PIP Margerat Thatcher

[GigantorX]

so you are implying that free health care, education and nationally owned industry are bad things to be discouraged?

seriously.

for what it is worth I earn in the highest bracket in the UK. I am happy to pay taxes at a higher rate- I neither want nor expect tax breaks. However the tories just now have given me a tax break. why?

its nonsense.

I would happily be heavily taxed if it meant getting education back to being free or subsidised and or the NHS back to where it belongs.

also pull us out of petro-wars, regulate the bankers and their 'bonus system' for fucking up. you should just a country by how they help or treat those who are least able to help themselves- eg the elderly and the poor. we used to be good at it. since thatcher and her doctrine we have gone downhill.


the tories look after the rich and the idiots who think they can break into the old school tie network- you can't its a closed shop but the carrott they offer will bring the naive into line.

the wealthy protect the wealthy- and rely on working the poor over. not for me.

How did nationalized British-Leyland work out? The place the economy was in during 60-70's was, in part, a result of those policies of nationalization. Whole industries became noncompetitive. The unions overplayed their hands, as well. And actually, today the auto industry in the U.K. is producing more cars than at anytime in its history.

You are actually taking Attlee's tact, full employment via govt. controlled industries and massive social spending. It worked, for short time and then it didn't. In a vacuum without a recovering Europe and Japan it may have worked, but there wasn't a vacuum and Britain had become sick and simply couldn't compete. The pendulum swings one way and then the other. I don't hail Thatcher as a saint or devil like some, there was a pendulum swing in the other direction, but even then she didn't really have a huge majority in Parliament that only happened until after the Falklands in 1982.

And nothing is ever, ever free.

[Donny]

so from now on in getbig i am known as Citizen Smith....   you Brits remember this...

[Coach is Back!]

Why do you say its "free"? You're getting taxed to death for inadequate care.

.

[Mr Nobody]

Wonder when her last sex episode was? I mean year.

[Tapeworm]

Wonder when her last sex episode was? I mean year.

That can still be arranged.

[gee38]

ITS GREAT TO BE told how thatcher was great by US citizens who didn't live in the cities affected by her shithouse policies.


anyone who lived through the thatcher years and wasn't one of the chosen few had it tough. her chosen few however had it easy.

she was all for working hard to get ahead- except for her son who was handed contract after contract because of mummy

hard work and the ethic of it applied to other people not to her and her cohorts. they rinsed the system. good riddance to her and her like.

she even had 3 rounds of breast augmentation paid for  by the taxpayer

[Raymondo]

Good conversation!

Taking a step back (and as an American) could many of the problems that Britain faced and Britain's decline in the 60's-70's be placed at the feet of PM Clemente Attlee? Wasn't it he and his government that nationalized whole industries/utilities, began what was to be the NHS, enlargement of social services, large govt. role in the economy etc etc etc? The auto industry and British-Leyland is shinning example of that. That was pretty extreme and it would seem that Thatcher was the pendulum swinging the other way.

Just my opinion.

You're right in that as an American you have a patchy notion of British history

Thatcher's acolytes would have you believe that the problems of the 1970s were all down to bitter men standing on platforms asking for a show of hands to down tools.

Yes, indeed.

It wasn't the loss of the imperial markets.

Nor was it lazy management.

Nor did it have anything to do with the education system.

It was all down to those damn unionists.

[Raymondo]

Fuck that.

A mate had a Danish girlfriend for a while, we went over to visit and were stunned at how expensive a beer was in the bars we visited, her and her friends all drink before going out because its prohibitively expensive to spend an evening just sat in a bar with friends drinking....likewise the motorcycle i ride was about twice as expensive over there, coupled with high taxes i'd likely not be able to afford my current lifestyle over there....i would have a tiny disposable income and for what?....some wishy washy notion of greater equality, a government that tells me what i need and charges me accordingly instead of allowing me the choice to provide for myself.

Socialist policies baby a population, they infer that individuals are stupid and that the government knows best in the most condescending of ways.

No thanks, i'll take the Thatcher model any day of the week.

