Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Female Info Boards => Figure, Bikini and Fitness Info and Discussions => Topic started by: Lift Studios on September 14, 2007, 05:33:01 PM
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Based on the 1 piece callouts - your top 5 thus far in figure:
• Michelle Adams
• Chasity Slone
• Andrea Dumon
• Heather Green
• Paola Almerico
Props to Heather Green for a strong showing in her pro debut, it looks like she could be Olympia bound in her debut. Much deserved she looks awesome. Things could switch up in the 2 piece, so we'll see who prevails and heads to the Olympia tomorrow night. Either way there will be THREE MORE figure competitors added to the already loaded figure Olympia.
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Hi Isaac :)!
Thank you for the update! Are there any pics anywhere? Wishing all the best to my dear friend Claire P. who is such a sweetheart!
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Shouldnt that be PaolA AlmericO :)
go Jelena, kick it in the 2 piece!
:D
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Shouldnt that be PaolA AlmericO :)
go Jelena, kick it in the 2 piece!
:D
Thanks Webster.
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Thanks Webster.
had an old Gf in Giardini-Naxos in Sicilia named Paola....awww, the memories, thats how i caught ya!
;)
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Competitors
Jelena Abbou
Alejandra Abdala
Michelle Adams
Chastity Slone
Andrea Dumon
Jen Cook
Marie Gibbon
Cheri Lewis
Danielle Hollanshade
Paola Almerico
Becky Clawson
Carina Dupree
Debbie Leung
Haxel Nelson
Lisa Morton
Heather Green
Thais Cabrices
Chaire Parmley
Shelly Taucher
Alti Bautista
Marie Allegro
Jamie Senuk
1st Callout
Michelle Adams
Chastity Slone
Andrea Dumon
Heather Green
2nd Callout
Jelena Abbou
Paolo Almerico
Debbie Leung
Hazel Nelson
3rd Callout:
Heather Green
Andrea Dumon
Paolo Almerica
Michelle Adams
Chasty Sloan
Hazel Nelson
4th Callout
Daniele Hollanshade
Becky Clawson
Lisa Morton
Thais Cabrices
Jennifer Cook
5th Callout
Claire Parmley
Alti Bautista
Marie Allegro
Jamie Senuk
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had an old Gf in Giardini-Naxos in Sicilia named Paola....awww, the memories, thats how i caught ya!
;)
Sure you did Rico, good on ya. 8)
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Lift Thanks for the Update.
Danielle H went through hell to get to the show. She missed her flight from FL to AC, had to get a flight to Maryland and then drove 12 hours through the night. She arrived Friday AM and had to paint and get ready to be on stage by 5 PM. She got some rest last night and she has today to relax so she will be improved for the night show.
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I really can't decipher how these figure competitions are judged. Based on the pics that I've seen, Alti Bautista should have been called out in the first callout. The best package overall IMO. Oh well, see what happens later...
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Tracey Greenwood looks to be the champ in Atlantic City. She has streamlined her physique and looks great.
The rest off the top 5 based on physique call-outs:
Bethany Gainey
Julie Lohre
Amy Haddad
Brenda Lee Santiago-Capella
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I really can't decipher how these figure competitions are judged. Based on the pics that I've seen, Alti Bautista should have been called out in the first callout. The best package overall IMO. Oh well, see what happens later...
I also agree. Based on the Pics that I saw Alti Bautista looked "FANTASTIC". However, Alti carries a lot of Muscle on her legs and the judges don't like that. I personally Think the other top figure Women LOOKED!!! Not Ass Bad as I thought. Andrea is a friend of mine and I love her body, Although I like Andera Tighter!!! She Looked Good. I also like Michelle Adams and Chastity Sloan. However, The I.F.B.B. is putting way to much pressure on these women to have skinny legs, big back and shoulders, Small waist and a perfect! "full of water Face and body". For some of these women, It ruins there body. Not everyone can genetically pull it off.
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I also agree. Based on the Pics that I saw Alti Bautista looked "FANTASTIC". However, Alti carries a lot of Muscle on her legs and the judges don't like that. I personally Think the other top figure Women LOOKED!!! ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE!!!. Andrea is a friend of mine and I love her body. I also like Michelle Adams and Chastity Sloan. However, The I.F.B.B. is putting way to much pressure on these women to have skinny legs, big back and shoulders, Small waist and a perfect! "full of water Face and body". For some of these women, It ruins there body. NOt everyone can genetically pull it off.
whoa that's a bit harsh. You're saying Alti looks fantastic but Michelle, Chasity and Andrea look horrible? :-\
How do you figure Alti looks fantastic while these three look horrible? Where do you get "skinny legs, big back and shoulders" as the IFBB's fault?
Heather Green looked the best on this stage, in my opinion.
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I agree Isaac. Alti does look good but not the best. The problem is the back of her legs are not even close to being tight as compared to the rest of her body. From the front she looks good although the legs are a tiny bit over powering. But from the back her back looks good but the back of her legs look bad. If she was tighter from the back she might of been called out sooner. Its between Christy and Heather in mind opnion. Again we are looking for overall look. Not just the body but the whole presentation. ;D
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I would like to know why there is absolutely no consistency in the judges decision of top competitors. All that I can think of when I look at some of these girls is a pizza and ice cream buffet! What in the world are the judges doing or looking at? One thing is for sure, they aren't looking at the competitors. I've been watching all of the figure competitions this year, and this CRAP placings have got to stop. There is no way that some of these competitors should even be on stage! It's sad when this used to be a sport, and now it is just a business. I guess you have to know that right person or kiss that right ass! Give me a break!
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I would like to know why there is absolutely no consistency in the judges decision of top competitors. All that I can think of when I look at some of these girls is a pizza and ice cream buffet! What in the world are the judges doing or looking at? One thing is for sure, they aren't looking at the competitors. I've been watching all of the figure competitions this year, and this CRAP placings have got to stop. There is no way that some of these competitors should even be on stage! It's sad when this used to be a sport, and now it is just a business. I guess you have to know that right person or kiss that right ass! Give me a break!
The judges have to judge what is in front of them on that day. Some shows have stronger line-ups than others. Who should be in the top five at this show that wasn't? I'd say they got it right with what was presented on that day. What "CRAP" placings are you talking about. Perhaps if you were looking at the competitors physiques instead of thinking of pizza and ice cream you'd see what the judges do. You sound like Eric Bui or a bitter boyfriend posting without providing evidence of your claims. :-*
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whoa that's a bit harsh. You're saying Alti looks fantastic but Michelle, Chasity and Andrea look horrible? :-\
How do you figure Alti looks fantastic while these three look horrible? Where do you get "skinny legs, big back and shoulders" as the IFBB's fault?
Heather Green looked the best on this stage, in my opinion.
Thank you Isaac for the update!
I agree with you that Heather looked GREAT-what a wonderful PRO debut for her!
Chastity looks great also and Andrea looks better each show-
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I said that the judges aren't looking at the competitors because they aren't! 3 out of the top 5 shouldn't even have made it close to the top, but they did. If you would just look at all of the competitors, you would obviously see that some are well conditioned, have great shape, and have good symmetry. Most of those girls aren't even in the top ten. Others have been eating whatever they want for a while, and it shows. If you thought that the judges got it right, then you are either a judge yourself, a boyfriend of one of the competitors, or just blind. If you want names, I can give them, but I'm trying to be somewhat nice to theses competitors. I'm irritated at the incompetency of the judges, not the competitors.
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::)
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fitness results ;)
1 tracy greenwod
2 bethany gainey
3 julie lohre
4 brenda santiago
5 stacy simons
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Where are the pictures??? I want to see :-*
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http://www.musculardevelopment.com/browse/index.php?mode=contest&eventcode=1184
there are a TON here !! :)
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Congrats to Team FigureRX's Erin Riley on winning the 45-second routine round!!
http://www.figurerx.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=110
We will have a lot of positive things to say about the placings in Atlantic City. We chose not to launch our first pro figure coverage at the Europa because of the lineup and the placings, we want to have a lot of positive things to say because we are on the side of all the athletes. We're very happy that the judging here seems to be considerably better. Lisa Morton presented an ideal figure upper body .... more later ....
Team FigureRX
www.FigureRX.com
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Congrats to Team FigureRX's Erin Riley!!
http://www.figurerx.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=110
And photos are up at MDOnline
http://www.musculardevelopment.com/browse/index.php?mode=contest&eventcode=1184
We will have a lot to say about the placings. We chose not to report or comment on pro figure at the Europa because of the lineup and the placings, but the judging here was somewhat better.
Team FigureRX
www.FigureRX.com
No offense but why would you pick and choose which shows you report on? If you want to be credible, you should report on all shows.
Two Cent. Out.
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I said that the judges aren't looking at the competitors because they aren't! 3 out of the top 5 shouldn't even have made it close to the top, but they did. If you would just look at all of the competitors, you would obviously see that some are well conditioned, have great shape, and have good symmetry. Most of those girls aren't even in the top ten. Others have been eating whatever they want for a while, and it shows. If you thought that the judges got it right, then you are either a judge yourself, a boyfriend of one of the competitors, or just blind. If you want names, I can give them, but I'm trying to be somewhat nice to theses competitors. I'm irritated at the incompetency of the judges, not the competitors.
Then become a judge and make a change that way. Who in your opinion, should have been top 5 Mr. Adonis?
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whoa that's a bit harsh. You're saying Alti looks fantastic but Michelle, Chasity and Andrea look horrible? :-\
How do you figure Alti looks fantastic while these three look horrible? Where do you get "skinny legs, big back and shoulders" as the IFBB's fault?
Heather Green looked the best on this stage, in my opinion.
First, Im making a Generalization. Second, you are Correct, Alti does have to work on the back of her legs. Heather Green does look pretty Good. However, Most of these women could look much better. I'm Comparing them to how good they could look. They have Great Genetics. I Think all the women who did the show, Could look much better. I think they all have the potential to look amazing. Do Not Confuse what I'm trying to say. The Competitors are simple doing what they are told to do!!! As a Fan, I wish they could just bring the body that they like, and be judged accordingly.
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Complete Fitness Results:
1 Tracey Greenwood 7 7 15 13 42
2 Bethany Gainey 9 10 26 28 73
3 Julie Lohre 14 13 14 39 80
4 Brenda Lee Santiago-Capella 24 23 24 16 87
5 Stacy Simons 33 31 19 25 108
6 Erin Riley 40 43 10 40 133
7 Susan Groshek 36 34 44 47 161
8 Amy Haddad 21 22 63 63 169
9 Lea Waide 42 43 59 27 171
10 Hollie Stewart 61 58 54 8 181
11 Bridgette Murray 67 69 40 45 221
12 Lori Kimes 59 49 53 68 229
13 Christy Green 66 62 41 69 238
14 Rosalina Vanterpool 47 61 65 66 239
15 Allison Daughtry 75 74 63 51 263
16 Jennifer Cassety 76 78 80 74 308
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Complete Figure Results:
1 Andrea Dumon 9 8 17
2 Heather Green 9 14 23
3 Chastity Slone 17 11 28
4 Michelle Adams 19 22 41
5 Hazel Nelson 24 26 50
6 Paola Almerico 29 31 60
7 Jelena Abbou 36 31 67
8 Jennifer Cook 45 44 89
9 Lilsa Morton 41 52 93
10 Debbie Leung 54 50 104
11 Becky Clawson 53 53 106
12 Danielle Hollanshade 55 54 109
13 Thais Cabrices 71 61 132
14 Shelly Taucher 75 75 150
15 Cheri Lewis 80 73 153
16 Alti Bautista 75 79 154
16 Carina Dupree 79 77 156
16 Marie Gibbon 76 80 156
16 Jamie Senuk 77 80 157
16 Alejandra Abdala 80 80 160
16 Marie Allegro 80 80 160
16 Claire Parmley 80 80 160
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Congrats to Heather for making it to the Olympia on her pro debut! She battled her way through the earlier NPC shows this year and was victorious at Team U.
