Shawn Ray's First Experiences as a Promoters

[ManBearPig...]

i thought women's bodybuilding was the comic relief at these shows?

[Always Sore]

ok before we bring on the challenge round, i want to say i saw less oil being mined by exxon then was just onstage...ha ha ha ....really folks can you say synthol...ha ha ha..don't forget to tip your waiters and waiteress, try the veal i will be here all night.

[onlyme]

YOu knwo what is cool to do is what I did at my second show and show Ronnie Coleman tapes on the big screens.  I had two 11' video screens on the sides of the stage.  During intermission or whenever we played Coleman tapes.  Everyone just sat there sand stared at the screen.  You could see peoples eyes popping out and mouths drop when they saw Ronnie 11' tall

[ManBearPig...]

240, you seem to not realize the utter homosexuality of a bodybuilding show.
700,1200, 2000 whatever the turnout was is amazing for that type of show.

i think it's some kind of a mental issue if you want to go see an oiled up man on stage.
i think the reason the arnold's a success is:
a. brand name (arnold schwarzenegger vs. shawn ray...hmmm, no offense to shawn)
b. sponsors, giveaways, booths, hot chicks (hell, i'd go for the chicks)
c. longevity (everyone knows when/where it is, and i'm sure it gets bigger every year because they have an mma, strongman, arm wrestling, etc. contest, not solely oiled up men)

shawn's not retarded.  he sees where he made mistakes (if any that he could've controlled), and im' sure the quality of the show's gonna improve with each year.  he has 2 more chances to make it work. 

johnny cash once said:
"have you ever heard a man say
if i had his money
i'd do things my way".

the point is shawn put together a show that got people from other countries to compete in, and he got someone else to pay for it all.

could you say you could pull of the same?  see how many supp companies you call and ask for 30k for a weekend , and actually get it.

oh, and just to prove this isn't an ass lick fest.

shawn has sex with trannies.

[240 is Back]

First off, I sure wouldn't try to fill an auditorium.  I'd go for the personality, matchups, and action the fans would like to see.  No more details though... if it happens, it'll be interesting...

[alexxx]

I think if you could get the audiances participation between setions such as egg the fool it would be more interesting. 240 I vote you as the first to go onstage.

[thisiskeith12]

You could hear Bob and Dan discussing certain things away from the mic. Not able to make it out, lot of mumbling, but you could hear it and it was annoying. A comedian is in desperate need at bodybuilding shows. Maybe a Bernie Mac or Steve Harvey, or anyone. He would need a co-host or someone that knows much about the sport. Hell there are a lot of comedians out there!

[240 is Back]

I'm thinking of something with a lot less overhead and far more fan involvement via web.  I'm not trying to put some union guys' kids thru college. 

remember there are only two ways to increase profit
1) reduce costs, or
2) increase output.

I think promoters should find ways to do both.  I have a few ideas for something, I don't know if it's something I'll do or something I'll sell for someone else to do... but I have something in mind...

[onlyme]

Denver is an *awesome* city and had the best weather of any show you will see all year in the IFBB. 

Mother's Day weekend did present an obstacle or two, but didn't dramatically hurt attendance. 

The venue is gorgeous and perfectly suitable for an event of this stature.  We're talking about the #3 event on the pro league calendar (in terms of prize money) and one for which there is only upside. 

When the GNC show bombed in 2002, everyone said, "Oh, it was really bad, but it was just their first year - they'll get better", but at the Colorado Pro, NO ONE WHO WAS PRESENT had a bad time.  Those of us who paid to attend had a great time and I guarantee many of us will return to support this event in 2007. 

I'm sorry Tre but it will be hard to convince me and other major sponsors that Denver is a good location.  There is nothing around it.  As much promo, advertising and marketing you did around Denver and outside of it the show was visited by 80% less people than it would take to make it attractive enough to be a big show.  Sorry but Denver is a bad place to do a BB show.  Like I said it might be the 5th fittest city in the country but I think that played against you.  Cause the fittest people are the ones who care about there bodies and exercise regualry.  They do not go to a gym and throw barbells around and they are certainly 100% against steroids. 

