Author Topic: Marjorie Traitor Greene CAUGHT LYING during hearing with pitch-perfect FACTCHECK  (Read 8639 times)

Andy Griffin

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He is a Democrat and thereby a supporter of pedophilia and the mental, physical, moral and spiritual mutilation of our Nation's Children and more. 

All these assholes that despise Mr. Trump and the Conservatives of our Nation are filthy and supporters of what the Democrats are doing.  Fuque 'em all.

Never forgive and never forget.  Fuck him.

We'll keep fighting the good fight, sir.
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LurkerNoMore

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YAWN. One trick pony. This is like that saying about playing chess with a pigeon.

You didn't really have to offer evidence to prove my statement true.

LurkerNoMore

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You and your side are the ones constantly whining and "peacefully protesting." Your poor kids.  Hopefully one day you can find them shoes which fit their feet and your budget.

A Trumpturd talking about whining?






HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Go sit your ass down with that weak shit.

Andy Griffin

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A Trumpturd talking about whining?






HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Go sit your ass down with that weak shit.

All caps?  Weak ass shit from a weak ass "man"  ::)

~

LurkerNoMore

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All caps?  Weak ass shit from a weak ass "man"  ::)

Awwww is that what you think of Trumpy? 

Still weak, keep sitting.

Andy Griffin

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Awwww is that what you think of Trumpy? 

Still weak, keep sitting.

Weak is how your wife describes your retarded, cucked ass to the black men railing her while you're at work. Clown.
~

Gym Rat

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We know "Wayne Tracker" is StrawBob, the use of "Traitor" he throws around, except when it comes to the real actual traitor, CCP Puppet Pervy-Joe the Pant-Shitter.  8)

Straw-Bob also talked about his dead dads jizz-filled anus. (And being buried ass-up).

LMAO  "traitor"   ::)

Dos Equis

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We know "Wayne Tracker" is StrawBob, the use of "Traitor" he throws around, except when it comes to the real actual traitor, CCP Puppet Pervy-Joe the Pant-Shitter.  8)

Straw-Bob also talked about his dead dads jizz-filled anus. (And being buried ass-up).

LMAO  "traitor"   ::)

straw man aka The Village Idiot is "Wayne Tracker," "Curelato," and whatever other short-lived gimmicks she has created.

Primemuscle

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He is a Democrat and thereby a supporter of pedophilia and the mental, physical, moral and spiritual mutilation of our Nation's Children and more. 

All these assholes that despise Mr. Trump and the Conservatives of our Nation are filthy and supporters of what the Democrats are doing.  Fuque 'em all.

Never forgive and never forget.  Fuck him.

FYI, there is a massive difference between despising a person or people at one end of a spectrum and supporting folks at the other end. Some people forget this, which is one reason people are currently so polarized and angry. There is a whole array of folks whose beliefs and support fall somewhere between the ultra-conservative and ultra-liberal. Ideally, we will eventually find a middle ground.

Fortunately, Getbig is not an good example of how most people in the real world think and act today.

Dos Equis

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If he didn't do it or there was sufficient evidence that he did it, then he would not be in this position.

His due process will reveal - or not - what he is accused of and whether enough evidence says he did.  No due process would mean he would be getting sentenced right away.

That's now how this works.  You don't indict and identify the crime later.  This isn't China or North Korea. 

You know why Bragg didn't identify the underlying crime that he claims makes this a felony?  Because the underlying "crime" isn't a crime at all:

FEC: Trump-Stormy case ‘not a campaign finance violation’
by Paul Bedard, Washington Secrets Columnist |
April 05, 2023

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A key member of the Federal Election Commission today rejected the Manhattan district attorney’s indictment of former President Donald Trump as a violation of federal election laws.

“It's not a campaign finance violation. It's not a reporting violation of any kind,” said FEC Commissioner James E. “Trey” Trainor.

In trying to stretch the law to make it look like a violation, he added, District Attorney Alvin Bragg “is really trying to make a square peg fit into a round hole.”

In a 34-count indictment of Trump, the first criminal case ever against a former president, Bragg charged that a $130,000 payment made by former Trump lawyer Michael Cohen to porn star Stormy Daniels, which Cohen went to jail for in a plea deal, violated several campaign finance laws that splashed onto Trump.

But, said Trainor, the FEC and Justice Department already considered the case and tossed it.

With that as background, Trainor told Secrets today that it will be hard for a judge or jury to come up with a different conclusion since it’s the FEC and DOJ that prosecute federal campaign finance law. He reiterated that in a Tuesday tweet that showed the FEC hearing room, and he wrote, “This is where campaign finance violations are tried.”

