Long Cycle Coming Up, chime in juiceheads!

[Fitness4Life]

First cycle coming up, I plan on making it a long one, 16 weeks maybe?  I'm sitting at 236lbs, 10% BF, 6ft.  Cycle experience consists of on and off pro hormones (steroids lol).  Been off and on tren, halodrol, epistane.  10 years training, 8 COMPLETE natural, true natty.  With that said.


I'm thinking of doing 8 weeks of:  Trying to get down from 10 percent to 7

Test prop  700-900mg
Tren 500-700
Masterona 200?
t3  50mcg to  75mcg  (liquid t3)
Ephedrina (low dose, this crap is really good at raising my blood pressure)
Low dose gh (3iu)  I'm a broke bodybuilder
Peptides  GHRP2, CJC129 3 times a day 200 mcg each time.


Next 8 weeks:  Put on lean size...

test prop
npp
eq
gh and peptides same protocal.

Doses, haven't decided yet. 

ALSO,  I have a ton of pro hormones,  ALPHA ONE (andro like clone), HALODROL, SUPERDROL, FURUZA  (EQ wannabe).

How would you guys emplement those prohormones into either cycle if it were up to you.  Keeping it short, I know questions will come so we'll keep this topic going. Thanks fellas




-Dosage is still being worked out, standard dosages, nothing crazy

[Arnold jr]

That's a lot of gear for a first cycle...I guarantee you with testosterone alone assuming your diet is right you'd drop down to the 7% bf you want...especially if GH was part of the mix.

The GHRP2 and CJC129 are a waste of money IMO.

Test, GH and maybe another anabolic is all you really need and will give you amazing results.

[Meso_z]

First cycle coming up, I plan on making it a long one, 16 weeks maybe?  I'm sitting at 236lbs, 10% BF, 6ft.  Cycle experience consists of on and off pro hormones (steroids lol).  Been off and on tren, halodrol, epistane.  10 years training, 8 COMPLETE natural, true natty.  With that said.


I'm thinking of doing 8 weeks of:  Trying to get down from 10 percent to 7

Test prop  700-900mg
Tren 500-700
Masterona 200?
t3  50mcg to  75mcg  (liquid t3)
Ephedrina (low dose, this crap is really good at raising my blood pressure)
Low dose gh (3iu)  I'm a broke bodybuilder
Peptides  GHRP2, CJC129 3 times a day 200 mcg each time.


Next 8 weeks:  Put on lean size...

test prop
npp
eq
gh and peptides same protocal.

Doses, haven't decided yet. 

ALSO,  I have a ton of pro hormones,  ALPHA ONE (andro like clone), HALODROL, SUPERDROL, FURUZA  (EQ wannabe).

How would you guys emplement those prohormones into either cycle if it were up to you.  Keeping it short, I know questions will come so we'll keep this topic going. Thanks fellas




-Dosage is still being worked out, standard dosages, nothing crazy

Throw the peptides in the trash! garbage..and instead of wasting money on them, buy more hgh. 

[DK II]

Throw the peptides in the trash! garbage..and instead of wasting money on them, buy more hgh. 

x2


Also i would really go with the advise not to stack too many compounds on a first cycle, go with test and deca, and spend the rest of the money on HGH.

Leave the tren and masteron for later cycles.

You can cut on test e for 6-8 weeks and then add the deca for another 10 weeks.

btw, 16 weeks is considered minimum length for a cycle in Germany, when i read "long cycle" i thought you were talking about 24 or 36 weeks, lol.

[Luolamies]

That's a lot of gear for a first cycle... 

Way, way too much!

x2


Also i would really go with the advise not to stack too many compounds on a first cycle

If i was you i would just use testosterone at 500 mg per week and nothing else! I know that might seem "low" or "weak" but i assure you it's not. Also that way you will know how you react to it. + Seeing that you have used designers and gotten obviously good results with them, test is the way to go. After at least one TEST ONLY cycle you can start adding more compounds and even then do it one at a time so, once again you will know how you will react to it...

PS. No such thing as masterona/ephedrina, but masteron and ephedrine are ok compounds  if epherine raises your blood pressure significantly just forget it.

[Arnold jr]

Way, way too much!

If i was you i would just use testosterone at 500 mg per week and nothing else! I know that might seem "low" or "weak" but i assure you it's not. Also that way you will know how you react to it. + Seeing that you have used designers and gotten obviously good results with them, test is the way to go. After at least one TEST ONLY cycle you can start adding more compounds and even then do it one at a time so, once again you will know how you will react to it...

