Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: G o a t b o y on June 17, 2008, 10:21:15 PM
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Levrone's video and Tom Prince's before/after pics say it all. Anyone (other than Bob) still wanna claim drugs are just a "finishing touch", and not responsible for 90% of these guys' physiques?
Sure you gotta lift weights and sure you gotta have great genetics, but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
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Levrone's video and Tom Prince's before/after pics say it all. Anyone (other than Bob) still wanna claim drugs are just a "finishing touch", and not responsible for 90% of these guys' physiques?
Sure you gotta lift weights and sure you gotta have great genetics, but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
quoted for truth
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quoted for truth
quoted for truth
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Levrone's video and Tom Prince's before/after pics say it all. Anyone (other than Bob) still wanna claim drugs are just a "finishing touch", and not responsible for 90% of these guys' physiques?
Sure you gotta lift weights and sure you gotta have great genetics, but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
actually, genetics is really the key, same with most sports, many pro bb's don't train once off drugs, who really gives a shit?
what happens to a pro football player once they retire?
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quoted for truth
Good post. Spot on as usual
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actually, genetics is really the key, same with most sports, many pro bb's don't train once off drugs, who really gives a shit?
what happens to a pro football player once they retire?
A guy with great genetics who would be 260 with drugs competes at 190 with no drugs (assuming he's 6' or under). Stop making excuses for these human science experiments.
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actually, genetics is really the key, same with most sports, many pro bb's don't train once off drugs, who really gives a shit?
what happens to a pro football player once they retire?
What, genetics to drug response? Currently, pro bb is based on lies and faggotry IMO. The sooner you accept that, the better. The reason Tom Prince and Levrone are tiny now, is because they dont juice. Sure they have great genetics, but without the drugs they are average guys with good genetics. Shit, most retired pros are still juiced to the gills, and that's why they are "big". I see guys in better shape than levrone, that drink all weekend, and eat shit.
Pro football players are usually really banged up from actual atheltic competition, so many have health problems. I think even comparing the two sports - (bb is not a sport), is insanity.
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A guy with great genetics who would be 260 with drugs competes at 190 with no drugs (assuming he's 6' or under). Stop making excuses for these human science experiments.
my point being, you cannot look like a Levrone just by taking a shit load of steroids, it takes MUCH more than that, first and foremost the superior genetics.
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What, genetics to drug response?
ummm...yeah!
Currently, pro bb is based on lies and faggotry IMO.
I have no idea what that means.
The sooner you accept that, the better. The reason Tom Prince and Levrone are tiny now, is because they dont juice. Sure they have great genetics, but without the drugs they are average guys with good genetics. Shit, most retired pros are still juiced to the gills, and that's why they are "big". I see guys in better shape than levrone, that drink all weekend, and eat shit.
ok!
Pro football players are usually really banged up from actual atheltic competition, so many have health problems. I think even comparing the two sports - (bb is not a sport), is insanity.
right, and pro bb's that have used drugs for 15-20 years, competed and trained like animals walk away in perfect health...ok.
::)
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Levrone's video and Tom Prince's before/after pics say it all. Anyone (other than Bob) still wanna claim drugs are just a "finishing touch", and not responsible for 90% of these guys' physiques?
Sure you gotta lift weights and sure you gotta have great genetics, but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
why do you post on a bodybuilding board?
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my point being, you cannot look like a Levrone just by taking a shit load of steroids, it takes MUCH more than that, first and foremost the superior genetics.
I never said you could turn a gym rat with crap genetics into a pro by adding drugs. I said that a pro with good genetics wouldn't look much like a pro without the drugs. It's not a 5 or 10% difference... it's night and day. That guy winning IFBB shows would be lucky to place in a local show if he had his same genetics but no drugs.
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How did you add your reply in my post without mod stars?
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why do you post on a bodybuilding board?
Because every time I click on the stamp collecting board I get a message that says "hang on tight..."
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How did you add your reply in my post without mod stars?
I don't know. It's a mystery to me.
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why do you post on a bodybuilding board?
Stupid question. Do you think that someone has to be pro-drugs to post on a BBing board? Levrone retained about 25-30% of what he had. 250 big and ripped to 190 small and fat. Do the math.
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Stupid question. Do you think that someone has to be pro-drugs to post on a BBing board? Levrone retained about 25-30% of what he had. 250 big and ripped to 190 small and fat. Do the math.
Getbig is a board that is known for attracting pro bb's, is it not? that being the case and the fact the all pro bb's use steroids it seems like the wrong place for a person to post if they are against steroid use, dontcha think?
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Getbig is a board that is known for attracting pro bbb's, is it not? that being the case and the fact the all pro bb's use steroids it seems like the wrong place for a person to post if they are against steroid use, dontcha think?
I'm not against steroid use. I'm against these guys using the ridiculous amounts and types of chemicals they do to achieve 90% of their results then execting us to consider them "athletes" or making ridiculous claims about how supposedly inconsequential the drugs are to their success.
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I'm not against steroid use. I'm against these guys using the ridiculous amounts and types of chemicals they do to achieve 90% of their results then expecting us to consider them "athletes" or making ridiculous claims about how supposedly inconsequential the drugs are to their success.
many pro athletes in many sports use a shitload of drugs, whether it be steroids, anti-inflammatories, pain killers, etc., I don't see your point.
take drugs out of any sport and level the playing field, do you think there will be different pros at the top? same pros in bodybuilding will win, the genetically gifted, they would all just be smaller without the drugs.
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Getbig is a board that is known for attracting pro bbb's, is it not? that being the case and the fact the all pro bb's use steroids it seems like the wrong place for a person to post if they are against steroid use, dontcha think?
