Deca year round for joints

[bigkahuna]

Anyone have any experience with this? Recently been running NPP around 300-400mg a week and joints been feeling good.
Thinking about staying on indefinitely at about 200mg for the joint release effects...

[millineum man]

Have you started the 200mgs of Deca, yet?

[sceagacros]

I used 300mg/wk for about eight months and came away thinking half that dose would have been better for joint comfort without bloat. My joints were great on 300 but I wasn't as dry as I would have liked to be.

[AbrahamG]

I used 300mg/wk for about eight months and came away thinking half that dose would have been better for joint comfort without bloat. My joints were great on 300 but I wasn't as dry as I would have liked to be.

How did your cock hold up?

[sceagacros]

Fine , but then  I was on 700 test also.

[gh2]

I have done 100-150mg deca pr week together with 125-250mg test for years straight with no problems. Nice for joint relief and that little bit of extra water in the body for strength. Nice round muscles also. Blood work was within range on it even with 20mg dbol pre workout.

[theworm]

I have done 100-150mg deca pr week together with 125-250mg test for years straight with no problems. Nice for joint relief and that little bit of extra water in the body for strength. Nice round muscles also. Blood work was within range on it even with 20mg dbol pre workout.

Did u need an AI etc on this?

[millineum man]

I have done 100-150mg deca pr week together with 125-250mg test for years straight with no problems. Nice for joint relief and that little bit of extra water in the body for strength. Nice round muscles also. Blood work was within range on it even with 20mg dbol pre workout.

Any negatives associated with the low dose of Deca for years on end?

[gh2]

Did u need an AI etc on this?

No, the doses are so low. I also don't want additional stress on my cholesterol levels due to the AI so I keep it simple. I believe the ratio between test/estrogen is important, not the number itself. Like cholesterol.

[gh2]

Any negatives associated with the low dose of Deca for years on end?

No, I always work fine downstairs on any AAS so no problems in that area. It actually mellows me out as opposed to high test alone or tren which increases my aggressiveness. It's a feel good hormone for me at that dose together with low dose test.

[freakfestMD]

Anyone have any experience with this? Recently been running NPP around 300-400mg a week and joints been feeling good.
Thinking about staying on indefinitely at about 200mg for the joint release effects...

This may be the orthopaedic surgeon in me talking, but there has got to be a better way to manage joint discomfort than long-term deca use...

And Deca as HRT?  Seriously?

Also, responses that imply things like "I've done this for years and haven't had any problems with it"...or "I've done this or that without any issues"  are great and obviously the person's individual experience (which does count for something, for sure), but none of us have a problem with something until we have...a problem with it.  I would be wary of these types of responses.  Also, one individual's experience can be very different than another's.

You also didn't say how old you are.  Deca will shut you down just like any other AAS will. I agree that it does help with joint pain (diffuse wear-and-tear pain and inflammation, not true joint pathology like a rotator cuff tear), as I can attest for my own use of it.  But are you ready to tip yourself into long-term endogenous suppression?  Most of us are not pro bodybuilders, and don't make our living from this sport.  If you want to continue bodybuilding through your later years, you have to be smarter about AAS use.  There will be a price to pay at some point.  Don't think that anyone is going to abuse this stuff for years and years without scheduled breaks and not pay a price at some point.  It's just a matter of time.

One of my favorite training motivation videos on YouTube is called "30 years as a lion or 70 years as a lamb."  If you haven't seen it check it out.  It will pump you up for sure.  This concept that (we) are willing to die for this sport is often stated.  But in my experience, most lifters who say this type of thing somehow get the idea that they will just drop dead suddenly and instantly and painlessly some day, preferably in the gym, preferably monstrously huge (my favorite local hero from back in the day was a guy named Vinny Conzo from Staten Island who carved the phrase "Bury Me Massive" into his lifting belt--he was the biggest human I had ever seen up to that point[early 1980's]).  But that isn't the collective experience--it's usually years of debilitating illness, dying slowly as you watch your physique absolutely disappear.  All those years of training down the drain.  And you WILL regret it.  Bodybuilders make horrible patients, because they can't bear the thought of not training.  Mike Matarazzo is a fantastic example of this.  You should see his videos, where he speaks openly about how AAS destroyed his life, his family, his health.  And that monster died small...and horribly...and painfully slow.  And so did Vinny Conzo...