The city of Denver has almost 4 times the number of residents as all of Hawaii combined and 5 times that of Oahu, yet I had more people at my show.  Sure Denver has big time sports but that might also be a bad mark against doing a show there.  I mean who did the Business Plan for this show or was there one done.  I mean did anyone do any type of research on this.  The demographics or anything.  Hawaii has 160 health clubs, gyms, and spas.  How many does Denver have.  Hawaii has NO professional sports here.  Having a show in an area that has so many professional sports and other activitis can work against you.  There may be just to much to do there and BB is not that appealing to go to.  It might have been bigger if he put on a Dart tournament.

In any case, Denver will never be a major BB location.  Travel expenses alone for most major companies who support BB is just too much to add to their plate of BB shows to support.  And a big thing is that Sean doesn't even live in Denver.  He has to spend sponsorship money to get there.  I don't knwo why any sponsor would give him money to travel back and forth.  How can you secure any kind of major local sponsor and not live there.

You want some advice.  YOU NEED TO GET LOCAL MAJOR SPONSORSHIPS.  Not vitamin companies but banks, car dealerships, real estate companies, untiltiy companies, a drink distributor.  As much as Sean tried to convince everyone he knows how to promote, he was way off.  Putting on a show and hiring people to do it in one thing, but raising the money and getting local involvement is the thing that will make or break your show.  Local involvement is and should be your #1 concern.  Sorry but this show will be short lived without it.

[thisiskeith12]

It's not hard to find ways to entertain the crowds. I just don't think there are enough promoters who really think about it that much. They are satisfied with the way things are because they have always been that way. Having musicians play would be hardly as entertaining as a decent comedian who will keep people awake and in there seats. The Oscars, the Golden Globes, the Grammy's, these shows all would be flops if comedians weren't there as hosts.

[thisiskeith12]

Thanks.  Shawn did well, but the mission plan was flawed.  Surgery was a success, but the patient died.

When it comes to the marketing, your approach has to match the product offering, and the target audience.  Check it:

If you're going to advertise to a mass audience (shotgun approach), you need a mass appeal offering.  If you're going to be on the morning news, talk about something that they like.  Add something to the show to make them want to visit. IE: "guest host" someone that housewives identify with, etc.

If you're going to advertise to a specific audience (rifle approach- my favorite!) you need to NOT spend time on the news, but spend time doing seminars at local gyms the 8 weekends before the colo pro, with athletes coming along to meet the patrons and giveaways, etc.  THIS would have motivated ppl to come out. (IE: "I met darrem, nice dude. I'll be there!"). 

Shawn was just another guy selling something on the morning news.  But in the gyms, he would have been THE man with THE SHOW OF THE YEAR!

Schedule 4 appearances a weekend- Q&A with Phil Heath and a few other guys, for the 8 weeks BEFORE the colo pro.  Hit the 32 biggest gyms closest to Denver.  That's 2 every sat, 2 every sunday.  Meet thousands of real pro BBing fans in the denver area. 

Anyway, that is my marketing advice. You never asked, but I'm sharing anyway.  You went after the wrong cutomer group, Shawn.  You did things right, but for the WRONG people, IMHO.

Rob

Though I like your thinking and very much agree with it, the costs of these things are gonna fall on who? The promoter. The promoter would have to gamble too big and most promoters won't do that.

[240 is Back]

Though I like your thinking and very much agree with it, the costs of these things are gonna fall on who? The promoter. The promoter would have to gamble too big and most promoters won't do that.

VYO would shell out the supplements.  Give the athletes a stipend for showing up.  I am sure $200 a day would suffice for Phil Heath to do 2-3 appearances for an hour shaking hands. Put it all under marketing costs.   The fact is, with a niche product like this (tickets to a BBing show), blind mailings and another ad in a sea of ads just don't work. 