Trainor, a Texas-based election lawyer appointed by Trump, listed several reasons why the FEC decided not to take up the payment to Daniels in 2018. He also released a statement, shown below, that he and Commissioner Sean Cooksey wrote in April 2021 explaining why the FEC voted to dismiss the case.

First, he said, Cohen took the blame in his plea deal. “At the end of the day, there's the person who committed the crime, and there's the person who is behind bars because of it,” Trainor said of Cohen.

Second, the paperwork violation in question came well after Trump’s 2016 election, so it couldn’t have been done to help his election.

Third, it is not obvious that the reason for the payment and the reimbursement to Cohen was to influence the election, thus failing the “objective standard” of law. “It has to be something that anybody on the street can look at and say the only reason you did that was to influence the campaign,” said Trainor. “There's a lot of reasons that he could have done it that aren't related to him being a candidate for president, and so therefore, it wouldn't have met the standard as campaign expenditure under federal law,” he added.

Also, the statute of limitations on the case was running out, and it wasn’t worth the time and expense to prosecute, he said.

“I don't know how you get around the evidence that both the Department of Justice in their investigation of the federal campaign finance issues and the Federal Election Commission in their ultimate jurisdiction over campaign finance issues, neither of them found there to be any violations whatsoever, and I think the jury is going to see that and they're going to have to rely upon the fact that both the law enforcement experts and the civil enforcement experts, as far as campaign finance are concerned, didn't find any violation of the law here,” said Trainor.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/washington-secrets/fec-trump-stormy-case-not-a-campaign-finance-violation

Dos Equis

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Who would that be?

The Village Idiot cannot come to the phone right now. 

Primemuscle

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That's now how this works.  You don't indict and identity the crime later.  This isn't China or North Korea. 

You know why Bragg didn't identify the underlying crime that he claims makes this a felony?  Because the underlying "crime" isn't a crime at all:

FEC: Trump-Stormy case ‘not a campaign finance violation’
by Paul Bedard, Washington Secrets Columnist
April 05, 2023



https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/washington-secrets/fec-trump-stormy-case-not-a-campaign-finance-violation

Paul Bedard is entitled to an opinion on this matter. However, Mr. Bedard is not a legal expert or necessarily understands the law.  He has an opinion, nothing more. Much like you, me and others do. Opinions about the strength of Trump’s indictment are extremely varied.


Bedard is a longtime D.C. reporter who joined the Washington Examiner in 2012 after penning U.S. News & World Report's premiere political column, "Washington Whispers."  As part of his "body of work," he has written dozens of pieces advancing the agenda of the National Rifle Association.

The Washington Examiner is a conservative news website and weekly magazine based in Washington, D.C. Founded in 2015 as a newspaper. It is owned by Clarity Media Group. Mr. Bedard opinions are aligned with his employer.

LurkerNoMore

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That's now how this works.  You don't indict and identity the crime later. This isn't China or North Korea. 

You know why Bragg didn't identify the underlying crime that he claims makes this a felony?  Because the underlying "crime" isn't a crime at all:


There is no law that says you can't.  In fact, you can if you want.  Especially if it is a strategic move.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/da-alvin-braggs-one-time-172834605.html

The Manhattan DA was sharply criticized for omitting key details that would justify upgrading the charges from misdemeanors to felonies.

Bragg's approach appears to be a deliberate strategy to choose among four different secondary crimes later on.

A 30-year veteran of the DA's office told Insider that Bragg will lay the specifics out in a so-called "bill of particulars" down the road.


Shortly after the Manhattan district attorney's office unsealed its 34-count felony indictment against former President Donald Trump, questions started pouring in.

To prove that Trump committed felony falsification of business records, as opposed to a misdemeanor, state prosecutors would need to show that he did so in order to commit or cover up a second crime.

And former prosecutors — some of them veterans of the Manhattan DA's office — wondered: why didn't DA Alvin Bragg include any information about a secondary crime in such a high-stakes case?

One 30-year veteran of the DA's office said Bragg's approach, however, is less an omission than a deliberate strategy. It's an approach that Diana Florence, who worked in the DA's office for three decades as a prosecutor focusing on white-collar crime, said was "100 percent the right way to charge this."

"When you have an indictment, anything you put in the indictment, you must prove it," Florence, who ran against Bragg for DA in 2021, told Insider in an interview. She added that so-called "speaking indictments" in cases like Trump's are very rare — they're generally more common in conspiracy and racketeering cases that require a long narrative of alleged criminal acts.

Indeed, when reporters asked Bragg about the underlying crimes at a news conference following Trump's arraignment, the DA said his office chose not to include those details because it wasn't required by law to do so.