Lonnie....it might be known for it, but with the exeption of few, they don't stay. If a person is intrested in BBing but don't want the drugs, why shouldn't he/she post here? Everyone knows that pro's take drugs...duh, but when people say ALL DRUGS...it's true and you of all people know it.
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Lonnie....it might be known for it, but with the exeption of few, they don't stay. If a person is intrested in BBing but don't want the drugs, why shouldn't he/she post here? Everyone knows that pro's take drugs...duh, but when people say ALL DRUGS...it's true and you of all people know it.
they can and should post here, but what is the point of coming to a bb board and ripping on the sport or those that compete in it? it is what it is, and as far as drugs no different than football and many others...
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I don't see your point.
Ask one of the many non-schmoe posters here to explain it to you. They all seem to get it.
take drugs out of any sport and level the playing field, do you think there will be different pros at the top? same pros in bodybuilding will win, the genetically gifted, they would all just be way smaller, unbelieveably smaller, an order of magnitude smaller without the drugs, so much so they wouldn't look much different from a typical gym rat.
Fixed.
And there could indeed be different pros at the top, since some of these guys have an incredible genetic response to drugs, but not very good genetics for natural muscle building.
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Ask one of the many non-schmoe posters here to explain it to you. They all seem to get it.
Fixed.
And there could indeed be different pros at the top, since some of these guys have an incredible genetic response to drugs, but not very good genetics for natural muscle building.
maybe you should go find a natural bodybuilding board to post on.
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maybe you should go find a natural bodybuilding board to post on.
Will I have to stop using AAS before they'll let me post?
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they can and should post here, but what is the point of coming to a bb board and ripping on the sport or those that compete in it? it is what it is, and as far as drugs no different than football and many others...
LOL...what player in Football takes 3000mg of test, GH, Deca, Insulin and whatever else you want to throw in? Oh oh, I'll answer that.............NONE!
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why do these people try to defend the pros by saying they are not all drugs? sure it takes dedication, but the main point is that you must have a genetic response to gear and take lots of it to be successful as a bodybuilder
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LOL...what player in Football takes 3000mg of test, GH, Deca, Insulin and whatever else you want to throw in? Oh oh, I'll answer that.............NONE!
Exactly. A pro football player could legitimately make the claim that steroids are a "finishing touch" or a 5-10% boost. IFBB pros, on the other hand, are ALL DRUGS, period. They're walking science experiments, not "athletes".
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Will I have to stop using AAS before they'll let me post?
a true hippocrite, had you said you were natural I may have gave you a little respect.
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well, you use steroids yourself, yet go around ripping on pro bb's that use them because they use too much in your opinion? ???
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well, you use steroids yourself, yet go around ripping on pro bb's that use them because they use too much in your opinion? ???
Your sarcasm detector is on the fritz. I'm not on steroids.
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Your sarcasm detector is on the fritz. I'm not on steroids.
good for you, go find a natural bodybuilding board then, you would be a good asset there, here you just act like an ass.
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good for you, go find a natural bodybuilding board then, you would be a good asset there, here you just act like an ass.
Well, since I was here years ago long before this became the "IFBB schmoe board" when it was just a bunch of guys talking about their workouts and diets, I think I'll be staying. Thanks for the unsolicited advice, though. ::)
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Well, since I was here years ago long before this became the "IFBB schmoe board" when it was just a bunch of guys talking about their workouts and diets, I think I'll be staying. Thanks for the unsolicited advice, though. ::)
if that is what you think of this board why stay here and rip on bodybuilders?
wasn't it Ron's goal from the beginning to make Getbig all about pro bodybuilding?
oh, you're welcome. :0
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Well, since I was here years ago long before this became the "IFBB schmoe board" when it was just a bunch of guys talking about their workouts and diets, I think I'll be staying. Thanks for the unsolicited advice, though. ::)
The ::) expression. Simply the best..haha
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if that is what you think of this board why stay here and rip on bodybuilders?
wasn't it Ron's goal from the beginning to make Getbig all about pro bodybuilding?
oh, you're welcome. :0
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so is the "rolling eyes" reply all anyone can do here?
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if that is what you think of this board why stay here and rip on bodybuilders?
Ripping on pros is only part of what I do here. I also make "gayer than" jokes, post Evanescence pics to piss Debussey off, and cause n00bs to meltdown.
wasn't it Ron's goal from the beginning to make Getbig all about pro bodybuilding?
Possibly, you'd have to ask him. But from almost the beginning he had a "training/nutrition" board that had nothing to do with pro bodybuilding, and the gossip board was mostly off-topic stuff. Except for around the O and ASC, pro bodybuilding wasn't discussed that much.
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ok, whatever flips your nickel.
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so is the "rolling eyes" reply all anyone can do here?
No, you can always opt for a.....oh yeah,
MELTDOWN!
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No, you can always opt for a.....oh yeah,
MELTDOWN!
you think I am having a meltdown? lol, I have been running a board for over 7 years now. :)
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you think I am having a meltdown? lol, I have been running a board for over 7 years now. :)
No, I was giving you the other thing someone can do on this site, other than ::)
Answering your previous question, is all....one more thing
PSYCH!
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Kevin and Tom. ALL PED.
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my point being, you cannot look like a Levrone just by taking a shit load of steroids, it takes MUCH more than that, first and foremost the superior genetics.
how would you know, only like 0.0001% maybe less of the population uses the insane amount of drugs pros use.
don't give examples of juicing gym-rats cause they aren't using even 1/4 of what pros use.
maybe the superior genetics your talking about is the 'drug addict' gene cause thats the only thing superior here
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Levrone's video and Tom Prince's before/after pics say it all. Anyone (other than Bob) still wanna claim drugs are just a "finishing touch", and not responsible for 90% of these guys' physiques?