Sorry for the rant.    

Be Safe.  Be Smart.

[gh2]

Personally, I am 48 and have used for 17 years, the last 12 or so non stop. I can only speak for myself but I made educated decisions from the start. I educated myself for 6 months before I took the plunge and knew where my personal limits were and I was prepared to go on trt for the rest of my life, no way I was going to deteriorate like many older men. I set a limit to what risks I was willing to take. The choice was easy and I never looked back.

I do agree with your (freakfestMD) warning that this should not be taken lightly and you definitely need to make the right choices all the way. If you don't compete and just lift weights because you love it I would go low to moderate on dosages, time off for the most part and then only on true trt, healthy eating, no recreational drugs, no alcohol (a couple of glasses of wine with your girlfriend is ok once in a while), no pain killers, no diuretics.

I chose to use deca year round. Will it have a negative effect later on in life? Who knows. Will living in a big city full of air pollution reduce life expectancy? Possibly, but millions of people are willing to take the chance. There are endless examples like this, we all have to make a choice in life, there are no quarantees. Just make sure you are aware of the consequences before you make the choice.

Bringing out the worst case scenarios like many pros who have had health issues is understandable as a warning but if anybody really wants to make the choices they did they should be educated enough to know the risks. You can refer to Matarazzo, I refer to Stallone. One unfortunately died, the other is still going strong in his sixties. They both use(d) AAS but with different approaches. Choose wisely! People need to educate themselves and make the right choice for themselves.

[Christo]

This may be the orthopaedic surgeon in me talking, but there has got to be a better way to manage joint discomfort than long-term deca use...

And Deca as HRT?  Seriously?

Also, responses that imply things like "I've done this for years and haven't had any problems with it"...or "I've done this or that without any issues"  are great and obviously the person's individual experience (which does count for something, for sure), but none of us have a problem with something until we have...a problem with it.  I would be wary of these types of responses.  Also, one individual's experience can be very different than another's.

You also didn't say how old you are.  Deca will shut you down just like any other AAS will. I agree that it does help with joint pain (diffuse wear-and-tear pain and inflammation, not true joint pathology like a rotator cuff tear), as I can attest for my own use of it.  But are you ready to tip yourself into long-term endogenous suppression?  Most of us are not pro bodybuilders, and don't make our living from this sport.  If you want to continue bodybuilding through your later years, you have to be smarter about AAS use.  There will be a price to pay at some point.  Don't think that anyone is going to abuse this stuff for years and years without scheduled breaks and not pay a price at some point.  It's just a matter of time.

One of my favorite training motivation videos on YouTube is called "30 years as a lion or 70 years as a lamb."  If you haven't seen it check it out.  It will pump you up for sure.  This concept that (we) are willing to die for this sport is often stated.  But in my experience, most lifters who say this type of thing somehow get the idea that they will just drop dead suddenly and instantly and painlessly some day, preferably in the gym, preferably monstrously huge (my favorite local hero from back in the day was a guy named Vinny Conzo from Staten Island who carved the phrase "Bury Me Massive" into his lifting belt--he was the biggest human I had ever seen up to that point[early 1980's]).  But that isn't the collective experience--it's usually years of debilitating illness, dying slowly as you watch your physique absolutely disappear.  All those years of training down the drain.  And you WILL regret it.  Bodybuilders make horrible patients, because they can't bear the thought of not training.  Mike Matarazzo is a fantastic example of this.  You should see his videos, where he speaks openly about how AAS destroyed his life, his family, his health.  And that monster died small...and horribly...and painfully slow.  And so did Vinny Conzo...

