Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Nutrition, Products & Supplements Info => Topic started by: Bluto on November 05, 2008, 09:13:52 AM
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???
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Blutes,
You asking for types of supplements or names of brands?
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Blutes,
You asking for types of supplements or names of brands?
Types of supplements. People like to experiement with supplements and try a new product every now and then but I'm curious on which supplements they consider make enough difference to take them all the time!
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Whey protein powder
BCAA powder
Starch based carb drink (during workouts)
Fish oil
Dessicated Liver tablets
Egg Beaters (I’m fussing a bit with this one, but because of its processing, I consider it a “supp.”)
Multi-vitamins- including additional B12 & 6.
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protein powder
carbohydrate powder
fish oil
zinc
magnesium
melatonin
caffiene tabs
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Yeah.
I forgot caffeine.
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what do you notice from the dessicated liver tabs ? how do you use them ?
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They’ve been a big thing on and off over the past few decades – dating back to Larry Scott’s peak years.
Supposedly, some guys would consume 100+ (and some well above that) per day.
I take 50/day divided over two doses – Vitamin Shoppe brand.
Good source of iron, folic acid and B vitamins 1&12 (12 helps metabolize food into energy).
I use them as two of my daily “meals” – part of them, anyway.
It’s beef liver, so I presume they carry benefits similar to beef as far as the protein/amino content, anti-catabolic effects, etc.
Liver is also considered an extremely nutrient-dense food, but I can’t hack the stuff no matter how it’s prepared – unless they’re defatted, dried out, and pressed into little pellets about the size of an aspirin.
When taking them at night, I also include a B6 tablet to aid my CNS.
Here are links to a few articles you may find interesting:
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86412&perpage=30&pagenumber=2 (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86412&perpage=30&pagenumber=2)
http://www.ironguru.com/Home/tabid/637/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/81/NEW-DISCOVERIES-WITH-DESICCATED-LIVER.aspx (http://www.ironguru.com/Home/tabid/637/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/81/NEW-DISCOVERIES-WITH-DESICCATED-LIVER.aspx)
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Fish Oil, Multi, & Protein Powder.
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whey
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what do you notice from the dessicated liver tabs ? how do you use them ?
I use them when dieting to help spare muscle tissue...but to answer your question...I don't know
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what do you notice from the dessicated liver tabs ? how do you use them ?
They are a good source of protein, natural iron, & b vitamins.
I forgot I also buy them too. I usually take about five of the Universal kind every night.
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Its a secret. ;D
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???
Vitamin C and E. The are the only supplements that a real scientist, Linus Pauling, Nobelist in chemistry, demonstrated to have long-term health benefits. Everything else offers only some specific benefits with potential side effects. Avoid everything else unless strictly necessary.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Vitamin C and E. The are the only supplements that a real scientist, Linus Pauling, Nobelist in chemistry, demonstrated to have long-term health benefits. Everything else offers only some specific benefits with potential side effects. Avoid everything else unless strictly necessary.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
hmmm that's not what the "experts" and "gurus" say though
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hmmm that's not what the "experts" and "gurus" say though
like the studies that showed those with the highest intake of vitamin E supplementation had a higher mortality rate then the general population.
GTE is something that has tons of research behind it
fish oil is another huge general health supplement
magnesium has shown some real nice beenies in studies
zinc has immune enhancing effects.
i could go on but some shit if take
whey
fish oil
cal,mag,d supp
forskolin for cAMP elevation (i need it)
Vit e(mixed tocopherols,tocotrienols, with gamma toc being higher dosed which fits with research)
tumeric (this probably has more health benefits then all other supps combined, the research for health and health conditions is impressive)
some creatine supp
i also take some niacinamide for anti aging, stress and mast cell stabilization. The research also shows it to be a potent neuroprotective
caffeine.
I take some more shit for other specific reasons, but i would consider the above stuff i take all the time. Forskolin in cycles, mainly for my asthma, which it works quite well for.