Sure you gotta lift weights and sure you gotta have great genetics, but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
There's no credibility to what these guys spew. Why is it so hard to give the drugs their proper credit? Let's face it, without the drugs they are NOTHING, just like when they come off (the ones that actually do).
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What, genetics to drug response? Currently, pro bb is based on lies and faggotry IMO. The sooner you accept that, the better. The reason Tom Prince and Levrone are tiny now, is because they dont juice. Sure they have great genetics, but without the drugs they are average guys with good genetics. Shit, most retired pros are still juiced to the gills, and that's why they are "big". I see guys in better shape than levrone, that drink all weekend, and eat shit.
Pro football players are usually really banged up from actual atheltic competition, so many have health problems. I think even comparing the two sports - (bb is not a sport), is insanity.
Great post.
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Levrone's video and Tom Prince's before/after pics say it all. Anyone (other than Bob) still wanna claim drugs are just a "finishing touch", and not responsible for 90% of these guys' physiques?
Sure you gotta lift weights and sure you gotta have great genetics, but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
quoted for truth again :D
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Levrone's video and Tom Prince's before/after pics say it all. Anyone (other than Bob) still wanna claim drugs are just a "finishing touch", and not responsible for 90% of these guys' physiques?
Sure you gotta lift weights and sure you gotta have great genetics, but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
Levrone said some where he'd gain 40-50 lbs once he started lifting again naturally...i doubt it he has never trained without steroids...
prince by his own admission in flex said he "took 20%" of what he nornally took for shows in steroids for the ironman after his kidneys failed and he was in CHF then he also posted on the boards he was on 400 mg test and 600 mg deca a week for the ironman which 20% if 1/5 so 1000 mgs x 5 =5,000 mgs a week...
these guys would be a lot bigger than most of us clean..trouble is we never see them after they stop competing for the most part...
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what ive learned from the levrone and prince cases;
bodybuilding is all about drugs, and those who are on drugs are pathetic addicts and liars who can't even admit their whole life revolve around the miracle drug (ie bob chick).
I learned that "bbing" is a joke that is not even funny anymore , and that the best thing is to train naturally for health and well being.
Somehow i'd like to thanks all the weak minded losers for enlightning smarter people.
Again what i've learned recently with the levrone video and this boevin guy story where he admits that even smaller guys like models are on steroids has been the last and ultimate give away about the whole fitness/bbing thing .
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what Ive learned from the levrone and prince cases;
bodybuilding is all about drugs, and those who are on drugs are pathetic addicts and liars who can't even admit their whole life revolve around the miracle drug (ie bob chick).
I learned that "bbing" is a joke that is not even funny anymore , and that the best thing is to train naturally for health and well being.
Somehow I'd like to thanks all the weak minded losers for enlightening smarter people.
Harsh, but unfortunately it is fairly accurate...
I think one of the main problems is that for every guy who has genuinely good genetics and can still hold good size when "off", there are half a dozen guys who were hitting the gear before they broke 180lbs and as soon as they come "off", its like a totally different person.
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good for you, go find a natural bodybuilding board then, you would be a good asset there, here you just act like an ass.
You seem to know your shit when it comes to acting like an ass. A dozen posts in a row of typical Bbing nuthugging: "It takes a lot of dedication, etc....will power, higher pain treshold and all the usual bullshit" to convince people who have no need to be convinced because guess what? They train, they eat, diet, do the usual stuff most people who lift weights do. Most of them know their shit, the infos are out there, there's no need to be a fuckin' rocket scientist to find out how to train, how to eat, to see what the possibilities are, to experiment. The major difference between most people here and pros is that even those who juice are not stupid enough to do 1/4 the drugs those guys do.
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LOL...what a joke of a thread ...a bunch of loses on the internet trying to justify why they're where they are in life....classic.
And by all means, use probably the two WORST examples in Kevin and Tom...two guys who are retired pros, who don't train or take steroids, don't follow a eating program, etc....
I see many retired pros at every show like Labrada, Gaspari, Larry Scott, Bill Pearl, Serge Nubret, Bill Grant, etc.... that look very good and maintain a scaled down version of what they looked like in their prime...because they still train and eat regularly.
Keep up the god work. boys...it's justification that makes not achieving anything an easier pill to swallow.
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bingo!!!!
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LOL...what a joke of a thread ...a bunch of loses on the internet trying to justify why they're where they are in life....classic.
And by all means, use probably the two WORST examples in Kevin and Tom...two guys who are retired pros, who don't train or take steroids, don't follow a eating program, etc....
I see many retired pros at every show like Labrada, Gaspari, Larry Scott, Bill Pearl, Serge Nubret, Bill Grant, etc.... that look very good and maintain a scaled down version of what they looked like in their prime...because they still train and eat regularly.
Keep up the god work. boys...it's justification that makes not achieving anything an easier pill to swallow.
Chick, are you implying that croatch is "THE GRENCH THAT STOLE BODYBUILDING SPIRIT" ;D
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Goatboy is right, of course. He isn't putting forward something revolutionary or outrageous. He is merely stating what is patently obvious to most of us. I would also add that, for me, the single most important genetic factor is the genetic response to AAS. Some will truly 'blow up' - obviously genetics are then also important in how that will actually look.
The whole argument the drugs are a minor little finishing touch is absurd and insulting. They would not spend the huge amounts of money on them that they do if it were the case. They also wouldn't shrink down to pathetically small sizes the moment they are off them for a sustained period. The drugs and their response to them is the key. Look at Coleman before and after he got on a 'decent' drug programme. He went from Olympia makeweight to No1 almost overnight.
