spoke on this:

1 Corinthians 7:2-5 & 8-9
2 But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband.
3 The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband.
4 The wife's body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband's body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife.
5 Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

8 Now to the unmarried and the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I am.
9 But if they cannot control themselves they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.,

HMIC

Simplistic view at best... You're talking about a bunch of statements which were written before humans had ANY understanding of what the brain did.

We can do that more so now, and we still do not even have an understanding of .001% of the human mind.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn9125.html

It is not a choice... I just can't buy that. You are attracted to who you're attracted to... That is just the way it is.

[nzhardgain]

pretty clear cut what the Bible says you fags.

Simplistic view at best... You're talking about a bunch of statements which were written before humans had ANY understanding of what the brain did.

We can do that more so now, and we still do not even have an understanding of .001% of the human mind.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn9125.html

It is not a choice... I just can't buy that. You are attracted to who you're attracted to... That is just the way it is.

Forgetting who actually inspired the scriptures.Dont rely on mans wisdom.

[Necrosis]

pretty clear cut what the Bible says you fags.
Forgetting who actually inspired the scriptures.Dont rely on mans wisdom.

lol...... are you a gimmick or a real christian?

i thought you werent suppose to do the judging, thats up to god isnt it?

remember your part gay, so dont be so hard on yourself.

[nzhardgain]

lol...... are you a gimmick or a real christian?

i thought you werent suppose to do the judging, thats up to god isnt it?

remember your part gay, so dont be so hard on yourself.

reading the word thats all.not me who wrote it.Uh i admit power and strength exhibited in others is impressive to me,weight training is beneficial,bodybuilding is art.
Beauty in female especially and male i guess is easy to see.
Dislike the acts of man,not man himself.
peace

[Necrosis]

reading the word thats all.not me who wrote it.Uh i admit power and strength exhibited in others is impressive to me,weight training is beneficial,bodybuilding is art.
Beauty in female especially and male i guess is easy to see.
Dislike the acts of man,not man himself.
peace

so you enjoy the company of a man? and your christian

[MCWAY]

Do you think the religious right has the right to force their sexual morality on the rest of us? Do you think the president has the right to use taxpayer money to fund his faith-based initiative?

Talking to imaginary friends and having gay sex both belong behind closed doors, and I'm fine with both behind closed doors. But when either group try to use the government to force the rest of us to accept what happens behind closed doors, that's wrong!

Then, you must also be in opposition to the liberal left, trying to force their sexual morality (or lack thereof) on "the rest of us".

To anyone not bound to a mythical religious belief it's no big deal. To those bound to ridiculous religious dogma it is a big deal. Those people hate homosexuals and want to control what they can and can't do.

I've asked this question a million times and I've never gotten anything other than rhetoric about children as an answer.

What does it matter if two consenting adults of the same sex want to get married? What effect does it have on the life of anyone else except the two people that want to get married?

If certain people want to live their lives based on a fairy tale good for them but to force everyone else to do the same is shameful.

Wouldn't limiting the number of parties in marriage to just two be trying to "force everyone else to do the same"?

[Hustle Man]

Simplistic view at best... You're talking about a bunch of statements which were written before humans had ANY understanding of what the brain did.

We can do that more so now, and we still do not even have an understanding of .001% of the human mind.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn9125.html

It is not a choice... I just can't buy that. You are attracted to who you're attracted to... That is just the way it is.

This is very amusing, your comments here!

Are you trying to tell me that homosexuality is normal/natural behavior?

Is any behavior abnormal to you?

What about humans being attracted to animals and having sexual relations with animals is that normal too?

Or adults attracted to non adults (infants, toddlers, pubescent boys and girls), is that normal behavior?

NO! It’s un-natural, decadent and perverted behavior! But it’s all because of the curse of sin!

[Hustle Man]

so you enjoy the company of a man? and your christian

For the sake of argument, let's say someone was a professing Christian and also was attracted to the opposite sex, what then? Do you think think Jesus/God would or should reject that person and send them to hell?

[tu_holmes]

This is very amusing, your comments here!

Are you trying to tell me that homosexuality is normal/natural behavior?

Is any behavior abnormal to you?

What about humans being attracted to animals and having sexual relations with animals is that normal too?

Or adults attracted to non adults (infants, toddlers, pubescent boys and girls), is that normal behavior?

NO! It’s un-natural, decadent and perverted behavior! But it’s all because of the curse of sin!

You're talking about apples and oranges really.

Wild animals do not reason like adult people, and as such your argument holds no grounds. Also, there are many homosexual creatures in nature.

As far as little children are concerned... Of course that's sick and disgusting... The fact you even see them as similar says something. No normal person does. Children have no understanding of sexuality what so ever, so for someone to use their lack of understanding for their own personal satisfaction is not just abnormal, it's immoral.

Once people have matured however, and they understand their sexuality, then no, I have no issue with two (or more) adults engaging in what they find stimulating due to their sexual preference. Notice that word... "preference"... They prefer one over the other... That is not a choice.

In your way of thinking... It could be a sin to like redheads over brunettes or blonds.

For the sake of argument, let's say someone was a professing Christian and also was attracted to the opposite sex, what then? Do you think think Jesus/God would or should reject that person and send them to hell?

If God is going to send you to hell for loving a person of the same sex... Then I think that's a God I'd rather be without in the first place.

What kind of God hates people just because they are homosexual? Next you'll be telling me he hates black people, or Asians.