Props to Hazel Nelson for cracking the top 5 in her pro debut. She placed second behind Krissy Chin in New York earlier this year to earn her pro card.
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Lisa Aukland your 2007 Overall Female Bodybuilding champion.
Female Bodybuilders:
Light-Weight:
1 Nicole Ball USA 10 5 5 20
2 Klaudia Larson Sweden 30 12 13 55
3 Angela Debatin USA 32 16 16 64
4 Joanna Thomas USA 38 20 21 79
5 Debbie Bramwell USA 40 21 19 80
6 Carla Salotti USA 62 30 92
7 Emery Miller USA 70 35 105
8 Giusy Caputo Italy 88 43 131
9 Melanie Derosa Bermuda 86 49 135
10 Nadia Nardi Canada 88 48 136
11 Claudia Partenza Italy 110 50 160
12 Elizabeth Meza Gomez Venezuela 120 60 180
13 Mary Ellen Jerumbo USA 130 65 195
Heavy-Weight:
1 Lisa Aukland USA 10 5 5 20
2 Betty Viana-Adkins USA 22 10 10 42
3 Debi Laszewski USA 32 17 15 64
4 Lora Ottenad USA 38 19 21 78
5 Heather Foster USA 52 26 24 102
6 Beth Roberts USA 64 34 98
7 Helen Bouchard Canada 74 32 106
8 Mario Calo USA 78 41 119
9 Jana Linke-Sippl Germany 82 44 126
10 Wendy Mccready United Kingdom 104 51 155
11 Zoraida Figueroa-Rivera Puerto Rico 112 57 169
12 Brenda Raganot USA 116 59 175
13 Mercedes Bazemore USA 136 70 206
14 Marika Johansson Sweden 144 69 213
15 Irene Anderson Sweden 150 78 228
16 Aurelia Grozajova Slovakia 152 76 228
16 Carmella Cureton USA 158 80 238
16 Irina Veselova Russia 160 78 238
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Then become a judge and make a change that way. Who in your opinion, should have been top 5 Mr. Adonis?
I said I don't want to name any names on here, but I definitely have a top 5 list in mind. Again, the problem is the judging here. If you aren't consistent with the judging, then it has no merit. Why would you place a conditioned athlete right beside an unconditioned one? NO CONSISTENCY! I don't think that I could be a judge because I don't want to play this game that they call competition. It's not just a sport any more, it's a business.
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Just posted some pix from finals on our boards and site:
http://www.genexmagazine.com - going to drink a few with folks now so more pix later!
gene
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Full scorecards and results at:
http://www.ifbbpro.com/results/atlantic-city-pro-2/
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Congrats everyone!
Did you miss me...? Come on, you missed me, didn't y'all??!! ;)
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I agree Isaac. Alti does look good but not the best. The problem is the back of her legs are not even close to being tight as compared to the rest of her body. From the front she looks good although the legs are a tiny bit over powering. But from the back her back looks good but the back of her legs look bad. If she was tighter from the back she might of been called out sooner. Its between Christy and Heather in mind opnion. Again we are looking for overall look. Not just the body but the whole presentation. ;D
Her legs from the rear are tighter than those of the top 5. Her whole structure was better than any girls in the show. But, this is a figure show & I can never understand out what the judges are looking for. It seems that they want the girls who have no hint of any muscular shape/development to win...
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Ah I don't think so. ???
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Her legs from the rear are tighter than those of the top 5. Her whole structure was better than any girls in the show. But, this is a figure show & I can never understand out what the judges are looking for. It seems that they want the girls who have no hint of any muscular shape/development to win...
Most assinine statement of the year.
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Congrats to Andrea for her win ;)!
Congrats to Heather on her awesome PRO debut and for qualifying for the Olympia-definitely well deserved!
Congrats to my friend Claire who comes in improved and stronger each show-great conditioning and shape!
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Most assinine statement of the year.
Look at the pics, and you tell me if my statement is assinine.
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Just wanted to share my opinions of the pro fitness show since I got to see it from a new perspective (sitting pregnant in the audience rather than competing on stage :) )...
First of all, after viewing the score cards I have to say that the routines were actually scored fairly. Usually, in the IFBB whatever a competitor scores in physique rounds seems to be how she scores in the routine rounds regardless of how different the scores should be. In this show, it actually seemed that the routine rounds shifted the final placings (as they should-this is "fitness" after all). The only exceptions to this were Julie Lohre's 2-minute which should have placed 1st (or at least higher than 7th ??? ) and Bridgette Murrays 2-minute which should have placed higher as well.
As for final placings, I believe Julie Lohre should have placed first considering her overall package is awesome. Again, if her routine were judged fairly that would have happened. I think Bethany's physique was incredible and she deserved her placing. I think Tracy's Physique was also amazing (as always), but not sure why some of the other routines placed so much lower than hers.
In general though, it seemed much more fair than the Europa and certainly the NY Pro.
Congrats ladies and good luck at the "O"
-Katie Szep
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Life will be a lot easier when everyone that does this accepts the fact that this is a BUSINESS, it is not an open/fair competition. It never has been and never will be. If you want fair judging, then judges need to be detached from the industry. Name one form of competition in which the HEAD judge has a family business which "manages" athletes that compete within the same business? I don't understand why people get upset over placings. It's not as if you were green to this before getting involved. You competed at the state and national level before you got to this point. This has been talked about for years.
If you aren't competing for the FUN of it, then you're in it for all the wrong reasons. The people that compete DO NOT MAKE MONEY. Even the most "successful" athletes aren't that successful when you look at the time put into it. Do it for fun or don't do it all. If you expected things to be fair, you're in the wrong field.
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I thought Jelena should have placed higher in the figure.
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The judging can be a difficult thing to decipher, but I refuse to be this pessimistic about the business. For the most part, looking back on shows, top five placings can be somehow justified. Athletes look great or they look pretty good. The problem arises when you have a couple of competitors who come in looking incredible, like a Claire Parmley, yet that athlete comes in outside of the top ten. Some athletes get overlooked and that doesn't seem right, and it's hard to defend .... you just have to say what you think about that competitor and hope that they stay at it to change the direction of the sport. The sad thing would be if top level competitors with all the qualities and tools decided to give up. As far as the money, yes a lot more of it needs to be directed to the athletes themselves rather than going to line the pockets of the federations and their corporate allies.
Life will be a lot easier when everyone that does this accepts the fact that this is a BUSINESS, it is not an open/fair competition. It never has been and never will be. If you want fair judging, then judges need to be detached from the industry. Name one form of competition in which the HEAD judge has a family business which "manages" athletes that compete within the same business? I don't understand why people get upset over placings. It's not as if you were green to this before getting involved. You competed at the state and national level before you got to this point. This has been talked about for years.
If you aren't competing for the FUN of it, then you're in it for all the wrong reasons. The people that compete DO NOT MAKE MONEY. Even the most "successful" athletes aren't that successful when you look at the time put into it. Do it for fun or don't do it all. If you expected things to be fair, you're in the wrong field.
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Name one form of competition in which the HEAD judge has a family business which "manages" athletes that compete within the same business?
Quite disturbing...
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Someone will always be unhappy, it's called life. I don't see what the big hub-bub is with this show. The judging seemed fair with what was presented at this show. I'm still waiting for those who are complaining to share who they think should have been in the top 5.
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Ms. Szep I like your posts, kick in more often ;)
As far as the figure judging, I really did just give up trying to sort that out some time back. For the life of me I don't see what placed Alti last. Moronic post here I know, but at pro level basically 90% of the figure girls look fantastic, so I cannot decipher.
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I'm one of the few who's been on ALL sides of this sport. From fan, company owner and someone that has dated women that compete. I've held my own pro show and been to tons of national level events. Everyone knows that shows can be rigged. We've all seen it happen. My comments have NOTHING to do with this show as I haven't looked at pics. Pics aren't live either, so keep that in mind. Nothing is ever directly done. Everything is via unwritten, but obvious actions. This isn't a real sport. The rules aren't enforced. They are broken ALL the time, especially in fitness. One of my favorites is watching a girl NOT finish her routine, which is a mandatory last place for that round, yet she was scored and placed in the top 8 overall. When the judges don't know the rules, how can you expect anything to be fair?
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Congrats to Heather for making it to the Olympia on her pro debut! She battled her way through the earlier NPC shows this year and was victorious at Team U. She's the look figure shoul be about.
Props to Hazel Nelson for cracking the top 5 in her pro debut. She placed second behind Krissy Chin in New York earlier this year to earn her pro card.
Heather looked amazing! WOW!!!! :o
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Life will be a lot easier when everyone that does this accepts the fact that this is a BUSINESS, it is not an open/fair competition. It never has been and never will be. If you want fair judging, then judges need to be detached from the industry. Name one form of competition in which the HEAD judge has a family business which "manages" athletes that compete within the same business? I don't understand why people get upset over placings. It's not as if you were green to this before getting involved. You competed at the state and national level before you got to this point. This has been talked about for years.
If you aren't competing for the FUN of it, then you're in it for all the wrong reasons. The people that compete DO NOT MAKE MONEY. Even the most "successful" athletes aren't that successful when you look at the time put into it. Do it for fun or don't do it all. If you expected things to be fair, you're in the wrong field.
This post is not fair. :-\
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Why is it not fair? Because it's honest? Of ALL people you know everything I said is true. Heaven forbid I become the voice of reason by saying people should compete for FUN rather than the misguided hope that a pot of gold is waiting for them.
If you don't see the OBVIOUS issues with a judging panel being ran by a person who also manages the very people he judges, well...nevermind.
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people should compete for FUN rather than the misguided hope that a pot of gold is waiting for them.
I agree so much with this, especially for women. I am not sure how much one can make at $12.95 p.m, performing on webcam shows, selling pics and all of that.......but to think there is a pot of gold in the womens physique arena is not wise. I compete, love it, but seek my 'pot of gold' through business interests, like many other girls do. Those that seek 'fame and fortune' will be sorely dissapointed.
