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Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: MattT on September 11, 2009, 12:12:33 PM
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24027&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23602&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
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Best 5'7 and under guy ever.
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Shawn should have won two Olympias - 94 and possibly 96.
Yates destroys him on back shots though.
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Padilla was better and was robbed.
Ray was narrow, lacked dryness and was a little soft most of the time, quads were a little blocky and lacked sweep. Just too small in comparison to some others who were at least as good, such as Wheeler.
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Shawn should have won two Olympias - 94 and possibly 96.
Yates destroys him on back shots though.
these pics r from 1995, and he should have won then.
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23200&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23204&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=22772&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
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pound for pound, I think Shawn outmuscled Yates. And he had some much more muscle detail and separation. Plus he had full round muscle bellies. And, he more than held his own in back shots against Yates.
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pound for pound, I think Shawn outmuscled Yates. And he had some much more muscle detail and separation. Plus he had full round muscle bellies. And, he more than held his own in back shots against Yates.
agreed ...
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Shawn should have won two Olympias - 94 and possibly 96.
No way. Shawn's front & rear lat spreads were nothing special, not to mention he was narrow and had blocky quads. Dorian beat him fair and square everytime and by a huge margin at that.
these pics r from 1995, and he should have won then.
Pretty retarded thing to say even for you Matt
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oh brother. Yates dominated 92-95.
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oh brother. Yates dominated 92-95.
At least 3x
/yeah, i know *shh*
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No flaws?? He is black.
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Pretty retarded thing to say even for you Matt
;D
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Shawn didnt win the Mr O because he is a midget on drugs just like MoronT
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Matt T judges bodybuilders with the same criteria he uses for politicians.
95 Yates was one of the best ever.
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24027&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23602&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
Being a midget and small is a major flaw.
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What flaws Yates had?
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Shawn achieved runner up. That's pretty good.
:)
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In 95 Yates looked good, only bettered by 93. Shawn had a better argument in 94 but still a good big man will always beat a good small man.
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these pics r from 1995, and he should have won then.
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23200&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23204&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=22772&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
you people are tripping. Yates killed ray at the 95, i was there. no contest at all. over form the moment they walked onstage.
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No flaws?? He is black.
LMAO
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these pics r from 1995, and he should have won then.
A lot of people give you shit about being an idiot , I never joined them but with this statement I'm gonna have to agree
1995 Dorian was untouchable to utter anything to the contrary is lunacy
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24027&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23602&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
monster forehead and epic negroid gums
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A lot of people give you shit about being an idiot , I never joined them but with this statement I'm gonna have to agree
1995 Dorian was untouchable to utter anything to the contrary is lunacy
I think Nassar would have to say something bout this .. ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
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He wasn't in the same league as Yates, just too small and also had some flaws. Wheeler was better and had a better shot to win.
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
Flaws? height these contests are for the genetic elite he was 5'7" , muscular bulk 205 pounds isn't that spectacular even for someone his height , he had a long torso and short legs , he had high calves , narrow clavicles , no back width
awesome bodybuilder no doubts but don't claim he had no flaws , you can argue all you want if his type of physique should be the ideal in which a Mr Olympia should represent but that's a matter of semantics , Dorian destroyed him utterly as well as everyone else in 1995
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at his best, shawn's back double bi was right there thanks to incredible detail.
but his rear lat shot sucked.
Mr. O 1994 and 96
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I think Nassar would have to say something bout this .. ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
He has a lot to say most bitter washed up people do ;D Nasser was left for dead to in 1995 like 1993 there was NO contest
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at his best, shawn's back double bi was right there thanks to incredible detail.
but his rear lat shot sucked.