Sorry for the rant.    

Be Safe.  Be Smart.

Are you really an orthopedic surgeon?

[Christo]

This may be the orthopaedic surgeon in me talking, but there has got to be a better way to manage joint discomfort than long-term deca use...

And Deca as HRT?  Seriously?

Also, responses that imply things like "I've done this for years and haven't had any problems with it"...or "I've done this or that without any issues"  are great and obviously the person's individual experience (which does count for something, for sure), but none of us have a problem with something until we have...a problem with it.  I would be wary of these types of responses.  Also, one individual's experience can be very different than another's.

You also didn't say how old you are.  Deca will shut you down just like any other AAS will. I agree that it does help with joint pain (diffuse wear-and-tear pain and inflammation, not true joint pathology like a rotator cuff tear), as I can attest for my own use of it.  But are you ready to tip yourself into long-term endogenous suppression?  Most of us are not pro bodybuilders, and don't make our living from this sport.  If you want to continue bodybuilding through your later years, you have to be smarter about AAS use.  There will be a price to pay at some point.  Don't think that anyone is going to abuse this stuff for years and years without scheduled breaks and not pay a price at some point.  It's just a matter of time.

One of my favorite training motivation videos on YouTube is called "30 years as a lion or 70 years as a lamb."  If you haven't seen it check it out.  It will pump you up for sure.  This concept that (we) are willing to die for this sport is often stated.  But in my experience, most lifters who say this type of thing somehow get the idea that they will just drop dead suddenly and instantly and painlessly some day, preferably in the gym, preferably monstrously huge (my favorite local hero from back in the day was a guy named Vinny Conzo from Staten Island who carved the phrase "Bury Me Massive" into his lifting belt--he was the biggest human I had ever seen up to that point[early 1980's]).  But that isn't the collective experience--it's usually years of debilitating illness, dying slowly as you watch your physique absolutely disappear.  All those years of training down the drain.  And you WILL regret it.  Bodybuilders make horrible patients, because they can't bear the thought of not training.  Mike Matarazzo is a fantastic example of this.  You should see his videos, where he speaks openly about how AAS destroyed his life, his family, his health.  And that monster died small...and horribly...and painfully slow.  And so did Vinny Conzo...

Sorry for the rant.    

Be Safe.  Be Smart.

I agree but what is smart AAS use? can you give me an example?

[Christo]

This may be the orthopaedic surgeon in me talking, but there has got to be a better way to manage joint discomfort than long-term deca use...

And Deca as HRT?  Seriously?

Also, responses that imply things like "I've done this for years and haven't had any problems with it"...or "I've done this or that without any issues"  are great and obviously the person's individual experience (which does count for something, for sure), but none of us have a problem with something until we have...a problem with it.  I would be wary of these types of responses.  Also, one individual's experience can be very different than another's.

You also didn't say how old you are.  Deca will shut you down just like any other AAS will. I agree that it does help with joint pain (diffuse wear-and-tear pain and inflammation, not true joint pathology like a rotator cuff tear), as I can attest for my own use of it.  But are you ready to tip yourself into long-term endogenous suppression?  Most of us are not pro bodybuilders, and don't make our living from this sport.  If you want to continue bodybuilding through your later years, you have to be smarter about AAS use.  There will be a price to pay at some point.  Don't think that anyone is going to abuse this stuff for years and years without scheduled breaks and not pay a price at some point.  It's just a matter of time.