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hmmm that's not what the "experts" and "gurus" say though
The "experts" and "gurus" have won no Nobel Prize. Until they do, I don't care what they hacve to say.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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like the studies that showed those with the highest intake of vitamin E supplementation had a higher mortality rate then the general population.
Define "high" intake. 1,000 I.Us daily? Maybe. 400 I.Us daily? No, only benefits. Just the fact that vitamin E thins the blood is already a huge plus.
fish oil is another huge general health supplement
Lots of these "studies" were payed for by the fishing industry. Fish oil actually increases oxidative stress and decreases the level of several DNA-repairing enzymes.
magnesium has shown some real nice beenies in studies
You only need 400 miligrams a day. More than that and you start interfering with the absorption of other minerals.
zinc has immune enhancing effects.
You only need 15 miligrams a day. More than that and you start to interfere with the absorption of other minerals.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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The "experts" and "gurus" have won no Nobel Prize. Until they do, I don't care what they hacve to say.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
So with your logic, anything that you post that isn't the thoughts of Linus Pauling (who died 14 years ago and who won the Nobel Prize 54 years ago ) nobody should care about.
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Define "high" intake. 1,000 I.Us daily? Maybe. 400 I.Us daily? No, only benefits. Just the fact that vitamin E thins the blood is already a huge plus.
I know something else that thins the blood... fish oil!
Lots of these "studies" were payed for by the fishing industry. Fish oil actually increases oxidative stress and decreases the level of several DNA-repairing enzymes.
I challenged you to post numerous studies with the conclusion that the cons far outweight the pros when it comes to fish oil - 5 days ago! So far no answer?
You only need 400 miligrams a day. More than that and you start interfering with the absorption of other minerals.
Which other minerals?
You only need 15 miligrams a day. More than that and you start to interfere with the absorption of other minerals.
Actually the quantaties would have to be 50, not 15 miligrams a day for that to happen. And with "other" minerals, I assume you mean copper?
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The "experts" and "gurus" have won no Nobel Prize. Until they do, I don't care what they hacve to say.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
;D
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So with your logic, anything that you post that isn't the thoughts of Linus Pauling (who died 14 years ago and who won the Nobel Prize 54 years ago ) nobody should care about.
So going by your logic, the word of "gurus" with very sophomoric knowledge of physiology and biochemistry, who are on the payroll of supplement companies, is worth more than that of a Nobelist with an IQ of 170 who had no interest in selling people anything? Nice.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I know something else that thins the blood... fish oil!
And I know soemthing that thins the blood without the negatives of fish oil: vitamin E.
I challenged you to post numerous studies with the conclusion that the cons far outweight the pros when it comes to fish oil - 5 days ago! So far no answer?
You mean for me to post studies that, unlike yours, were not payed for private parties with financial interests at stack?
Which other minerals?
What diffeence does this make? Interfering with the absorption of any mineral is bad for you, so the specific mineral that is less absorbed when you mega dose a certain mineral is not relevant as the end result is the same: your health is impaired.
Actually the quantaties would have to be 50, not 15 miligrams a day for that to happen. And with "other" minerals, I assume you mean copper?
Actually, 50 miligrams is the maximum physiologically tolerable levle of Zinc you can take. More than that and Zinc becomes a poison, and starts to affect your health negatively in far more ways than simply inhibiting the absorption of other minerals. Anything above 15 miligrams is not used by the body and represents a burden that must be dealt with by the whole system. Even Victor Conte stated - don't ask me to post the quote or a link because I read this interview with him in the M&F many years ago - that he might have been wrong and that the dose of 30 miligrams of Zinc in ZMA might be excessive.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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bronkaid
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And I know soemthing that thins the blood without the negatives of fish oil: vitamin E.
You mean for me to post studies that, unlike yours, were not payed for private parties with financial interests at stack?