"We are not going to go into our deliberative process on what was brought," the DA said. "The charges that were brought were the ones that were brought. The evidence and the law is the basis for those decisions."

Though Bragg didn't include the specifics of Trump's alleged underlying crimes in the charging documents, he laid them out in his post-arraignment news conference.

Trump's alleged scheme — coordinating a $130,000 hush-money payment to the adult film star Stormy Daniels — violated New York state law, "which makes it a crime to conspire to promote a candidacy by unlawful means," Bragg said.

Second, the alleged scheme violated federal election laws because the hush-money payment "exceeded the federal campaign contribution cap," Bragg said.

Third, the DA alleged that Trump also broke New York laws when he and his then-lawyer Michael Cohen worked with the publisher American Media Inc. on a "catch-and-kill" scheme, and AMI falsely characterized payments made as part of the scheme in its accounting books.

The fourth underlying crime alleged by Bragg related to false statements "that were planned to be made to tax authorities."

Bragg elaborated on that alleged underlying falsehood in a statement of facts included as an addendum to the indictment. Cohen had admitted to acting as a bag man for the hush-money payment, wiring his own personal funds to Daniels' lawyer less than two weeks before the 2016 election.

The tax falsehood allegedly arose the following year. That's when Allen Weisselberg, then the Trump Organization's chief bookkeeper, characterized Trump's repayment of the hush money as taxable income for Cohen, instead of as the reimbursement it actually was, Bragg's office alleged in the statement of facts.

Florence told Insider that "these underlying misdemeanors are elements of the crime of falsifying business records in the first degree" — which is what Trump was ultimately charged with — "but the law does not require you to name them."

"Though Bragg doesn't have to name them now, he will down the road," she said. "Now, you can't ride this train forever, right? There's a point where you have to pick a theory" and inform the defense that prosecutors allege that business records were falsified to conceal a specific, underlying tax or election crime, which Bragg said Tuesday that his office will do.

Those will be put on paper when the DA submits to the defense a so-called "bill of particulars," Florence said.


Trump's defense team, for its part, is expected to try to get the case dismissed.

"The indictment itself is boilerplate," Trump lawyer Todd Blanche told reporters after the ex-president's arraignment. "It's really disappointing. It's sad, and we'll fight it."

Legal experts recently told Insider that, based on their public statements and media reporting, Trump's attorneys will likely roll out three key defense strategies: hammering Bragg for not including any underlying crimes in the indictment itself; alleging that Bragg's office is bringing a selective and politically motivated case; and shredding Cohen's credibility as a witness given that he's an admitted felon.

"The prosecution is boxed in at this stage of the game," Ty Cobb, who served as White House special counsel during the Trump administration, told Insider. "They've got the indictment, they have to defend it. They're gonna be totally reactive and the strategic opportunities available to the defense are pretty extreme."

But experts said that, whatever the flaws in the charging document may be, Trump's team likely won't be successful in getting the case dismissed, which means the former president will be headed toward a blockbuster trial.

"I think there's enough there to get the indictment through motions to dismiss," Kevin O'Brien, a former federal prosecutor who specializes in white-collar criminal defense, said of the charges. "The case will go forward."

Dos Equis

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Paul Bedard is entitled to an opinion on this matter. However, Mr. Bedard is not a legal expert or necessarily understands the law.  He has an opinion, nothing more. Much like you, me and others do. Opinions about the strength of Trump’s indictment are extremely varied.


Bedard is a longtime D.C. reporter who joined the Washington Examiner in 2012 after penning U.S. News & World Report's premiere political column, "Washington Whispers."  As part of his "body of work," he has written dozens of pieces advancing the agenda of the National Rifle Association.

The Washington Examiner is a conservative news website and weekly magazine based in Washington, D.C. Founded in 2015 as a newspaper. It is owned by Clarity Media Group. Mr. Bedard opinions are aligned with his employer.

This is an article that quotes and relies on FEC Commissioner James E. “Trey” Trainor.  But you would know that if you climbed out of your bubble and actually read the article. 

Dos Equis

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There is no law that says you can't.  In fact, you can if you want.  Especially if it is a strategic move.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/da-alvin-braggs-one-time-172834605.html

The Manhattan DA was sharply criticized for omitting key details that would justify upgrading the charges from misdemeanors to felonies.

Bragg's approach appears to be a deliberate strategy to choose among four different secondary crimes later on.

A 30-year veteran of the DA's office told Insider that Bragg will lay the specifics out in a so-called "bill of particulars" down the road.