PS. No such thing as masterona/ephedrina, but masteron and ephedrine are ok compounds  if epherine raises your blood pressure significantly just forget it.

Thank you, someone else finally said it too....that whole "Equipoina, Trenbolona, Masterona thing really gets on my nerves, it sounds retarded. It's like saying I'm going to start calling protein powder "Proteinona Powder"......very dumb sounding and it's the same with the gear names.

[Luolamies]

Thank you, someone else finally said it too.... that whole "Equipoina, Trenbolona, Masterona thing really gets on my nerves, it sounds retarded. It's like saying I'm going to start calling protein powder "Proteinona Powder"......very dumb sounding and it's the same with the gear names.

x ∞

I can't stand it either!

  - and i mean i can't stand it at all...
    
      - at all.

[claymore]

Way, way too much!

If i was you i would just use testosterone at 500 mg per week and nothing else! I know that might seem "low" or "weak" but i assure you it's not. Also that way you will know how you react to it. + Seeing that you have used designers and gotten obviously good results with them, test is the way to go. After at least one TEST ONLY cycle you can start adding more compounds and even then do it one at a time so, once again you will know how you will react to it...

PS. No such thing as masterona/ephedrina, but masteron and ephedrine are ok compounds  if epherine raises your blood pressure significantly just forget it.

"Way, way too much!"...Agreed

[Fitness4Life]

x ∞

I can't stand it either!

  - and i mean i can't stand it at all...
    
      - at all.

I think it's hilarious lol.  


I hear you guys on that cycle being pretty heavy, I'm just done messing around and ready to do damage on stage asap.  
With that said, I know tren is the best aas, but because of that one of the harsher ones, so that one might go.  
I'd like to keep Masteron in there for it's anti-estrogen and anabolic properties.  Seems like a far wiser choice than throwing my money on a few letro's, and it will be a few for 16 weeks+.

So how's switching out tren for some eq?  OR,  should I just be "safe" and do Test, Masteron cycle only for 8 weeks?  Hell, is it ok to run Masteron for the full 16 weeks?  It's really in their mainly for the anti-estrogen really, I do like all the other perks it comes with though.  Also, what do you guys think about implenting the pro-hormones?


maybe, test, masteron, halodrol, t3, gh?  oh the possibilities lol

[Fitness4Life]

That's a lot of gear for a first cycle...I guarantee you with testosterone alone assuming your diet is right you'd drop down to the 7% bf you want...especially if GH was part of the mix.

The GHRP2 and CJC129 are a waste of money IMO.

Test, GH and maybe another anabolic is all you really need and will give you amazing results.

Why do you give these a bad rep?  I've seen studies where they're proven to release your own gh.  gh15 once said that although it does release it, it's not in the way you want it too...?  This I don't understand, I would think that the more gh flowing through your body is better end of story.  I usually take the peptides 3 times a day, evenly spaced.  After 2 of these dosages I'll follow it up with 1 iu of hgh  10 mins post to the peptides.  They're supposed to have a great synergistic effect.  If I had the money, I'd do 10 iu's a day, bodybuilding is too damn expensive 

[efanhowz]

In the studies are they getting the peptides from bodybuilding board sponsors?
NO! They are using real shit, not some relabeled water that these "research chems" stores ripped you off for

Bro this is your first cycle. See how you react to test.
You have no idea about the sides you will get from tren/mast/eq
Want to keep your hair? Worry about anxiety? Prostate irritation?

If not, than shot go balls out

[Arnold jr]

I think it's hilarious lol.  


I hear you guys on that cycle being pretty heavy, I'm just done messing around and ready to do damage on stage asap.  
With that said, I know tren is the best aas, but because of that one of the harsher ones, so that one might go.  
I'd like to keep Masteron in there for it's anti-estrogen and anabolic properties.  Seems like a far wiser choice than throwing my money on a few letro's, and it will be a few for 16 weeks+.

So how's switching out tren for some eq?  OR,  should I just be "safe" and do Test, Masteron cycle only for 8 weeks?  Hell, is it ok to run Masteron for the full 16 weeks?  It's really in their mainly for the anti-estrogen really, I do like all the other perks it comes with though.  Also, what do you guys think about implenting the pro-hormones?


maybe, test, masteron, halodrol, t3, gh?  oh the possibilities lol

Masteron may indeed have some positive anti-estrogen effects in-terms of giving one a dryer look but in-terms of overall aromatase prevention it will do very little in that regards. With testosterone in play, especially at the dosing you're wanting to use all the Masteron in the world will not protect against Gyno, blood pressure and cholesterol issues that can be caused by estrogenic effects.