Mr. O 1994 and 96
Hahahahahahaha you post a pic from 1995 Mr Olympia , his back double bicep sucks compared to Dorian he has a nice detailed back with excellent separation but spare me if you think that's anywhere next to Yates ANY year
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no moron ::)
I know that pic is from 95
shawn should have won the O in 94 and 96
pay attention. ::)
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his back double bicep sucks compared to Dorian he has a nice detailed back with excellent separation but spare me if you think that's anywhere next to Yates ANY year
ironically, musclemag's contest review of the 94 olympia said otherwise..
said shawn's back was good enough to be right there beside dorian, and that dorian's back had filled in somewhat compared to 93..
deal with that Mr. Quotes ::)
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no moron ::)
I know that pic is from 95
shawn should have won the O in 94 and 96
pay attention. ::)
Yeah and you typed he's right up there in the back double biceps shot NO he's not NOT in 94/95/96 NOT ever
Shawn was gifted second place in 1994 never mind he beat Dorian , he was BEHIND Levrone after the prejudging in 94 and only beat him by virtue of a better posing routine
Shawn was never close to Dorian ever
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ironically, musclemag's contest review of the 94 olympia said otherwise..
said shawn's back was good enough to be right there beside dorian, and that dorian's back had filled in somewhat compared to 93..
deal with that Mr. Quotes ::)
You're a liar I have their coverage and NO WHERE does it say his back was good enough to be right besides Dorian and Dorian's back filled in? WTF is that supposed to mean?
I already busted you making up quotes before so anything you quote is worth ' fuck all '
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ironically, musclemag's contest review of the 94 olympia said otherwise..
said shawn's back was good enough to be right there beside dorian, and that dorian's back had filled in somewhat compared to 93..
deal with that Mr. Quotes ::)
Musclemag's contest pics were good, but their writers were morons who never got it right (esp. Johnny Fitness). I'd rather read one of your posts about Ronnie in the 99 Mr Olympia.
Shawn never, not once, claimed that he deserved to win any of the Olympias over Dorian and for good reason. You just keep proving how little you know about judging a contest, Hulkster - stick to being a Ronnie fan boy and leave the analysis to guys like ND ;D
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You're a liar I have their coverage and NO WHERE does it say his back was good enough to be right besides Dorian and Dorian's back filled in? WTF is that supposed to mean?
I already busted you making up quotes before so anything you quote is worth ' fuck all '
Shawn was great for weighing 50lbs less than Dorrian. Close but no cigar ;)
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Musclemag's contest pics were good, but their writers were morons who never got it right. I'd rather read one of your posts about Ronnie in the 99 Mr Olympia.
Shawn never, not once, claimed that he deserved to win any of the Olympias over Dorian and for good reason. You just keep proving how little you know about judging a contest, Hulkster - stick to being a Ronnie fan boy and leave the analysis to guys like ND ;D
Great post ! hahahahahaha Shawn said in 1994 he got the place he deserved in 1997 he did NOT bitch Dorian should have lost just complained why he got straight firsts lol years later he pulls a Nasser and cries he should have won ::)
Hulkster KNOWS dick about competitive bodybuilding , Shawn was trailing Levrone after the prejudging in points and only managed to edge past him with a better posing routine in the night show , 1994 was a close contest ...................for second place
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Shawn was great for weighing 50lbs less than Dorrian. Close but no cigar ;)
in 1994 Shawn was 205 pounds Dorian was 262 pounds that's a whopping 57 pound advantage in dense muscular bulk that's a massive ( no pun ) deficit to try and overcome
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Shawn said in 1994 he got the place he deserved in 1997 he did NOT bitch Dorian should have lost just complained why he got straight firsts lol years later he pulls a Nasser and cries he should have won ::)
Exactly. It was night and day between him and Doz every time they competed. He was pissed off with Flex placing above him in the 93 Olympia and after the 94 Olympia, said, "I feel I didn't get what I deserved last year. Fast forward to tonight and I'm really pleased with my placing".
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in 1994 1996 Shawn was 205 pounds Dorian was 262 pounds that's a whopping 57 pound advantage in dense stuck together muscular bulk mess that's a massive ( no pun ) deficit to try and overcome along with one arm and baby kangaroo in his pouch
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Dorian trampled Shawn in 96 was well , Shawn was never a legitimate thread for the Olympia title if you believe otherwise I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn
again you can argue if Shawn's physique should represent the ideal but the judges have spoken and Shawn Ray wasn't Mr Olympia material
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Exactly. It was night and day between him and Doz every time they competed. He was pissed off with Flex placing above him in the 93 Olympia and after the 94 Olympia, said, "I feel I didn't get what I deserved last year. Fast forward to tonight and I'm really pleased with my placing".