Of course they appeal to hard work, dedication to diet etc..but these are things that most serious trainers also do right. The fact is that pro bodybuilders are not the best people to talk to about this as they are habitual liars, over-compensators, and , somewhat understandably, loath to actually admit the really defining factor in their success is the response their body has to sticking a needle in their ass.
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LOL...what a joke of a thread ...a bunch of loses on the internet trying to justify why they're where they are in life....classic.
And by all means, use probably the two WORST examples in Kevin and Tom...two guys who are retired pros, who don't train or take steroids, don't follow a eating program, etc....
I see many retired pros at every show like Labrada, Gaspari, Larry Scott, Bill Pearl, Serge Nubret, Bill Grant, etc.... that look very good and maintain a scaled down version of what they looked like in their prime...because they still train and eat regularly.
Keep up the god work. boys...it's justification that makes not achieving anything an easier pill to swallow.
Such great examples! ::)
Why not talk about Benaziza, Munzer, De Mayo? Oh shit, I forgot they're dead!
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Such great examples! ::)
Why not talk about Benaziza, Munzer, De Mayo? Oh shit, I forgot they're dead!
People die in every sport (and in life)...the list from them is much longer than in BB.
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it's interesting to see that bob chick considers that people who don't share his passion for the bbing industry and everything that is related to it (steroids) are "losers".
I guess that people who don't lift to "compete" on a bodybuilding stage are moron in his opinion.
And it's also interesting to see how insecure he is about his own steroid use, being out of competition but still feeling the need to inject anabolic steroids to keep feeling like a he-man.
But we all know he would just be another 180 lbs guy without it, and somehow I think that it hurts him badly that every fan now figures it out with the recent revelations in the "industry".
Looks like everyone has a weakness.
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And by all means, use probably the two WORST examples in Kevin and Tom...two guys who are retired pros, who don't train or take steroids, don't follow a eating program, etc....
Lol. You always undermine your own arguments Bob. The thread is about people being 'all drugs' and you use them not taking drugs as an example of why they're so small. Classic
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People die in every sport (and in life)...the list from them is much longer than in BB.
Come on, you're a smart man, Chick. Guys like Scott, Pearl, even Nubret (and those who actually have seen Nubret in person know that he looks in much better shape on pics than he actually is) are from a different era. And Labrada was the less "AAS dependant" of all the top competitors of his time. Let's give it some time and see what becomes of Ronnie, DJ, Cutler, etc...Levrone and Prince are not the only ones to look like shit. Nasser comes to mind also. Titus doesn't look that good either in his orange suit and he's got plenty of time to workout like every other inmate.
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dude have you seen pic's of bob when he was 16. he was a beast back then without gear. if bob stopped his supplements but continue to train he would still maintain a bodybuilder look. no doubt. he has the genetics, and the science of it down. of course not as big but still look like a bodybuilder. no doubt
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People die in every sport (and in life)...the list from them is much longer than in BB.
I bet that even if you had to get off steroids for health related issues you would keep taking steroids, because all your life and what you are rely on the miracle drug.
I've never seen you so angry and scornful toward the potential "fans" / customers that post here since cutler admited to steroids , the release of HBFS, the boevian guy story, the levrone video ; all of this seems to have destabilized you somehow.
Well, at least it shows you like you are; You obviously think very low of all the teens and adults who buy crap from bbing .com , I guess you re most of the time making fun of them, these very same "stupid noobs" who aren't "in the know" and that make 99,9 % of the customers of bbing.com.
I guess the "fans" are ok in your book as long as they don't figure what it's all about and who people like you truly are; hypocritical liars who inject steroids for a living while selling bullshit supps and mocking the very same people who believe they can get as "big" as you with the shitty powders you promote lol
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I bet that even if you had to get off steroids for health related issues you would keep taking steroids, because all your life and what you are rely on the miracle drug.
I've never seen you so angry and scornful toward the potential "fans" / customers that post here since cutler admited to steroids , the release of HBFS, the boevian guy story, the levrone video ; all of this seems to have destabilized you somehow.
Well, at least it shows you like you are; You obviously think very low of all the teens and adults who buy crap from bbing .com , I guess you re most of the time making fun of them, these very same "stupid noobs" who aren't "in the know" and that make 99,9 % of the customers of bbing.com.
I guess the "fans" are ok in your book as long as they don't figure what it's all about and who people like you truly are; hypocritical liars who inject steroids for a living while selling bullshit supps and mocking the very same people who believe they can get as "big" as you with the shitty powders you promote lol
On spot, specially the "shitty powders" stuff! It's amazing that some people will assume that fans are gullable to such a point...the worse thing beeing that most of the fans are actually that gullable.
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The "bodybuilding" lifestyle/ideal has taken serious blows lately with people from the inside of the industry spilling the beans about what it's truly all about and how pointless it seems to be to most of them in the end.
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it's interesting to see that bob chick considers that people who don't share his passion for the bbing industry and everything that is related to it (steroids) are "losers".
I guess that people who don't lift to "compete" on a bodybuilding stage are moron in his opinion.
And it's also interesting to see how insecure he is about his own steroid use, being out of competition but still feeling the need to inject anabolic steroids to keep feeling like a he-man.
But we all know he would just be another 180 lbs guy without it, and somehow I think that it hurts him badly that every fan now figures it out with the recent revelations in the "industry".
Looks like everyone has a weakness.
I see the need to label LOSERS as people that feel the need to put down those who have achieved something in life (in this case BB)...and attribute all the success to one element of that success. It's the same attitude that people have in regards to a actor that made it "because his/ her father is a big time producer"....that may have gotten the door open, but if they suck, they suck...
I find it even more amusing that people who have NEVER taken steroids, are commenting on what they do, how much they're responsible for, etc.....comical to say the least.
