Author Topic: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?  (Read 2618 times)

Rambone

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #50 on: October 23, 2025, 12:31:36 PM »
 :D

US MUSL

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #51 on: October 23, 2025, 07:24:11 PM »
It sounds like Derrick was in a death cramp (aka Dillet) before the finals and Bonac and Martin pretty much forces him to drink a potassium solution before he died.

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #52 on: October 23, 2025, 08:41:25 PM »
It sounds like Derrick was in a death cramp (aka Dillet) before the finals and Bonac and Martin pretty much forces him to drink a potassium solution before he died.

Heard likewise. But not the potassium solution. Heard it was a sodium solution.

The rumor: aldactazide combined with potassium loading. It's not advisable (easy to overshoot potassium), but if you get it just right along with insulin and carbs it can make you pretty full. Screw it up, and your muscles cramp and you can't get the cramping to stop without a huge dose of insulin to drive potassium from the blood stream back to the inside of the cells to maintain proper ionic balance. Hyperkalemia sets in and you basically die a very painful death. Apparently Bonac saw it and insisted Derek drink some electrolytes and eat some chips (sodium, to counter-balance the potassium). So sayeth the internet rumor mills.

He almost pulled a Benaziza, if this is all true.

If this is true, it's pretty old school in terms of prep. I haven't heard that this is Aceto's current protocol, so I'm finding it hard to believe, but then who knows what's true these days.

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #53 on: October 24, 2025, 01:18:11 AM »
I doubt any competitor got Derek to do anything, it was his coach or coaches. But who knows really, but another competitor doesn't know what he's done. A long time ago my friend called frantically from a hotel room as a pro was lying cramping violently on his bed. I said I'm not advising anything, if in doubt call an ambulance. They didn't want that so my buddy ran into the hotel corridor and grabbed sodium packets off a staff cart and poured it into his mouth and luckily it did solve the issue. He had taken an OTC supposed natural diuretic but which contained and undisclosed loop diuretic, called "Star caps."

"StarCaps was a dietary supplement that was found to contain the prescription diuretic bumetanide ["Bumex"], which can cause dehydration and dangerous side effects like low potassium levels. The product was marketed as a weight-loss aid but was not labeled as containing the prescription drug. Its use has been linked to issues for people like athletes, particularly when used for rapid weight cutting"


If this is true, it's pretty old school in terms of prep. I haven't heard that this is Aceto's current protocol, so I'm finding it hard to believe, but then who knows what's true these days.

Everything I've "heard" says Aceto is old school and some of his protocols sound risky if true, but like someone not drinking for days. Or Cutler testing positive for 5 different diuretics, though I'm not sure who was advising him then. There's really only "old school" ways to quickly drop water with them, you do a loop one like Bumex. You're of course right about the potassium issue, Milos says he saved a couple of pros' lives by stopping them taking it or paramedics administering it. He thought Benaziza died from this. Instead of potassium you take insulin and do some other things, if you know the problem is in fact hyperkalemia. 12 hours ago I took a  40mg Lasix since my ankles had swelling. A few weeks ago at hospital I got it IV both for water retention and high-ish potassium.

Chad Nicholls sells quinine tabs for countering cramping from dehydration. Back in the day everyone used it, don't know how popular these days. It attaches to the magnesium receptor.


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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #54 on: October 24, 2025, 05:03:21 AM »
I doubt any competitor got Derek to do anything, it was his coach or coaches. But who knows really, but another competitor doesn't know what he's done. A long time ago my friend called frantically from a hotel room as a pro was lying cramping violently on his bed. I said I'm not advising anything, if in doubt call an ambulance. They didn't want that so my buddy ran into the hotel corridor and grabbed sodium packets off a staff cart and poured it into his mouth and luckily it did solve the issue. He had taken an OTC supposed natural diuretic but which contained and undisclosed loop diuretic, called "Star caps."

"StarCaps was a dietary supplement that was found to contain the prescription diuretic bumetanide ["Bumex"], which can cause dehydration and dangerous side effects like low potassium levels. The product was marketed as a weight-loss aid but was not labeled as containing the prescription drug. Its use has been linked to issues for people like athletes, particularly when used for rapid weight cutting"

Everything I've "heard" says Aceto is old school and some of his protocols sound risky if true, but like someone not drinking for days. Or Cutler testing positive for 5 different diuretics, though I'm not sure who was advising him then. There's really only "old school" ways to quickly drop water with them, you do a loop one like Bumex. You're of course right about the potassium issue, Milos says he saved a couple of pros' lives by stopping them taking it or paramedics administering it. He thought Benaziza died from this. Instead of potassium you take insulin and do some other things, if you know the problem is in fact hyperkalemia. 12 hours ago I took a  40mg Lasix since my ankles had swelling. A few weeks ago at hospital I got it IV both for water retention and high-ish potassium.