Shortly after the Manhattan district attorney's office unsealed its 34-count felony indictment against former President Donald Trump, questions started pouring in.

To prove that Trump committed felony falsification of business records, as opposed to a misdemeanor, state prosecutors would need to show that he did so in order to commit or cover up a second crime.

And former prosecutors — some of them veterans of the Manhattan DA's office — wondered: why didn't DA Alvin Bragg include any information about a secondary crime in such a high-stakes case?

One 30-year veteran of the DA's office said Bragg's approach, however, is less an omission than a deliberate strategy. It's an approach that Diana Florence, who worked in the DA's office for three decades as a prosecutor focusing on white-collar crime, said was "100 percent the right way to charge this."

"When you have an indictment, anything you put in the indictment, you must prove it," Florence, who ran against Bragg for DA in 2021, told Insider in an interview. She added that so-called "speaking indictments" in cases like Trump's are very rare — they're generally more common in conspiracy and racketeering cases that require a long narrative of alleged criminal acts.

Indeed, when reporters asked Bragg about the underlying crimes at a news conference following Trump's arraignment, the DA said his office chose not to include those details because it wasn't required by law to do so.

"We are not going to go into our deliberative process on what was brought," the DA said. "The charges that were brought were the ones that were brought. The evidence and the law is the basis for those decisions."

Though Bragg didn't include the specifics of Trump's alleged underlying crimes in the charging documents, he laid them out in his post-arraignment news conference.

Trump's alleged scheme — coordinating a $130,000 hush-money payment to the adult film star Stormy Daniels — violated New York state law, "which makes it a crime to conspire to promote a candidacy by unlawful means," Bragg said.

Second, the alleged scheme violated federal election laws because the hush-money payment "exceeded the federal campaign contribution cap," Bragg said.

Third, the DA alleged that Trump also broke New York laws when he and his then-lawyer Michael Cohen worked with the publisher American Media Inc. on a "catch-and-kill" scheme, and AMI falsely characterized payments made as part of the scheme in its accounting books.

The fourth underlying crime alleged by Bragg related to false statements "that were planned to be made to tax authorities."

Bragg elaborated on that alleged underlying falsehood in a statement of facts included as an addendum to the indictment. Cohen had admitted to acting as a bag man for the hush-money payment, wiring his own personal funds to Daniels' lawyer less than two weeks before the 2016 election.

The tax falsehood allegedly arose the following year. That's when Allen Weisselberg, then the Trump Organization's chief bookkeeper, characterized Trump's repayment of the hush money as taxable income for Cohen, instead of as the reimbursement it actually was, Bragg's office alleged in the statement of facts.

Florence told Insider that "these underlying misdemeanors are elements of the crime of falsifying business records in the first degree" — which is what Trump was ultimately charged with — "but the law does not require you to name them."

"Though Bragg doesn't have to name them now, he will down the road," she said. "Now, you can't ride this train forever, right? There's a point where you have to pick a theory" and inform the defense that prosecutors allege that business records were falsified to conceal a specific, underlying tax or election crime, which Bragg said Tuesday that his office will do.

Those will be put on paper when the DA submits to the defense a so-called "bill of particulars," Florence said.


Trump's defense team, for its part, is expected to try to get the case dismissed.

"The indictment itself is boilerplate," Trump lawyer Todd Blanche told reporters after the ex-president's arraignment. "It's really disappointing. It's sad, and we'll fight it."

Legal experts recently told Insider that, based on their public statements and media reporting, Trump's attorneys will likely roll out three key defense strategies: hammering Bragg for not including any underlying crimes in the indictment itself; alleging that Bragg's office is bringing a selective and politically motivated case; and shredding Cohen's credibility as a witness given that he's an admitted felon.

"The prosecution is boxed in at this stage of the game," Ty Cobb, who served as White House special counsel during the Trump administration, told Insider. "They've got the indictment, they have to defend it. They're gonna be totally reactive and the strategic opportunities available to the defense are pretty extreme."

But experts said that, whatever the flaws in the charging document may be, Trump's team likely won't be successful in getting the case dismissed, which means the former president will be headed toward a blockbuster trial.

"I think there's enough there to get the indictment through motions to dismiss," Kevin O'Brien, a former federal prosecutor who specializes in white-collar criminal defense, said of the charges. "The case will go forward."

Yeah that's what Bragg said:  he didn't identify the underlying crime because New York law didn't require it.  That's BS and blatantly unconstitutional.  And I've just shown why he didn't identify the underlying crime (because it's not a crime). 

But as the last seven years have shown, you liberals don't care about due process, the Constitution, fundamental fairness, individual liberty, etc., so long as we are targeting your political enemies.  This use of law enforcement and the criminal courts as a political weapon will not end well for the country. 

