More proof we’ve been played

[epic is back]

So you believe the entire planet is pretending to be sick and die to participate in grand scheme to  devalue our currency?

Jesus Christ you Trumptards get dumber by the hour

germany isnt prtending. russia isnt pretending. turn off your tv  tv tard

[Tapeworm]

theres inflation and hyperinflation. we are in hyperinflation and theres no turning back from that. financial collapse happened last october. the trillions pumped into the markets is keeping it afloat right now. trillions.  Basically a reset. but you cannot reset a broken system.

you dont purposely want to be in hyperinflation, but theres no way out after the thing collapeses. which it did. which is why the fake covid overaction.

ever wonder why it takes  mass amounts of money to fix a  germ problem?  because it doesnt.

 so in 3-7 years gallon of gas will be 10 bucks, but youll get paid more to offset it.

then everything goes digital, and you never notice you cant stuff thousands of dollars in your wallet to do simple shopping and errands.

Bread doesn't cost $100, then $1000, then a million the next day. What are you looking at to see runaway devaluation?

I could see governments wanting electronic records of all transactions but risking crashing the entire system seems like an awfully big gamble to achieve it, particularly when cashless buying is being voluntary adopted.

[epic is back]

the worlds gdp is at about 140 trillion.

over 90 trillion  trillion has been pumped in just to the USA

do you know how much a trillion is?

is so big we cant even wrap our minds round it.

 in the past you needed debt to create money. in the ratio of 9-1 in this case. This year there is more money created  than there is debt

 meaning,  those issuing the debt didnt have it to issue as there was no debt to even issue it at the usual rate of 9-1.

its now around 20-1 . = crash

to hide this they just created more money but theres not enough debt behind it =hyperinflation.

 its inflation in reverse. once you reach this stage, its not downhill, its no hill. its over

[Mayday]

in the past you needed debt to create money. in the ratio of 9-1 in this case. This year there is more money created  than there is debt.

to hide this they just created more money but theres not enough debt behind it =hyperinflation.

 its inflation in reverse. once you reach this stage, its not downhill, its no hill. its over

Currency printing has been used for thousands of years. It gives immediate inflation.

Debt mechanisms like what we have in place today, are delayed inflation pretty much. The central banks print at a much lower rate and expand debt at a much faster one.

The issue with what we do today is we have exhausted debt. Without expansion of currency, we are unable to monetise the debt so we hit stagflation. Japan has been there for 20yrs already.

Using debt as your major tool for expanding the money supply is why we are fucked. We lasted all of about 40yrs using debt whereas the Romans lasted 1,000yrs using monetisation.

Now, we will switch to QE and this will monetise debt. 

The scam was brainwashing people into thinking inflation is bad. They used debt to get faster growth whilst delaying inflation. However there is always a day when you need to pay the piper.

[Tapeworm]

Lost. What debt? Whose debt to whom?

How about:

Define the situation prior to printing money and issuing checks.

Why did they print money to issue checks?

What will be the result and why?


Those of us who haven't studied economic theory need our hand held on this.

[Mayday]

We use a leveraged system based on hard currency. 100 bucks gets deposited, 10 bucks is held in the vault and 90 is loaned out to people and business. The 90 bucks get deposited and you now have 190 bucks.

Depending on your country, digital money to currency is 30 times leveraged. You deposit 100 bucks in cash and after leverage it reads as 3,000 bucks. This is why shit unfolds so quickly because it's all leveraged and as that leverage unwinds the digital money actually vanishes.

Go back a looong time ago Where you have a hard currency. You deposit 100 bucks. They vault it all and charge a fee. It's still only have 100 bucks. To create more money they had to mine it and smelt it, ie printing money.

Does that help a bit?

[epic is back]

its worse than that. its the concept of "interest" so how do i pay back the money that doesnt exist, with more money that doesnt exist?

best ponzi scheme ever.

you lean on others to get more

[rocket]

Response for what you dumb fucking communist. Is the meme right or not? Do you actually believe (of course you do because you’re clueless) that all 157k deaths are #chinavirus related despite the reports all over the country that the numbers are being skewed?