You then make assumptions that I'm still taking anything....just what do you base that on??
As for being just another 180 lb. guy without it....I was over that as a Natural TEEN competitor, being tested and winning shows...and placed 5th at 196 lbs natural, at the 1990 Nationals...also tested.
Whats your excuse now?
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I bet that even if you had to get off steroids for health related issues you would keep taking steroids, because all your life and what you are rely on the miracle drug.
I've never seen you so angry and scornful toward the potential "fans" / customers that post here since cutler admited to steroids , the release of HBFS, the boevian guy story, the levrone video ; all of this seems to have destabilized you somehow.
Well, at least it shows you like you are; You obviously think very low of all the teens and adults who buy crap from bbing .com , I guess you re most of the time making fun of them, these very same "stupid noobs" who aren't "in the know" and that make 99,9 % of the customers of bbing.com.
I guess the "fans" are ok in your book as long as they don't figure what it's all about and who people like you truly are; hypocritical liars who inject steroids for a living while selling bullshit supps and mocking the very same people who believe they can get as "big" as you with the shitty powders you promote lol
What maes you think I'm taking anything now? My look?
Thanks for making my argument for me....
Lets not confuse people...."fans" (true ones) don't go around badmouthing, taking cheap shots and trying to demean the accomplishments of pros...that's why they're FANS...LOSERS do all of the above to make themselves feel better about themselves like you're doing)
I've got news for you...95% of the busienss we generate at BB.com doesn't come from aspiring BBers.
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What maes you think I'm taking anything now?
The fact that you yourself said that not taking any steroids was one of the reasons TP and KL had shrunk down to normal man size?
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The fact that you yourself said that not taking any steroids was one of the reasons TP and KL had shrunk down to normal man size?
Not that I'm shocked, but you completely missed the point...
What I said was that neither of the two mentioned train, eat, supplement, take drugs, etc....
Both would be closer looking to their "day" if the just trained on a regular basis, and ate with any regularity.
Not too tough to understand.
And neither of which has anything to do with me...I maintain what I have without AAS because I built a base naturally, have been training for almost 30 years, AND I eat and and supp consistantly.
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"IronMagazine" is being destroyed in this thread. And Chick chiming in makes matters even worse. haha
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LOL...what player in Football takes 3000mg of test, GH, Deca, Insulin and whatever else you want to throw in? Oh oh, I'll answer that.............NONE!
How the fuck would you know that. You think Lyle Alzado didn't use that much you closet case.
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LOL...what a joke of a thread ...a bunch of loses on the internet trying to justify why they're where they are in life....classic.
And by all means, use probably the two WORST examples in Kevin and Tom...two guys who are retired pros, who don't train or take steroids, don't follow a eating program, etc....
I see many retired pros at every show like Labrada, Gaspari, Larry Scott, Bill Pearl, Serge Nubret, Bill Grant, etc.... that look very good and maintain a scaled down version of what they looked like in their prime...because they still train and eat regularly.
Keep up the god work. boys...it's justification that makes not achieving anything an easier pill to swallow.
Chick, please be honest. You know most of the one's you mention still cycle regularly or are on HRT or "HRT".
I would also bet anything you too are on "HRT". You might feel it isn't really cycling, that it's just a case of restoring hormones to youthful levels but I would humbly disagree.
You also say
I maintain what I have without AAS because I built a base naturally, have been training for almost 30 years, AND I eat and and supp consistantly.
So you don't agree with Tom Prince that supplements are shit? I have seen Tom say supplements are total crap, creatine is shit and doesn't do anything and protein shakes are much worse than real food.
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I have seen Tom say supplements are total crap, creatine is shit and doesn't do anything and protein shakes are much worse than real food.
Wow, Tom actually made a truthful statement. Good for him! :D
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And neither of which has anything to do with me...I maintain what I have without AAS because I built a base naturally, have been training for almost 30 years, AND I eat and and supp consistantly.
I don't think anyone would doubt that most professional bodybuilders have a genetic propensity toward building muscle. What is also a major factor is the amount of drugs used and, more importantly, the genetic response to those drugs in taking people to unprecedented levels of size.
Bob, why did you spend many, many years turning yourself into a human pincushion with multiple injections of AAS, insulin and HGH if it wasn't for the fact that these drugs drastically changed your physique?
As the drugs have changed, so have the bodies.. while constants like eating well and training hard have not changed since the 20s - that's stunningly obvious.
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When did we define 'achievement' as taking steroids and standing in front of a crowd of schmoes in a thong fully oiled up ???
Epic showing how ignorant 'Chick' is to the 'Real World' .....
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Wow, Tom actually made a truthful statement. Good for him! :D
Doesn't Chick have a meal named after him at the Firehouse? I think that's what he ate postworkout and not some "recovery drink". I don't know what supplementation Chick was referring to but if it was vitamin and mineral supps those aren't going to maintain muscle after going off anabolics.
Chick, which supplements do you use?
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I think that by now whatever Chick will say will have zero credibility. This thread has turned into a massacre, which was pretty obvious from the start. Pro Bbbers should just keep their mouths shut, ignore the rest of the world as the rest of the world ignores them. It's best for both.
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this is Croatch's dream thread
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This thread has turned into a massacre
I was thinking it might go that way when I started the thread. ;D
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So congrats! 'Cause I must say I'm enjoying it.
