Author Topic: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State  (Read 11282 times)

24KT

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #100 on: August 08, 2013, 12:28:54 AM »
so by that same logic the nba and nfl are exclusionary against whites?

I mean they pick players on athletic ability but the leagues are predominately black so...::)

what a fuking moron

Why do you insist on labeling people while you display the very label you attach to them?

Yes, the NBA & the NFL pick their players on athletic ability, but that doesn't in any way compare to TV content.

You can't say in TV performers are picked based on talent & ability because it all starts with the content.

I remember when "The Hunt for Red October" came to town. HUGE HUGE budget, and every actor wanted to put a piece of the budget in their bank account. But the bottom line is, the storyline was about a bunch of young Russian sailors stuck in a submarine. Halle Berry, Jennifer Hudson and Octavia Davis are all very talented Oscar winning actresses, however, there is no way on God's green earth that they would ever be included in that cast. They would NEVER even get to apply. They wouldn't even be considered because they could never pass as young Russian seamen. They could chug a gallon of Kahlua and wash it down with a pint of milk, ...and they still wouldn't pass for Black Russians. It just ain't happening!!!

So comparing the film & TV industry to the NFL or NBA... don't even go there. And you call Al a moron?  ::)
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24KT

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #101 on: August 08, 2013, 01:05:25 AM »
They are ignored not for racist reasons but because it is not profitable to invest large sums of money appealing to a small demographic.  The amount of advertising dollars would not justify it.

That is a well accepted myth, ...but a myth nonetheless. Shows like Cosby and a slew of films like Waiting to Exhale etc., proved how innacurate such a premise is.

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 UPN is a prime example.  UPN failed because not enough people were watching their minority centric shows and they couldn't generate any revenue. It's a mistake believe that a private company has any obligation to level the playing field.  Equality is not their business, generating a profit is.

UPN failed NOT because they were producing shows with Black leading characters, but because the content they were producing was not delivering the audiences they were targetting. The numbers were there for them to be successful. Believe me, no one invests in the kind of money required to initiate the venture without adequate feasibility studies. The problem is not just a lack of inclusion at the cast level, ...it starts with the content.

Do you honestly believe that you can have a bunch of non-lifting sloths write a TV show about body builders, and attract a large enough audience of body builders to make it profitable? Do you believe some guy who horks down McD's everyday, can even begin to write anything with a sense of realism. Do you think s/he would even be aware of the pain you guys go through, the drama, all the stuff that exists in your world, in a real enough way that would make you guys want to tune in? ...or do you think you might end up with a caricature that might prompt you to channel surf? That's the difference.  Some guy whose heaviest life is the tab on the beer can which he rests on his gut... might not necessarily be fully equipped to write about your experience. To give that show a fighting chance, it's not just enough to cast a few serious lifters in the leads, but to extend the inclusiveness to having a writer behind the scenes who can write knowledgebly & credibly about the bodybuilder experience and make it relatable to the target audience. And then you had better pray to Mr. Weider in the sky, that the commercial airtime is not purchased by Tampax or Revlon, ...cause I would guarandamtee ya, the story lines would change to a bunch of women griping about what inconsiderate pricks their boyfriends are for going to the gym to play with weights rather than take them out on the town for their birthday. If there is not full vertical inclusion from the script to the screen, all you will end up with is a caricature of yourselves, and the perpetual stereotype of you as just a bunch of dumb meatheads.

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As I said,  the distinction between BET and any other network is that BET is racially motivated, while the major networks are motivated by profit.  Again, the music industry is a prime example of this works.  Music by black artist sell well so record companies release a disproportionate number of works by black entertainments.

Blacks are represented well on television if you consider their actual percentage of the population.    If you don't see as many minorities as you like, it may mean your conception of equality is skewered. It's a mistake to believe that equality means fifty-fifty. Also, equality doesn't mean that every situation requires the presence of a minority.

Blacks are NOT represented well regardless of their percentage of population.
Throwing a person up on a screen is hardly representation, ...and certainly not when the images are periferal, inconsequential, or derogatory. That's not representation, ...that's portrayal, ...not representation. 

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If you ever watch black-centric shows it is immediately apparent that whites and other minority are woefully underrepresented.  Where are the whites and minorities?  You'd think that black people being such a small portion of the population, would be encountering other groups of people quite frequently.  Beyond the occasional white guest star or white/minority peripheral character-usual the focus of derision by the way- they are barely visible.  I doubt you noticed this because you weren't looking for it.  