You have to put some boots in the dirt. Travel to gyms. Talk to people. Ask them on the stop if they'll be attending the show, then offer to sell them a ticket and get some free supps with it.  Who isn't going to be inspired by meeting Phil heath/similar pro in person? 

[weedoutheweak]

VYO would shell out the supplements.  Give the athletes a stipend for showing up.  I am sure $200 a day would suffice for Phil Heath to do 2-3 appearances for an hour shaking hands. Put it all under marketing costs.   The fact is, with a niche product like this (tickets to a BBing show), blind mailings and another ad in a sea of ads just don't work. 

You have to put some boots in the dirt. Travel to gyms. Talk to people. Ask them on the stop if they'll be attending the show, then offer to sell them a ticket and get some free supps with it.  Who isn't going to be inspired by meeting Phil heath/similar pro in person? 

You sure you have a degree in business?

[240 is Back]

You sure you have a degree in business?

I'm about as sure of that, as I am for the fact you have a major hard-on for me.

Please tell us weedy, what would you do to increase attendance?

[weedoutheweak]

I'm about as sure of that, as I am for the fact you have a major hard-on for me.

Please tell us weedy, what would you do to increase attendance?

Here's your first business tip, don't give your assets away (this includes information).   I can't believe you let out a secret like 'putting boots to the dirt'.  Somebody make sure Microsoft isn't watching this board.  240 might have just made them another billion.  Seriosuly though, when do you 'put your boots to the dirt'?  You sit at a computer all day (and probably eat Tostino's cereal all day long, and I would guess that you don't shower every day), when do you leave your room?

[Azure]

Denver is an *awesome* city and had the best weather of any show you will see all year in the IFBB. 

Mother's Day weekend did present an obstacle or two, but didn't dramatically hurt attendance. 

The venue is gorgeous and perfectly suitable for an event of this stature.  We're talking about the #3 event on the pro league calendar (in terms of prize money) and one for which there is only upside. 

When the GNC show bombed in 2002, everyone said, "Oh, it was really bad, but it was just their first year - they'll get better", but at the Colorado Pro, NO ONE WHO WAS PRESENT had a bad time.  Those of us who paid to attend had a great time and I guarantee many of us will return to support this event in 2007. 

Let's be real people are experiencing soem real Schadenfraude right now because they were happy to see Shawn "fail".

I'm no Shawn fan myself...not in the least.  But at least he's trying to do something unlike most of the people on the board who are such know it alls about what he should have done...and have probably never promoted a show in their life.

[240 is Back]

Here's your first business tip, don't give your assets away (this includes information).   I can't believe you let out a secret like 'putting boots to the dirt'.  Somebody make sure Microsoft isn't watching this board.  240 might have just made them another billion.  Seriosuly though, when do you 'put your boots to the dirt'?  You sit at a computer all day (and probably eat Tostino's cereal all day long, and I would guess that you don't shower every day), when do you leave your room?

I can't leave my room.  I'll be arrested for welfare fraud, silly.

[weedoutheweak]

I can't leave my room.  I'll be arrested for welfare fraud, silly.

Answer the question McFly: When do you put your boots to the dirt?

[240 is Back]

Answer the question McFly: When do you put your boots to the dirt?

LOL @ Mcfly...

Dude, once a week I travel to local businesses, dropping off brochures and talking to local business owners in different segments of town.  I might sell them a website, I might find a barter deal, I might just keep on kicking rocks.

Also twice a week I do my contract work, where I stop in to make sure staff and facilities at my *other* position are still running things smoothly.

Rest of the time, I work from home.  Is that really so bad?

[weedoutheweak]

LOL @ Mcfly...

Dude, once a week I travel to local businesses, dropping off brochures and talking to local business owners in different segments of town.  I might sell them a website, I might find a barter deal, I might just keep on kicking rocks.