8 wk cycles are fine but 16wk cycles are far more efficient, I'd stick with the original plan in that regards. You want cycles long enough to create maintainable changes.

If you wanted to add in EQ to the mix a good cycle using the items you've mentioned might look like this:

WK 1-10 EQ
WK 8-16 Tren
Wk 1-16 Test
WK 11-16 Masteron
WK 1-16 HGH

Personally, even though the above would be a solid protocol it's far more than you need right now, I'm simply trying to give you an idea. Also, as has been said, you need to think long-term, if you start your first cycle with a butt load of AAS of all types even though you may have success and get away without any side-effects you won't be able to tell which anabolics were the best in-terms of your individual response.

Also, the HGH, while 16wks of use is often considered the minimum amount of time, 6 month periods of use is far more effective. Personally I'd continue the HGH for 2 months post cycle and if money allowed a month or so before.

[Arnold jr]

Why do you give these a bad rep?  I've seen studies where they're proven to release your own gh.  gh15 once said that although it does release it, it's not in the way you want it too...?  This I don't understand, I would think that the more gh flowing through your body is better end of story.  I usually take the peptides 3 times a day, evenly spaced.  After 2 of these dosages I'll follow it up with 1 iu of hgh  10 mins post to the peptides.  They're supposed to have a great synergistic effect.  If I had the money, I'd do 10 iu's a day, bodybuilding is too damn expensive 

Some of them will cause a little natural HGH release but it doesn't matter, you're supplementing with Somatropin, so it doesn't matter what your body does naturally in this regard. Yes, you can supplement with these peptide fragments safely but the amount of HGH they cause to be released will be so negligible it will be less than noticeable

[Fitness4Life]

Masteron may indeed have some positive anti-estrogen effects in-terms of giving one a dryer look but in-terms of overall aromatase prevention it will do very little in that regards. With testosterone in play, especially at the dosing you're wanting to use all the Masteron in the world will not protect against Gyno, blood pressure and cholesterol issues that can be caused by estrogenic effects.

8 wk cycles are fine but 16wk cycles are far more efficient, I'd stick with the original plan in that regards. You want cycles long enough to create maintainable changes.

If you wanted to add in EQ to the mix a good cycle using the items you've mentioned might look like this:

WK 1-10 EQ
WK 8-16 Tren
Wk 1-16 Test
WK 11-16 Masteron
WK 1-16 HGH

Personally, even though the above would be a solid protocol it's far more than you need right now, I'm simply trying to give you an idea. Also, as has been said, you need to think long-term, if you start your first cycle with a butt load of AAS of all types even though you may have success and get away without any side-effects you won't be able to tell which anabolics were the best in-terms of your individual response.

Also, the HGH, while 16wks of use is often considered the minimum amount of time, 6 month periods of use is far more effective. Personally I'd continue the HGH for 2 months post cycle and if money allowed a month or so before.

A little more background, I've been on hgh for about 4 months now, threw in the peptides 2 months ago.  Going well ever since, definitely a positive recomp.   I just got off a week ago, from halodrol and tren stack of 6 weeks.  Taking it easy right now, going to get blood work done in about 2 weeks.  Was thinking of doing the andro and furuza (eq wannabe) for about a month, take 2 weeks off then start this stack.  Only reason I'm doing this little cycle is because I'm slowly stocking up on what I'll be on for this actual 16 week long cycle.

As far as the sample cycle you posted, it looks good, but it's in reverse it seems.  First 8 weeks I wanted to shred, then blow up lean once I hit that 7 %.  Whereas you have me throwing in the cutting roids in the end.  Or in you professional opinion, does your sample cycle yield the results I want as is?  I know tren is multi purpose beast of an anabolic, and I can see how you'd want me to do the masteron towards the for the anti estrogen effects? 

Really appreciate the feedback fellas.

[abijahmaniaco]

but receptors downgrade after six weeks so what's the point in 16 week cycle? (i'm not saying there isn't point; just that i don't know what it is.)

[Fitness4Life]

but receptors downgrade after six weeks so what's the point in 16 week cycle? (i'm not saying there isn't point; just that i don't know what it is.)

Tell that to the pro circuit bodybuilders.

[DK II]

but receptors downgrade after six weeks so what's the point in 16 week cycle? (i'm not saying there isn't point; just that i don't know what it is.)

LOL!!!

[claymore]

but receptors downgrade after six weeks so what's the point in 16 week cycle? (i'm not saying there isn't point; just that i don't know what it is.)

"but receptors downgrade after six weeks"...Incorrect sir

[Fitness4Life]

but receptors downgrade after six weeks so what's the point in 16 week cycle? (i'm not saying there isn't point; just that i don't know what it is.)