What diffeence does this make? Interfering with the absorption of any mineral is bad for you, so the specific mineral that is less absorbed when you mega dose a certain mineral is not relevant as the end result is the same: your health is impaired.
Actually, 50 miligrams is the maximum physiologically tolerable levle of Zinc you can take. More than that and Zinc becomes a poison, and starts to affect your health negatively in far more ways than simply inhibiting the absorption of other minerals. Anything above 15 miligrams is not used by the body and represents a burden that must be dealt with by the whole system. Even Victor Conte stated - don't ask me to post the quote or a link because I read this interview with him in the M&F many years ago - that he might have been wrong and that the dose of 30 miligrams of Zinc in ZMA might be excessive.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
there is no way to measure at which point anti oxidants become pro oxidants. Oxidation is not a very good argument against fish oil, as i outlined that exercise induces far more oxidation then fish oil. Post some relevant research and i will do the same until then your argument is pretty moot.
"Actually, 50 miligrams is the maximum physiologically tolerable levle of Zinc you can take. More than that and Zinc becomes a poison, and starts to affect your health negatively in far more ways than simply inhibiting the absorption of other minerals. Anything above 15 miligrams is not used by the body and represents a burden that must be dealt with by the whole system. Even Victor Conte stated - don't ask me to post the quote or a link because I read this interview with him in the M&F many years ago - that he might have been wrong and that the dose of 30 miligrams of Zinc in ZMA might be excessive."
references? it depends on the individual, many people are deficient in zinc, people like polquin have his athletes take up to 100 mgs a day with nothing but positives reported. Again, you cant make such broad generalizations to the general population as mineral and vitamin status changes according to activity,age,diet,health..
"You mean for me to post studies that, unlike yours, were not payed for private parties with financial interests at stack?"
where are you getting this from, you know that the peer reviewed process does not operate with doctored studies, and companies are obligated to release studies regardless of conclusion.
"What diffeence does this make? Interfering with the absorption of any mineral is bad for you, so the specific mineral that is less absorbed when you mega dose a certain mineral is not relevant as the end result is the same: your health is impaired."
no. In orthomolecular medicine many times nutrient levels are out of wack, some need to come down, like copper for instance, and some need to come up. For example reducing iron in a hepatitis patient or someone with cirohsis of the liver is beneficial. Likewise taking vitamin c in this case in high doses is negative and harmful to the individual.
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Vitamin C and E. The are the only supplements that a real scientist, Linus Pauling, Nobelist in chemistry, demonstrated to have long-term health benefits. Everything else offers only some specific benefits with potential side effects. Avoid everything else unless strictly necessary.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
you are saying that the only supps worth taking are vit c and E? bit of a weird statement from a mod, i would of geussed you were pro supplementation.
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Define "high" intake. 1,000 I.Us daily? Maybe. 400 I.Us daily? No, only benefits. Just the fact that vitamin E thins the blood is already a huge plus.
.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
NO, 400IUS is defined as high and actually increases risk of death like i said. Your statement is patently false.
http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/press_releases/2004/11_10_04.html
"The study results showed that people taking vitamin E supplements of 400 IU or more per day had an increased risk of death."
"Our study results do not support the use of high-dose vitamin E supplements. If people are taking a multivitamin, they should make sure it contains no more than a low dose of vitamin E," said study lead author and internist Edgar R. Miller III, M.D., Ph.D., associate professor of medicine at The Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine. "A lot of people take vitamins because they believe it will benefit their health in the long term and prolong life. But our study shows that use of high-dose vitamin E supplements certainly did not prolong life, but was associated with a higher risk of death."
"In the current study, the Johns Hopkins team re-analyzed raw data from 19 major clinical trials, sorting information by whether high- or low-dose levels of vitamin E were taken. Nine of these studies tested vitamin E alone; 10 tested its use in combination with other vitamins.