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Yeah that's what Bragg said:  he didn't identify the underlying crime because New York law didn't require it.  That's BS and blatantly unconstitutional.  And I've just shown why he didn't identify the underlying crime (because it's not a crime). 

But as the last seven years have shown, you liberals don't care about due process, the Constitution, fundamental fairness, individual liberty, etc., so long as we are targeting your political enemies.  This use of law enforcement and the criminal courts as a political weapon will not end well for the country.

He didn't have to.  It is not required of him at this point.  Kind of hard to be unconstitutional when it isn't required.  Your opinion of it being BS does not make it unconstitutional anywhere else other than your own mind.  If the judge feels the same way, he will toss it out.

Gym Rat

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 14414
  • Hail, Hail, Hail & Kill!
Wayne "The Packer" Tracker (AKA Straw-Bob) visits the cemetery, where he dumps his dummy all over the grave of his dead dad who is anus-up...
Knuckle-shuffling to the oldies.

chaos

  • Getbig V
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  • Posts: 59389
  • Ron "There is no freedom of speech here" Avidan
That's now how this works.  You don't indict and identify the crime later.  This isn't China or North Korea. 

This is exactly what they want,
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

Andy Griffin

  • Getbig V
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  • Posts: 6645
  • I know my own name, bitch.
FYI, there is a massive difference between despising a person or people at one end of a spectrum and supporting folks at the other end. Some people forget this, which is one reason people are currently so polarized and angry. There is a whole array of folks whose beliefs and support fall somewhere between the ultra-conservative and ultra-liberal. Ideally, we will eventually find a middle ground.

Fortunately, Getbig is not an good example of how most people in the real world think and act today.

So we should be "civil" ?   Hardly...since that gorilla faced kvnt in Congress told people on the left to aggressively get in the face of those with whom they disagree and to give no peace, and "peaceful protesters" are never punished for their crimes...all bets are off. 

Which is fine...our side, who will not allow bureaucrats to disarm us,  against your side, most of whom don't know which bathroom to use.

Fuck off and die, soggy assed old queen.
~

LurkerNoMore

  • Getbig V
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  • Posts: 33595
  • Dumb people think Trump is smart.
This is exactly what they want,

No.  This is America and it isn't required at this point.  YOUR opinion doesn't get to determine how Bragg runs his case. 

Wayne Tracker.

  • Getbig II
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  • Lurker and I - Team Biden
No.  This is America and it isn't required at this point.  YOUR opinion doesn't get to determine how Bragg runs his case.

Yes the Sorros backed DA and his not knowing actual case law does not matter, what matters is you and I supporting a genderless society, YAY team Gay Lurker and Tracker !!

LurkerNoMore

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 33595
  • Dumb people think Trump is smart.
Yes the Sorros backed DA and his not knowing actual case law does not matter, what matters is you and I supporting a genderless society, YAY team Gay Lurker and Tracker !!

Apparently he knows more about case law than you. 

Already can't contain the gay projections.  I guess it will be 2 more days before you are back with your pedo projections as well.   ::)

Wayne Tracker.

  • Getbig II
  • **
  • Posts: 25
  • Lurker and I - Team Biden
Apparently he knows more about case law than you. 

Already can't contain the gay projections.  I guess it will be 2 more days before you are back with your pedo projections as well.   ::)

Why so Salty ?? we are on the same team  ->Team Biden !!

LurkerNoMore

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 33595
  • Dumb people think Trump is smart.
Apparently he knows more about case law than you. 

Already can't contain the gay projections.  I guess it will be 2 more days before you are back with your pedo projections as well.   ::)

Primemuscle

  • Getbig V
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  • Posts: 42288
This is an article that quotes and relies on FEC Commissioner James E. “Trey” Trainor.  But you would know that if you climbed out of your bubble and actually read the article.

Note: James E. Trey Trainor was nominated to that position by none other than Donald Trump in 2017. Trump re-nominated him twice (in 2019 and 2020). He was eventually confirmed in 2020. Even though it was a Republican controlled Senate, they were not very anxious to appoint him until the FEC was short one commissioner when Matthew S. Petersen (R) resigned his position. Trainor's appointment expires at the end of this month. Trainor represented the Texas Republican Party and two presidential campaigns.

Is it not possible Trainor is a bit biased when it comes to Trump's problems? Maybe he hopes Trump will be able to appoint him to another Republican political position.

Since 'bubble' seems to be your go to word for this week, I thought you might get a kick out this witch’s song:

'Double, double toil and trouble;
Fire burn and caldron bubble.'