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i think a few guys are exceptions... phil heath being the perfet example of a guy who is just "all drug genetics"... (response to hormones)..... i mean 4 years ago he was 190 lb basketball player now hes a top contender in the ifbb... that is ALL response to hormones..
but for 99% of guys it is a combo of hard training over plenty of years, consitant diet over plenty of years, and also YES consistant heavy doseages of hormones over plenty of years...
and then theres another group of small excpetionswho could never be pro because they genetic response is not excellent, not average, but non existant. aka billygunz
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The pros are pissed when noobs and idiots who never juiced say it's all about the drugs and I understand that. Drugs are the easiest part of the equation, anyone can do them. Without the genetics and the time put in gym and at the table you're not going to turn pro.
However, there's a lot of people on this thread who acknowledge all this and do get it. But the pros minimize the impact drugs. Chick mentioned Labrada. From the pics I've seen he still uses. Without them he is just a tiny tiny man. Gaspari is a small man naturally too.
Platz is another one who is nothing off drugs, especially the upper body. I don't care how he trains or eats, without steroids he is real small even by regular Joe standards.
All the retired pros who look muscular to the desensitized eye of the bb fan still use. Drugs are just an integral part of what it takes to look muscular nowadays.
Mike Morris is one pro who got off and continued training and eating and mere months after he looked like nothing at all.
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but the biggest thing separating a 180-lb gym rat and a 280-lb pro is a whole shitload of AAS, GH, and insulin.
the man with the BEST CONTACT wins! ;D
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The pros are pissed when noobs and idiots who never juiced say it's all about the drugs and I understand that. Drugs are the easiest part of the equation, anyone can do them. Without the genetics and the time put in gym and at the table you're not going to turn pro.
However, there's a lot of people on this thread who acknowledge all this and do get it. But the pros minimize the impact drugs. Chick mentioned Labrada. From the pics I've seen he still uses. Without them he is just a tiny tiny man. Gaspari is a small man naturally too.
Platz is another one who is nothing off drugs, especially the upper body. I don't care how he trains or eats, without steroids he is real small even by regular Joe standards.
All the retired pros who look muscular to the desensitized eye of the bb fan still use. Drugs are just an integral part of what it takes to look muscular nowadays.
Mike Morris is one pro who got off and continued training and eating and mere months after he looked like nothing at all.
The fact is that after several years of juicing, most guys have no hormonal response when they go "natural". Or it takes them a long time for the hormonal balance to get back to anything resembling to normality. Hence the "mega-fast shrinkage".
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All i see is there's no point discussing steroids with people who use them since they re 16 y/o.
These people are on drugs since so long they cannot even comprehend what it's like to be natural anymore, and they consider those who are as subhuman low scum losers like bob clearely stated it.
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Coming from drug addicts, I'll take the term "loser" as a compliment.
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cannot even comprehend what it's like to be natural anymore, and they consider those who are as subhuman low scum losers like bob clearely stated it.
i dont think thats true. even gh15 says he has got tremendous respect for the TRUE natural bodybuilders out there.
flagada if you are a lifetime natural and you keep plugging away i have got respect for that. even though you constantly attacking me for no reason and i dont even know whoo you are... lol
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Many typical responses. Mr. X works out, takes his protein shakes religiously, creatine, no2 etc buys flex magazine and attems to follow all the mostly bs workouts in there. Still looks like crap and nothing even remotely like a bodybuilder, much less a pro bodybuilder. So Mr. X starts taking steroids, gets a bit bigger, but still hardly looks like a bodybuilder and nowhere near a pro. Mr. X becomes frustrated and jealous that he can't get anywhere near a decent bodybuilding level, much less a pro level and begins looking for an excuse.
He can't use an eating excuse because that is in his control, he can't use a training excuse because that he is in control of, he refuses to use the genetics excuse because that in his mind is just unacceptable, so he chooses the only excuse left that he can't control. He convinces himself that the pro must take an ungodly amount of steroids HGH etc to look like that. Since Mr. X can't afford 60k of steroids a year like he believes the pro's take, he comes to getbig and decides to start bashing pro's when in reality it is deep seeded jealousy most of the time.
BTW, ones response to steroids is also a part of genetics. Some people grow instantly and immediately from reasonable doses while others can take large doses and get little. Unfair? Yes. However that's life.
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Good post. Spot on as usual
quoted for truth
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quoted for truth
Quoted for truth.
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Quoted for truth.
Thats not the truth.
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I think it's sad when 51 year old Canadian porn stars are in better shape than retired pro bodybuilders:
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I'm not against steroid use. I'm against these guys using the ridiculous amounts and types of chemicals they do to achieve 90% of their results then execting us to consider them "athletes" or making ridiculous claims about how supposedly inconsequential the drugs are to their success.
Stop talking about Phil like that.
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you think I am having a meltdown? lol, I have been SPAMMING THIS BOARD for over 7 years now WITH MY RIDICULOUS IRONMAGAZINE.COM ICON AND USERNAME. :)
Fixed it for you..
"1"
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I've got news for you...95% of the busienss we generate at BB.com doesn't come from aspiring BBers.
If so, why are they using YOU as a poster boy when 95% of the people that purchase products don't ever want to look like you??
"1"
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I've got news for you...95% of the busienss we generate at BB.com doesn't come from aspiring BBers.
Agreed. So why would they (or supplement makers) spend money to have IFBB "pros" under contract, since there's no way it translates into enough increased revenue for them to justify the costs?
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Agreed. So why would they (or supplement makers) spend money to have IFBB "pros" under contract, since there's no way it translates into enough increased revenue for them to justify the costs?
Are we in exact agreement on this one?
"1"
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Are we in exact agreement on this one?
"1"
If we agree it doesn't make a whole lot of sense for supplement makers to put money into sponsoring IFBB "athletes" given that 95% of their customers are not into IFBB bodybuilding and could care less, then yes we are.