The 19 studies took place between 1993 and 2004 and involved more than 136,000 patients in North America, Europe and China. All of the studies involved use of a control group taking a dummy pill, or placebo. Risk of death was estimated by comparing the death rates in both groups. Follow-up periods ranged from 1.4 years to 8.2 years.When the data for these trials was re-evaluated, through a process called a meta-analysis, nine of 11 trials involving high-dose vitamin E (400 IU per day, or more) showed an increased risk of death. The other eight trials involved low-dose vitamin E users"
when you say vitamin e what exactly are you referring to also? alpha tocopherol, gamma tocopherol perhaps a tocotrienol? they all have different effects to a large degree, and supplementing with one usually decreases plasma levels of the others.
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So going by your logic, the word of "gurus" with very sophomoric knowledge of physiology and biochemistry, who are on the payroll of supplement companies, is worth more than that of a Nobelist with an IQ of 170 who had no interest in selling people anything? Nice.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
I've got an open mind. I don't limit myself to only believe in a dead guy that won the Noble Prize 50-60 years ago. You do.
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You mean for me to post studies that, unlike yours, were not payed for private parties with financial interests at stack?
Post any study you want.
I haven't so far seen a single study where the conclusion is that the cons far outweight the pros when it comes to fish oil. You make it sounds like there's numerous such studies, well let's have it! Back up your claims!
What diffeence does this make?
You sure it interfers with other minerals?
Actually, 50 miligrams is the maximum physiologically tolerable levle of Zinc you can take.
You claimed over 15grams starts to interfere with the absorption of other minerals. Not true.
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you are saying that the only supps worth taking are vit c and E? bit of a weird statement from a mod, i would of geussed you were pro supplementation.
I think so too, I was expecting someone with an open mind.
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NO, 400IUS is defined as high and actually increases risk of death like i said. Your statement is patently false.
I've been taking 400 I.U of vitamin E daily for the past 6 years and my blood work shows very low levels of LDL and high levels of HDL. So I don't care what these studies have to say since I've done a study on myself and I have empirical data supporting my postulate that 400 I.U is good for you.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I've got an open mind. I don't limit myself to only believe in a dead guy that won the Noble Prize 50-60 years ago. You do.
No, what you're saying is that the opinions of guys with basic college degrees, who have a vested interest in selling supplements, carries more weight than the opinion of a genius with an IQ of 170, a doctoral degree in biochemistry, a Nobel Prize and no vested interests in manipulating the truth for his own gain. This is what you're saying, in a nutshell.
:)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I've been taking 400 I.U of vitamin E daily for the past 6 years and my blood work shows very low levels of LDL and high levels of HDL. So I don't care what these studies have to say since I've done a study on myself and I have empirical data supporting my postulate that 400 I.U is good for you.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
to many extraneous variables, the link between cholesterol and disease is pretty weak also so i wouldnt use that marker for longevity.
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No, what you're saying is that the opinions of guys with basic college degrees, who have a vested interest in selling supplements, carries more weight than the opinion of a genius with an IQ of 170, a doctoral degree in biochemistry, a Nobel Prize and no vested interests in manipulating the truth for his own gain. This is what you're saying, in a nutshell.
:)
SUCKMYMUSCLE
No.
You're trusting the old dead guy. And nobody else. Period. That's not opened minded.
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LOL @ "studies on myself"
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No.
You're trusting the old dead guy. And nobody else. Period. That's not opened minded.
I am open minded, but I believe that the opinion of a genius, who won the most respectable scientific prize in the World, and was not trying to sell us stuff is more important than the opinion of "gurus" with barely a college education who earn a living selling supplements. That's all.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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LOL @ "studies on myself"
What is wrong with that statement? I am a Human, so the conclusions of experimentations done on myself can be extrapolated to some degree to my species as a whole.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I keep buying protein, creatine, multi-vitamins and sugar free rockstars. :)
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Whey protein,
Mutlivitamin,
Fish oil...
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Fish Oil
Creatine
Whey
Multi