I've noticed, ...but I along with alot of people don't make a habit of watching racially derisive shit!
Could be a reason why so many fail at creating content for delivering product to an audience. The audience simply cannot relate to the crap they are spewing, and tune out.
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JOHN MATRIX

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #102 on: August 08, 2013, 06:52:48 AM »
They need it now more than ever.  White culture is being exterminated.  In the old days whites held minority groups back.  Now minorities of every kind are making the rules of society and white heterosexual males have a target on their backs.  They better wise up and start standing up for themselves or they are going to get trampled. 
THIS!!!!

Archer77

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #103 on: August 08, 2013, 08:54:05 AM »
I totally disagree 24k but instead of retreading all my previous arguments I will again affirm my arguments.  Even BETs rating, a network exclusively designed for black audiences, are abysmal in comparison to television designed for general audiences or any other compariable cable network for that matter

As far as demographic representation, if we go down that road, any show that deals with situations which naturally have low black participation to begin with, you'd see even less blacks on television. Again, this really has to do with perception.  Because you dont see blacks on television as often as you would like, doesn't mean they are under represented.  Equality is not fifty-fifty.  In any real situation 12% of the participants will not be black nor will 13% be Hispanic. 

I understand this is a personal cause for many minorities and emotion is involved but let's be rational about it.  It's not the responsibility or in the interest of a money making venture to promote equality at the expense of profit. Personally, I don't care that BET exists to appeal to a particular audience, that is their right to do so.  I'm offended by the argument that white people have some obligation to minority interests even if it goes against their own.  Or that it is somehow wrong for white people to persue their own issues.

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Archer77

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #104 on: August 08, 2013, 09:00:55 AM »
That was the argument network execs made for years, until Cosby turned that argument on it's ass where it belonged. They made the same argument about feature films as well, ...then they produced "Waiting to Exhale", ...and turned that argument on it's ass again.

People are not going to pay good money to sit in a theatre and watch themselves denigrated on the screen.

In many cases there is a very good reason why their "customer base" is not Black!
It's the same reason why I suspect the majority of Pastor Manning's congregation is white.
What self -respecting Black person would listen to his garbage? Racist white's however find it pretty humourous.


And do you know why Cosby was such a hit?  It was a hit because despite having black characters it was a show that all people could relate to and was not aimed exclusively at black audiences. 

As far as degrading images, why would whites have to degrade minorities when they do an excellent job of that themselves.  This is a clear example of scapegoating.  Blacks need to start holding themselves accountable for their own behavior. 

By the way, most of pastor mannings congregation are not white.  I'd recommend you look into that further. 
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24KT

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #105 on: August 08, 2013, 12:43:11 PM »
I totally disagree 24k but instead of retreading all my previous arguments I will again affirm my arguments.  Even BETs rating, a network exclusively designed for black audiences, are abysmal in comparison to television designed for general audiences or any other compariable cable network for that matter

That is because they are trying to cater to a "niche"

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As far as demographic representation, if we go down that road, any show that deals with situations which naturally have low black participation to begin with, you'd see even less blacks on television. Again, this really has to do with perception.  Because you dont see blacks on television as often as you would like, doesn't mean they are under represented.  Equality is not fifty-fifty.  In any real situation 12% of the participants will not be black nor will 13% be Hispanic. 

You're missing a key portion of "representation". Representation is not based on numbers as a percentage of the population. That is merely "portrayal". Not representation.

Let me give you an example of what I mean by representation vs. portrayal.

Let us take BET as an example. If you were to have a show on BET that had a cast that consisted of 13% Black characters, and 87% white characters, ...however each white character was an inbred troll married to his sister and named Billy Bob, and was also a member of the KKK, would you say the white characters were being represented fairly... after all population demographics say 87% white?

And in a culture so segregated as the USA (relatively speaking) what impression does that leave in the minds of Blacks who rarely interact with whites? Throw in a race baiting media & a few poverty pimps, and the moment you show your face, people are going to assume your white hood was at the dry cleaners.