Exactly he was happy to be runner-up again and bitched & moaned about apples & oranges
Shawn has a very nice physique and did very well for himself despite his shortcomings he should be proud but he was NEVER EVER going to become Mr Olympia even if Dorian never existed
These guys can't separate what they like from what wins 99% of GetBiggers judge physiques on what they prefer , they can't separate their bias & preference from what wins , Dorian Yates
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This question is better asked to Milos.
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pound for pound, I think Shawn outmuscled Yates. And he had some much more muscle detail and separation. Plus he had full round muscle bellies. And, he more than held his own in back shots against Yates.
nope. Yates was approx 44 lbs per foot of height. ray was approx 39 lbs per foot. not outmuscled.
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Dorian was a tremendous bber no doubt, but I never liked his physique. What was the fascination with him anyways?? Much prefer Flex, Levrone, and even Wolf. Just my stupid opinion, but whatever ;D
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Dorian was a tremendous bber no doubt, but I never liked his physique. What was the fascination with him anyways?? Much prefer Flex, Levrone, and even Wolf. Just my stupid opinion, but whatever ;D
Not a stupid opinion a popular one , I would prefer to look like Reeves or Zane but what I would prefer to look like and what would win are two entirely different things
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shawn never deserved to be runner up, let alone Mr. Olympia
E
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Shawn threw a hissyfit when he lost to this man in 95 - didn't he threaten to retire after that? :)
He said something like, "I could see myself being second, or third, but fourth to Nasser was a slap in the face"
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Shawn through a hissyfit when he lost to this man in 95 - didn't he threaten to retire after that? :)
He said something like, "I could see myself being second, or third, but fourth to Nasser was a slap in the face"
Nasser owning right there dont tell sheriff though he will get the "Big head"
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when I saw the title thought this thread was going to be about Edgar Fletcher.
he is the greatest non-pro of all time.
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when I saw the title thought this thread was going to be about Edgar Fletcher.
he is the greatest non-pro of all time.
Yes agreed
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24027&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23602&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
IMO the Olympia title is a character award and Shawn nd Flex just had a type of personality the IFBB may have not wanted to represent the top title of bodybuilding. I easily predicted Ronnies first win for this reason.....he was a cop and allegedly known to be natural.
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IMO the Olympia title is a character award and Shawn nd Flex just had a type of personality the IFBB may have not wanted to represent the top title of bodybuilding. I easily predicted Ronnies first win for this reason.....he was a cop and allegedly known to be natural.
Shawn had the perfect personality for an Olympia winner , smart , articulate , handsome , awesome physique .
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when I saw the title thought this thread was going to be about Edgar Fletcher.
he is the greatest non-pro of all time.
No, Sean Allen is. :P
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They don't favor short guys for the Olympia, everything else equal.
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24027&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23602&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
RASICS
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Sean was into trannies and BB was something he did to impress the G4P crowd. For a midget he looked awesome.
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in 1994 Shawn was 205 pounds Dorian was 262 pounds that's a whopping 57 pound advantage in dense muscular bulk that's a massive ( no pun ) deficit to try and overcome
Actually ND, that's not a 57 pound advantage when you factor in the height difference. Shawn was 5'6"-5'7" and Dorian 5'10"-5'11". Each inch of height equals to about 10 pounds more on the scale, meaning if Shawn were 3-4" taller, he would have weighed 30-40 pounds more, bringing his weight up to 235-245 pounds in 1994 and therefore, Dorian only would have had between 17-27 pounds on him. Really surprised you failed to take this into account ND.
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Dorian wasn't even close to being 262 pounds in 1996. He claimed to be in his mid 250's, but I believe he was less. He looked FAR thinner than his 1993 physique, where he supposedly weighed the same.
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No flaws?? He is black.
lol
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when I saw the title thought this thread was going to be about Edgar Fletcher.
he is the greatest non-pro of all time.
X2
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They don't favor short guys for the Olympia, everything else equal.
They sure did with Dexter.
