Author Topic: Barbell Rows (Read 12034 times)

Shinobi · « **on:** April 19, 2006, 05:33:53 AM »

My fellow iron bros.
When doing barbell rows, I have noticed that the heavier I go, the more difficult it becomes for me to "pull" the barbell to my lower chest. I find that when I use heavy weight(which for me is about 70kgs) I can't get the barbell to touch my chest as I would with a lower weight(say 30kgs for eg).In fact my bicep starts to twist/cramp up whenever I try to row with heavy weight.

My question then, is my form sloppy and should I then stick to the lower weights, bearing in mind that I want a bigger back ?

thanks
Shinobi

Always Sore · « **Reply #1 on:** April 19, 2006, 06:00:17 AM »

never and i repeat never sacrifice feeling the weight in the intended muscle just to add more weight to the bar and jerk it around.so many people life for years (back work) moving a ton of weight but not feeling the complete motion and pull from the weight and thats why they see little growth. who cares what the number is at the end you want to feel the movement and cause muscle breakdown in your back not arms and thru eating and sleeping you will see growth. always keep trying to add weight but better to do 10 reps and feel the stress than do 6 reps with sloppy/jerky form with 35 more pounds on the bar.I think if you add a little weight and always try to do one more rep even if your only adding 1/4 a pound per workout it will keep the muscle growing by placing more stress and forcing change.look long term after a year you will have added 25 or more pounds to the bar and even more size to the target muscle.good luck

pumpster · « **Reply #2 on:** April 19, 2006, 06:30:32 AM »

Somewhere in between-do most of the set fairly strictly, then loosen form at the end in order to progress by doing some cheats, partials or rest-pause reps.

Also try other versions of rowing, that I personally find more effective: T-bars, rows while lying face down on a bench, and hammer machine rows, all of which are more isolating and don't tax the lower back as much. Stick with whatever works the back best.

Peaking at 45 !!! · « **Reply #3 on:** April 19, 2006, 04:35:17 PM »

I stopped doing barbell rows years ago, simply because it is such an awkward exercise, and when you do go up in weight, then your form gets all out of wack, plus there is a lot of strain on the lower back----talk about an injury waiting to happen.

So... I instead have been doing one arm dumbell rows, I feel absolutely NO STRAIN on my lower back, and I get results !!!

Rather than resting my arm on a bench, I use no bench at all, and rest my forearm on my lower thigh, and it is comfortable and works just fine (well, this exercise is never comfortable , as you all know it can take the breath out of you after a heavy set).

Typically I use around a 100 lb. dumbell for around 10 reps, and have worked up to a 130 lb. dumbell-----now that may not sound like a lot for some of you, but my form is excellent, I get a much better stretch, so I feel it in the muscle more, I am not constantly fighting my form and balance--and I feel no lower back strain or pressure on the lower back.

Since I use 100 lbs. for one arm, that would mean 200 lbs. on a barbell, but anytime I got up to that kind of weight, my form was terrible, and it was just not good.

I love the one arm dumbell rows, and so does my back !!! good luck

candidate2025 · « **Reply #4 on:** April 19, 2006, 04:47:34 PM »

stop doing barbell rows....unless they are really working fo ryou. ive never found them usefull, and they are exceptionally hard to isolate my back with..also they really fuckin hurt my lower back. just doing machine rows ....different vrieties and grips.....hyperextension s will make up fo anylosss of lower back thickness.

Peaking at 45 !!! · « **Reply #5 on:** April 19, 2006, 04:52:24 PM »

Quote from: candidate2025 on April 19, 2006, 04:47:34 PM

stop doing barbell rows....unless they are really working fo ryou. ive never found them usefull, and they are exceptionally hard to isolate my back with..also they really fuckin hurt my lower back. just doing machine rows ....different vrieties and grips.....hyperextension s will make up fo anylosss of lower back thickness.

I didnt want to sound too harsh about barbell rows in my reply, as they have been one of the key exercises for years and years, but you said it perfectly in your first couple of statements-----I have never found them usefull, hard to isolate, back injury waiting to happen... but I will say, one arm dumbell rows are worth a try !!! Good luck !!!

!@#$% · « **Reply #6 on:** April 19, 2006, 05:54:41 PM »

I used to do this excercise with perfect form but found I could go much heavier when I was lax with form. Mostly I concentrate on lifting as much as I can and don't think about keeping my back parrallel with the floor, sometimes using a 65 degree angle, I also bounce a little. My logic is this:

1. After watching Coleman and Jay Cutler's videos I noticed they use a higher than 45 degree angle. Coleman even bounces a little.

