LA Lakers - Steve Nash Will Save The LA Lakers

[Walter Sobchak]

Michael Jordan was notorious for doing this.  Hell, he punched Steve Kerr in the face at practice on time.  Just challenging his teammates to man up, compete harder and elevate their level of play.

Derek Fisher used to be the good cop on the Lakers, Kobe was always the bad cop.  Another ESPN non-story that becomes a story.  Tell me ESPN isn't always trying to stir up shit on this team. 

People think about the "72 win" Bulls and forget about the years Jordan struggled with Luc Longley, Will Perdue, BJ Armstrong, and others. Horace Grant and Scottie Pippen would never have become the players they were without Jordan and Rodman riding them in practice every day.

[Hulkotron]

People think about the "72 win" Bulls and forget about the years Jordan struggled with Luc Longley, Will Perdue, BJ Armstrong, and others. Horace Grant and Scottie Pippen would never have become the players they were without Jordan and Rodman riding them in practice every day.

 I'm confused by your assertions here.  Maybe you are thinking of earlier Jordan teams before he had any teammates or a coach of any ability level

- Luc Longley played three seasons with Jordan, averaged 68 wins, won three championships.
- Will Purdue played five seasons with Jordan, averaged 57 wins, won three championships
- BJ Armstrong played four seasons with Jordan, averaged 60 wins, won three championships
- Pippen, Grant, and Armstrong were all All-Stars in 1994 without Jordan playing and they still won 55 games that year.
- Horace Grant never played with Dennis Rodman.

After about 1989 or so the Bulls never "struggled" unless your definition of struggling is restricted to advancing no further than the Conference Finals.  Scottie Pippen is one of the best all-around players ever, nobody with any knowledge of NBA basketball disputes this.  The only full season he played without Jordan (1994) he was easily the best non-center in the league.

[calfzilla]

Even in his later years Pippen almost took the Trailblazers to the finals in 2000.

[Pray_4_War]

Even in his later years Pippen almost took the Trailblazers to the finals in 2000.

Until Kobe shook him out of his sneakers and threw Shaquille that lob. 

[calfzilla]

Until Kobe shook him out of his sneakers and threw Shaquille that lob. 

Yep. 4th quarter meltdown by the blazers.

[240 is Back]

Kobe is shooting 38% from the floor, and 27% from 3-point range. 
The Lakers team (including Kobe) averages 44% shooting.

Per 100 possessions, WITHOUT kobe they are +5 points offensively, and +15 points defensively.
They score a little better without kobe out there, and they play WAY better defense.

At this point, kobe is Ronnie Coleman, guest posing 2 years after retirement.  Still had more muscle than Joe Blow on the street, but a total mess. Despite this, people would line up for blocks to meet Ronnie over most of the dudes in the top 10 at the O that year, with far better physiques.  Ask a kid if he wants to meet Ronnie Coleman, or Ronnie Rockel.  No offense to rockel, just pointing out the #10 competitor in the world is less than an 8-time O winner, in terms of popularity.

That's what kobe is.  Sell tickets, everyone wants to see him play.  but the team is better without him.  Stats show it.

[Quickerblade]

Kobe is shooting 38% from the floor, and 27% from 3-point range. 
The Lakers team (including Kobe) averages 44% shooting.

Per 100 possessions, WITHOUT kobe they are +5 points offensively, and +15 points defensively.
They score a little better without kobe out there, and they play WAY better defense.

At this point, kobe is Ronnie Coleman, guest posing 2 years after retirement.  Still had more muscle than Joe Blow on the street, but a total mess. Despite this, people would line up for blocks to meet Ronnie over most of the dudes in the top 10 at the O that year, with far better physiques.  Ask a kid if he wants to meet Ronnie Coleman, or Ronnie Rockel.  No offense to rockel, just pointing out the #10 competitor in the world is less than an 8-time O winner, in terms of popularity.

That's what kobe is.  Sell tickets, everyone wants to see him play.  but the team is better without him.  Stats show it.

ME

[Dr.J]

We have gotten off steve nash subject people

[240 is Back]

ME

I was given a Heat ticket in year 1 of their run back in 2010 or whatever.  I sold it.  Wasn't worth it to drive across state when I can watch game on TV in comfort of home.  I didn't want to see LBJ play that much.

Now, if you give me a ticket to watch jordan come out of retirement and play a game?  Yeah, I would have been there, even if dude is 50 and fat and angry and everything else.  So I totally understand that.   You wouldn't fly all the way to USA to see Del Curry or russell westbrook play, even if they school kobe these days.  You wanted to witness the legacy of the best ever, I totally understand that.   Lakers are selling lots of tickets and they're still the top team to watch, even with awful record.  I totally understand. 

[240 is Back]

We have gotten off steve nash subject people

http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/08/23/steve-nash-called-kobe-bryant-a-mother-f-a-but-in-a-good-way/

Soon there is going to be a documentary  on Showtime about Kobe Bryant and his comeback this season, one that will undoubtedly play to the mythology of Kobe and his toughness, his determination, his single-mindedness. It promises to be interesting.