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You guys are so pathetic, the pros even without drugs would look better than you because of genetics, they have them, you don't have good genetics. With gear you probably still wouldn't look as good as they do if they just worked out and ate right. Then you add in drugs and they become even bigger, what an idiotic thread like Chic said, keep justifying your loserness.
jt
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Are we in exact agreement on this one?
"1"
Why does nike show basketball players in their commercials when so many of their customers are lazy asses who'll just end up wearing their nikes to work?
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You guys are so pathetic, the pros even without drugs would look better than you because of genetics, they have them, you don't have good genetics. With gear you probably still wouldn't look as good as they do if they just worked out and ate right. Then you add in drugs and they become even bigger, what an idiotic thread like Chic said, keep justifying your loserness.
jt
I'm trying to figure out where anyone here said they'd be as big as a pro if they took the same drugs? No one said or even implied this, yet you schmoes who come out to defend your heroes always toss that strawman into these types of threads.
What is being compared here is a pro with good genetics on drugs and that same pro off drugs, and pointing out that the difference is massive... night and day... not just 5 or 10% as they all claim. NO ONE is comparing gym rats to pros with great genetics.
Get it now? ::)
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I think it's sad when 51 year old Canadian porn stars are in better shape than retired pro bodybuilders:
he does cardio ...alot of cardio
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who really cares if they're all drugs? What does it matter?
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who really cares if they're all drugs? What does it matter?
because the pros boast that they are pros because they train harder. they suck basically.
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Why does nike show basketball players in their commercials when so many of their customers are lazy asses who'll just end up wearing their nikes to work?
What lazy asses do you speak of that actually wear sneakers to work? Are you fucking kidding me? Who the hell else wears high top Nike sneakers but those guys you see playing basketball at the park at all hours of the day/night or the NBA athletes that are sponsored by Nike and wear them on the court?
I mean, look at this shit..
(http://bp2.blogger.com/_t7miKww5B8Q/RbPQ02ymWDI/AAAAAAAAAE0/d0OLe3imWYo/s400/DSCF7418.JPG)
In my line of work, and in most work, people wear regular shoes to work. Nike and ReeBok sneakers are a thing of yesterday, today most fashionable males/females wear sneakers that resemble that of shoes, hence why the Diesel, DKNY, Puma & Sketchers brands are all in style now. Inner city kids in the 11-14 age bracket are the ones who I see sporting those damn Nike sneakers (In particular, the high top ones that basketball players promote in their commercials)... Those shits are horrible looking as all hell, they remind me of those space boots seen in the 1969 space landing, horrendous!
(http://chnm.gmu.edu/worldhistorysources/unpacking/Resources/moon.jpg)
Bodybuilding.com employs Bob Chick. Bob, although a heck of a nice guy and good looking at that, admitted that 95% of the clientèle at Bodybuilding.com don't even aspire to be bodybuilders or to even look like bodybuilders, so why the hell would you have a 270-pound poster boy advertising products geared at customers that don't want to end up that way? Counterproductive no?
You target a particular market with a figure that they can relate to in some manner that, in turn, will boost your sales. If not for sticking to that simple formula, we can very well have an obese (500 pounds), bow-legged, 5'8, white guy promoting Nike Basketball sneakers and by your logic, Nike would have the same numbers in sales as they do by using someone like Kevin Garnett. It wouldn't happen, plain and simple..
"1"
P.S. There is a reason why they use the tall, black guy on the right as opposed to the butterball on the left..
(http://images.agoramedia.com/shaq/cms/publicsite/this-weeks_pub-large.jpg)
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S##t...everyone as usual has the right answer. Shawn has retained alot since his stage days which he is probably doing some xtra test. Also...Ronnie came off a bit and was still a good 220 or so on a vacation photo with his wife. Both men have football backgrounds. I'm assuming they started off with a good base esp Ronnie out of college. Phil, Tom Prince, Flex and some others were just bone thin guys to begin with before needle day.
So...what is good genetics? Does it have to do with limb length vs torso? Shawn eventhough short as Lee Priest has better limb balance to his truck. There is no way you can attribute good genetics to response to needle sticks.
I'm thinking if Phil had "the Gift" genetics he would be in the NBA instead or Shawn would have had a nice NFL career as a 3rd back.
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I wear nothing but hightops and i've never stepped on a bball court in my life. They're comfy.
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Harden the Fuk Up.
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you can put jet fuel in a prius, but that wont turn it into a ferrari
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I just dont understand why anyone cares if they're all drugs. I dont care what a bodybuilder looks like when they're retired, hell i dont care how they look in their offseason. I do care what they look like when they're on stage at a comp. I wanna see a buncha freaky mass monsters. Do I care if it takes a ton of drug use to get there? Fuck no who gives a shit.
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THEIR FAMILY ;D
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you can put jet fuel in a prius, but that wont turn it into a ferrari
Once again, nobody has said or implied that you can turn someone with crap genetics into a pro by adding drugs. No one. This is about the 270-lb pro maxing out at 200 at best if he cuts out all drugs. So your argument has nothing at all to do with this thread.
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I just dont understand why anyone cares if they're all drugs. I dont care what a bodybuilder looks like when they're retired, hell i dont care how they look in their offseason. I do care what they look like when they're on stage at a comp. I wanna see a buncha freaky mass monsters. Do I care if it takes a ton of drug use to get there? Fuck no who gives a shit.
I tend to agree.
Its a bit of a shame that it has gotten to this level of "use" but bb'ing, like all sports, progresses. People want to see bigger bb'ers, bigger football players, faster runners and swimmers. For every sport, not just bb'ing, there is a natural limit that people can reach, then to surpass that, which the fans seem to want, they need to take extra measures to achieve that level.
Today is the era of the "mass monster". If the judging were to change, maybe the drug use might come down too. Who knows. I don't care what someone takes, i don't care what they look like when they retire. Seems like some people here care a little bit too much though...