You're talking more about stims like clenbuterol pal

[abijahmaniaco]

yes, you continue to gain but not dramatically like first six weeks.

for example: last cycle i did 12 weeks gaining a total of 34 lbs, 25 of which i gained in the first six weeks.

i've read it in various internet articles citing studies as well as william llewellyn's anabolics 10th edition: "anabolic/androgenic steroids tend to be most effective at a given dosage for approximately 6-8 weeks. after this point, the rate of new muscle gain will slow, and soon after will usually hit a full plateau."

[DK II]

yes, you continue to gain but not dramatically like first six weeks.

for example: last cycle i did 12 weeks gaining a total of 34 lbs, 25 of which i gained in the first six weeks.

i've read it in various internet articles citing studies as well as william llewellyn's anabolics 10th edition: "anabolic/androgenic steroids tend to be most effective at a given dosage for approximately 6-8 weeks. after this point, the rate of new muscle gain will slow, and soon after will usually hit a full plateau."

Has nothing to do with "receptor downgrade", but that your body's cortisol production has caught up with the AAS use until then. You can add an oral for the last weeks of the cycle to combat this effect.

[abijahmaniaco]

hmm, well maybe that explains why i couldn't find mention of androgen receptors to this regard in william llewellyn's book.
i must have gotten this conception from this pdf file on steroids that gets passed around the net...
i've heard the argument as well that staggering your stack wont help bc all aas activate the same receptors... false as well?

[DK II]

hmm, well maybe that explains why i couldn't find mention of androgen receptors to this regard in william llewellyn's book.
i must have gotten this conception from this pdf file on steroids that gets passed around the net...
i've heard the argument as well that staggering your stack wont help bc all aas activate the same receptors... false as well?

Bullshit, the receptor downgrade story is plain bullshit.

Look at the IFBB pros, these guys are on for years and years, some probably decades long.

Ask a few people here about adding an oral at the end of the cycle, most have gotten good results with it.

[Arnold jr]

A little more background, I've been on hgh for about 4 months now, threw in the peptides 2 months ago.  Going well ever since, definitely a positive recomp.   I just got off a week ago, from halodrol and tren stack of 6 weeks.  Taking it easy right now, going to get blood work done in about 2 weeks.  Was thinking of doing the andro and furuza (eq wannabe) for about a month, take 2 weeks off then start this stack.  Only reason I'm doing this little cycle is because I'm slowly stocking up on what I'll be on for this actual 16 week long cycle.

As far as the sample cycle you posted, it looks good, but it's in reverse it seems.  First 8 weeks I wanted to shred, then blow up lean once I hit that 7 %.  Whereas you have me throwing in the cutting roids in the end.  Or in you professional opinion, does your sample cycle yield the results I want as is?  I know tren is multi purpose beast of an anabolic, and I can see how you'd want me to do the masteron towards the for the anti estrogen effects? 

Really appreciate the feedback fellas.

As you get into steroid supplementation you'll soon realize that the idea of bulking steroids and cutting steroids is more myth and legend then truth. Yes, certain steroids are more suited towards one purpose, for example, a particular steroid may have a primary mass building role but most all steroids have secondary characteristics that are well-suited for any cycle, cutting or bulking. Of course there are some steroids that are more highly versatile in that they can meet both needs equally or at least close to it.

I think you're over estimating the anti-estrogen effects of Masteron, if they were that strong such estrogen related side-effects like Gynecomastia would not be as big of a problem as it has been the last 30yrs with all the bodybuilders who use Masteron. To truly combat estrogen related side-effects some sort of AI will have to be used if you're going to inhibit the aromatase effect to any noteworthy degree.

Personally I wouldn't have you run Masteron at all as I see no need for it for you here. I only through it in there where I best see fit because I know you desire to use it.

[Fitness4Life]

Am I also over-estimating the fat burning effects of tren?  Everything I read says this is the best for incinerating fat.  Would be nice to do a smaller cycle though, money-wise lol.  Plus, If I cut down the tren, means my libido is still functioning, thank god, especially since I got some Americana whores in line for some loving lol. 

Arnold, care to chime in on how you would implement the fat burners I have?  I got the liquid clen, liquid t3 (wish I had legit cytomel pill form : /  ), and I do have bronkaid. 

Like I said with ephedra, shit raises blood pressure, but then again i was running it with 600mg of caffeine a day, on top of all the other crap I was on, is it pointless to do eca only 3 or 4 days a week? 

Thanks again for lending your expertise.