Kobe and his comeback also are the cover story this week in Sports Illustrated, a brilliant feature by one of the very best NBA writers, Chris Ballard. A story with a lot of great quotes and anecdotes.

However this one may be the best one, tying the documentary into it. Gotham Chopra, the director of the documentary, asked a lot of players to describe Kobe in three words. (Hat tip to Business Insider/Yahoo.)

“After each interview Kobe would text Chopra, eager to hear what people said. Most answered with some variation of ‘the ultimate competitor’ or ‘killer instinct.’ But when Chopra asked Steve Nash, he said something different. After thinking for a moment, Nash answered, slowly, in three beats: ‘Mother … f****** … a******.’[

“Kobe thought this was awesome.”

[Pray_4_War]

Kobe is shooting 38% from the floor, and 27% from 3-point range. 
The Lakers team (including Kobe) averages 44% shooting.

Per 100 possessions, WITHOUT kobe they are +5 points offensively, and +15 points defensively.
They score a little better without kobe out there, and they play WAY better defense.

At this point, kobe is Ronnie Coleman, guest posing 2 years after retirement.  Still had more muscle than Joe Blow on the street, but a total mess. Despite this, people would line up for blocks to meet Ronnie over most of the dudes in the top 10 at the O that year, with far better physiques.  Ask a kid if he wants to meet Ronnie Coleman, or Ronnie Rockel.  No offense to rockel, just pointing out the #10 competitor in the world is less than an 8-time O winner, in terms of popularity.

That's what kobe is.  Sell tickets, everyone wants to see him play.  but the team is better without him.  Stats show it.

I love how you highlight the negatives but forget to mention the positive things he's doing.  Like becoming the only player in NBA history with 30,000 points and 6,000 assists.  Like averaging 25/5/5 in his 19th year when most people didn't think he was even going to be able to play worth shit being old and coming off two major leg injuries.

Also, you per 100 possessions stats wouldn't mean shit even if they were accurate.  Kobe plays with the starting unit, a unit that just recently was forced to bench two of it's players for lack of production and refusal to get back on defense.  That's not a Kobe issue.  Also, he is the only one that creates shots for others with any consistency.  Kobe is the initiator of everything for this team offensively.  I'd also argue that the fact that our defense is poor has a lot to do with Jordan Hill bailing anytime someone gets in the paint.  Jordan Hill will rebound and play hard for you but if someone is in the lane he flatly refuses to step up and challenge them.  It's a layup drill.  He is our 6'10" starting Center.

The way you talk about Kobe just show how ignorant you are about him and that you are a genuine hater desperately trying to find a way to make him look bad.  I'm not made at you though.  There is an army of people just like you.  Most of these people are Micheal Jordan or Lebron James fans just trying to tear Kobe down so their guy looks good.  It's pathetic and laughable.  Anyone who doesn't recognize how great all three of these guys are is a tool and a moron.

You can declare things all day, but that doesn't make your opinion fact.

[closeline]

People think about the "72 win" Bulls and forget about the years Jordan struggled with Luc Longley, Will Perdue, BJ Armstrong, and others. Horace Grant and Scottie Pippen would never have become the players they were without Jordan and Rodman riding them in practice every day.

One of the Most idiotic post ever

Pippen was Allrady a legend when rodman joined the bulls

[Hulkotron]

I love how you highlight the negatives but forget to mention the positive things he's doing.  Like becoming the only player in NBA history with 30,000 points and 6,000 assists.  Like averaging 25/5/5 in his 19th year when most people didn't think he was even going to be able to play worth shit being old and coming off two major leg injuries.

Also, you per 100 possessions stats wouldn't mean shit even if they were accurate.  Kobe plays with the starting unit, a unit that just recently was forced to bench two of it's players for lack of production and refusal to get back on defense.  That's not a Kobe issue.  Also, he is the only one that creates shots for others with any consistency.  Kobe is the initiator of everything for this team offensively.  I'd also argue that the fact that our defense is poor has a lot to do with Jordan Hill bailing anytime someone gets in the paint.  Jordan Hill will rebound and play hard for you but if someone is in the lane he flatly refuses to step up and challenge them.  It's a layup drill.  He is our 6'10" starting Center.

The way you talk about Kobe just show how ignorant you are about him and that you are a genuine hater desperately trying to find a way to make him look bad.  I'm not made at you though.  There is an army of people just like you.  Most of these people are Micheal Jordan or Lebron James fans just trying to tear Kobe down so their guy looks good.  It's pathetic and laughable.  Anyone who doesn't recognize how great all three of these guys are is a tool and a moron.

You can declare things all day, but that doesn't make your opinion fact.

Yes he's still one of the most (maybe the most) entertaining players in the league to watch, and that's what I'm in for.  Could not give a lesser fuck about his field goal %.

Per-possession or per-minute stats are useful for some things in basketball, mostly for comparing teams, but they can be misleading when assessing players in my opinion.  Kobe takes a lot of shots yes but who else on that shitshow of a team is going to take those shots and do better?  Most players would not put up Kobe's numbers even at this stage in his career if they were taking the same number of shots he does.  