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Heaven forbid I become the voice of reason
LORD HELP US ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Is this the one that competed? She must be "off-season"
DENNY CRANE
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LORD HELP US ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Is this the one that competed? She must be "off-season"
DENNY CRANE
thanks champ, for showing us all how u practice for ur hot dates
:o
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First, I have to apologize For initially saying the Women didn't look to Hot!! I actually took some time and looked at more pics and must say, as a group they look pretty decent. However, I still like my figure women a little Tighter. Second, Congratulations to Andrea!!!! She has a lovely body. She should have won a top show a long time ago. Alti did look fantastic and I hope she doesn't get discouraged!!!! I have a reputation for being honest!!!! That means I don't always say whats popular or politically correct. I can piss some competitors off. I have told a couple of women I trained who actually made the top three, that they looked like shit!!!! Should have place last, if I was the judge. Understand, I didn't tell them to do the show in the first place. If I did, would tell them don't worry about the placings. I even told my Wife that she looked like a cow in two of her shows. I'm Brutally honest. Anyway, I spoke to Soon!!! SORRY!!!!! MY BAD!!!! FORGIVE ME PLEASE?
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Congrats to Andrea for her win ;)!
Congrats to Heather on her awesome PRO debut and for qualifying for the Olympia-definitely well deserved!
Congrats to my friend Claire who comes in improved and stronger each show-great conditioning and shape!
Krissy,
You were sorely missed at this show! I hated not having you there!! Thanks so much for giving me a smile! I try to come in better at every show...just hope it will one day pay off. I love you girl!
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The judging can be a difficult thing to decipher, but I refuse to be this pessimistic about the business. For the most part, looking back on shows, top five placings can be somehow justified. Athletes look great or they look pretty good. The problem arises when you have a couple of competitors who come in looking incredible, like a Claire Parmley, yet that athlete comes in outside of the top ten. Some athletes get overlooked and that doesn't seem right, and it's hard to defend .... you just have to say what you think about that competitor and hope that they stay at it to change the direction of the sport. The sad thing would be if top level competitors with all the qualities and tools decided to give up. As far as the money, yes a lot more of it needs to be directed to the athletes themselves rather than going to line the pockets of the federations and their corporate allies.
Thank you so much for taking the time to make a post regarding me. You've been a true ego booster! ;D
I must say that this show was the FIRST to upset me regarding the placings. I have always competed b/c I love it and it is so much fun meeting most of these girls. I usually just grin and bear it no matter where I place...and then take the motivation from placing last to push me even harder until the next show. As long as I come in looking better at the next show, I don't get too upset with how I place. However, 3 shows in a row...placing DEAD LAST...well, it hurts a LITTLE. No worries though. I am still going to show up at the West Palm in 4 weeks in, ONCE AGAIN, better shape. So...time to get to work.....
Thanks again for your kind comments and motivation FigureRX!
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For those that don't know, Denny posted my myspace pic haha. www.myspace.com/my50nash. She's the best girl in competition. If she comes in to "full" you just let the air out of her before finals. She has great flexibility for the routine rounds.
Just remember, come into a show in what YOU think is your best shape. What a judge says at a show 2 weeks prior doesn't matter. I watched a girl, during the get hard as nails years of fitness, listen to judges. She kept getting harder and harder each national show. Go to dallas and all of a sudden she went from placing 3rd at the past two, to 8th. Seems a bunch of softies showed up, so it didn't matter what they had been saying. They just judged whatever. They can give you the excuses of "when your time is right", "you need more experience", that's all BS. I've seen tons of girls magically make it through on their first tries.
If you want to see one of the biggest setup crocks, go back and look at the arnold from 2-3 years ago. A girl was allowed to compete in figure that had NO CLUE what she was doing. She was ungodly out of shape vs the other girls and had NO clue how to pose. The arnold was her 4th show, EVER. Wonder how she got invited to that show? She must have known the right people wink wink.
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If you want to see one of the biggest setup crocks, go back and look at the arnold from 2-3 years ago. A girl was allowed to compete in figure that had NO CLUE what she was doing. She was ungodly out of shape vs the other girls and had NO clue how to pose. The arnold was her 4th show, EVER. Wonder how she got invited to that show? She must have known the right people wink wink.
I recall that well. The audience was astounded...that 'eerie' hush came over when she came out.
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You mean this....
And btw, you say allowed, you meant "invited" right?
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First things first - YES Sandra, WE MISSED YOU!!!!!!!! It is actually funny you asked because backstage (ok on stage too while warming up routines before night show with our typical 'it's time to have fun' Kimes style dancing) we were saying just that. For those of you that have never been backstage to see the crazy trail mix eating, dancing and singing fitness competitors hopped up on adrenaline and sugar, I just have to say, you are missing out. And while we had a great time, it just is not the same without Sandra (actually, Semsch too - we missed her at the last few shows). By the way, good luck this weekend, we will be watching ;)
Many have said it and they are sooo right - if this ain't fun, don't do it. This sport should be about finding your own personal best. My goal with each show is to come in better than I did the time before and to learn something new about myself. The process that gets you to the show, as hard and trying as it maybe, is the reason to do it. Knowing that you can shape your body the way YOU want it to be is the goal. Overcoming obstacles, being creative and balancing life in the meantime are the challenges that make it worthwhile. Is it hard – heck yes, but everything worth doing is hard.
Here is how I really feel - after so many months of intense training and dieting the show should be your icing – your time to stand on stage and say – ‘look what I did’. It is an incredible privilege to get to compete as an IFBB Pro and I thank God that I have been able to make it onto that stage in the first place. Don't get me wrong, I want to win and work my ass off to do the best I possibly can, but I try to come into every show feeling like I have accomplished a personal win regardless of what the judges say. Because with all due respect to the judges, I have to live with the body that I create and the name that I make for myself. Of course, it is nice to do well and a little easier to say after 11 pro shows :)
Katie, it was great to see you, we definitely miss you and I am so glad that you enjoyed my routine. The crowd participation made it really fun and I walked off stage thrilled with what I had done. Actually, I still think that round was my best round personally in Atlantic City so I am happy.
Anyhow, the show was a very good experience and I am so excited to see some new women with strong routines competing. Erin & Holly had incredible routines and I really enjoyed watching them. Congrats to Tracy on another pro win! Bethany Gainey looked amazing and I really like her physique. Congratulations and I look forward to competing with you at the Olympia!
See you all next week!
Julie Lohre
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Amazing how people remember exactly what you're talking about, even when it was years ago. Now how could something like that happen? The show that is supposed to only invite the best, invited a girl that didn't even know the poses? How would you like to be a girl sitting in the crowd that got turned down? I have so many good stories, but I have to respect some of the other people that are involved in those stories. It's a crooked industry, always has, always will be.
To all fitness/figure girls. If you ever want to have a chance in hell of placing, don't associate with me. From these postings, I will be blackballed by the IFBB/NPC groupies. Not that I give two flying flips, but for your own sake :).
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Julie!!
Thanks for the comment about my routine! It's funny, I scored better in the 45 second round, but I consider my 2 minute routine to be my strongest round...go figure.
Oh well, it was a great experience, i am vey pleased with how I did, and I really am looking forward to making some improvements in my physique and getting back on stage in 2008 :)
Julie, your physique is absolutely amazing and so was your 2 minute routine (I too thought you would win the show). More than that, it was really nice of you to help me keep my nerves in check and help make me feel comfortable in my pro debut. Thanks so much, I really appreciate it!
I hope you have a great time at the Olympia. I know you will do awesome...kick some butt!!!
Keep training hard everyone!
Erin
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Thanks Erin! I am so excited for you - 6th at your pro debut in what I consider to be one of the toughests fitness shows this year : ) You are going to be a force in 08. Keep working hard
Julie ;D
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Yes, Sandra we missed you!! :-*
Well, I HAD FUN!!! I just go to dance on stage and eat trail mix back stage!! ;)
Hehehehe!!
Congrats everyone! Bethany looked great ans deserved the Q for the "O"
Julie I think you have a great chance of cracking the top 6 at the "O"
Keep up the great work and the great attitude!
I had a great time with my roomie Claire Parmley who definitely got over looked in Fig.
And I want to give a shout out to Mandy Polk who I had a great time hanging out with after the show & in the airport. Your a very sweet girl and I wish you a speedy recovery on your hamstring!
God bless everyone!
Lorie
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I even told my Wife that she looked like a cow in two of her shows. I'm Brutally honest.
I hope she bitch slapped you after telling her that.
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Amazing how people remember exactly what you're talking about, even when it was years ago. Now how could something like that happen? The show that is supposed to only invite the best, invited a girl that didn't even know the poses? How would you like to be a girl sitting in the crowd that got turned down? I have so many good stories, but I have to respect some of the other people that are involved in those stories. It's a crooked industry, always has, always will be.
To all fitness/figure girls. If you ever want to have a chance in hell of placing, don't associate with me. From these postings, I will be blackballed by the IFBB/NPC groupies. Not that I give two flying flips, but for your own sake :).
You had your own business in the industry and now that you're out of it you want to belittle it? Doesn't that make you a bit of a "crook"?
The Arnold is by invite only and who gets invited is ultimately up to Jim Lormier. I asked about why Jen Hartley was invited to the Arnold and was told that came directly from Jim Lormier. 2 years later, what difference does it make? Many competitors come and go, very few stick around for the long haul.
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I hope she bitch slapped you after telling her that.
No offense FG, but I honestly thought along those lines when I read that also....
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I hope she bitch slapped you after telling her that.
Alexis is harder on herself than I could ever be. However, she is Dominican, and would Bitch Slap me if you knew she could get away with it. However, I'm 6"2 220lbs & From Inglewood Ca. Know one is ever going to think about Bitch Slapping me. However, People do respect honesty!!!! NO Women likes a Man who is To Much of a Pussy!! to tell the Truth!!!
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Alexis is harder on herself than I could ever be. However, she is Dominican, and would Bitch Slap me if you knew she could get away with it. However, I'm 6"2 220lbs & From Inglewood Ca. Know one is ever going to think about Bitch Slapping me. However, People do respect honesty!!!! NO Women likes a Man who is To Much of a Pussy!! to tell the Truth!!!
There's a thing called respect and tact, to call your wife "a cow" is disrespectful and rude.
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There's a thing called respect and tact, to call your wife "a cow" is disrespectful and rude.
I concur. If Alexis is happy being called a cow, and also having her husband tell the world - cool...and I do not meant that snidely, I am serious, if that is cool by her great - but for me, I would simply not accept that and if Alexis is a cow, my god, I am a super whale as her level of conditioning makes me look obese.
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You had your own business in the industry and now that you're out of it you want to belittle it? Doesn't that make you a bit of a "crook"?
Yes I had my own business in this industry. My comment about "this" industry is the competition side. The reason why I kept my mouth shut before is that I often dated girls that competed. It wasn't fair for me to voice the truth and have it hurt them and hteir placings. So while I appreciate your attempt to take my comments out of context, you know what I'm saying is true. I used my influence in this industry to help people in the past. That is why I call this crooked, because I've done it.
The Arnold is by invite only and who gets invited is ultimately up to Jim Lormier. I asked about why Jen Hartley was invited to the Arnold and was told that came directly from Jim Lormier. 2 years later, what difference does it make? Many competitors come and go, very few stick around for the long haul.
