Reg Park and aas

[Figo]

Originally posted on IA, it seems a few undies got tangled up, and the thread locked. My comments may have contributed...

Since we are in a more liberal discussion environment, whats your take?

http://ironage.us/yabbse/index.php/topic,19480.0.html

[pumpster]

Originally posted on IA, it seems a few undies got tangled up, and the thread locked. My comments may have contributed...

Since we are in a more liberal discussion environment, whats your take?

I find Iron Age and their overly-serious attitudes to be obnoxious. Especially since Perine the guy who runs it is a Weider "writer". Writer's are supposed to be the last people to exercise control over free speech yet it's the standard over there.

I realize that they're too important to care, but the fact is they lose alot of good people who would contribute to the site because of their unfriendly approach to free speech.

[Figo]

Its a joke, actually. If you dont share their take and view, they censor you.

Lets be realistic here, the guys back in the day were just regular people/bbers, they were just as messed up/obsessed as todays guys, did whatever it took to progress, took rec drugs, etc. This wonderland holier than thou attitude...

[Bill Loguidice]

Is the question did he ever take AAS or what would he have been like versus Arnold if he did?  I think it's a pretty big assumption he never tried the former at some point in his long career.

[BB]

Yes, one is of no fault to think that Reg Park and others prayed to the Dianabol gods at certain points in their career.

There wasn't the same level of stigma attached to the drugs like there is today. If you look at reports from the York Barbell team, and other honest lifters from that era, it wasn't a big deal, just something you did to win. It wasn't until years later that they had regrets.    


Just look at the fella, his physique still compares favorably to the pros of the late 60's-early 80's, who were well known to be steroid users.
He carried 50-65 lbs of quality muscle over the true drug-free champs of the pre WWII/steroid era.

Also strength wise, he was almost as strong as most modern IFBB  steroid using pros, but we are to believe that it was the result of clean living:)?


If Reg showed up on these modern message boards(including Ironage) claiming natural status, he'd be a laughing stock, but because he is from a nostalgic era we are to ignore the the obvious.    

 

[Figo]

There wasn't the same level of stigma attached to the drugs like there is today. If you look at reports from the York Barbell team, and other honest lifters from that era, it wasn't a big deal, just something you did to win. It wasn't until years later that they had regrets.    

If Reg showed up on these modern message boards(including Ironage) claiming natural status, he'd be a laughing stock, but because he is from a nostalgic era we are to ignore the the obvious.    

Your post is spot on what I'm saying.

It wasnt a big deal then at all, it was just another sup, but when it became illegal/immoral, everybody quickly denied use.

Nostalgia is being taken a bit far, to the point of believing in Santa and the easter bunny.

[funk51]

the standard back then was to admit to trying it for a cycle or two than realizing it was worthless ahem!!!!!!!!!!!! discontinue use ref bill pearl and freddie oritz or deny it's use entirely. to read some of the truth read john fair's book muscletown usa and find out the york gang roided thanks to john ziegler and also did quite a few halluetogenic drugs at york picnics etc..

[pumpster]

Popping pills and ingesting chemicals were a very accepted part of the modern lifestyle from the 50s through the 70s. Even smoking was quite acceptable, health concerns were minimal.

Park it would seem most likely especially considering he was one of the first to get to a 500 lb. bench. Reeves even earlier is still controversial as to whether he partook as is Grimek.

[GoneAway]

For those claiming that it was "just another supplement" back in the 50's and 60's, please show me magazine articles that freely advocate the use of AAS as part of a bodybuilding program. I don't believe it was viewed with such an acceptable attitude. If it was, the great champions of the day would have likely admitted their use in print.

In the end, debates will rise no matter what is said. Only a select few may know the truth, and it's doubtful that they will ever divulge the correct information. Let's just agree that Reg Park was a great champion and built a body that stood the test of time.

[Figo]

For those claiming that it was "just another supplement" back in the 50's and 60's, please show me magazine articles that freely advocate the use of AAS as part of a bodybuilding program. I don't believe it was viewed with such an acceptable attitude. If it was, the great champions of the day would have likely admitted their use in print.

In the end, debates will rise no matter what is said. Only a select few may know the truth, and it's doubtful that they will ever divulge the correct information. Let's just agree that Reg Park was a great champion and built a body that stood the test of time.

Did anybody say otherwise?

[BB]

This http://ydr.inyork.com/ydr/sports/ci_4895138  article shows how acceptable they were at the time among lifting/bodybuilding elite.

As to why they weren't openly publicised in the magazines, well my feeling is that much like today, the magazines were/are controlled by the supplement companies. If Bob Hoffman openly said the secret is Dianabol, then he couldn't hawk Protein-by-the-Sea, liver pills, etc..... For most, money will trump honesty.

Most of these fellows didn't become anti-steroid till they had health problems, their records fell, or it became obvious to everyone that this hobby/sport is mostly drug dependant after a certain point.

Reg Park was a great lifter but lets not let our hero worship cloud our vision.

[Figo]

As to why they weren't openly publicised in the magazines, well my feeling is that much like today, the magazines were/are controlled by the supplement companies. If Bob Hoffman openly said the secret is Dianabol, then he couldn't hawk Protein-by-the-Sea, liver pills, etc..... For most, money will trump honesty.

If Weider had written in his mags about his champs' experiences with, and the efficacy of aas, imagine how megapaks, mega mass and victory sups sales would've dropped... It was all the Weider principles, Weider lifestyle and Weider products!

[Figo]

Reg Park was a great lifter but lets not let our hero worship cloud our vision.