From another perspective, a guy who shoots 50% on 10 shots a game will in most cases not shoot anywhere near 50% if he were to double that to 20 shots a game.

[Walter Sobchak]

One of the Most idiotic post ever

Pippen was Allrady a legend when rodman joined the bulls

A legend?

Pippen refused to enter the end of Game 3 of the Bulls' Eastern Conference semifinal against the New York Knicks, for a final play called for Toni Kukoc.

Pippen left the last game of the 1989 playoffs after being smacked by Detroit's Bill Laimbeer and had that famous migraine headache in the final game of the 1990 playoffs, Michael Jordan told management that he wouldn't mind seeing Pippen traded. Jordan had sized him up as a loser.


Pippen was chastised by teammates and the media in the 1992 playoffs when Xavier McDaniel taunted Pippen throughout the playoffs against the Knicks about Pippen's pussy attitude.

It's easy to judge: Pippen quit on his teammates, he defied and embarrassed his superiors, and at times he was a disgrace to the Bulls

He acted like a petulant child, nothing new For Pippen, and tried to quit the Bulls before the 1990-91 season in a contract dispute and developed the so-called blue flu later that season, again over contract problems.

Pippen became angry with Bulls fans and criticized them. He said Kukoc should have been the one booed; And Kukoc didn't deserve the last shot.

Pippen lacked the respect of his teammates and was a quitter and a coward. Hardly the stuff of legend.

[240 is Back]

it's just that kobe keeps being painted with the 'legend' brush.  Yes, he did amazing things, but THIS YEAR he is selfish, on the court only for ratings, tanking, and his own drive for alltime scoring title.  It's what basketball is about these days, I get it. 

[Pray_4_War]

it's just that kobe keeps being painted with the 'legend' brush.  Yes, he did amazing things, but THIS YEAR he is selfish, on the court only for ratings, tanking, and his own drive for alltime scoring title.  It's what basketball is about these days, I get it. 

This is just what you want to think.  You are certainly entitled to that opinion but I don't share it.  Frankly, I doubt you actually watch the games or have any real understanding of what is going on with this basketball team. 

[Hulkotron]

Scottie Pippen fucked my wife

Are you a Knicks fan by any chance?

[Quickerblade]

I was given a Heat ticket in year 1 of their run back in 2010 or whatever.  I sold it.  Wasn't worth it to drive across state when I can watch game on TV in comfort of home.  I didn't want to see LBJ play that much.

Now, if you give me a ticket to watch jordan come out of retirement and play a game?  Yeah, I would have been there, even if dude is 50 and fat and angry and everything else.  So I totally understand that.   You wouldn't fly all the way to USA to see Del Curry or russell westbrook play, even if they school kobe these days.  You wanted to witness the legacy of the best ever, I totally understand that.   Lakers are selling lots of tickets and they're still the top team to watch, even with awful record.  I totally understand.  

exactly i wanted to watch the man that has 5 rings and all that. Glad i got to see him before he retires.

I was in the US for 5 days, I just went to see Kobe play.
I had the best seats for the lakers vs Wolves and Vs Raptors.

both games he played well, got a triple double against the raptors.

No, I would not even fly to watch lebron play let alone westbrook or even Durant.

Watching on TV and Live up close is different. He is impossible to stop, his footwork is amazing, his jumpshot is stellar.
Lowry kept yelling at teammates to double kobe and he was either hitting the jumper or finding the open man.

I will not compare him to jordan, jordan is the greatest all time. I respect Kobe alot after watching him play Live.
I was blessed to have really good seats.

[Hulkotron]

I will not compare him to jordan, jordan is the greatest all time. I respect Kobe alot after watching him play Live.
I was blessed to have really good seats.

Jordan at his peak would demolish Kobe (or anyone else) at their respective peak.

At this age though (both 36) I think Kobe would give him a run for his money though, especially without the injuries.  Jordan never had any major injuries after the broken foot his second year.

Before the last two seasons Kobe was pretty much a shoe-in to break the career points record if he felt like playing long enough.

[Quickerblade]

Jordan at his peak would demolish Kobe (or anyone else) at their respective peak.

At this age though (both 36) I think Kobe would give him a run for his money though, especially without the injuries.  Jordan never had any major injuries after the broken foot his second year.

Before the last two seasons Kobe was pretty much a shoe-in to break the career points record if he felt like playing long enough.

you are spot on. I fucken love the NBA.

I could talk NBA all day long if anyone was interested in Australia, most people here think shaq is still playing.

[Quickerblade]

 

[Hulkotron]

Is that in LA QB?  How'd you get those seats?

Must have been pricey.

[Quickerblade]

Is that in LA QB?  How'd you get those seats?

Must have been pricey.

yeah that is at staples centre, remember that steve arce fund?

[Hulkotron]

Haha yes the fund

[Quickerblade]

Haha yes the fund

Well the dividends paid like a mother fucker