Because it's an example of how even on the highest level things aren't fair. She was let in as a favor. I know who asked and I know why she was let in. I can't believe of ALL people that you don't see the competition side of things as crooked. Then again, you're still involved and can't piss off the "wrong" people. I know what that feels like
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First of all, I said she looked like a Cow for a Show. I think my wife looks Great in General. However, when I look bad I expect the Truth. If I call someone a name, it's all in Fun!!! However, they get the point. I get called worse sometimes, so you don't have to feel sorry for Alexis, my Clients or Me. We can all take it!!!! I think your missing the point. I have a reputation for holding no Punches, some people could consider some of the things I do and say as disrespectful!!! I can live with that. All the women and clients that I train have my admiration and respect!!! My actions prove that. However, I believe in "tough love". Not everyone responds well to having there ego constantly Stroked!!! Yes, all the Pro Women athletes are amazing, they just don't need to be told that all the time, especially when it is not appropriate. I do not have what it takes to be a pro Athlete, However, I do have what it takes to train them.
I concur. If Alexis is happy being called a cow, and also having her husband tell the world - cool...and I do not meant that snidely, I am serious, if that is cool by her great - but for me, I would simply not accept that and if Alexis is a cow, my god, I am a super whale as her level of conditioning makes me look obese.
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There's a thing called respect and tact, to call your wife "a cow" is disrespectful and rude.
by the way "Lift Studio". I'm not trying to win a popularity contest. There is a reason why I can take a overweight person and make them look amazing!!!! I can be Mean, Rude, Hard, disrespectful, but I get results. My way of motivating people and training is NOT for everyone. I can be a complete Asshole!!!!. However, ask my wife, Clients or anyone else who has ever been trained by me. I put my heart and Soul into everyone I train. My family, friends, clients and wife are very loyal to me for a reason. NO ONE WANTS TO HEAR THE TRUTH!!! NO MATTER HOW MUCH HONEY AND SUGAR YOU PUT ON IT!!!!
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First of all, I said she looked like a Cow for a Show. I think my wife looks Great in General. However, when I look bad I expect the Truth. If I call someone a name, it's all in Fun!!! However, they get the point. I get called worse sometimes, so you don't have to feel sorry for Alexis, my Clients or Me. We can all take it!!!! I think your missing the point. I have a reputation for holding no Punches, some people could consider some of the things I do and say as disrespectful!!! I can live with that. All the women and clients that I train have my admiration and respect!!! My actions prove that. However, I believe in "tough love". Not everyone responds well to having there ego constantly Stroked!!! Yes, all the Pro Women athletes are amazing, they just don't need to be told that all the time, especially when it is not appropriate. I do not have what it takes to be a pro Athlete, However, I do have what it takes to train them.
Like I said, if Alexis is cool with that cool, that's great for you guys - I merely said I would not personally accept it. Before I got into this game, I was 200lbs+, and my 1st husband never once called me a "cow" despite the fact that I totally was [;D]. It's all personal preference, but for me I would simply find it unacceptable. But again I will say - if you guys are cool with it that's all that matters, but I was just giving my opinion.
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by the way "Lift Studio". I'm not trying to win a popularity contest. There is a reason why I can take a overweight person and make them look amazing!!!! I can be Mean, Rude, Hard, disrespectful, but I get results. My way of motivating people and training is NOT for everyone. I can be a complete Asshole!!!!. However, ask my wife, Clients or anyone else who has ever been trained by me. I put my heart and Soul into everyone I train. My family, friends, clients and wife are very loyal to me for a reason. NO ONE WANTS TO HEAR THE TRUTH!!! NO MATTER HOW MUCH HONEY AND SUGAR YOU PUT ON IT!!!!
That's great mang whatever floats your boat. Different people respond to different things. It's one thing if it's a client, I'd think it would be a little different with one's spouse. Like CQ said, if that works for you, cool. I'd have a little more respect for my wife than to call her a "cow" but if that works for you two, so be it.
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I had a great time with my roomie Claire Parmley who definitely got over looked in Fig.
And I want to give a shout out to Mandy Polk who I had a great time hanging out with after the show & in the airport. Your a very sweet girl and I wish you a speedy recovery on your hamstring!
Thanks Lorie! I had so much fun with you after the show and stealing bagels in the airport. Well, not really stealing, we DID pay for them, right? ;D You looked great and I can't wait to see you again and hopefully compete with you next year.
Claire Parmley looked amazing as well. I was really disappointed she didn't get a better callout.
Julie was fabulous and had a fun routine. I enjoyed talking to she and her husband, they're great people.
Congratulations to everyone who qualified for the O and to all the competitors for showing up and doing their best!
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Then again, you're still involved and can't piss off the "wrong" people.
Lift definitely lacks balls integrity as far as that's concerned - you are 100% correct there, 1Fast.
That being said, Lift does bring some talent to the table with respect to his web design and photography skills, but when it comes to offering an objective view of anything in the industry, his opinions are anything but (objective).
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i just want some fit gourmet oatmeal
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I love you Tre!!!!! :-*
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Lift definitely lacks balls integrity as far as that's concerned - you are 100% correct there, 1Fast.
That being said, Lift does bring some talent to the table with respect to his web design and photography skills, but when it comes to offering an objective view of anything in the industry, his opinions are anything but (objective).
I lack integrity by not bashing on an industry that helps pay my bills? ::) The same industry that you make money at mind you, Tre. If it weren't for the IFBB/NPC where would you find all your schmoe material?
Mike do you want a medal or a chest to pin it on when it comes to you sounding off now? I agree with you about having fun when it comes to competing but for you to spout off now, what are you trying to prove? You didn't have the balls to say it when you're girlfriend was competing at the Arnold because of you, oh wait you didn't want to hurt her placings that's why. ::)
For anyone complain about "politics" is a load of shit. The same politics one wins by are the same ones they loose by. Politics are involved in most everything in life. This is the same story every year around this time that people complain about. WAAAAAAAAAAAA :'(
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Yes, Sandra we missed you!! :-*
Well, I HAD FUN!!! I just go to dance on stage and eat trail mix back stage!! ;)
Hehehehe!!
Congrats everyone! Bethany looked great ans deserved the Q for the "O"
Julie I think you have a great chance of cracking the top 6 at the "O"
Keep up the great work and the great attitude!
I had a great time with my roomie Claire Parmley who definitely got over looked in Fig.
And I want to give a shout out to Mandy Polk who I had a great time hanging out with after the show & in the airport. Your a very sweet girl and I wish you a speedy recovery on your hamstring!
God bless everyone!
Lorie
Hey Lorie!
I had a blast roomie! Thanks for the kind message...you looked awesome, too! Let's have more fun at West Palm!
Congratulations to all the girls!
Congrats to Heather on her first pro show...way to go to get that O qualification so quickly! You were super sweet backstage. I hope us Georgia girls can hang out together sometime soon!
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I lack integrity by not bashing on an industry that helps pay my bills? The same industry that you make money at mind you, Tre. If it weren't for the IFBB/NPC where would you find all your schmoe material?
I don't think either of you are really doing it for the money. Issac, you provide a great service for a lot of people. I'd say it's a pretty thankless job, given the amount of time and effort you put into it vs the pay you get. You obviously do it because you love the sport, not for money. There is nothing wrong with that.
Mike do you want a medal or a chest to pin it on when it comes to you sounding off now?
Not at all. I just want people to quit turning a blind eye to what is right in front of them.
I agree with you about having fun when it comes to competing but for you to spout off now, what are you trying to prove? You didn't have the balls to say it when you're girlfriend was competing at the Arnold because of you, oh wait you didn't want to hurt her placings that's why.
Well, like usual, you go off spouting as if you know what you're talking about when you don't. I wasn't dating her when she competed at the Arnold. We hadn't been dating for 6 months. I'm not trying to PROVE anything issac. I don't have a dog in this fight, unlike you. That is why I can be truthfull about the things in this industry, unlike you. You are right, I didn't upset the waters, because competing is a game. A game I was in a position to play. What do you tell someone who doesn't know a single person in this industry that goes to compete? Oh I'm sorry, you just don't know/pay the right people? Issac, you come off as an IFBB puppet if you disagree with any of this. We all know that money gets shoved into people's pockets and favors get traded out all the time. I put over 75k dollars in the IFBB's pocket putting on the charlotte pro, you think if I wanted someone to place a little higher it couldn't be done? How about an IFBB pro coming to me telling me that if I gave him a good deal on raw materials he could put anyone I wanted in the top 3? How was he able to do that? Simple, he had dinner with two judges that night, I saw it. I thought he was bs'ing, at the time I was single but had a friend in the show. What do you know, she got in the top 3. I saw a sheet of paper with numbers written on it as to who needed to be placed near the top. He didn't ask me her name, he didn't care. He just wanted her suit number.
See these are things you only hear about issac, I experienced them. Does it happen at every show, of course not, but it does happen. I would give anything for these competitions to be 100% fair, as they are so much fun to watch.
For anyone complain about "politics" is a load of shit. The same politics one wins by are the same ones they loose by. Politics are involved in most everything in life. This is the same story every year around this time that people complain about. WAAAAAAAAAAAA
It isn't a load of shit. Some people can't play the politics. There are tons of people that compete that don't know anyone, they can't play the game. It's only fair when everyone is on the same level and everyone can play by the same rules. I never once asked for anyone to be placed anywhere. Things were offered to me because I was in a position to give back.
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Well personally I absolutely love the input of Tre, 1Fast400 and Lift. No disrespect intendend, but without those 3's input this board would basically be a boring graveyard with just threads of people spamming their sites/services and blatantly politically correct posts from girls. Like them all or not - those guys keep this board interesting - so thanks to them.
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Thank you so much for taking the time to make a post regarding me. You've been a true ego booster! ;D
I must say that this show was the FIRST to upset me regarding the placings. I have always competed b/c I love it and it is so much fun meeting most of these girls. I usually just grin and bear it no matter where I place...and then take the motivation from placing last to push me even harder until the next show. As long as I come in looking better at the next show, I don't get too upset with how I place. However, 3 shows in a row...placing DEAD LAST...well, it hurts a LITTLE. No worries though. I am still going to show up at the West Palm in 4 weeks in, ONCE AGAIN, better shape. So...time to get to work.....
Thanks again for your kind comments and motivation FigureRX!
I think it was a crime placing you last. You look outstanding, and you are a class act!
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Well personally I absolutely love the input of Tre, 1Fast400 and Lift. No disrespect intendend, but without those 3's input this board would basically be a boring graveyard with just threads of people spamming their sites/services and blatantly politically correct posts from girls. Like them all or not - those guys keep this board interesting - so thanks to them.
totally agree
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I'm craving that mongolian beef I had with you in vegas a few weeks ago. I got 8 more weeks of dieting though :(
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I'm craving that mongolian beef I had with you in vegas a few weeks ago. I got 8 more weeks of dieting though :(
too bad you had ur date... i could have given you other cravings ya know
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First
(http://i11.tinypic.com/63mr1c9.jpg)
Second
(http://i15.tinypic.com/4puifpc.jpg)
Seventh
(http://i8.tinypic.com/4kcrcpv.jpg)
Looking at those 3 photos, easy to see who has the best mid section, shoulders, symmetry, skin tone, face......even the best suit!
Correct me if im wrong but isnt that how Figure is judged?!?!?
Talk about the competition being crooked. I think the judges need glasses.
::)
Tough luck Jelena, u easily deserved Top 3
By going what i see there, you could def give the Olympia girls a run for their money!