2. In Dr. Hatfield's book, he says that rows are rows it doesn't matter which ones you do they all effect the back the same. When watching people, like Coleman, doing t-bar rows, I noticed they are standing almost straight up.
So why not use a high angle?

3. I believe that you have to do at least one power excercise per major body part, and no other exercise fits better for the back except maybe t-bar rows.

4. One armed rows suck, like all excercises you do one side at a time. It is too hard to concentrate on an excercise for that long. I barely can concentrate on normal excercises.

Just what works for me. My thickness as gone up a lot since I started going heavy on this movement.

pumpster · « **Reply #7 on:** April 19, 2006, 06:13:14 PM »

The angle of the back is completely individual, use whichever angle doesn't stress the back.

One-arm rows, like T-bars, machine rows and face-down bench rows, all isolate the back better, IMO. The *best* way to isolate the back using barbell rows is to rest your head on a pad and keep it there, to eliminate cheating; then it has the same isolation as one-arm dumbbell rows with one arm braced against the bench or leg.

Stick with whatever works-for some, it's rows that use a loose style-if it's hitting the back in good ways, don't worry about strictness. If that doesn't hit the muscles, ensure that the form is kept strict, at least until the last few reps.

Barbell rows are definitely not essential, given that other versions often work better. One-arm rows for example, because of greater strictness and the fact the strain's removed from the lower back, seems to hit the back better, for many.

triple_pickle · « **Reply #8 on:** April 19, 2006, 07:57:58 PM »

Quote from: Shinobi on April 19, 2006, 05:33:53 AM

When doing barbell rows, I have noticed that the heavier I go, the more difficult it becomes for me to "pull" the barbell to my lower chest.

monster observation. r u retarded?

benchthis · « **Reply #9 on:** April 19, 2006, 09:40:35 PM »

just stop lifting before u hurt yourself

newdumbell303 · « **Reply #10 on:** April 19, 2006, 10:27:30 PM »

stop Barbell Rows!?!? Are you serious? this is probably one of the best if not THE best exercise for the Lats. Haney and Yates swear by the exercise, This was also one of Arnolds favorite exercises. Just reading people saying get rid of this exercise and stop doing it is making myself sick.

I'll ALWAYS include bb row in my routine, great exercise.

benchthis · « **Reply #11 on:** April 19, 2006, 11:02:47 PM »

I WAS BEING SARCASTIC THREE THINGS U NEED FOR A GREAT BACK DEADLIFT'S, BARBELL ROWS, PULL UPS

pumpster · « **Reply #12 on:** April 20, 2006, 05:35:52 AM »

Quote

Are you serious? this is probably one of the best if not THE best exercise for the Lats. Haney and Yates swear by the exercise, This was also one of Arnolds favorite exercises.

There are many good exercises for lats; various forms of rows & chins are equally good or better than BB rows. Yates loved the Hammer row version enough that Hammer named one of their machines after him. Yates also loves machine pullovers, IMO the best single lat exercise and better than the free weight version of same.

mesmorph78 · « **Reply #13 on:** April 20, 2006, 09:00:29 AM »

DO barbell rows....
use weight u can manage till..u slowly advance in weight..
not doin an excercise because its hard......
thats pussy..

newdumbell303 · « **Reply #14 on:** April 20, 2006, 10:24:35 AM »

Quote from: mesmorph78 on April 20, 2006, 09:00:29 AM

DO barbell rows....
use weight u can manage till..u slowly advance in weight..
not doin an excercise because its hard......
thats pussy..

exactly, gotta man up. Thats like saying "I dont want to squat cuz its uncomfortable" pffft get the hell out of here

Hedgehog · « **Reply #15 on:** April 20, 2006, 11:55:00 AM »

Quote from: Shinobi on April 19, 2006, 05:33:53 AM

My fellow iron bros.
When doing barbell rows, I have noticed that the heavier I go, the more difficult it becomes for me to "pull" the barbell to my lower chest. I find that when I use heavy weight(which for me is about 70kgs) I can't get the barbell to touch my chest as I would with a lower weight(say 30kgs for eg).In fact my bicep starts to twist/cramp up whenever I try to row with heavy weight.