Chad Nicholls sells quinine tabs for countering cramping from dehydration. Back in the day everyone used it, don't know how popular these days. It attaches to the magnesium receptor.


Bumex...have to look into that one! Come here and never fail to learn something new!


On the Bonac front (again, allegedly). I agree - no one would likely get Derek to do anything under normal circumstances. I think it's probably more that Aceto went backstage and handled the issue personally, as his coach.

Still, I'm reasoning that Derek would have been in some crippling pain if he was in fact hyperkalemic. Imagine having most of your muscles cells (smooth and striated muscle cells alike) cramping uncontrollably, and maximally, without relief. I can only think with that level of pain, it wouldn't be hard to be told to do anything to make the pain go away. Maybe not in the first minute or few as you try to knuckle your way through the pain. But eventually, that kind of cramping just erodes your resolve and you'll do anything or say anything to make it stop.

I'd also imagine today how it could have been Bonac. I think today, a lot of pros have a much stronger working knowledge of diuretics and their side effects (and how to mitigate them), than in the 90s when information was far less available and clustered in tight circles. It's not unreasonable to think a guy like Bonac knows a thing or two about diuretics (provided Derek actually said "help me....here's what I took").

Again...all allegedly!

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #55 on: October 24, 2025, 06:15:40 AM »


 :)

Padilla with no coach and 40 years behind in technology/progress just looks better



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Pet shop boys

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #56 on: October 24, 2025, 06:18:50 AM »

Bumex...have to look into that one! Come here and never fail to learn something new!


On the Bonac front (again, allegedly). I agree - no one would likely get Derek to do anything under normal circumstances. I think it's probably more that Aceto went backstage and handled the issue personally, as his coach.

Still, I'm reasoning that Derek would have been in some crippling pain if he was in fact hyperkalemic. Imagine having most of your muscles cells (smooth and striated muscle cells alike) cramping uncontrollably, and maximally, without relief. I can only think with that level of pain, it wouldn't be hard to be told to do anything to make the pain go away. Maybe not in the first minute or few as you try to knuckle your way through the pain. But eventually, that kind of cramping just erodes your resolve and you'll do anything or say anything to make it stop.

I'd also imagine today how it could have been Bonac. I think today, a lot of pros have a much stronger working knowledge of diuretics and their side effects (and how to mitigate them), than in the 90s when information was far less available and clustered in tight circles. It's not unreasonable to think a guy like Bonac knows a thing or two about diuretics (provided Derek actually said "help me....here's what I took").

Again...all allegedly!

Aceto has a lot to answer for ....

Sadly, Palumbo will be kissing his ass and afraid to address this serious (life and death) matter.




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joswift

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #57 on: October 24, 2025, 07:25:59 AM »
IHe thought Benaziza died from this.

I remember being told at the time from a pro that Benaziza was taking diuretics and clenbuterol and was only eating puréed apples

When he started cramping in his hotel and projectile vomitting he started drinking water , a lot of it.
Due to the effrects of clen (lubricates your lungs as its an ashmatic drug) all the water was going to his lungs.
He was past the point of no return

Humble Narcissist

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #58 on: October 24, 2025, 08:04:46 AM »
I remember being told at the time from a pro that Benaziza was taking diuretics and clenbuterol and was only eating puréed apples

When he started cramping in his hotel and projectile vomitting he started drinking water , a lot of it.
Due to the effrects of clen (lubricates your lungs as its an ashmatic drug) all the water was going to his lungs.
He was past the point of no return
So he drowned in his own fluids?

snx

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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #59 on: October 24, 2025, 11:54:45 AM »
I remember being told at the time from a pro that Benaziza was taking diuretics and clenbuterol and was only eating puréed apples

When he started cramping in his hotel and projectile vomitting he started drinking water , a lot of it.
Due to the effrects of clen (lubricates your lungs as its an ashmatic drug) all the water was going to his lungs.
He was past the point of no return

All of the above is accurate the way I heard it as well.

He was truly too far gone; so far gone that when he was dying in his hotel room, even Porter Cottrell couldn't save him when Porter was called into the room (and Porter is a firefighter well-trained in emergency lifesaving exercises).




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Re: 2025 Olympia - Was Derek going weak at the finals?
« Reply #60 on: Today at 01:39:31 PM »
pro bodybuilding has got to be the less functional activity there is ...

ironically while looking like a super athlete.


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