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Ha ha, well Marc you did pick the two most unflattering photos of the first two athletes. Heather deserves to be up there, she's much more symmetrical than she appears to be in that picture. ::) As you know we picked Jelena to win in Atlantic City but unfortunately the conditioning in her upper legs wasn't where we would have liked to see it. So I can definitely see the reasoning behind her placing.
We'll just keep plugging along until we can make the figure judging be about the things that matter, and I suggest that others do as well - it's about shape, mass, symmetry, beauty, small joints, bling, you know the drill ... and then the conditioning and the thin skin without holding water that makes *all* the desirable qualities most visible. All of the above attributes can be found in figure athletes with a lot of muscle or with less muscle, and that's a good thing and both physique types should be rewarded - we have absolutely no problem with seeing athletes with a lot of muscle standing next to smaller athletes in the same top five, that is within the judging criteria. It's the penalty for conditioning that we disagree with - and that seems to change over time. The second thing that is maddening is this notion that the physiques on stage need to be attainable to average people ... the idea that if Jane Doe sees herself winning in her mind then show entries will increase and more of the money that should go to athletes (the people who do the *real* work) will end up in other hands. That's sad, no other sport tries to make their success more attainable by lowering qualifications. I would love to see a trend where we award excellent physiques at all levels, and believe me there are a lot of people who we are tracking who haven't even hit a local figure stage yet but who have *huge* potential.
I still think that athletes can come out of nowhere with the best physique and win shows without having any politics involved - in fact it happened many, many times already this year. I know several figure athletes who won their class and turned pro this year without one stitch of politics on their side. Every now and then you see something that is obviously political and that makes no sense, like a couple of the height classes at the 2006 Junior Nationals, or the really bad results at the 2007 Europa Pro. But the whole situation is not nearly as dramatically bad as people make it out to be.
Stephen
Team FigureRX
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Those pics do tell a story huh!
Lets have another look....are upper legs more important than a smaller waist? better skin tone? face? shoulders? suit?
(http://i10.tinypic.com/5zpunev.jpg)
(http://i15.tinypic.com/5xh8w42.jpg)
(http://i15.tinypic.com/5y35o3q.jpg)
Upper legs conditioning aside, in every other aspect, Jelena has the other two girls measure and then some!
Heather looks good, but Jelena has a better V taper, better skin tone, prettier face, even better knees...geez
:o
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and believe me there are a lot of people who we are tracking who haven't even hit a local figure stage yet but who have *huge* potential.
What do they get for this huge potential? Suits that cost 1000 bucks, countless "expenses" associated with getting on stage and you get to piss your spouse off for 12 weeks haha. Any girl I see attempting to compete in the NPC route, that actually has an attractive face, I discourage. I tell them to try real modeling, at least they might get paid and won't have to kill themselves. We all know stepping on a stage puts a lot of stress on the body. Not to mention the drugs that are so commonly used these days. This is the problem when you have people with below average genetics trying to compete with a select few that can do it naturally (VERY few). There is a reason I don't do bodybuilding shows, I don't have the frame for it. If I were going to, I'd have to juice up big time. I'll stick to hanging around 170ish pounds and staying lean, but I'm 6' tall.
You are right, there are a lot of shows that don't have the political impact that others do. However, that doesn't mean the judging panel did a good job when they judged.
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Looking at those 3 photos, easy to see who has the best mid section, shoulders, symmetry, skin tone, face......even the best suit!
Correct me if im wrong but isnt that how Figure is judged?!?!?
Talk about the competition being crooked. I think the judges need glasses.
::)
Tough luck Jelena, u easily deserved Top 3
By going what i see there, you could def give the Olympia girls a run for their money!
Do you enjoy talking out of your ass? I'll correct you, no that's not how figure is judged. It's not an abs and shoulders contest combined with symmetry, skin tone, pretty face and a nice suit. There are a few other body parts you left out. Why don't you take a look at the back shots. It's much more telling of who is a more deserved winner. 99% of the women on stage look great from the front and the model pose as you posted. Turn them around and you'll see a much different story on many of them.
There is no disputing Jelena is a beautiful woman. She's already accomplished more than most of the women on the figure stage ever will in terms of magazine covers, tv commercials and exposure. Jelena will continue to have success in her modeling career because of her curvy body and pretty face. However, her genetics will never allow her to give the "Olympia girls a run for their mone"y as you put it. That's reality. Which goes back to competing because you enjoy it and have fun with it.
At the end of the day any of these women are turning heads left and right in their every day lives. When you put your self worth into your placing in a subjective competition, you'll never be happy.
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There is no disputing Jelena is a beautiful woman. She's already accomplished more than most of the women on the figure stage ever will in terms of magazine covers, tv commercials and exposure. Jelena will continue to have success in her modeling career because of her curvy body and pretty face.
That's the problem, figure was CREATED under the premise that those type of women would win. To me, the irony that a woman has actually accomplished so much outside of Figure, ends up placing way back, is funny. Most women would die to be on covers, commercials and so on. Isn't that the LOOK they should want in figure. You know, one that actually is desirable by mainstream?
Lets face it, you show any average person a picture of someone on stage and they freak out. Figure shouldn't be that way IMO.
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That's the problem, figure was CREATED under the premise that those type of women would win.
NO... Figure was created as an avenue for Fitness girls (with little skill but great structure) to keep competing without almost killing themselves trying to do routines they were not skilled enough to perform. And now today there are girls competing who only dreamed about it before because they knew they lacked the gymnastic skills to step on stage.
Because Figure is part of the overall Bodybuilding and Fitness show it only makes sense that the competitors would have a harder more muscular look. It was expected that Figure would resemble the prime years of female bodybuilding when Rachel and Cory were physique stars, but in a slightly softer form... and I believe it has achieved that.
What you are referring to does exist... it is called Hawaiian Tropic!!!
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NO... Figure was created as an avenue for Fitness girls (with little skill but great structure) to keep competing without almost killing themselves trying to do routines they were not skilled enough to perform. And now today there are girls competing who only dreamed about it before because they knew they lacked the gymnastic skills to step on stage.
So instead of having girls hurt themselves attempting a routine, we have them pumping themselves full of drugs, much better. You still have the same issue. A girl starts out natural and does decent on the local level. Then she gets beat on the state level, which begins her route into drugs. If you don't think drugs are everywhere in figure, then someone please explain the massive backne see on national level shows. Team U was horrible and that's a drug tested show! Girls who don't have the genetics to achieve what VERY few girls can will find the short cuts needed to get there. I think some girls confuse clen with smarties with the way they take them. Anavar, winny, clen, t3 and aldactone are all things VERY commonly found on this level. Just go grab some pictures of these girls 4-5 years before they made it. Amazing how bone structure changes.
Because Figure is part of the overall Bodybuilding and Fitness show it only makes sense that the competitors would have a harder more muscular look. It was expected that Figure would resemble the prime years of female bodybuilding when Rachel and Cory were physique stars, but in a slightly softer form... and I believe it has achieved that. What you are referring to does exist... it is called Hawaiian Tropic!!!
Take any girl that was on stage at this show and put them on stage when they were 4-5 weeks out. That is the look that needs to be accepted. Girls won't have to kill themselves, it will be FAR from a hawaiian tropic contest and you're still putting girls who are in excellent shape on stage. Figure on the pro level has gone way to extreme. That's why this sport, on ALL levels has ZERO fan base. The only way promotors make money these day is by putting an NPC show with a pro show. Nobody comes to watch pro's. Families/friends come to watch the npc stuff and that saves it. The NPC knows that to, which is why they charge an ungodly admission price to come see it. They know families will pay for it.
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So instead of having girls hurt themselves attempting a routine, we have them pumping themselves full of drugs, much better. You still have the same issue. A girl starts out natural and does decent on the local level. Then she gets beat on the state level, which begins her route into drugs. If you don't think drugs are everywhere in figure, then someone please explain the massive backne see on national level shows. Team U was horrible and that's a drug tested show! Girls who don't have the genetics to achieve what VERY few girls can will find the short cuts needed to get there. I think some girls confuse clen with smarties with the way they take them. Anavar, winny, clen, t3 and aldactone are all things VERY commonly found on this level. Just go grab some pictures of these girls 4-5 years before they made it. Amazing how bone structure changes.
Well first off usage is the same in Fitness and Figure... AAS use is probably slightly higher in Fitness, and diuretic usage is probably equal in both. So your statement about "instead of having girls..." is stupid, because there is a 99% chance they already were anyway.
As far as usage goes... it is just like any other goal in a persons life and how much they want it, and what they are willing to do to get it. I have seen genetically gifted girls succeed without them, and I have seen girls who want it so bad they are willing to take whatever it takes to get it... and yes the latter group usually ends up screwed up for life (thyroid mostly).
I do however put a lot of the blame on wanna-be trainers out there who don't know enough about diet and nutrition and training... and they resort to putting their clients on AAS programs. It may have started innocent with just popping a diuretic the night before... but then the results are seen and it spirals from there.
Take any girl that was on stage at this show and put them on stage when they were 4-5 weeks out. That is the look that needs to be accepted. Girls won't have to kill themselves, it will be FAR from a hawaiian tropic contest and you're still putting girls who are in excellent shape on stage. Figure on the pro level has gone way to extreme. That's why this sport, on ALL levels has ZERO fan base. The only way promotors make money these day is by putting an NPC show with a pro show. Nobody comes to watch pro's. Families/friends come to watch the npc stuff and that saves it. The NPC knows that to, which is why they charge an ungodly admission price to come see it. They know families will pay for it.
That is just the natural progression of things... in NASCAR every year cars go faster, in bodybuilding every year guys get bigger, in women's bodybuilding things really went out of control so I won't go there... but you get my point. What starts out one way... keeps progressing and evolving... hopefully Figure doesn't evolve into something grotesque.
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Okay 1Fast400, you have plenty of federations and organizations out there that adhere to your standards of supplementation, physique, etc. This has become a completely different topic regarding the direction of the sport, it is no longer about judging. May I suggest you familiarize yourself with one of the other federations? I can't watch their figure and fitness shows because there's not enough muscle, the majority of the athletes carry too much body fat and look way too average to be impressive. The NPC (and to a lesser extent, the IFBB) is about achieving physique excellence. To me it is very similar to bodybuilding but with different physique goals, and those who don't agree with doing what it takes to strive for that "perfection," that total package, have many of other places to compete.
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I'm a little behind on my reading here, but just so there's no argument about one important point - Scooby is 100% correct about the true origin of IFBB/NPC figure competitions. The only difference between fitness and figure was that figure had no routines.
Looking at some of the judging decisions over the years, one might argue that figure has evolved from its early days, but in the beginning, the plan was for the figure physiques to be just as muscular, symmetrical, and conditioned as those in fitness.
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**yawn**
Nobody has yet to point out in the pictures i put up how Jelena comes Seventh and the other 2 girls come First & Second
Show those photos to 99% of people out there, and u clearly have one winner. Dont they wanna bring Figure to the masses after all!
Talk about Crapola!
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**yawn**
Nobody has yet to point out in the pictures i put up how Jelena comes Seventh and the other 2 girls come First & Second
Show those photos to 99% of people out there, and u clearly have one winner. Dont they wanna bring Figure to the masses after all!
Talk about Crapola!
Hell why don't we just judge the competitions by photos, from the front, in model poses? Whoever has the best model pose in the photo wins.