Well, as it happens I've been to Denmark as well, and I've only seen what you describe in certain parts of Copenhagen... it's one of the most expensive places in the world, anyway.

I don't mind higher prices on alcohol, do you prefer the "Thatcher" model here as well, where some market towns are like battlegrounds on Saturday nights... because yobs can buy a bottle of cider for 99p?

Fuck that noise.

[Raymondo]

part of the reason we moved from a manufacturing based economy to financial services was down to the unions fucking up the industry

we probably agree that a shift back to a more manufacturing based economy would put us in a much stronger position maybe similiar to Germany

i agree that the way she shifted the economy towards a system that encouraged a selfish money grabbing approach hasnt helped but i believe she was niave in that she though the rich would have the morality to stimulate the economy by reinvesting their wealth rather than hiding it from the tax man

she ultimately tried to make an aspirational britain based on the American anyone can be president model

but british people have a much diferent mentality some might argue we are architects of our own downfall

bigmc, a man of hidden depths

[BigCyp]

bigmc, a man of hidden depths

A stud and a gentleman like yourself Raymondo.

[GigantorX]

You're right in that as an American you have a patchy notion of British history

Thatcher's acolytes would have you believe that the problems of the 1970s were all down to bitter men standing on platforms asking for a show of hands to down tools.

Yes, indeed.

It wasn't the loss of the imperial markets.

Nor was it lazy management.

Nor did it have anything to do with the education system.

It was all down to those damn unionists.

Understand your point and to be clear I'm not a Thatcher acolyte or anything.  I'm just attempting tp bring some more planks into the conversation.  It's not as simple as blaming it on unions just as it's not as simple to label Thatcher as a blood drinking capitalist.

And again, this is coming from an American. All I have is what I read and what I've studied. I didn't live it, that is certain.

[gee38]

big round of applause to raymondo and donny from me!

the idea that the health service and free education could ever be a bad thing is hilarious.

[BigCyp]

The last week of 'welfare bashing' has really pissed me off no end. The real leeches in this society are scumbag politicians. As a member of society and as a tax payer, why am I funding the lifestyles of Iain Duncan Smith claiming £39 on a breakfast, while hardworking Brits are having to queue in a food bank for an hour in the freezing cold to collect a can of chopped tomatoes some tuna and pasta. Why does 22% of my salary go towards these gross excesses, when some taxpayers can't afford to feed themselves.
 
How about Sir Peter Vigger’s £1,165 ‘floating pond feature’ for his duck pond? Or for £41,000 of furniture for the Care Services Minister, Phil Hope’s small London flat?
 
Why, as a taxpayer and as a member of society, am I paying for second and third homes, for soundproofing of bedrooms of MPs daughters, for Laura Ashley curtains for other people, which I get pissed off enough aboiut buying for my own wife! At least she gives me a blowjob for it!

Fucking scumbags.

[bigmc]

The last week of 'welfare bashing' has really pissed me off no end. The real leeches in this society are scumbag politicians. As a member of society and as a tax payer, why am I funding the lifestyles of Iain Duncan Smith claiming £39 on a breakfast, while hardworking Brits are having to queue in a food bank for an hour in the freezing cold to collect a can of chopped tomatoes some tuna and pasta. Why does 22% of my salary go towards these gross excesses, when some taxpayers can't afford to feed themselves.
 
How about Sir Peter Vigger’s £1,165 ‘floating pond feature’ for his duck pond? Or for £41,000 of furniture for the Care Services Minister, Phil Hope’s small London flat?
 
Why, as a taxpayer and as a member of society, am I paying for second and third homes, for soundproofing of bedrooms of MPs daughters, for Laura Ashley curtains for other people, which I get pissed off enough aboiut buying for my own wife! At least she gives me a blowjob for it!

Fucking scumbags.

completely agree

they are all criminals

[MORTALCOIL]

The last week of 'welfare bashing' has really pissed me off no end. The real leeches in this society are scumbag politicians. As a member of society and as a tax payer, why am I funding the lifestyles of Iain Duncan Smith claiming £39 on a breakfast, while hardworking Brits are having to queue in a food bank for an hour in the freezing cold to collect a can of chopped tomatoes some tuna and pasta. Why does 22% of my salary go towards these gross excesses, when some taxpayers can't afford to feed themselves.
 