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Once again, nobody has said or implied that you can turn someone with crap genetics into a pro by adding drugs. No one. This is about the 270-lb pro maxing out at 200 at best if he cuts out all drugs. So your argument has nothing at all to do with this thread.
But you're saying this like its a bad thing...or new information... most bbing fans dont give a shit how a pro looks after he retires. Well granted its cool to see them still huge, but if not who cares. And who cares that its all drugs? Whats the problem here? Personally im happy that pros take a fuckton of drugs cuz it means they look huge and fuckin freaky, i dont really care about their health all that much as heartless as it sounds.
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he does cardio ...alot of cardio
LOL!
You guys are so pathetic, the pros even without drugs would look better than you because of genetics, they have them, you don't have good genetics. With gear you probably still wouldn't look as good as they do if they just worked out and ate right. Then you add in drugs and they become even bigger, what an idiotic thread like Chic said, keep justifying your loserness.
jt
No one defends me when the peanut gallery bashes my physique and that's fine by me. No one defends the majority of people whose physiques are bashed on here. That is just the nature of getbig. So why is it that when pros like Kevin, Tom Prince, Mike Francois and others shrink down to my size, they deserve protection?
Guess which retired pro is pictured below? ;D
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Nor do they.
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I think it's sad when 51 year old Canadian porn stars are in better shape than retired pro bodybuilders:
what's even more sad is that you're posting videos of them!!! ;D ;D ;D
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LOL!
No one defends me when the peanut gallery bashes my physique and that's fine by me. No one defends the majority of people whose physiques are bashed on here. That is just the nature of getbig. So why is it that when pros like Kevin, Tom Prince, Mike Francois and others shrink down to my size, they deserve protection?
Guess which retired pro is pictured below? ;D
lookin not too bad ther..... but fuk the vest............
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Many typical responses. Mr. X works out, takes his protein shakes religiously, creatine, no2 etc buys flex magazine and attems to follow all the mostly bs workouts in there. Still looks like crap and nothing even remotely like a bodybuilder, much less a pro bodybuilder. So Mr. X starts taking steroids, gets a bit bigger, but still hardly looks like a bodybuilder and nowhere near a pro. Mr. X becomes frustrated and jealous that he can't get anywhere near a decent bodybuilding level, much less a pro level and begins looking for an excuse.
He can't use an eating excuse because that is in his control, he can't use a training excuse because that he is in control of, he refuses to use the genetics excuse because that in his mind is just unacceptable, so he chooses the only excuse left that he can't control. He convinces himself that the pro must take an ungodly amount of steroids HGH etc to look like that. Since Mr. X can't afford 60k of steroids a year like he believes the pro's take, he comes to getbig and decides to start bashing pro's when in reality it is deep seeded jealousy most of the time.
BTW, ones response to steroids is also a part of genetics. Some people grow instantly and immediately from reasonable doses while others can take large doses and get little. Unfair? Yes. However that's life.
So true,
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You seem to know your shit when it comes to acting like an ass. A dozen posts in a row of typical Bbing nuthugging: "It takes a lot of dedication, etc....will power, higher pain treshold and all the usual bullshit" to convince people who have no need to be convinced because guess what? They train, they eat, diet, do the usual stuff most people who lift weights do. Most of them know their shit, the infos are out there, there's no need to be a fuckin' rocket scientist to find out how to train, how to eat, to see what the possibilities are, to experiment. The major difference between most people here and pros is that even those who juice are not stupid enough to do 1/4 the drugs those guys do.
exactly 8)
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the thread of truth 8)
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It is a sad part of bodybuilding that mg = Kg, but it is also true that some guys can compete at 240 on 1500mg and others need to take 4000mgs for 220. Drugs are a big part no doubt. But they arent everything.
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No they are not everything that is why the IFBB don't do Drug tests, there is No need.
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Many typical responses. Mr. X works out, takes his protein shakes religiously, creatine, no2 etc buys flex magazine and attems to follow all the mostly bs workouts in there. Still looks like crap and nothing even remotely like a bodybuilder, much less a pro bodybuilder. So Mr. X starts taking steroids, gets a bit bigger, but still hardly looks like a bodybuilder and nowhere near a pro. Mr. X becomes frustrated and jealous that he can't get anywhere near a decent bodybuilding level, much less a pro level and begins looking for an excuse.
He can't use an eating excuse because that is in his control, he can't use a training excuse because that he is in control of, he refuses to use the genetics excuse because that in his mind is just unacceptable, so he chooses the only excuse left that he can't control. He convinces himself that the pro must take an ungodly amount of steroids HGH etc to look like that. Since Mr. X can't afford 60k of steroids a year like he believes the pro's take, he comes to getbig and decides to start bashing pro's when in reality it is deep seeded jealousy most of the time.
BTW, ones response to steroids is also a part of genetics. Some people grow instantly and immediately from reasonable doses while others can take large doses and get little. Unfair? Yes. However that's life.
This is the truth.......
And if you think this guy doesnt know his shit, ask liquid c to post his rear lat spread
;)
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It is a sad part of bodybuilding that mg = Kg, but it is also true that some guys can compete at 240 on 1500mg and others need to take 4000mgs for 220. Drugs are a big part no doubt. But they arent everything.
That's true. Response is variable. The point of this thread is that successful pros definitely have a great genetic response but do not necessarily respond as well to natural training. Although to be perfectly fair, Kevin really did go out of his way to look bad and I would still say he is bigger and leaner than tons of twenty somethings who train and eat properly and don't forget Kevin is 43 next month. Also, who knows if his endocrine system is even completely stable after his retirement from pro bodybuilding.