I’ll be waiting right here, Karl. If I don’t respond right away it’s because capitalism takes me away from dumbshits like you.

H1N1 had 8% of the deaths that are currently attributed to Covid.

Therefore, the numbers need to be skewed/falsified at around an 11:1 ratio for it to be less fatal than H1N1. 

Or in other words, you need at least 11 deaths in 12 to be inaccurately associated with covid (about 91%)

The texas correction modified 225 of around 5500 down (4%ish). 

Instead of believing every half baked info graphic you read that supports what you want it support, actually do the math and maybe think for yourself a little.  It diminishes your point when you post stuff without realising how weak the claims are.    I wouldn't go as far as to say you are a dumbshit, but you sound like a dumbshit because you didn't even bother to check your shit before posting - and even when someone gives you the numbers, you still don't do the math.

[Mayday]

its worse than that. its the concept of "interest" so how do i pay back the money that doesnt exist, with more money that doesnt exist?

best ponzi scheme ever.

you lean on others to get more

Interest is offset by monetisation.

The interest rates used to follow the rate of currency printing until we stretched the debt door wide open and they split. Now we have 5% currency printing but 0% interest (central banks).

You hear people whinge about the 80s when they had 15% interest rates. What they don't tell you is they had 15% currency devaluation which is why the IRs were so high. They also got wage inflation inline with it.  So each year your debt was worth less and you earned more.

[Thin Lizzy]

Lost. What debt? Whose debt to whom?

How about:

Define the situation prior to printing money and issuing checks.

Why did they print money to issue checks?

What will be the result and why?


Those of us who haven't studied economic theory need our hand held on this.

At the end of the day as has been mentioned there is simply too much debt in the system. If we were in that position on an individual level we would just declare bankruptcy. Governments have the option of printing money which is essentially the same thing.

Mayday and Epic have some solid posts but if you want to read up, the subject is Fractional Reserve Banking:



Confusing Capitalism with Fractional Reserve Banking | Mises Institute

https://mises.org/library/confusing-capitalism-fractional-reserve-banking

[Thin Lizzy]

So you believe the entire planet is pretending to be sick and die to participate in grand scheme to  devalue our currency?

Jesus Christ you Trumptards get dumber by the hour

No shithead. The people who are dying were old and sick to begin with and their deaths
are being attributed to COVID. These are the numbers from NYC. The median age is 35.

[Primemuscle]

H1N1 had 8% of the deaths that are currently attributed to Covid.

Therefore, the numbers need to be skewed/falsified at around an 11:1 ratio for it to be less fatal than H1N1. 

Or in other words, you need at least 11 deaths in 12 to be inaccurately associated with covid (about 91%)

The texas correction modified 225 of around 5500 down (4%ish). 

Instead of believing every half baked info graphic you read that supports what you want it support, actually do the math and maybe think for yourself a little.  It diminishes your point when you post stuff without realising how weak the claims are.    I wouldn't go as far as to say you are a dumbshit, but you sound like a dumbshit because you didn't even bother to check your shit before posting - and even when someone gives you the numbers, you still don't do the math.

Some people only see what they want to see. That would be coach.

[Grape Ape]

Some people only see what they want to see.

Spot on.

For example, there are those who were calling the protests in Portland peaceful, despite large destruction of property, and criminal behaviors running rampant.

[ilalin]

Some people only see what they want to see. That would be coach.

Coach is using this board for therapy since he's so short only this and anabolics make him feel somewhat adequate. Little scottie, mental health coach, the rape ape and others here are just poor, educationally challenged rednecks lost in the modern world inevitably knocking on their trailer trash doors.

[Kwon]

Spot on.

For example, there are those who were calling the protests in Portland peaceful, despite large destruction of property, and criminal behaviors running rampant.
[/quote

This.