One of my favorite training motivation videos on YouTube is called "30 years as a lion or 70 years as a lamb."  If you haven't seen it check it out.  It will pump you up for sure.  This concept that (we) are willing to die for this sport is often stated.  But in my experience, most lifters who say this type of thing somehow get the idea that they will just drop dead suddenly and instantly and painlessly some day, preferably in the gym, preferably monstrously huge (my favorite local hero from back in the day was a guy named Vinny Conzo from Staten Island who carved the phrase "Bury Me Massive" into his lifting belt--he was the biggest human I had ever seen up to that point[early 1980's]).  But that isn't the collective experience--it's usually years of debilitating illness, dying slowly as you watch your physique absolutely disappear.  All those years of training down the drain.  And you WILL regret it.  Bodybuilders make horrible patients, because they can't bear the thought of not training.  Mike Matarazzo is a fantastic example of this.  You should see his videos, where he speaks openly about how AAS destroyed his life, his family, his health.  And that monster died small...and horribly...and painfully slow.  And so did Vinny Conzo...

Sorry for the rant.    

Be Safe.  Be Smart.

lot People suffer and dies young without using AAS

[freakfestMD]

Personally, I am 48 and have used for 17 years, the last 12 or so non stop. I can only speak for myself but I made educated decisions from the start. I educated myself for 6 months before I took the plunge and knew where my personal limits were and I was prepared to go on trt for the rest of my life, no way I was going to deteriorate like many older men. I set a limit to what risks I was willing to take. The choice was easy and I never looked back.

I do agree with your (freakfestMD) warning that this should not be taken lightly and you definitely need to make the right choices all the way. If you don't compete and just lift weights because you love it I would go low to moderate on dosages, time off for the most part and then only on true trt, healthy eating, no recreational drugs, no alcohol (a couple of glasses of wine with your girlfriend is ok once in a while), no pain killers, no diuretics.

I chose to use deca year round. Will it have a negative effect later on in life? Who knows. Will living in a big city full of air pollution reduce life expectancy? Possibly, but millions of people are willing to take the chance. There are endless examples like this, we all have to make a choice in life, there are no quarantees. Just make sure you are aware of the consequences before you make the choice.

Bringing out the worst case scenarios like many pros who have had health issues is understandable as a warning but if anybody really wants to make the choices they did they should be educated enough to know the risks. You can refer to Matarazzo, I refer to Stallone. One unfortunately died, the other is still going strong in his sixties. They both use(d) AAS but with different approaches. Choose wisely! People need to educate themselves and make the right choice for themselves.

Well said

[freakfestMD]

Are you really an orthopedic surgeon?

I am.

Of course, I learned nothing about AAS in my formal medical training.  Certainly not directly, as there really is no legitimate reason to prescribe them (I am not talking about the field of anti-aging, however, which didn't really exist when I was in school[1987-1991]).  I learned a lot about endocrinology, however, and things like the HPTA, which certainly served me well as a background for my own education into the dark side.

I am 52 years old, and have been lifting consistently since I was about 13 years old.  I trained as a bodybuilder and powerlifter, always recreational, and loved, and still love, every aspect of it.  I did my first cycle at age 24, and have intermittently used ever since.  I had some forced breaks for periods of time (some very extended) due to life/situational circumstances, but for the most part, have stayed with a "6 month on/6 month off" mentality for many years when on.

I went on TRT 2 years ago (400mg test cypionate per week) as a personal choice even though my blood levels were normal for age, but still do 6 month on/6 month off anabolic cycles.

I keep my dosages reasonable, with some occasional "monster cycles" thrown in (I'm on one now--it's posted on another thread).  I get blood work right before and right after every cycle.  I check my blood pressure almost daily when on.  I practice meticulously sterile technique when injecting.  I don't smoke or drink alcohol other than an occasional small glass of cabernet (4-6 oz. at best), eat very clean with an essentially zero sugar diet, never take recreational drugs and will NEVER do insulin.

I was a consistent member of getbig from about 2004-2011.  You can look up my old posts.  There's a lot of information in there, and there really was a great mentality to the board during those years.  This truly was the "go to" forum for many gear heads, and the environment fostered a lot of well-researched information, PubMed article reviews and personal experience.  I would love to see this board restore itself to that level of information and camaraderie.  

All my best,

freak

[Christo]

I am.

