"Experts" say everyone is on the same amount of gear

[controldenied33]

5-10% my arse.

I lifted for nine years without touching gear and I made some decent gains but when I went "on" I added about 50% to my lifts and my lean weight increased by 25lbs. I will never be a pro and I was hardly taking anything but some of these pros are taking four or five times as much as I ever did - the bottom line if you want to talk percentages, gear gives you an edge of about 40-50% over a natural trainer if not more.

What was your lean weight before juicing?

[LuciusFox]

As much as 5%??!
I would say that it`s hardly more than a couple of % for most IFBB pros

 You're right, for some pros, even that is an exaggeration. I know of one pro who only uses 100mg of test the last week before a contest.

[tom joad]

remember how small Coleman was when he started out - was the freakish size increase due to training or did he finally find the right cocktail?

Ronnie's freakish size is the result of his mastery of the mind-muscle connection.

[LuciusFox]

So spending 15k on gear/gh for contest prep is just a finishing touch?

Interesting.

 

 Some people spend that much and more on an addition to a house, because it is an important finishing touch.

[LuciusFox]

5-10%?  Put down Cormier's crack pipe!

I'd say at least 50%.  I base this on the following: After a decade of training more or less naturally, I weigh 210 at 8-10% bf.  If I were at similar bodyfat levels before I started lifting (I wasn't), I would have weighed 155-160 or so. Juiced-to-the-gills pro bodybuilders my height compete around 250-260.  So, i've gained 50 lbs or so at my natural limit, and pro's weigh 50 lbs more.  You do the math.

 Juiced to the gills pros use more than just steroids, though, and they have superior genetics. Ronnie Coleman was 220 before touching steroids and Tom Prince was 230. Lee Priest was already huge as a teenager. Not to mention that these guys usually train harder than the average person. If you gained another 50 pounds, you would be gaining 24%, but you wouln't be able to gain that much from steroids, because they are mostly a finishing touch.  Like the last brushstroke on a painting.

[MisterMagoo]

You're right, for some pros, even that is an exaggeration. I know of one pro who only uses 100mg of test the last week before a contest.

unsurprisingly, if you told us who it was no one would know who it is. anyone who saw the chad vs milos thread on mayhem a while back knows that these guys are practically built on chemicals.

[Overload]

You're right, for some pros, even that is an exaggeration. I know of one pro who only uses 100mg of test the last week before a contest.

Hahahahahahaha...good one.

 

[LuciusFox]

unsurprisingly, if you told us who it was no one would know who it is. anyone who saw the chad vs milos thread on mayhem a while back knows that these guys are practically built on chemicals.

 Some of the guys who don't place as well  use miniscule amounts. The guy who uses the 100mg the week before a contest is a Canadian pro.

[LuciusFox]

And what's he at now, 290?

70 lbs is a "Finishing touch" ?


And if you believe that one, I've got a WPI pro card for you.

 Ronnie used alot more than steroids to get bigger. He may also have a better response to steroids than most, allowing him to gain more than the AVERAGE of 5-10%. But I agree, 70 lbs is way more than a finishing touch. Steroids can be used as something different than a finishing touch, but that is the use that Arnold Schwarzenegger and Lee Haney suggest, and they have 15 Mr. Olympia titles between them.

[absent]

I hope you people understand that LuciusFox is a gimmick account, he's making up bullshit left and right.

[LuciusFox]

I hope you people understand that LuciusFox is a gimmick account, he's making up bullshit left and right.

 That's an outrageous claim. I may consider suing you for libel.

[puredrive]

alot of them do have jobs. or they do their "posing" or sell off excess junk. i know of one pro who uses tons of stuff. doesnt really look very good though and he doesnt place well at all. but he is a pro nonetheless. anyway, he supports himself with selling nubain. he sells enough every month that he can afford his condo and his car and his lifestyle.
i have heard of female fitness girls that use about 10,000 a years worth of gear too though. and they are fitness chicks! but still spending the money. i have a friend who was a local competitor. nothing big and ever any qualifier contests. always locals. anyway, he would spend 12 grand leading up to a show so he could come in around 212. he looked ok. but not great. genetics he didnt have.

[mulder]

If gear only gives you an extra 5-10% then why spend thousands of dollars and risk your health taking it? Why not put in 5-10% more effort into your training and diet, save the money and stay healthy? I say 5-10% = bullshit.

[LuciusFox]

If gear only gives you an extra 5-10% then why spend thousands of dollars and risk your health taking it? Why not put in 5-10% more effort into your training and diet, save the money and stay healthy? I say 5-10% = bullshit.

 I am only talking about steroids. People spend so much because it is a great finishing touch, like a deck on a house. They risk their health because winning is important to them.

[tom joad]

I am only talking about steroids. People spend so much because it is a great finishing touch, like a deck on a house. They risk their health because winning is important to them.

you can still have a monster house without a deck, but you can't have a monster physique without roids. 
so even without the deck, your house can still belong in a nice neighborhood; but without the roids, your physique does not belong on a competitive pro stage. 

[tommywishbone]

Tell Jocelyn he needs to up his dose.

[Overload]

Ronnie used alot more than steroids to get bigger. He may also have a better response to steroids than most, allowing him to gain more than the AVERAGE of 5-10%. But I agree, 70 lbs is way more than a finishing touch. Steroids can be used as something different than a finishing touch, but that is the use that Arnold Schwarzenegger and Lee Haney suggest, and they have 15 Mr. Olympia titles between them.