[Mayday]

No shithead. The people who are dying were old and sick to begin with and their deaths
are being attributed to COVID. These are the numbers from NYC. The median age is 35.

LOL

Agree. The media pushing the young people sick and dying is media sensationalism to sell ads and keep the topic alive.

The oldies are at risk and always have been.

They used bad data initially and made a bad call shutting down the globe. Then they had to fudge the data to bring the numbers up to justify it. Now they fudge the data to try and scare young people to justify why they are losing their jobs and homes.

It's been one enormous fuck up in how it has been handled and they destroyed us financially. (I know we disagree on that point Lizz.

[Flexacon]

Like most things if you stand staunchly on either side of the argument you're being played, so yeah coach you're being played too.

A handful, maybe a dozen of the most densely packed, highly polluted cities globally exciting their winters needed lockdown. The rest of the world could have navigated through it just by taking some sensible preventative measures.

[Agnostic007]

Adjusting for today's population, the Hong Kong flu of 1968 and Asian flu of 1957 (where are these viruses originating?) each killed
nearly 200,000 Americans.  No social media, 24-hour cable news, or authoritarian governors or mayors to foment hysteria back then.

You think maybe if they had, the 200,000 would be less?

[visualizeperfection]

You think maybe if they had, the 200,000 would be less?

You’re still getting your pension?

[Moontrane]

You think maybe if they had, the 200,000 would be less?

I don’t know.  What we did during the past few generations was to suck it up and move on – walk it off. 
Now we’re inflicting great and lasting harm to our society and economy in response to a bug that’s rather
selective about its victims.

Back in March the numbers from Italy told us most (I believe) of what we needed to know: average age
of someone dying from it was 79.5, and only one person under 50 had died.  The takeaway was to protect
at-risk folks.

Here in CA, no one under 18 has died from it, but the governor has ordered schools closed.  Missing the
second half of the school year really hurt my kids. 

Masks, gloves, hand-washing, & social-distancing are all good practices (and will incidentally save many from
the plain ole flu), but the shutdown was unnecessary. 

[Tapeworm]

We use a leveraged system based on hard currency. 100 bucks gets deposited, 10 bucks is held in the vault and 90 is loaned out to people and business. The 90 bucks get deposited and you now have 190 bucks.

Depending on your country, digital money to currency is 30 times leveraged. You deposit 100 bucks in cash and after leverage it reads as 3,000 bucks. This is why shit unfolds so quickly because it's all leveraged and as that leverage unwinds the digital money actually vanishes.

Go back a looong time ago Where you have a hard currency. You deposit 100 bucks. They vault it all and charge a fee. It's still only have 100 bucks. To create more money they had to mine it and smelt it, ie printing money.

Does that help a bit?

Kinda. Seems like fast & loose bookkeeping tho. Whether you leverage 1.9x or 30x (presumably 30 is the integrity limit where you can reasonably expect repayment? Otherwise why not 50x or a million times leverage?), isn't there still a -90 or -3000 on the system's books? So no money got conjured, on aggregate.

That aside, if there's $3000 moving around the economy as a function of the $100 deposit, and there isn't enough actual money to repay the $3000 (and this iterates such that conjured money repays loans on conjured money etc) wouldn't the value of money ultimately be buoyed since its supply is sparse compared to the demand of debt? Instead of a gold standard you've got a debt standard? You and Lizz seem to be saying there's too much debt resulting from the fractional leverage, and the house of cards will topple, but seems like epic says there's not enough debt to offset the devaluation resulting from handing out covid checks?

Anyway, how do the covid payouts relate to a debt leveraged system? Seems like if they physically print money to back each check then the dollar devalues, but if it's deemed to be electronic dollars then it's in the debt column. Is it the case that the economy is backed into a corner where it can't increase debt (the debt exhaustion you mentioned) and it can't afford to weaken its currency?

These are a fool's questions, clearly. If the answer is "just go to the library, man" then fair enough.