Of course, I learned nothing about AAS in my formal medical training.  Certainly not directly, as there really is no legitimate reason to prescribe them (I am not talking about the field of anti-aging, however, which didn't really exist when I was in school[1987-1991]).  I learned a lot about endocrinology, however, and things like the HPTA, which certainly served me well as a background for my own education into the dark side.

I am 52 years old, and have been lifting consistently since I was about 13 years old.  I trained as a bodybuilder and powerlifter, always recreational, and loved, and still love, every aspect of it.  I did my first cycle at age 24, and have intermittently used ever since.  I had some forced breaks for periods of time (some very extended) due to life/situational circumstances, but for the most part, have stayed with a "6 month on/6 month off" mentality for many years when on.

I went on TRT 2 years ago (400mg test cypionate per week) as a personal choice even though my blood levels were normal for age, but still do 6 month on/6 month off anabolic cycles.

I keep my dosages reasonable, with some occasional "monster cycles" thrown in (I'm on one now--it's posted on another thread).  I get blood work right before and right after every cycle.  I check my blood pressure almost daily when on.  I practice meticulously sterile technique when injecting.  I don't smoke or drink alcohol other than an occasional small glass of cabernet (4-6 oz. at best), eat very clean with an essentially zero sugar diet, never take recreational drugs and will NEVER do insulin.

I was a consistent member of getbig from about 2004-2011.  You can look up my old posts.  There's a lot of information in there, and there really was a great mentality to the board during those years.  This truly was the "go to" forum for many gear heads, and the environment fostered a lot of well-researched information, PubMed article reviews and personal experience.  I would love to see this board restore itself to that level of information and camaraderie.  

All my best,

freak

Hi Freak,

Thanks for your comments. A lot of respect and wisdom!
I have a few comments/ questions. (sorry for my bad english)

-However; Are you not afraid to dy young or suffer one day, due to your (continuously) anabolic use? (the so called "payday" you mentioned earlier in your post above)

-Are you using also HGH?

- Are you still working as a medic surgeon?

-At a certain age > 40 years. your body needs more time to recover than in your 20 years age after an AAS cycle. Without doing TRT, do you not thing Test500 plus Deca 300 is too much for me? (HPTA suppression, More chance getting Cancer, Heart attacks etc and specially prostate enlargement!)
-
-Is it not better in my case, to lower the test to 250 plus add an androgeen like Primo or Masteron instead of Deca?
I am 45 years old.

Sorry for disturbing you.


Thanks Freak and wish you all the best.

[ESFitness]

I am.

Of course, I learned nothing about AAS in my formal medical training.  Certainly not directly, as there really is no legitimate reason to prescribe them (I am not talking about the field of anti-aging, however, which didn't really exist when I was in school[1987-1991]).  I learned a lot about endocrinology, however, and things like the HPTA, which certainly served me well as a background for my own education into the dark side.

I am 52 years old, and have been lifting consistently since I was about 13 years old.  I trained as a bodybuilder and powerlifter, always recreational, and loved, and still love, every aspect of it.  I did my first cycle at age 24, and have intermittently used ever since.  I had some forced breaks for periods of time (some very extended) due to life/situational circumstances, but for the most part, have stayed with a "6 month on/6 month off" mentality for many years when on.

I went on TRT 2 years ago (400mg test cypionate per week) as a personal choice even though my blood levels were normal for age, but still do 6 month on/6 month off anabolic cycles.

I keep my dosages reasonable, with some occasional "monster cycles" thrown in (I'm on one now--it's posted on another thread).  I get blood work right before and right after every cycle.  I check my blood pressure almost daily when on.  I practice meticulously sterile technique when injecting.  I don't smoke or drink alcohol other than an occasional small glass of cabernet (4-6 oz. at best), eat very clean with an essentially zero sugar diet, never take recreational drugs and will NEVER do insulin.