::)
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Well mate as we say back in Oz...
Do yourself a favour & pull out that finger from your backside, take a look at some rear shots which you deem so important and prove me wrong champ!
;D
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Hell why don't we just judge the competitions by photos, from the front, in model poses? Whoever has the best model pose in the photo wins.
::)
That's not a bad idea at all and I'm surprised that no one has taken the lead in doing something like this already.
You would slash overhead, allowing more of the pot to be paid directly to the pros instead of to the union workers.
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Dont they wanna bring Figure to the masses after all!
No, they don't.
The IFBB's profit model is vastly different from what you saw in Fitness America.
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No, they don't.
The IFBB's profit model is vastly different from what you saw in Fitness America.
so the IFBB doesnt want the sport to grow?? come on!
Every International Governing body in EVERY sport on the planet wants their sport to grow...gain more participants, money, coverage etc
Until they can judge properly, Figure is definitely going to be stumped to go anywhere.
Put this judging on TV and the average joe watching sport would laugh & change the channel!
Can anybody find the IFBB on a map of the world?
::)
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I think it was a crime placing you last. You look outstanding, and you are a class act!
Sioux,
You are the class act! Thank you so much! XOXOXOXOXO to you and all you do on MD!
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so the IFBB doesnt want the sport to grow?? come on!
Every International Governing body in EVERY sport on the planet wants their sport to grow...gain more participants, money, coverage etc
Until they can judge properly, Figure is definitely going to be stumped to go anywhere.
Put this judging on TV and the average joe watching sport would laugh & change the channel!
Can anybody find the IFBB on a map of the world?
::)
If it's such a joke why do you bother photographing it?
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If it's such a joke why do you bother photographing it?
If you did you research champ, you'd be making more intelligent statements. I dont shoot shows.
I shoot beautiful women, period.
Some of them may do fitness, figure or be a regular model. I dont discriminate.
So count my uninformed opinion with those of the 99% of other sport lovers around the globe who would agree Jelena looks better than 1st & 2nd placings.
The judging at the Atlantic City Pro still sucked & it doesnt do anything positive for increasing interest to Figure.
Jelena dont worry, you really kicked butt!
Stick at it & the judging will come good when the IFBB wakes up & defines consistency
:D
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so the IFBB doesnt want the sport to grow?? come on!
Every International Governing body in EVERY sport on the planet wants their sport to grow...gain more participants, money, coverage etc
Until they can judge properly, Figure is definitely going to be stumped to go anywhere.
Put this judging on TV and the average joe watching sport would laugh & change the channel!
Can anybody find the IFBB on a map of the world?
::)
No, the IFBB does not desire the type of growth you are thinking about.
Kim Lyons of NBC's 'Biggest Loser' is, without question, the biggest IFBB-related star in the world (Arnold doesn't count), yet what has the federation done to capitalize on her success? The door is obviously open, and the IFBB has its own media company, yet they have chosen not to market their stars at any time over the past two decades that I've been paying attention.
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No, the IFBB does not desire the type of growth you are thinking about.
Kim Lyons of NBC's 'Biggest Loser' is, without question, the biggest IFBB-related star in the world (Arnold doesn't count), yet what has the federation done to capitalize on her success? The door is obviously open, and the IFBB has its own media company, yet they have chosen not to market their stars at any time over the past two decades that I've been paying attention.
"The creation and development of Figure competition provides the IFBB with yet another way to promote the sport of bodybuilding and fitness worldwide," said Ben Weider, IFBB President. "By adding this new discipline, we are able to further expand our federation and, just as important, to provide a means for Figure athletes to compete on a professional stage."
So maybe they need new judges Tre?
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If you did you research champ, you'd be making more intelligent statements. I dont shoot shows.
I shoot beautiful women, period.
Some of them may do fitness, figure or be a regular model. I dont discriminate.
So count my uninformed opinion with those of the 99% of other sport lovers around the globe who would agree Jelena looks better than 1st & 2nd placings.
The judging at the Atlantic City Pro still sucked & it doesnt do anything positive for increasing interest to Figure.
Jelena dont worry, you really kicked butt!
Stick at it & the judging will come good when the IFBB wakes up & defines consistency
:D
oh right, I forgot you leave show coverage to your partner in crime and while you sit back and bitch about it online.
No one is arguing with you that Jelena is beautiful and looks great, just not the physique rewarded on stage.
Sorry chump but Heather Green looks great and deserved to place well.
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oh right, I forgot you leave show coverage to your partner in crime and while you sit back and bitch about it online.
No one is arguing with you that Jelena is beautiful and looks great, just not the physique rewarded on stage.
Sorry chump but Heather Green looks great and deserved to place well.
Can see your finger is still stuck in your backside. But at least you're learning about me while its there champ.
I did note Heather looks good, BUT i will say it again...
I think Jelena clearly looks the best PACKAGE out of those 3 girls by some margin.
Now stop piddling in a puddle, do you really think Heather Green looks a better package OVERALL than Jelena? and if you do, point out to me why.
Then i will actually value some of these statements you are typing. Nobody has yet pointed that out on this thread, yet you are all experts huh!
Upper thighs is not a reason to be 7th when every other aspect is No 1.
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Can see your finger is still stuck in your backside. But at least you're learning about me while its there champ.
I did note Heather looks good, BUT i will say it again...
I think Jelena clearly looks the best PACKAGE out of those 3 girls by some margin.
Now stop piddling in a puddle, do you really think Heather Green looks a better package OVERALL than Jelena? and if you do, point out to me why.
Then i will actually value some of these statements you are typing. Nobody has yet pointed that out on this thread, yet you are all experts huh!
Upper thighs is not a reason to be 7th when every other aspect is No 1.
Yes P diddle, I do. The back, hamstrings, booty and calves say it all.
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Good discussion .... You know that we like both of them a lot, as well as Chastity Slone ... but Heather has better glutes, hams and calves, as well as a more defined back. Jelena has a tighter waist and a better hip to waist ratio, and a little thicker upper back (arguable). This aspect of the show appears to have been judged fairly, while other aspects were not.
For our Figure Olympia preview, we have decided to release a "political top five" which represents how we expect the show to be judged .... and then an "actual top ten" which is how it would be judged if everyone was impartial and following the criteria, and if there were no politics. Sweating it out in our press room ... this should be interesting ...
Team FigureRX
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Yes P diddle, I do. The back, hamstrings, booty and calves say it all.
Well brown finger, you finally pulled it out! Congratulations!
I do see heather's calves, thighs & back are more defined, but waist to shoulders ratio like Figure RX said..Jelena's is better.
You can also see Jelenas arms are better too from the back.
From the front, Jelena has better shoulders, chest, symmetry, skin tone, face, suit. That more than compensates for her legs.
Figure is supposedly judged on everything from Physique to Hair, Skin tone, suit, face & composure.
I dont even need to be at the contest to tell you Jelena has better composure than even most of the Olympia girls too.
Yes, Chastity looks great. Better than Andrea & Heather i think too. So much for consistent judging!
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You can also see Jelenas arms are better too from the back.
??? Just how can you see this?
You're still trying to tell me that Heather should be placed lower than Jelena?
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Who cares what a 3rate DJ from Menudo and Liftschlong think? Menudo sounds like he's trying to bang Jelena and Lift loves to debate with anyone.
I want to know where Dina is at for the Olympia.
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Who cares what a 3rate DJ from Menudo and Liftschlong think? Menudo sounds like he's trying to bang Jelena and Lift loves to debate with anyone.
I want to know where Dina is at for the Olympia.
Keep dreamin' of Dina buddy while using ur right hand,
leave the action to those better qualified
;)
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Keep dreamin' of Dina buddy while using ur right hand,
leave the action to those better qualified
;)
May I express a thought? I so rarely get one.
You're a douchebag. I don't do well with douchebags.
The only thing you're qualified for is frosted hair and an update to your wardrobe.
Denny Crane.
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May I express a thought? I so rarely get one.
You're a douchebag. I don't do well with douchebags.
The only thing you're qualified for is frosted hair and an update to your wardrobe.
Denny Crane.
I'm sure you do much better having a spank & using a kleenex right? I bet just like thoughts, you so rarely get a woman too.
We were having healthy discussion.
So spare of us of your tragic personal contemplation, and keep enjoying yourself thinkin of Dina & hiding behind a fake account
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and then an "actual top ten" which is how it would be judged if everyone was impartial and following the criteria, and if there were no politics.
Given that they aren't on stage, I would love to know how you know the "actual" top 10? Prep changes for all of these shows. You shouldn't make your predicitions till you've actually seen them on stage. It only matters when they are all on the same stage at the same time.
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Given that they aren't on stage, I would love to know how you know the "actual" top 10? Prep changes for all of these shows. You shouldn't make your predicitions till you've actually seen them on stage. It only matters when they are all on the same stage at the same time.
Agreed but what else are we to talk about when it comes to figure before the Olympia or any show for that matter? Wondering what color suit someone will wear or how they will wear their hair? Wait, maybe they will switch make up artists, oh the drama if THAT happened? ;D
At least making predictions gets people talking and we all know they don't mean jack.
Marc - when you get done with your childhood banter with "denny" feel free to answer my last post. ;)
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I'm sure you do much better having a spank & using a kleenex right? I bet just like thoughts, you so rarely get a woman too.
So spare of us of your tragic personal contemplation, and keep enjoying yourself thinkin of Dina & hiding behind a fake account
I got the mad cow. And my penis only works on medication.
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Agreed but what else are we to talk about when it comes to figure before the Olympia or any show for that matter? Wondering what color suit someone will wear or how they will wear their hair? Wait, maybe they will switch make up artists, oh the drama if THAT happened? ;D
At least making predictions gets people talking and we all know they don't mean jack.
Marc - when you get done with your childhood banter with "denny" feel free to answer my last post. ;)
yes, Jelena's arms are bigger and more defined from the back..add to that all i mentioned from the front view
smaller waist, skin tone, shoulders, symmetry, face, suit, composure...
so i still fail to see how just legs and a more defined back can be a let down to 7th, when everything else is better
Indulge me Isaac
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Valerie Waugaman is the champion.
I assume that Jenny Lynn, Monica Brant, and Amber Littlejohn will be in the running for 2nd place.
1Fast - Do you have any interest in offering cash prizes directly to the competitors based on your own or fan votes? I imagine that that was a pretty successful campaign for you before.
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I'm sure you know what I mean. When we make predictions and do previews we study the previous shows and assume that athletes will show up at their best. Obviously if somebody slips than that changes things.
Given that they aren't on stage, I would love to know how you know the "actual" top 10? Prep changes for all of these shows. You shouldn't make your predicitions till you've actually seen them on stage. It only matters when they are all on the same stage at the same time.
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Thanks Lorie! I had so much fun with you after the show and stealing bagels in the airport. Well, not really stealing, we DID pay for them, right? ;D You looked great and I can't wait to see you again and hopefully compete with you next year.
Claire Parmley looked amazing as well. I was really disappointed she didn't get a better callout.
Julie was fabulous and had a fun routine. I enjoyed talking to she and her husband, they're great people.
Congratulations to everyone who qualified for the O and to all the competitors for showing up and doing their best!
Thanks Mandy!