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Actually ND, that's not a 57 pound advantage when you factor in the height difference. Shawn was 5'6"-5'7" and Dorian 5'10"-5'11". Each inch of height equals to about 10 pounds more on the scale, meaning if Shawn were 3-4" taller, he would have weighed 30-40 pounds more, bringing his weight up to 235-245 pounds in 1994 and therefore, Dorian only would have had between 17-27 pounds on him. Really surprised you failed to take this into account ND.
I'm not. the man doesn't have a clue. ::)
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No flaws?? He is black.
u bad lol
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24027&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23602&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
No one has no flaws!!.. being naturally small is a flaw!.. ronnie’s calves are naturally weak so why do we blame him for having naturally weak calves and don’t blame shawn for being naturally small? Bodybuilding is a genetics sports!..
Yes all shawn’s body parts were good but one important point is that non of them was the best!!.. he had great back but dorian’s back was better, he had good average arms not as some one like lee priest, his quads were good but not as good as nasser or cormier, his shoulders were good but not good beside someone like levrone.. etc..
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Actually ND, that's not a 57 pound advantage when you factor in the height difference. Shawn was 5'6"-5'7" and Dorian 5'10"-5'11". Each inch of height equals to about 10 pounds more on the scale, meaning if Shawn were 3-4" taller, he would have weighed 30-40 pounds more, bringing his weight up to 235-245 pounds in 1994 and therefore, Dorian only would have had between 17-27 pounds on him. Really surprised you failed to take this into account ND.
Actually in Steeve Reeves book he says for every 1 inch you add 5 pounds , so add 15 pounds to Ray's weight bringing him to 220 pounds
and do you realize what a 17-27 pound advantage in muscular bulk is? look at the difference between Dorian from 92-93 with 17 pounds , either way Dorian has a huge advantage in muscular bulk so Shawn's still at a disadvantage
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I'm not. the man doesn't have a clue. ::)
I don't have a clue? you're so pathetic you'll agree with anyone as long as it give you an chance to TRY and make me look bad , I don't blame you though I made you look stupid for a very long time you're always looking for revenge hence why you follow me around
even entertaining his 10 pound per inch theory , Dorian still has a clear advantage in muscular bulk so either way you're still and idiot and Shawn is still deficient in part of the judging criteria in which YOU don't know anything about , either way Hulkster = FAIL ;)
1994 was a close contest ........................ ........................ for second , Dorian destroyed everyone
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Dorian wasn't even close to being 262 pounds in 1996. He claimed to be in his mid 250's, but I believe he was less. He looked FAR thinner than his 1993 physique, where he supposedly weighed the same.
he was listed as 257 pounds and he did look smaller than usual and flat especially in the quads
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Actually in Steeve Reeves book he says for every 1 inch you add 5 pounds , so add 15 pounds to Ray's weight bringing him to 220 pounds
and do you realize what a 17-27 pound advantage in muscular bulk is? look at the difference between Dorian from 92-93 with 17 pounds , either way Dorian has a huge advantage in muscular bulk so Shawn's still at a disadvantage
The real calculation is to add 5 pounds for every inch under 6'0" and every 1" over 6'0" you're adding 10 pounds. Either way, the weight really does have little to no relevance seeing guys like Flex Wheeler according to you had far less muscle than Kevin Levrone, seeing Flex at his best was 227-232 pounds and was a full inch taller. Kevin at his best was around 248-253 pounds. My point is, you can't always base your judging criteria on bodyweight, seeing added bodyweight doesn't always equate to quality. The whole QUANTITY over QUALITY game, which we've seen too much of in the last decade.
Look at at Arnold S. At the 1975 Mr. Olympia Arnold weighed 227 pounds at 6'1.5", yet he probably had more quality muscle than Lou Ferrigno who outweighed him by 40 pounds onstage that year. Do you see what I'm saying?
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No one has no flaws!!.. being naturally small is a flaw!.. ronnie’s calves are naturally weak so why do we blame him for having naturally weak calves and don’t blame shawn for being naturally small? Bodybuilding is a genetics sports!..
Yes all shawn’s body parts were good but one important point is that non of them was the best!!.. he had great back but dorian’s back was better, he had good average arms not as some one like lee priest, his quads were good but not as good as nasser or cormier, his shoulders were good but not good beside someone like levrone.. etc..