My question then, is my form sloppy and should I then stick to the lower weights, bearing in mind that I want a bigger back ?

thanks
Shinobi

I suggest sticking with

Deadlifts,rotate on a 3week schedule: 1.regular deadlifts 2.deep deadlifts(standing on a plate or 2) 3.rack deads
DUMBBELL ROWS
Chins, shoulder width

YIP
Zack

JPM · « **Reply #16 on:** April 20, 2006, 02:01:28 PM »

One of the prime exercises for lat/back thickness & width are BB rows. Try curl grips to the lower abs, medium grip to the middle range abs and wide grip to the chest (keeping the elbows out and in line with the shoulders.....also affects the posterior delts very stronger). Might try doing two sets of each in a regular back workout. Can also try DB's with a curl grip, medium & wide. Alternate each side. With doing them together with DB's the focus becomes somewhat lost.

Feel free to cheat on any form of BB rows from time to time. The really strong and massive guy's do. I've been presented with many opportunities to watch some of the top BB'ers & Pro's work the back. Those SLDL-Hi-pull-Row combination BB row's are pretty common in most of the HD gym's in SoCal. I've yet to see many thick, massive back/lats built with doing strict, by the book, BB rows. The Pro's cheat for a reason, it makes them real big, real fast. Try for 4 or 5 fairly good style rep's and than let the looser style begin.

Don't worry that your not "feeling" the lat exercises all the time. The only feeling you want is the feeling when you lat's become big enought to rip out all of your shirts. Now that's a good feeling. Good Luck.

brianX · « **Reply #17 on:** April 20, 2006, 02:46:26 PM »

They're a great exercise, but my lower back can't take the punishment for too long.

newdumbell303 · « **Reply #18 on:** April 20, 2006, 04:21:53 PM »

Quote from: brianX on April 20, 2006, 02:46:26 PM

They're a great exercise, but my lower back can't take the punishment for too long.

then you my friend need to start hitting the deads harder

pumpster · « **Reply #19 on:** April 20, 2006, 04:33:29 PM »

Untrue; some aren't built for some exercises, in which case deads won't help and might even hurt. Better to try different angles for rows, and other exercises. Bottom line's hitting the back, not forcing the issue. No reason at all to stick with a particular exercise if there are better alternatives.

JPM · « **Reply #20 on:** April 20, 2006, 05:17:47 PM »

Might try bending the knee's more and bring the bar closer to the legs when pulling the bar up for row's. Curl grip and medium grip rows to the lower ab's come to mind. When the bar/weight is too far away for the body, when pulling, there will be way too much tension on the lower back. Can also apply this to DL's, bar too far out.Think of a hinge function of the lower back, less stress when the load closest to the pivot point. There are different physics when the bar is held behind and on the neck, as in the GM'ing exercise. May consider adding a few set's of GM'ings to further strenghten the lower back area. Good Luck.

kicker · « **Reply #21 on:** April 20, 2006, 08:20:09 PM »

I've had better results doing dumbbell rows as opposed to a barbell. Working each side in isolation works great and also my low back, which has been an issue, isn't stressed as much.

gtbro1 · « **Reply #22 on:** April 23, 2006, 12:00:20 AM »

Quote from: candidate2025 on April 19, 2006, 04:47:34 PM

stop doing barbell rows....unless they are really working fo ryou. ive never found them usefull, and they are exceptionally hard to isolate my back with..also they really fuckin hurt my lower back. just doing machine rows ....different vrieties and grips.....hyperextension s will make up fo anylosss of lower back thickness.

This comming from a guy with all the wisdom aquired at his ripe old age of 16.

Barbell rows are an excellent exercise if done correctly.Use heavy weight,but not so heavy that you can't feel it in the back.

pumpster · « **Reply #23 on:** April 23, 2006, 04:47:27 AM »

Quote

This comming from a guy with all the wisdom aquired at his ripe old age of 16.

The funny thing is, he's right. Do what works & doesn't cause the wrong kind of pain.

gtbro1 · « **Reply #24 on:** April 23, 2006, 04:53:47 AM »

Quote from: pumpster on April 23, 2006, 04:47:27 AM

The funny thing is, he's right. Do what works & doesn't cause the wrong kind of pain.

If done correctly how could they not work? I know everyone is different but if they are causing the wrong kind of pain I would bet he is either using way too much weight or using poor form...or both.