I was a consistent member of getbig from about 2004-2011.  You can look up my old posts.  There's a lot of information in there, and there really was a great mentality to the board during those years.  This truly was the "go to" forum for many gear heads, and the environment fostered a lot of well-researched information, PubMed article reviews and personal experience.  I would love to see this board restore itself to that level of information and camaraderie.  

All my best,

freak

400/week isnt trt. Thats about 4x what actual "trt" is. Your bloodwork should probably show total test >3000. "Normal" test levels are typically 350-900 or as high as 1200. Anything below 400 or surely 350 qualifies for trt. Being said, 350-900 doesnt mean "optimal", but 3000 isnt a "replacement" dose. More like a maintence dose.

Far as the op goes, id never use anything without using test as well. Not anavar or primo and especially not deca (or tren).

Youd be better off using test and gh year round if joint pain is a concern... And aromasin at at least 10mg per day. Arimidex can have my knees and elbows creeking while aromasin does not.

[freakfestMD]

400/week isnt trt. Thats about 4x what actual "trt" is. Your bloodwork should probably show total test >3000. "Normal" test levels are typically 350-900 or as high as 1200. Anything below 400 or surely 350 qualifies for trt. Being said, 350-900 doesnt mean "optimal", but 3000 isnt a "replacement" dose. More like a maintence dose.

You are correct.  I was surprised that I was able to convince the doc to write scripts for doses at that range, but at the time I went, I had been off all AAS for about 5 years, and my initial plan was to use about 200mg per week but then save up the leftovers to run a small cycle with it (there's a "back story" here that isn't relevant to this thread, but involved my wife discovering my previous use and flipping out--hence the 5 years off). My levels were in the 500 range when I went to see the doc (I actually expected to be quite a bit lower than that, give my extensive AAS history, and how I was feeling overall).

I started cycling again last year, however, and will keep at 200mg per week between cycles. 

[freakfestMD]

Hi Freak,

Thanks for your comments. A lot of respect and wisdom!
I have a few comments/ questions. (sorry for my bad english)

-However; Are you not afraid to dy young or suffer one day, due to your (continuously) anabolic use? (the so called "payday" you mentioned earlier in your post above)

-Are you using also HGH?

- Are you still working as a medic surgeon?

-At a certain age > 40 years. your body needs more time to recover than in your 20 years age after an AAS cycle. Without doing TRT, do you not thing Test500 plus Deca 300 is too much for me? (HPTA suppression, More chance getting Cancer, Heart attacks etc and specially prostate enlargement!)
-
-Is it not better in my case, to lower the test to 250 plus add an androgeen like Primo or Masteron instead of Deca?
I am 45 years old.

Sorry for disturbing you.


Thanks Freak and wish you all the best.

-My pleasure.

-Yes, I do have concerns about my health, and that is why I regularly check my blood pressure and lab values. I do think that is very important.  It's one thing to say that you have never experienced a problem using this or that, but you don't know for sure if you aren't checking.  I got to a point, however, after being off for many years, where I just didn't feel like myself any more.  Yes it's egoic and yes it's not important to anyone in my life but me, but I have always felt that my personality was defined in part by my large size.  I realize that it is an illness in-and-of-itself, but that's just how it is for me.  Plus I absolutely love the whole thing--the clean diet, the training, the way I feel when I'm jacked...  Sure, at 52 years of age I'm not training at the level I did when I was younger, and it's been a long time since I've seen the bar bending while I'm benching.  I go more for high volume training now, low to moderate weights to true failure, almost no rest in between sets.  Some times I'll do an entire giant set to a single song from start to finish (Five Finger Death Punch, typically ).  

-I haven't used GH.  Not at all against it, and certainly a possibility in the future.  Just expensive.

-I am a very busy surgeon at a very famous hospital, at what I would call the pinnacle of my career.  

-Yes, you will need more time to recover.  Any cycle is going to shut you down for a period of time, and it won't depend on whether you did 200 mg of this or 500 mg of that.  Remember, I am never offering medical advice here.  I am giving comments based on what the poster asks, and what I would do if I were that person.  