Yeah and arnold built his body with 3 dbol a day and primo before the show...

You should just Log out.

 

[tom joad]

I believe this stack was posted by "O" on the steroid board a year or so ago:

"One pro bodybuilder took all of this stuff.

15 iu's of GH-Year Round.

15 iu's insulin upon waking, 15 more iu's after w/o...six weeks on, four weeks off/repeat.

One gram of test/day-Year round.

200 mg halotestin/day-8 weeks on, 10 weeks off/repeat.

two vials(4 grams) of EQ/week, year Round except during shows.

Trenbolone, 150mg/day(2cc)...all thru contest times...

Not to mention T3, IGF-1 when he can afford it, clen, winny, a-bombs, HCg, nolva, masteron, the list goes on...

Can you believe that? Man, that's a lot of drugs!"

where's the cell-tech nitro-tech stack?   

[bigbalddaddy]

What a f*king retard!!! 5-10%?  I guess that's why Levrone weighs in at about a crisp 195lbs right now since he's "clean" which still probably means he's on 2-4iu of GH and 200 test for "health" reasons!  Lets do the math for the people who can't...

"ON" Offseason weight-275lbs                        Now Normal wieght-195lbs
"ON" Contest Weight-245ish lbs                      Currently is still in shape @ 195lbs

                                ---------29%----------------

275-195=80/275=.29% Comparative off season weight
            
              or

245-195=50/245=.20% Somewhat comparative not to mention he would still loose a little more fat/water to get down to "contest" shape, not underware model status!

So whoever said 5-10% needs to stay out of CT's meth stash and come back down to reality!!!
            

[bigbalddaddy]

You're doing the wrong calculation. 29% of his bodyweight may be due to roids, but that doesn't mean roids are responsible for 29% of his total muscle growth.

To see how much of the gains it is responsible for, you need to divide the difference between roided weight and natural but still bodybuilding at full natural capacity weight by the difference between the roided weight and the weight he would be untrained.

Let's say Kevin's weight was 155 back before he picked up a weight. Now let's say 195 is the weight he can achieve by bodybuilding naturally. And 275 is his weight on roids. His total muscle gain from untrained to roided is 120 lbs (275-155=120). Of that, 80 lbs are due exclusively to roids (275-195=80). 80 lbs due to roids = 66% of the 120 lb. total muscle gain from untrained.

That's a lot more than 29% or 5-10%!

Actually you are correct.  I guess mine was more of a was now deal.  Now that I look at yours, it makes even more sense!  Good one bro!!!

[LuciusFox]

You're doing the wrong calculation. 29% of his bodyweight may be due to roids, but that doesn't mean roids are responsible for 29% of his total muscle growth.

To see how much of the gains it is responsible for, you need to divide the difference between roided weight and natural but still bodybuilding at full natural capacity weight by the difference between the roided weight and the weight he would be untrained.

Let's say Kevin's weight was 155 back before he picked up a weight. Now let's say 195 is the weight he can achieve by bodybuilding naturally. And 275 is his weight on roids. His total muscle gain from untrained to roided is 120 lbs (275-155=120). Of that, 80 lbs are due exclusively to roids (275-195=80). 80 lbs due to roids = 66% of the 120 lb. total muscle gain from untrained.

That's a lot more than 29% or 5-10%!

 His max would be 195 natural? You are just making that up. His genetics are at least as good as Tom Prince's, and he was a lean 230 natural. Add in the fact that pros take more than just steroids, and the 5-10% AVERAGE is reasonable.

[ManBearPig...]

i put on 18 lbs in 10 weeks and my waist went down two inches on test alone.

so much for being natural.

[LuciusFox]

i put on 18 lbs in 10 weeks and my waist went down two inches on test alone.

so much for being natural.

 Sounds like you got great results. Do you have before and after pics?

[absent]

Fuck being natural.
Naturals are lame.

[Johnny Apollo]

These monkeys claiming more food is better are DUMBFUCKS.

More food is NOT better. Better food is better.

Take 2 guys with the same genetics.

Both guys are 200lbs with the same amount of bodyfat..10%.

Both guys are 5'8".

Both guys train 1 hour a day and do the same exercises.

Both burn the same amount of calories.

Guy 1. Eats 6,000 calories a day.

Guy 2.Eats 2,000 calories a day.(Or whenever he is hungry)

Guy 1 will build more muscle than guy 2 right? WRONG. The guy eating excessive amounts of food will NOT put on more muscle. He will put on more weight but it damn sure won't be muscle, it will be fat. When consuming excessive calories the calories that aren't burned get deposited into FAT.

Forcing yourcelf to eat high calories is a sure fire way to become a fatass.

You should WANT to eat the food,You should be hungry. If you aren't that means your body does not need the food. If it does not need the food and it is consumed it will be stored as fat.

Eating more is not the key. Eating BETTER foods when you are hungry is the key.

If you don't have an apetite it means you're doing something wrong. Meaning you probably aren't burning enough calories to begin with.

These Pro's you see eating all of this food..They are doing it BECAUSE THEY ARE HUNGRY. They are using anabolic steroids which makes synthesize more protein and makes you hungry more often.