How about Sir Peter Vigger’s £1,165 ‘floating pond feature’ for his duck pond? Or for £41,000 of furniture for the Care Services Minister, Phil Hope’s small London flat?
 
Why, as a taxpayer and as a member of society, am I paying for second and third homes, for soundproofing of bedrooms of MPs daughters, for Laura Ashley curtains for other people, which I get pissed off enough aboiut buying for my own wife! At least she gives me a blowjob for it!

Fucking scumbags.

People haven't figured it yet. Politicians are the new clergy. They have careers to run. That career depends solely on the fact that they are able to trick people into believing that they have both the power and the will to get things done. They have neither.

[BigCyp]

People haven't figured it yet. Politicians are the new clergy. They have careers to run. That career depends solely on the fact that they are able to trick people into believing that they have both the power and the will to get things done. They have neither.

Exactly. All they are interested in is the next election and what perks are involved if they win.

[Roger Bacon]

The communists hated her because she called out their failed polices and bs boldly.

Usually you know someone is on the right track when scumbags and dirty ghetto pos like Benny/Enigma/Hawk attack her. 

THIS^^

[Roger Bacon]

She was against socialist/communist type policies where people are viewed as a group instead of individuals, ie what is best for the group...trying to make everyone as close to equal as possible regardless of work effort and skill. Take from producers to spread it to everyone. No pure system is perfect but socialism makes no sense to me, as someone who strives to work hard and better my life & standing for family. I don't want to have to carry able bodied people that are low achievers, low energy or lazy.  We must help our sick, disabled and elderly and need some social programs but to indefinitely support able bodied people just because they are poor or have less is wrong.

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Voice of Doom]

Communism has to be stamped out wherever it raises its head.

[Roger Bacon]

You can't reason with hard core liberals or socialist.  They are filled with absolute seething hate for anything that falls out of their political views.  I very much dislike many liberals because I very much disagree with their politics.  However if one of them dies, I sure don't hope they burn in hell or have a party to spit on their grave so to speak. 

They're fucking lunatics

[Roger Bacon]

It doesn't make sense. Why would anyone WANT to be controlled?

One of your top posts!

[Soul Crusher]

One of your top posts!

Because being a lazy slug and not having to take responsibility and make decisions is a more attractive option to the socialist slug.  They rather sit on their wortheless asses and be told what to do, where to go, etc than to get up and take risks in life. 

[Roger Bacon]

Agree, don't like the little I know about the poll tax but otherwise, seems her ideals supporting hard work, freedom and individualism were admirable.
Tired of hearing that people who value those ideals and don't want to massively redistribute wealth are 'only for the rich', that is bullshit.  No one is perfect and neither party is good for all but it is absurd to think the only difference in people is because of luck and birth.  That does matter but far from the only factors in today's society in countries like the US and UK...the most important trait I have learned in life (coming from an absolutely middle class average family to becoming a doctor) is to work harder than others and always try to grow personally and professionally, not to settle for mediocracy...ideas that are not held in high esteem in a socialist mindset.  I absolutely believe people that who work hard, create and take advantage of opportunities should be able to do better (and not be taxed half their income).  I also believe government has a responsibility to keep the playing field as even as possible without picking winners and loosers.

[Roger Bacon]

Because being a lazy slug and not having to take responsibility and make decisions is a more attractive option to the socialist slug.  They rather sit on their wortheless asses and be told what to do, where to go, etc than to get up and take risks in life. 

That's what it comes down to, running your own life versus being controlled.

[Soul Crusher]

LOL.   Benny - get off welfare already will you? 

“Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”


Margaret Thatcher was terrible but she isn't nearly as bad as America's GOP base circa 2013. WATCH & LEARN THE TRUTH
'Conservative' Margaret Thatcher's History of 'Socialism'; USSR, Reagan Fal