What you really should do is ask yourself what you wish to accomplish:  
What do I expect to get out of doing a cycle now, at this age?
Am I willing to go through a post cycle period where I may not feel as good as I do right now?
Am I planning on doing more cycles in the future, or am I not sure right now?
How is my diet and training right now (honestly)?
Could I achieve what I want simply by improving those things, and skip AAS altogether?

Only you can answer these questions.

freak

 

[theworm]

-My pleasure.

-Yes, I do have concerns about my health, and that is why I regularly check my blood pressure and lab values. I do think that is very important.  It's one thing to say that you have never experienced a problem using this or that, but you don't know for sure if you aren't checking.  I got to a point, however, after being off for many years, where I just didn't feel like myself any more.  Yes it's egoic and yes it's not important to anyone in my life but me, but I have always felt that my personality was defined in part by my large size.  I realize that it is an illness in-and-of-itself, but that's just how it is for me.  Plus I absolutely love the whole thing--the clean diet, the training, the way I feel when I'm jacked...  Sure, at 52 years of age I'm not training at the level I did when I was younger, and it's been a long time since I've seen the bar bending while I'm benching.  I go more for high volume training now, low to moderate weights to true failure, almost no rest in between sets.  Some times I'll do an entire giant set to a single song from start to finish (Five Finger Death Punch, typically ).  

-I haven't used GH.  Not at all against it, and certainly a possibility in the future.  Just expensive.

-I am a very busy surgeon at a very famous hospital, at what I would call the pinnacle of my career.  

-Yes, you will need more time to recover.  Any cycle is going to shut you down for a period of time, and it won't depend on whether you did 200 mg of this or 500 mg of that.  Remember, I am never offering medical advice here.  I am giving comments based on what the poster asks, and what I would do if I were that person.  

What you really should do is ask yourself what you wish to accomplish:  
What do I expect to get out of doing a cycle now, at this age?
Am I willing to go through a post cycle period where I may not feel as good as I do right now?
Am I planning on doing more cycles in the future, or am I not sure right now?
How is my diet and training right now (honestly)?
Could I achieve what I want simply by improving those things, and skip AAS altogether?

Only you can answer these questions.

freak

 

You check ur PMs?   

I'm in the same boat, wife was kept in the dark etc.   I used a pharmacy that accidentally sent to my home and she intercepted it.  Busted, almost divorce level.
Stopped everything and 4-5 months after last cycle my total test was 17.  Was depressed and tired as shit!  Saw a hrt clinic and he started me on 200 mg twice a week!  Lol.   Loved it but realized this wasn't in my best interest in terms of health.  Saw an endo and she has me on about 75mg a week and I feel and look amazing!  Can't believe how you can still grow and look good on such a low dose. 

Thanks for ur input freak!

[Christo]

-My pleasure.

-Yes, I do have concerns about my health, and that is why I regularly check my blood pressure and lab values. I do think that is very important.  It's one thing to say that you have never experienced a problem using this or that, but you don't know for sure if you aren't checking.  I got to a point, however, after being off for many years, where I just didn't feel like myself any more.  Yes it's egoic and yes it's not important to anyone in my life but me, but I have always felt that my personality was defined in part by my large size.  I realize that it is an illness in-and-of-itself, but that's just how it is for me.  Plus I absolutely love the whole thing--the clean diet, the training, the way I feel when I'm jacked...  Sure, at 52 years of age I'm not training at the level I did when I was younger, and it's been a long time since I've seen the bar bending while I'm benching.  I go more for high volume training now, low to moderate weights to true failure, almost no rest in between sets.  Some times I'll do an entire giant set to a single song from start to finish (Five Finger Death Punch, typically ).  

-I haven't used GH.  Not at all against it, and certainly a possibility in the future.  Just expensive.

-I am a very busy surgeon at a very famous hospital, at what I would call the pinnacle of my career.  