Sheriff you are confusing me please explain
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Shawn is just too small to stand next to Yates.
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Shawn is just too small to stand next to Yates.
Yes 8)
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Sean Rey never won the Olympia because he would not play along. He just couldn't shut the fuk up.
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it was the "Mass monster era". smaller guys had no fucking chance in the line up. I'm glad things are changing this time around
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it was the "Mass monster era". smaller guys had no fucking chance in the line up. I'm glad things are changing this time around
Good old days
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Flaws? height these contests are for the genetic elite he was 5'7" , muscular bulk 205 pounds isn't that spectacular even for someone his height , he had a long torso and short legs , he had high calves , narrow clavicles , no back width
awesome bodybuilder no doubts but don't claim he had no flaws , you can argue all you want if his type of physique should be the ideal in which a Mr Olympia should represent but that's a matter of semantics , Dorian destroyed him utterly as well as everyone else in 1995
totally disagree...shawn was definitely robbed a few times..I attribute it to jealously and people simply not liking the guy......he had a very pleasing physique.....I really believe that people and judges didn't like shawn because he was outspoken and cocky..and they didn't give him the Olympia to keep him in his place....can you imagine his cockiness if he had ACTUALLY WON????
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Size for the sake of size does NOT always equal quality. Every bodybuilder in the last decade feels they need to be between 250-300 pounds at 5'8"-5'10" and we've seen that this does NOT equal quality. Jay GUTLER anyone?
Guys like Labrada, Ray, Benfatto, Zane, Robinson, Wheeler, Coe, Paris, etc, were ALL quality physiques.
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Size for the sake of size does NOT always equal quality. Every bodybuilder in the last decade feels they need to be between 250-300 pounds at 5'8"-5'10" and we've seen that this does NOT equal quality. Jay GUTLER anyone?
Guys like Labrada, Ray, Benfatto, Zane, Robinson, Wheeler, Coe, Paris, etc, were ALL quality physiques.
I agree size is redundant if it's size and nothing else , Dorian has the density , dryness and balance to compliment the size and it is part if the IFBB judging criteria , Dorian had a quality physique even if it wasn't aesthetically please
to argue Shawn's type of physique should embody what the Olympia ideal should be is understandable but to say he beat Dorian is another , according to the IFBB criteria Shawn was never going to be Mr Olympia sans Yates or not
Shawn promised to beat Haney in 91 and he represented what the Olympia title should be blah , blah , blah , same Shawn the sport should conform to him and he shouldn't conform to the sport
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Dorian deserved every olympia he won.
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Size for the sake of size does NOT always equal quality
exactly:
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exactly:
Wow that proves a lot ::) this is what you're offering?
Shawn was never going to me Mr Olympia , he failed during Haney's run , Dorian's run and Ronnies
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look at shawns quads and midsection just owning the keg's, not to mention the twigs on a barrel arms.
thanks for posting that. it verifies that bigger is not always better. quality counts.
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Wow that proves a lot ::) this is what you're offering?
Shawn was never going to me Mr Olympia , he failed during Haney's run , Dorian's run and Ronnies
not the best pic to prove your point ND
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not the best pic to prove your point ND
ND can never prove his point with pics. visuals always work against his bizzaro arguments.. ::)
he says one thing, but onstage reality tells a much different story..as he showed quite nicely
lol what an epic failure
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look at shawns quads and midsection just owning the keg's, not to mention the twigs on a barrel arms.
thanks for posting that. it verifies that bigger is not always better. quality counts.
Typical Hulkster think if he mentions a couple of advantages it wins a whole contest
When ALL of the criteria is considered Dorian is leaving Shawn for DEAD including quality
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not the best pic to prove your point ND
Proves my point exactly , Dorian kills him in muscular bulk , density & dryness and balance , you think because Shawn is flexing his abs and he's more aesthetic he beats him? NOT how it works
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ND can never prove his point with pics. visuals always work against his bizzaro arguments.. ::)
he says one thing, but onstage reality tells a much different story..as he showed quite nicely
lol what an epic failure
the reality Hulkster is Dorian Yates trampled Shawn Ray and that pic is proving exactly why , bigger , harder , drier , better balanced = Yates victory ....Shawn Ray " I got the place I deserved tonight " that is reality and you my stupid little friend are in denial of it
epic fail is saying Shawn beat Dorian in 1994 when REALITY says otherwise and the pics prove my points , you're the complete idiot who see 180 degrees of reality
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Dorian outclassing Ray & Levrone with a much bigger higher quality denser & drier physique which is exactly why he won
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Dorian deserved every olympia he won.