I totally had a blast hanging out with you and Lorie! I hate that I won't get to make the fitness road trip with you two for Nationals! :(
I'll call you tomorrow!
XOXOXOXOXO
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I put over 75k dollars in the IFBB's pocket putting on the charlotte pro, you think if I wanted someone to place a little higher it couldn't be done? How about an IFBB pro coming to me telling me that if I gave him a good deal on raw materials he could put anyone I wanted in the top 3? How was he able to do that? Simple, he had dinner with two judges that night, I saw it. I thought he was bs'ing, at the time I was single but had a friend in the show. What do you know, she got in the top 3. I saw a sheet of paper with numbers written on it as to who needed to be placed near the top. He didn't ask me her name, he didn't care. He just wanted her suit number.
There are tons of people that compete that don't know anyone, they can't play the game. It's only fair when everyone is on the same level and everyone can play by the same rules. I never once asked for anyone to be placed anywhere. Things were offered to me because I was in a position to give back.
Sorry, but I just had to bring the topic back to this...
When I was an NPC athlete, things seemed very fair (I had zero political affiliations and was/am drug free). At Team U when I turned pro some things started to seem a bit fishy (1fast400 may know what I am referring to), but still I didn't think things could be that horrible. My rude awakening was in NY last year when I finally learned about "management" companies, drugs, etc. It was very disappointing. But still, I had held on to the hope that things really weren't as f****d up as people said they were until I read the post above. I guess I had to see it in black and white. It makes me so very frustrated and sad.
I know what many will say: "compete for fun", but deep down inside I don't believe one competitor who competes for fun without wanting a top spot. Everyone likes a shot at the gold. EVERYONE.
So what does a IFBB pro do who isn't managed by the right company, who doesn't date show promotors, etc? Find a different organization? Its not that easy after working hard to achieve your pro card. You hold on to the hope that things may change, however you feel like the biggest sucker show after show when nothing does.
It all stinks >:(
Enough whining from me...
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marc, give it up bro. Lift totally pwned you with the posting of that photo. Not even close.
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Well Mate, its like saying your Schmoetography is quality, i'm sure many would object to that too
:o
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Katie, I was at the show you turned pro, I sat on the front row. You shocked everyone. You were just this big ball of energy that came from nowhere. Your routine turned you pro. There was no doubt when I watched your routine, that I knew you were going pro that night. I had never seen you before. That is what it takes when you don't know someone. I remember that night, it was interesting. Some girls messed up mandatory moves and got hurt by it.
It wasn't long after that, I stopped keeping up with shows. I always thought you'd do well on the pro level. From what I recall, I thought your physique was a great medium. Not to hard and not soft. Sadly on the pro level, it's all about getting freaky hard.
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Just a quick shot of Nicole Ball from one of our shoots at the Atlantic City:
(http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1050/1404879197_4748146807_o.jpg)
genex
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Well Mate, its like saying your Schmoetography is quality, i'm sure many would object to that too
:o
oooh - devastating coming from you... lol ::)
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Katie, You shocked everyone. You were just this big ball of energy that came from nowhere. Your routine turned you pro. There was no doubt when I watched your routine, that I knew you were going pro that night. I had never seen you before. That is what it takes when you don't know someone. I remember that night, it was interesting. Some girls messed up mandatory moves and got hurt by it.
From what I recall, I thought your physique was a great medium. Not to hard and not soft. Sadly on the pro level, it's all about getting freaky hard.
Wait... Let me get this straight...
Katie turned pro because she had the best routine?
Katie turned pro because she had talent?
Katie turned pro and didn't know the right people?
Katie wasn't dating a promoter or a judge?
Katie turned pro in NYC & at Team U?
Other girls screwed up mandatories and it hurt their scores?
And you are saying her physique is around a 10th place pro level physique?
Ummm okay! Not really sure I see the problem.
Hey Lift... any comment?
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In katie's class, when she did her routine, there was no doubt in my mind that she was going pro that night. The judges were looking at the same group of girls they had seen the past 3 pro qualifying shows, besides her. She came in so strong, I thought it was an easy event to score. There are things people mess up at fitness shows, such as music. I believe you're required to change your music 3x in the routine, yet some girls played one song throughout. The messed up mandatory was in the 2nd class. Katie was in short class.
IMO, I don't think katie will bring in a physique the judges seem to reward, which is ultra hard. I don't think that is the physique they should award, but they do. BTW, the show we're talking about is from two years ago and I'm going off memory, if I miss a detail or two, sorry.
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This just goes to show you that everyone has a different perspective. The way I see it, they haven't been rewarding the hardest physiques in fitness or figure (with the exception of mega-stars like Tracey Greenwood) since about 2005. Our athlete won one of the routine rounds but was told she was too hard and fell in the physique rounds.
IMO, I don't think katie will bring in a physique the judges seem to reward, which is ultra hard. I don't think that is the physique they should award, but they do. BTW, the show we're talking about is from two years ago and I'm going off memory, if I miss a detail or two, sorry.
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Since we're all seeing completely different things at the same shows, is it any wonder that the judging sometimes seems a bit confused?
:-\
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Since we're all seeing completely different things at the same shows, is it any wonder that the judging sometimes seems a bit confused?
:-\
Which will always be the case as it's subjective.
Scooby - good observations. I couldn't agree more and clearly Mike has to remove his foot from his mouth on that one.
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Keep dreamin' of Dina buddy while using ur right hand,
leave the action to those better qualified
;)
Marco Polo,
Yes, that would be me. While you're online arguing with Denny, I was out dining with Dina. She'd love to chat but is getting a massage right now. :-*
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Isaac and Dina,
My feelings are hurt! Where was my dinner invite >:(
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This just goes to show you that everyone has a different perspective. The way I see it, they haven't been rewarding the hardest physiques in fitness or figure (with the exception of mega-stars like Tracey Greenwood) since about 2005. Our athlete won one of the routine rounds but was told she was too hard and fell in the physique rounds.
Ugh, that's my point. You assume that because you were told something, that must be the actual reason for why things happen. You guys think all the judges have equal input? Did you ever notice that only ONE judge actually enters/tallies the scores? That is how shows get rigged. You can rig an entire panel, it's to hard. That's why at shows, you'll see the little slips of paper with suit numbers on it. This is mainly at national shows. That is how the top judges knows who's score needs to be where.
Issac, I don't need to remove anything. If you don't think they are rewarding hard bodies, then I would LOVE to know what shows you've attended. I saw a certain top level pro athlete just weeks ago at a shoot and nearly died. She was hard as nails and she was 2 weeks past a show. She will be doing the O. The extreme hardness was insane. She was also awarded a top spot, no surprise.
If you guys would read what I write, you would see what I'm saying in regards to katie. I believe katie brings in a great physique, but on average they reward a HARDER physique than hers. So until you can show me proof of someone softer than her, placing in front of her, then my point stands. I think she is more the line of what fitness SHOULD be, not what they are doing.
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No that's not true. I'm just relaying what our athlete was told, we cover every NPC national and IFBB show, so we are generally aware of what the judges are rewarding at a particular time. *Never* have we told an athlete to adhere specifically to what judges say unless it's obvious (like a suit or a makeup problem) - every competitor has to come in at what she feels is her personal best. As an organization we support physique excellence, which to *us* means achieving the objective of coming in with a perfect figure/fitness shape combined with fullness and hardness.
Everybody has different objectives regarding the direction of the sport - we want to see harder, better conditioned athletes. Figure (and fitness) to us is about achieving that symmetrical X-shape with tiny joints and big muscle bellies, but most of the other goals are similar to bodybuilding - conditioning, hardness, thin skin on stage to show it all off, etc. You know you are in shape if you can get the upper quad/hip tie-in conditioned and show off those veins in the lower abs, etc. That's all I am saying, we all come at this with different outlooks. Therefore there's no way that we'll all agree on the judging at any given time. All we can do is try to understand it, and point out those few times when we feel it is really off - while at the same time showing tremendous respect for the accomplishments of *all* the athletes. We like Katie a lot but if she came in softer we would place her a little lower in the physique rounds. You are saying that you want softer competitors to be rewarded and we respectfully disagree. To each his own in that respect.
Now if this discussion is about politics, however, we believe everything should be judged without any political factors in the mix at all. Judges assessing the best physiques (as they see them on that day) without any overrides from head judges, or companies, or managers. To be fair a lot of the same athletes would still win - there is a reason why they are sponsored, or managed - they are really good.
Team FigureRX
www.FigureRX.com
Ugh, that's my point. You assume that because you were told something, that must be the actual reason for why things happen. You guys think all the judges have equal input? Did you ever notice that only ONE judge actually enters/tallies the scores? That is how shows get rigged. You can rig an entire panel, it's to hard. That's why at shows, you'll see the little slips of paper with suit numbers on it. This is mainly at national shows. That is how the top judges knows who's score needs to be where.
Issac, I don't need to remove anything. If you don't think they are rewarding hard bodies, then I would LOVE to know what shows you've attended. I saw a certain top level pro athlete just weeks ago at a shoot and nearly died. She was hard as nails and she was 2 weeks past a show. She will be doing the O. The extreme hardness was insane. She was also awarded a top spot, no surprise.
If you guys would read what I write, you would see what I'm saying in regards to katie. I believe katie brings in a great physique, but on average they reward a HARDER physique than hers. So until you can show me proof of someone softer than her, placing in front of her, then my point stands. I think she is more the line of what fitness SHOULD be, not what they are doing.
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Dina has Denny Crane written all over her.
Who the hell is this FigureRX group? Never heard of them and now they have a team and cover all shows?
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We like you Denny - come on over to the RX site, look around and say hello.
Dina has Denny Crane written all over her.
Who the hell is this FigureRX group? Never heard of them and now they have a team and cover all shows?
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Show me the money.
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I do want to point out that there are some very good judges out there. They know what they're doing and what they are looking at. My biggest gripe is that the head judge owns a management company that manages the people he judges. That is what I have a problem with.
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You can rig an entire panel, it's to hard.
That sentence makes absolutely NO SENSE! Put down the crack pipe!
That's why at shows, you'll see the little slips of paper with suit numbers on it. This is mainly at national shows. That is how the top judges knows who's score needs to be where.
You should have paid more attention to what the judges were REALLY doing instead of trying to figure out which naive competitor you were going to try and BS into bed with how you could advance their career. Those pieces of paper are passed down from each end of the judging table to the center (to the head judge)... those pieces of paper contain the SUIT numbers of the girls each judge would like to see compared with each other. The head judge then begins the callouts based on those pieces of paper... which is why girls get pulled out, then put back in line, etc. Till all the comparisons that the other judges wanted to see are shown.
They use the pieces of paper because it is a little more professional than yelling from one end of the table to the other since ONLY the head judge has the microphone to make the callouts.
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I do want to point out that there are some very good judges out there. They know what they're doing and what they are looking at. My biggest gripe is that the head judge owns a management company that manages the people he judges. That is what I have a problem with.
Sandi Ranalli doesn't own a management company or does Jim Rockell or Steve Weinberger. We know you're talking about JM, stop being a pussy and say it. JM isn't a head judge.
You sound like skinny stooge who uses his momma's money to bang fitness chix.
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I do want to point out that there are some very good judges out there. They know what they're doing and what they are looking at. My biggest gripe is that the head judge owns a management company that manages the people he judges. That is what I have a problem with.