-Yes, you will need more time to recover.  Any cycle is going to shut you down for a period of time, and it won't depend on whether you did 200 mg of this or 500 mg of that.  Remember, I am never offering medical advice here.  I am giving comments based on what the poster asks, and what I would do if I were that person.  

What you really should do is ask yourself what you wish to accomplish:  
What do I expect to get out of doing a cycle now, at this age?
Am I willing to go through a post cycle period where I may not feel as good as I do right now?
Am I planning on doing more cycles in the future, or am I not sure right now?
How is my diet and training right now (honestly)?
Could I achieve what I want simply by improving those things, and skip AAS altogether?

Only you can answer these questions.

freak

 

Thanks for your input and good luck.

[Christo]

This may be the orthopaedic surgeon in me talking, but there has got to be a better way to manage joint discomfort than long-term deca use...

And Deca as HRT?  Seriously?

Also, responses that imply things like "I've done this for years and haven't had any problems with it"...or "I've done this or that without any issues"  are great and obviously the person's individual experience (which does count for something, for sure), but none of us have a problem with something until we have...a problem with it.  I would be wary of these types of responses.  Also, one individual's experience can be very different than another's.

You also didn't say how old you are.  Deca will shut you down just like any other AAS will. I agree that it does help with joint pain (diffuse wear-and-tear pain and inflammation, not true joint pathology like a rotator cuff tear), as I can attest for my own use of it.  But are you ready to tip yourself into long-term endogenous suppression?  Most of us are not pro bodybuilders, and don't make our living from this sport.  If you want to continue bodybuilding through your later years, you have to be smarter about AAS use.  There will be a price to pay at some point.  Don't think that anyone is going to abuse this stuff for years and years without scheduled breaks and not pay a price at some point.  It's just a matter of time.

One of my favorite training motivation videos on YouTube is called "30 years as a lion or 70 years as a lamb."  If you haven't seen it check it out.  It will pump you up for sure.  This concept that (we) are willing to die for this sport is often stated.  But in my experience, most lifters who say this type of thing somehow get the idea that they will just drop dead suddenly and instantly and painlessly some day, preferably in the gym, preferably monstrously huge (my favorite local hero from back in the day was a guy named Vinny Conzo from Staten Island who carved the phrase "Bury Me Massive" into his lifting belt--he was the biggest human I had ever seen up to that point[early 1980's]).  But that isn't the collective experience--it's usually years of debilitating illness, dying slowly as you watch your physique absolutely disappear.  All those years of training down the drain.  And you WILL regret it.  Bodybuilders make horrible patients, because they can't bear the thought of not training.  Mike Matarazzo is a fantastic example of this.  You should see his videos, where he speaks openly about how AAS destroyed his life, his family, his health.  And that monster died small...and horribly...and painfully slow.  And so did Vinny Conzo...

Sorry for the rant.    

Be Safe.  Be Smart.

Which deca dose is ok for you regarding schoulder/joint pain?

8 weeks 100 mg deca per week? combined with TestE 250?

[freakfestMD]

I've never run less than 600mg per week so I can't comment on lower doses.  It does help mitigate shoulder pain (and other over all joint pain from wear and tear).  If you have true pathology, like a chronic rotator cuff tear, it will not help much with that. The effect is likely anti-inflammatory.

There have been some studies that have showed improved as well as delayed rotator cuff healing when using deca in the postop period after cuff repair.  Nandrolone, specifically, has been found to prevent the fatty infiltration and reduced functional muscle impairment caused by rotator cuff retraction in a rabbit rotator cuff model.  It only seems to work if used immediately after the tear occurs (acutely), but not in chronic tears.  Interestingly, in one study nandrolone treated animals also had a significantly higher postop infection rate.  (Gerber et al, JBJS Am 2011, 93;2189-95.).

If you truly want to use it only for the joint effect, starting at lower dosages makes sense.  I would start around 100mg-200mg per week and see how it goes.