As I stated in the IA thread, this is not bout Park, it goes as far as Reeves and Grimek, and everyone else. It does not denigrate nor take away, but please take off the rose tinted shades and face up to facts.
Obviously the usual comeback is:
"...the only reason people would accuse these individuals no longer with us, unable to defend themselves is because of their inability to build their own bodies even on aas, and gotta defame the greats..."
Thats b.s. , I just cant stand people believing in bullshit claims and expecting everyone else to go along because they believe wrestling is real (WWE), they believe in Santa Claus, there were WMD's in Iraq...

[fredrollon]

From 1945....
This best-selling book had articles written about it in the New York Times,Newsweek and Time Magazine.Excerpt were also published in The Readers Digest.



Here is the original 1945 Time Magazine article.:

Virility Prolonged
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,775689-1,00.html

Testosterone is dangerous if improperly administered; it may overstimulate a man sexually, and it cannot be used at all when prostatic cancer is present or dormant. Otherwise it is likely to alleviate any distress or ailment directly or indirectly connected with "male hormone hunger." On young, normal men, oddly, it appears to lower sexual drive(sic) while improving muscle tone and endurance. Its effect is temporary.

Testosterone injections administered under medical supervision,was presented to mainstream public opion as a wonder tonic,which could safely enhance male virility and vigour.It doesn't seem then that the idea of HRT was either thought of as harmful or socially unacceptable.

[johnny1]

From 1945....
This best-selling book had articles written about it in the New York Times,Newsweek and Time Magazine.Excerpt were also published in The Readers Digest.



Here is the original 1945 Time Magazine article.:

Virility Prolonged
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,775689-1,00.html
Testosterone injections administered under medical supervision,was presented to mainstream public opion as a wonder tonic,which could safely enhance male virility and vigour.It doesn't seem then that the idea of HRT was either thought of as harmful or socially unacceptable.

Whao!!!..............now thats a REALLY interesting find there bud......Certently throws a few ah.........well subjects up in the air

[MuscleMcMannus]

Grimek admitted to using/trying dianabol but said he didnt like the way it made him feel.  Randy Roach's new book Muscle, Smoke and Mirros has  alot of good historical info on this topic. 

[Figo]

Grimek admitted to using/trying dianabol but said he didnt like the way it made him feel.  Randy Roach's new book Muscle, Smoke and Mirros has  alot of good historical info on this topic. 

Grimek! Guys over at IA will go into cardiac arrest if they hear that... Next thing you know, its gona be Reeves...

[Cleanest Natural]

Grimek admitted to using/trying dianabol but said he didnt like the way it made him feel.  Randy Roach's new book Muscle, Smoke and Mirros has  alot of good historical info on this topic. 

[Figo]

He only took it once, 5mg, 2 days before a show. It haunted him to the deathbed...

[Cleanest Natural]

He only took it once, 5mg, 2 days before a show. It haunted him to the deathbed...

exactly ..

It shows you how effective the Weider propaganda and lies were. People are in such denial that they almost don't want to believe.

BTW for all nostalgics : Reg Park took everything and as much as he could and also experimented a lot.

[wild willie]

I agree with all of the posts here!!!!! Very good points for sure!!!

I too feel like Ironage was way too censored and if you didn't agree with them, you were chastised...... I decided to stay away from there due to the nonsense. Yes, I think the champs back then did get involved with the gear. Don't tell that to the folks over at Ironage though.

[Schmoe Buster]

IA is an ok site to read stories and see old pics etc, but its not fun to discuss or debate as there are not many regular active members and they all agree with each other and pretty much suck each others e penis! the fact that mentioning,asking,discussing steroids is not really allowed there is stupid, those old schmoes worship the BB's who all used steroids, yet they only talk about how it was all down to genetics and hard work, considering that a lot of members there have been around the iron game for so many years i find it stupid perine is an utter schmoe and an idiot!

oh yeah and im sure Park did roids, does'nt matter he will always be a legend

[funk51]

This http://ydr.inyork.com/ydr/sports/ci_4895138  article shows how acceptable they were at the time among lifting/bodybuilding elite.

As to why they weren't openly publicised in the magazines, well my feeling is that much like today, the magazines were/are controlled by the supplement companies. If Bob Hoffman openly said the secret is Dianabol, then he couldn't hawk Protein-by-the-Sea, liver pills, etc..... For most, money will trump honesty.

Most of these fellows didn't become anti-steroid till they had health problems, their records fell, or it became obvious to everyone that this hobby/sport is mostly drug dependant after a certain point.

Reg Park was a great lifter but lets not let our hero worship cloud our vision.

                                                                                                                                protein from the sea that was some foul stuff, i much preferred his protein peanut butter bars, just the right mix of peanut butter ,honey, sawdust, sweat, and probably a load or two from old bohof himself. it was said that a shirtless bob hoffman used to come in and mix the stuff with a canoe oar himself in an open vat.

[wild willie]

IA is an ok site to read stories and see old pics etc, but its not fun to discuss or debate as there are not many regular active members and they all agree with each other and pretty much suck each others e penis! the fact that mentioning,asking,discussing steroids is not really allowed there is stupid, those old schmoes worship the BB's who all used steroids, yet they only talk about how it was all down to genetics and hard work, considering that a lot of members there have been around the iron game for so many years i find it stupid perine is an utter schmoe and an idiot!

oh yeah and im sure Park did roids, does'nt matter he will always be a legend

X2.......I agree with your input.....perine and IA was way too serious and they are so biased it isn't even funny......great site though for pics and stories about the old timers and even the 70s and 80s......but overall just too many hypcrites and too many arrogant attitudes and opinions. perine is one of the biggest name droppers ever to walk planet earth.

[wild willie]

i must say........ that i feel mr. park did use the gear....

but that being said.....


he is without a doubt the best representative bodybuilding has ever seen!!!