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I understand this is a personal cause for many minorities and emotion is involved but let's be rational about it.  It's not the responsibility or in the interest of a money making venture to promote equality at the expense of profit. Personally, I don't care that BET exists to appeal to a particular audience, that is their right to do so.  I'm offended by the argument that white people have some obligation to minority interests even if it goes against their own.  Or that it is somehow wrong for white people to persue their own issues.

I have never said it was wrong for white people to pursue their own issues. I was simply addressing the misinformation and myths believed with regards to the entertainment industry.

I have no issue whatsoever with a "White Student Union", ...especially if one were to be established on a campus like Morehouse or Howard etc.  

I do agree with Al that considering the default culture in America is white, the formation of a white student union certainly has "connotations" to it, however, one should monitor to ensure it is what it claims to be, and not just an excuse to exploit perceived grievance in order to foment hate.
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24KT

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #106 on: August 08, 2013, 01:19:25 PM »
And do you know why Cosby was such a hit?  It was a hit because despite having black characters it was a show that all people could relate to and was not aimed exclusively at black audiences.

Exactly!!!!! Cosby created quality content with fair contextual representation.

I also find it interesting that you would include the phrase despite having Black characters" when you could have simply said "It was a hit because it was a show that all people could relate to."

The fact that it also aired on FREE public TV, one of the big 3 networks prior to the fractionalization of the markets also helped in it's success.  Nowadays there are so many alternatives for the viewing audience viewer concentration doesn't exist anymore.

It all starts with the "creative process" and unfortunately the majority of film majors for the past 100 years were weaned on one of the most disgusting degrading pieces of propaganda ever created "Birth of a Nation" When the ban was removed, ...and I saw the film for the first time, ...I literally vomited. No joke. I stood up, went into the bathroom, and lost the contents of my stomache. It was all too clear to me why we have had the content we have had over the past century. No question Birth of a nation was a masterpiece and introduced ground breaking techjniques to film making, ...but oh what a legacy.

And it is a truth that no one dares to touch. When Marlon Brando dared to touch on it on Larry King, his career was ended.

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As far as degrading images, why would whites have to degrade minorities when they do an excellent job of that themselves.  This is a clear example of scapegoating.  Blacks need to start holding themselves accountable for their own behavior.  

Possibly for the same reason countries propagandize about other countries and the lack of freedoms & human rights abuses there, while stripping their own citizens of their rights, secretly spying on them, and sending global hit squads to assassinate them based solely suspicion alone.

The same reason why some people would point fingers at Manuel Noriega as being a drug dealer, while they import tons of heroin & cocaine into their own country, and destroy the leadership of other countries who have the audacity to end the outflow of heroin from their country.

Possibly to placate a populace from seeing how shitty their lives are because they can always say, ...at least I'm not one of those, ...and they can continue to feel good about themselves, ...confident in the knowledge that they are superior beings and their nation stands for freedom, liberty, and justice for all. That they are the greatest nation on the earth who are greeted as liberators.  who knows?

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By the way, most of pastor mannings congregation are not white.  I'd recommend you look into that further.  
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George Whorewell

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #107 on: August 08, 2013, 03:13:07 PM »
The legacy of black culture is essentially a cornucopia of nothingness and stupidity. Beyond the moral and intellectual bankruptcy of black culture as a whole, the only other lasting impact of the "black experience" on the United States which warrants any recognition (besides generational government dependency) is the absurd amount of time and effort non-blacks dedicate to the inane and tedious politics of victimization.- George Whorewell

24KT

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Re: ‘White Student Union’ started at Georgia State
« Reply #108 on: August 08, 2013, 04:20:25 PM »
Curious connection: I've heard Cuban-Americans use the terms 'niche' and 'nichardo' as pejorative terms for blacks.

I'm not a Cuban American, and I use the term niche in a way consistent with the Oxford Dictionary

noun
1a shallow recess, especially one in a wall to display a statue or other ornament:
each niche holding a shepherdess in Dresden china
2 (one's niche) a comfortable or suitable position in life or employment:
he is now head chef at a leading law firm and feels he has found his niche
 Ecology a role taken by a type of organism within its community:
the niche left vacant by the disappearance of wolves
3a specialized but profitable segment of the market:
[as modifier]:
a niche market for quality food
verb
[with object]
place (something) in a niche:
these elements were niched within the shadowy reaches
niched statues
Origin:

early 17th century: from French, literally 'recess', from nicher 'make a nest', based on Latin nidus 'nest'
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