Also twice a week I do my contract work, where I stop in to make sure staff and facilities at my *other* position are still running things smoothly.

Rest of the time, I work from home.  Is that really so bad?

Explain (all of it). 

[240 is Back]

Explain (all of it). 

Why?

[weedoutheweak]

Why?

You market yourself once a week to complete strangers, but you can't type up what you do right now?

[Vince G, CSN MFT]

Comedian is a pure waste of money.


People come to a bodybuilding show to see bodybuilders.  You can't increase attendance if everyone is already there at the show  to watch.  Not only that, generally comedians eventually end up making bodybuilding jokes and ends up making the show cheesy.

[240 is Back]

You market yourself once a week to complete strangers, but you can't type up what you do right now?

Well, some are referrals but many are just walk-ins.  Often I'm out doing errands and I strike up conversations with local business owners about trends, competitors, and websites/marketing materials.  Most of these companies pay outrageous prices for ad or graphic work.  I somethimes throw that in, or give them a good discount, to produce branded ads, cards, flyers, etc to match the branded look of their website.

It's not like I put on a tie and go cold-sell.  I talk about the day, then business, then leave a flyer. Easily 1/4 will talk shop then, and at least 1/3 will eventually purchase my services.  Some will put me on the spot and ask me to look at their site immediately, and I will throw some ideas at them.  We might set up lunch (IHOP is my favorite- wide menu, fairly cheap, and big tables, good for the laptop).  It's fun, and just about everyone is looking for an advantage. In person, I exhibit the same knowledge and quickness that I do here, without the whole '240 is a prick' thing

I manage the network needs, website, and user training for a local firm also. I stop in 2ce a week and just run thru things, restart a server or load some software if needed, and just make sure things are good. I also pick up a check   They have nothing to worry about on the network, ever, and I just make sure they're able to do what they need to do, to stay online and efficient!

And, the rest of the week, I'm in this recliner working on sites. I post and read a bit, I work for a bit. Make a few calls.  Hang out with my woman for a few hours every day also- one of the great things about working from home.  I also take a break to hit the gym most days, and I take naps when I'm sleep, eat when I'm hungry, and play with my kittens when I get bored with the computer.  That's about it.  Now tell us about you, weed.

[weedoutheweak]

Well, some are referrals but many are just walk-ins.  Often I'm out doing errands and I strike up conversations with local business owners about trends, competitors, and websites/marketing materials.  Most of these companies pay outrageous prices for ad or graphic work.  I somethimes throw that in, or give them a good discount, to produce branded ads, cards, flyers, etc to match the branded look of their website.

It's not like I put on a tie and go cold-sell.  I talk about the day, then business, then leave a flyer. Easily 1/4 will talk shop then, and at least 1/3 will eventually purchase my services.  Some will put me on the spot and ask me to look at their site immediately, and I will throw some ideas at them.  We might set up lunch (IHOP is my favorite- wide menu, fairly cheap, and big tables, good for the laptop).  It's fun, and just about everyone is looking for an advantage. In person, I exhibit the same knowledge and quickness that I do here, without the whole '240 is a prick' thing

I manage the network needs, website, and user training for a local firm also. I stop in 2ce a week and just run thru things, restart a server or load some software if needed, and just make sure things are good. I also pick up a check   They have nothing to worry about on the network, ever, and I just make sure they're able to do what they need to do, to stay online and efficient!

And, the rest of the week, I'm in this recliner working on sites. I post and read a bit, I work for a bit. Make a few calls.  Hang out with my woman for a few hours every day also- one of the great things about working from home.  I also take a break to hit the gym most days, and I take naps when I'm sleep, eat when I'm hungry, and play with my kittens when I get bored with the computer.  That's about it.  Now tell us about you, weed.

If you told the truth, I'd probably say what I do................but... ........................ ................you're online statistics at getbig seem to tell a different story from your post.