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wow two shots where he's unflexed and two random shots , if that's how contests were judged than maybe he wouldn't have won so dominantly
stop trolling seriously , you have no points to make other than you're a biased troll who hates Dorian because he beat all your ebony heros
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Wow Ronnie's relaxed and unflexed he shouldn't have won ::)
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Ronnie is still disgusting though...
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Wow Ronnie's relaxed and unflexed he shouldn't have won ::)
problem is, when dorian flexes, shawn still owns him in many poses.
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Wow that proves a lot ::) this is what you're offering?
Shawn was never going to me Mr Olympia , he failed during Haney's run , Dorian's run and Ronnies
Shawn was involved when smaller guys where winning the O and he didnt, then it all changed to the huge guys winning hence out of his league once that occurred.
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ronnie's arms in 2003 look to be almost the size of kevin's quads at that point. lol wow.
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problem is, when dorian flexes, shawn still owns him in many poses.
You're posting a picture of Shawn and Dorian in a front latspread from 1995 and you have the audacity to claim Shawn is owning Dorian in one of his best poses and one of Shawns worse , I rest my case you're an idiot .
you sir are of very limited intelligence
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Dorian in a front latspread from 1995 and you have the audacity to claim Shawn is owning Dorian in one of his best poses and one of Shawns worse
yup. dorian's lat spread has thick lats, and smooth low quality everything else. as shawn exploits. dorian's quads are literally pathetic that year. no sweep, no size, no shape no cuts..
bigger is not always better, as people are showing you in this thread.
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Shawn was involved when smaller guys where winning the O and he didnt, then it all changed to the huge guys winning hence out of his league once that occurred.
No he wasn't Shawn tried to take Haney's title and failed , same with Yates & Ronnie , he was never going to win this wasn't 1983 , Shawn turned pro in I believe 1988 the big man already owned the Sandow for 4 years
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LOL ND is melting down and getting owned by everyone yet again
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yup. dorian's lat spread has thick lats, and smooth low quality everything else. as shawn exploits.
bigger is not always better, as people are showing you in this thread.
You're just an idiot plain & simple , I'm sorry but there is no nice way to tell you this LMFAO smooth & low quality , Hulkster you're so far off the mark all one can do is laugh at your lunacy ;D
Dorian was smooth , low quality and Shawn beat him in the front latspread , got it LMMFAO
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No he wasn't Shawn tried to take Haney's title and failed , same with Yates & Ronnie , he was never going to win this wasn't 1983 , Shawn turned pro in I believe 1988 the big man already owned the Sandow for 4 years
You are right ND I'm outted I'll let you and Hulkster fight it out. 8)
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LOL ND is melting down and getting owned by everyone yet again
Yes and Dorian was smooth and low quality and Shawn beats him in the front latspread ! ;D a fanciful place in which your mind resides Hulkster where the impossible somehow because ' reality ' a place where I run from you and Ronnie has more detailed calves than Dorian and Dorian never deserved to win a Olympia and Ronnie dominated by losing LMMFAO where whoever disagrees with reality is right
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You're just an idiot plain & simple , I'm sorry but there is no nice way to tell you this LMFAO smooth & low quality , Hulkster you're so far off the mark all one can do is laugh at your lunacy ;D
Dorian was smooth , low quality and Shawn beat him in the front latspread , got it LMMFAO
You're wrong. Hulkster knows more about those contests and who should have won over the judging panel, the bodybuilding mags, the competitors themselves as well as guys like you and me. And the most amazing thing is, Hulkster knows all this just by looking at a few pics of the contest.
BTW Hulkster, you've made almost 6 posts without posting pics of Ronnie from the 99 Olympia. Everything OK with you?