Personally I can't ever remember seeing the owner of the management company you refer to being a judge, he is usually too busy sitting in the press pit taking photos. Also before you go down that road... I can't remember the last time his father actually judged a show either... he has however taken over the microphone and done callouts at large events. 9 times out of 10 at any National level show the head judge is Jim Rockell.
So what was your point again?
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You should have paid more attention to what the judges were REALLY doing instead of trying to figure out which naive competitor you were going to try and BS into...how you could advance their career.
1Fast is JC Lopez??
Hold on, now I'm confused!
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1Fast is JC Lopez??
Hold on, now I'm confused!
Tre...
I never said anything about contracts to advance careers... so the answer to your question is NO.
We don't need you confused this close to your fall 2007 Schmoe Convention in Vegas.
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This is all true. And indeed JM has not been a judge for as long as I have been involved. I wish the process were as pure as this, however - judges selecting call-outs and then judging on their own, with their preferences respected and reflected in the final results. The problem is in the overrides, when someone says competitor X (who is on the little slips of paper several times) should not be called out after all because she has sick quad separation, or she's rock hard and conditioned to the core. It's an unfortunate attempt to "manage" the judges to influence the direction of the NPC or the IFBB, for whatever reason. I think the judges have great instincts and for the most part they select the correct athletes, but then they get overruled. Sometimes there is a push for softer, attainable looks so more athletes feel like they can win, resulting in more entry fees throughout the heirarchy of the sport. That's the worst override in my opinion, no other sport relaxes their standards to make them "attainable." It should be about the best, on that stage, on any given day. And this is a process, a direction, not blatant favoritism. I have seen JM argue vehemently in favor of call-outs for an athlete who looked incredible, and even he was shot down by the head judge and Sandy on that day because quad separation was out of favor.
Those pieces of paper are passed down from each end of the judging table to the center (to the head judge)... those pieces of paper contain the SUIT numbers of the girls each judge would like to see compared with each other. The head judge then begins the callouts based on those pieces of paper... which is why girls get pulled out, then put back in line, etc. Till all the comparisons that the other judges wanted to see are shown.
They use the pieces of paper because it is a little more professional than yelling from one end of the table to the other since ONLY the head judge has the microphone to make the callouts.
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My biggest gripe is that the head judge owns a management company that manages the people he judges. That is what I have a problem with.
*groan*
Haven't we gone through this over and over again?
I know that some conspiracy theorist out there is keeping track of the 'questionable calls' involving JMP athletes, but most of the knowledgeable people who post here agree with a high percentage of the placings. Yes, there have been judging screw-ups, but has there been any major controversy since the NY Pro Fitness show back in '06? That was a blown call, true, but aside from that, the judging panels have consistently done a 'solid' job the past couple of years.
The numbers simply do not support the various theories.
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The problem is in the overrides, when someone says competitor X (who is on the little slips of paper several times) should not be called out after all because she has sick quad separation, or she's rock hard and conditioned to the core.
I understand time constraints, but would love to see some of the Group 1 people compared to the Group 2 people from time-to-time.
Even if there is a clear top 2 or top 3 in a given show, *rarely* is there a clear top 5.
My other issue is that physique judges should not be asked to judge fitness routines, HOWEVER, the problem for the IFBB is that there are not enough qualified (fitness routine) experts willing to judge the competitions.
Once we move to electronic scoring and a live scoreboard, I think we'll see a vast improvement in people's trust of the system.
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This has almost nothing to do with who JMP manages. If it did than Michelle Adams would have won in Atlantic City and would be Olympia bound. He has excellent athletes and sometimes they do well, and sometimes they do not. How do you explain Jessica Paxson winning the New York Pro last year? Her non-affiliation with JMP? Her sponsorship with ON? No - she was the best athlete on stage that day. Does a management contract or a corporate affiliation result in an occasional bump for a competitor? Maybe. You might say Shannon M's comeback this year was a bit surreal, but she looked the part and deserved her placings.
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You might say Shannon M's comeback this year was a bit surreal, but she looked the part and deserved her placings.
Shannon definitely worked her way back up this year... a rough first outting, a tough second in Detroit and finally a win in Dallas. But considering she went out with a win in Atlanta prior to having her second baby it puts the comeback in better perspective that she knew where she needed to be... and it was only a matter of time to get back there.
Something weird though... I did hear that not long after her Europa win she was released by Gaspari so I'm not sure what booth she will be at next week if any at all.
Good luck to Shannon I have always liked her physique (great a$$).
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I think we would all agree that the sport is subjective
BUT
I think we would all agree that basic politics (which you see EVERYWHERE in life) is different from bribary and complete fixing of a competition.
Some comments on prior posts (which I would quote but can not figure out how to!)
- Someone commented that no one softer then katie ever placed higher then she does - wrong - two years in a row at the ny show someone in the top three stood out like a sore thumb.
- AGREE different judges are needed for the fitness routines. There are times the judges are not even looking at the routines...it is very sad to see.
- As a spectator, I would rather sit at a NPC comp any day over an IFBB....there is some sort of excitement at the NPC show...there is no excitement at the IFBB fitness shows. Before anyone steps foot on stage you can name the top three....if routines were taken into consideration more, this would not be the case.
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Does a management contract or a corporate affiliation result in an occasional bump for a competitor?
Certainly not in the case of your competitors.
"And indeed JM has not been a judge for as long as I have been involved."
The entire year that you've been following figure? ::)
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Shannon definitely worked her way back up this year... a rough first outting, a tough second in Detroit and finally a win in Dallas. But considering she went out with a win in Atlanta prior to having her second baby it puts the comeback in better perspective that she knew where she needed to be... and it was only a matter of time to get back there.
Something weird though... I did hear that not long after her Europa win she was released by Gaspari so I'm not sure what booth she will be at next week if any at all.
Good luck to Shannon I have always liked her physique (great a$$).
Actually Scooby; you, shaggy and the others can all pile in the Mystery Machine and visit Shannon at the 8-ball Nutrition Booth at the Olympia. She'll be there along with Jennifer Gates, Liza Kampstra and UFC figher Houston Alexander. 8-ball Nutrition should have quite the crowd at the Olympia.
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8-ball Nutrition should have quite the crowd at the Olympia.
As long as they're not wearing 'Affliction' t-shirts, I'll be sure to stop by! ;D
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As long as they're not wearing 'Affliction' t-shirts, I'll be sure to stop by! ;D
Damn, I decide to skip the Europa this year, and I apparently miss out on the joke of the year..... How many forums have you mentioned this on now, T? lol
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Dave Palumbo interviews the figure & fitness champs. :)
http://forums.musculardevelopment.com/showthread.php?p=298448#post298448 (http://forums.musculardevelopment.com/showthread.php?p=298448#post298448)
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I just wanted to say I had such an awesome time getting on stage again after 2 1/2 years! It felt like my first show cause I didn't know most of the girls competing! It was great meeting you Julie, Bethany, Bridgette, Susan, Jenn, Brenda, and Allison and I enjoyed catching up with some of my fellow veterans Stacy, Claire, Lorie, and Tracy! Tracy you were my new best friend after getting us out of that two piece round! And Stacy, thank you for your magic pill that saved me for the night show! My cramping went away and I felt like a whole new person ;D
Oh and thanx to my figure girls Becky and Marie for keeping me calm and cheering for me! And thank you to everyone at the Fitness Factory (especially girls in my group Ginger, Cory, Deanne, and Lisa) for being so incredibily supportive and encouraging!
I actually had fun competing for the first time in I don't know...probably since I was an amateur! Overall I thought it was a great show and I felt proud of myself for stepping on stage again!
Mike D....You f'en ROCK. It's truly amazing what your knowledge and talent enables you to do with the human body. I lost 18 pounds in 5 weeks training with Mike D. in Ohio. Thank you for helping me achieve my goal of getting onstage again and being proud of what I presented! Check out the pics from 2 years ago to now :o
(http://hardfitness.com/competitions/emeraldcup2005/fitnesspro/leawaide/onetwopiece/images/DSC_0720.jpg)
Emerald Cup '05
(http://hardfitness.com/competitions/emeraldcup2005/fitnesspro/leawaide/onetwopiece/images/DSC_0473)
Emerald Cup '05
(http://hardfitness.com/competitions/atlanticcity2007/profitness/comparisonsprofitness/twopiece/images/DSC_9795.jpg)
Atlantic City '07
(http://www.graphicmuscle.net/photos/transferred/QW5Q4017_PQLQYVFEOI.jpg)
Atlantic City '07
(http://www.graphicmuscle.net/photos/transferred/QW5Q4018_BAYFEYOXCH.jpg)
AC '07
Thanks girls for a awesome show...best of luck to each of you at West Palm and the O. I will be praying for each and everyone of you...Maybe I will see you in '08!
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MS WAIDE...you are the one that ROCKS! You really looked incredible. I was so happy to see you again. You were definetly at your best at this show. I hope to see you again in '08! ;D
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Thanks girls for a awesome show...best of luck to each of you at West Palm and the O. I will be praying for each and everyone of you...Maybe I will see you in '08!
Another "born again" ::) There are two places to find the truth. First God and then Fox News.
Denny Crane.
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FYI, DC - one does not have to be 'religious' in order to pray for folks.
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FYI, DC - one does not have to be 'religious' in order to pray for folks.
It's a good feeling, you know, to shoot a bad guy. Something you Democrats would never understand.
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Claire Parmley, and Lorie Kimes!
:)
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Thanks siouxcountry for posting this pic of me and Lorie! We had a great time as roomies and munching on fries and ice cream after the show! MMMMMM!! :P
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Yeah Thanks!
Claire & I go way back!! ;D
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Thanks siouxcountry for posting this pic of me and Lorie! We had a great time as roomies and munching on fries and ice cream after the show! MMMMMM!! :P
Fries and ice cream, I need to give that a try! ;D ;)
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just want to thank everyone showing me love. i had a great time in AC. Placing doesn't define my success. I was very pleased with what I brought to the stage sept 14th! Congrats to all the ladies. see you all soon!
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;)
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Alti, you looked amazing at this show - congratulations! :o
Team FigureRX
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Stellar physique, Alti - nice work!
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We'll be seeing you at the West Palm Beach show, right Alti?
8)
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just want to thank everyone showing me love. i had a great time in AC. Placing doesn't define my success. I was very pleased with what I brought to the stage sept 14th! Congrats to all the ladies. see you all soon!
I'm right there with you Alti...I was proud with what I brought as well. However, I thought YOU looked FANTASTIC! You have the teeeeny tiny-est waist! Great shape all over, girl! It was so awesome to FINALLY meet you. Adela has told me sooooo much about you. It was great to laugh and chat with you. I hope to see you in West Palm! Take Care lady! "You look MARVELOUS!"
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change of plans. I have some work related things that need to get done that weekend, which is over extending thru the holidays. I got bills to pay, and you and I both know, this competing $hit don't pay the bills!! lol. but I'll be saving cause you will see a lot of me in 2008!!!! by the way, you look great! keep up the the good work!
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Alti, you looked amazing at this show - congratulations! :o
Team FigureRX
Ditto that! I have always been a fan of her physique, it's beautiful!