Oh, and cui bono? Are the covid checks basically another robbery perpetrated by wall st? My foil hat says they have a harvest about every ten years. Devalue currency, everyone's $100 becomes worth $20, some other investment vehicle inflates in relation to the devaluation, and they ultimately pocket our $80 and adjourn to the private island? Nobody knows they got robbed because they're still holding a Benjamin, even though it won't buy jack shit anymore.

[Mayday]

Kinda.

You are on the right track. I don't want to make this to long so i'll address the leverage bit.

The ceiling becomes the ability to repay and also the ability and/or willingness to take on board liability/risk. This is what determines just how many times something becomes leveraged, hence it is a finite system. There are different ways of looking at it but it might be better if we look at it from our own view.

Lets say Joe after living costs has 3000/mth spare. Joe borrows 300k for a house and spends 2500/mth on his mortgage (leaves 500). He then buys a 40k car for 500mth. With no more available money left, Joe is unable to borrow more because he just hit a ceiling.

I'm being really broad here so bare with me. Leverage was used to create 340k of money (debt) for Joe. This 340k appears in a liability column for Joe as he has to pay it back to the bank. The bank that loaned the money to Joe borrowed it off the Federal reserve and they to have 340k liability on their books which they need to repay to the Fed. The Fed created bonds to sell in order to provide the bank with the money so they too have 340k liability as they need to pay the purchases of the bonds in the future.

As a debt, it is not created currency because it is going to be repaid and therefore vanish at some point. The leveraged money only exists until it is repaid.

So lets say times are tough. In this example lets keep interest out of it. Joe sells his house and car for 340k. He repays the bank. Joe has no money but also no liability. The bank repays the Federal reserve the 340k it borrowed and it now has no money and no liability. The Federal Reserve repays the bond purchasers and they now have no money and no liability. The 340k just vanished and there is no inflation.

[Mayday]

Anyway, how do the covid payouts relate to a debt leveraged system? Seems like if they physically print money to back each check then the dollar devalues, but if it's deemed to be electronic dollars then it's in the debt column. Is it the case that the economy is backed into a corner where it can't increase debt (the debt exhaustion you mentioned) and it can't afford to weaken its currency?

These are a fool's questions, clearly. If the answer is "just go to the library, man" then fair enough.

Oh, and cui bono? Are the covid checks basically another robbery perpetrated by wall st? My foil hat says they have a harvest about every ten years. Devalue currency, everyone's $100 becomes worth $20, some other investment vehicle inflates in relation to the devaluation, and they ultimately pocket our $80 and adjourn to the private island? Nobody knows they got robbed because they're still holding a Benjamin, even though it won't buy jack shit anymore.

Covid cash payments are a bit different as it's Govt policy working with the Federal Reserve and the Treasury. The handouts are a public bailout. This is what you want as the end of the economic food chain (that's us) gets to touch the money first and benefit from it before it flows uphill. Especially as the Govts shut us down and financially ruined us. They should bail us out and it's BS for any Govt to say we are on our own.

As for doing QE to back the policies. There is a lag effect plus in the background it's like someone has pulled the plug from the bath and all the water (liquidity/leverage) is drying up. They are trying to replace what gets lost so right now there is no immediate inflation worry.

Typical that media scare the shit out of everybody about inflation. Would you prefer bread to cost $10 and your house be worth the same or that bread remains at $2 and your house loses $400k?

Interest rates coincide with currency inflation pretty much. If they devalue currency by 15% the interest rates will be 15%. Bread goes up 15%. gold goes up 15% and eventually salaries got up 15% and properties go up 15%. The timing isn't matched up of course but in the end inflation raises the price of everything, even wages.

[epic is back]

you do not know what your talking about. i think if given the chance you would argue with yourself in the mirror, for days

[Mayday]

you do not know what your talking about. i think if given the chance you would argue with yourself in the mirror, for days

Damn, you got me. I wasn't expecting that from someone who doesn't know the meaning of hyperinflation