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You are right ND I'm outted I'll let you and Hulkster fight it out. 8)
There is NO fight Dorian won and Shawn admitted he got the place he deserved now it's Hulkster just trying to get anyone to join in his bashing even if it's right or wrong , he has to try and get me back for the beat down I gave him on the Truce Thread , he's obsessed with me to the point where he chases me around he even has me in his sig saying I ran from him when it's plain as day not true I'm in yet another thread correcting his ass , he lives in a magical place that little Canadian elf ;D
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Elf :D
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You're wrong. Hulkster knows more about those contests and who should have won over the judging panel, the bodybuilding mags, the competitors themselves as well as guys like you and me. And the most amazing thing is, Hulkster knows all this just by looking at a few pics of the contest.
BTW Hulkster, you've made almost 6 posts without posting pics of Ronnie from the 99 Olympia. Everything OK with you?
Succinct ! Hulkster is 99.9% of the time in direct contradiction to ALL of the experts yet he's right lmao sometimes I wonder who is more delusional Hulkster of BigBobs ironically both are from Canada ??? not saying much about our friends up North
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ND fears shawn ray, because dorian was bigger, but not better :P
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Hulkster knows more about those contests and who should have won over the judging panel, the bodybuilding mags, the competitors themselves as well as guys like you and me. And the most amazing thing is, Hulkster knows all this just by looking at a few pics of the contest.
your just as clueless as ND, because you do realize that most of what I say (and prove) is echoed by many in the bb community.
ever notice how everyone says dorians should have lost several of his post tear olympia wins?
yeah, I thought so. :P
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I don't know much about bodybuilding, but I want to play the slobber blues on Ronnie's skin flute
First accurate thing I've ever heard you say
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ND fears shawn ray, because dorian was bigger, but not better :P
Yates destroying Ray there. It's not even close.
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First accurate thing I've ever heard you say
:P
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(http://images.absoluteastronomy.com/images/topicimages/p/pe/pederasty_in_ancient_greece.gif)
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Yates destroying Ray there. It's not even close.
only to the untrained eye...for those in the know, well, lets just say there is a reason why the shadow has such a poor post tear rep as far as physique goes...and shawn is widely believed to have been kept from winning the olympia when he really should have won.
lets not forget the whole reason this thread was started, shall we?
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:P
Meltdown
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(http://cfs4.tistory.com/upload_control/download.blog?fhandle=YmxvZzUzNjY3QGZzNC50aXN0b3J5LmNvbTovYXR0YWNoLzAvMi5qcGc%3D)(http://media-2.web.britannica.com/eb-media/90/87990-004-1492C35A.jpg)
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ND fears shawn ray, because dorian was bigger, but not better :P
Yes you're exactly right which is exactly why Shawn beat Dorian so many times ;)
every shot you posted Dorian is outclassing Shawn
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yeah, cause smooth puffy mass > cut, shapely mass..
::)
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these pics r from 1995, and he should have won then.
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23200&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23204&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=22772&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
95? Surely you jest.
(http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=69359.0;attach=338516;image)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23955&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=4f73b3cc7edc2298b76bd514b8eb2a88)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23979&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=4f73b3cc7edc2298b76bd514b8eb2a88)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24031&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=4f73b3cc7edc2298b76bd514b8eb2a88)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=22772&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=4f73b3cc7edc2298b76bd514b8eb2a88)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=45120&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=4f73b3cc7edc2298b76bd514b8eb2a88)
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sorry, no jest:
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Dorian was smooth , low quality and Shawn beat him in the front latspread ,
LMAO
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sorry, no jest:
We all know you're not kidding it shows how stupid you are , keep proving me right ;)
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dorian was really chubby at the 97 O he looked like a one armed chipmunk :o
where shawn owned him there too 8)
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Succinct ! Hulkster is 99.9% of the time in direct contradiction to ALL of the experts yet he's right lmao sometimes I wonder who is more delusional Hulkster of BigBobs ironically both are from Canada ??? not saying much about our friends up North
Believe me, I'm working on having them deported.
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Dorian deserved every olympia he won.
you're out of your mind
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look at shawns quads and midsection just owning the keg's, not to mention the twigs on a barrel arms.
thanks for posting that. it verifies that bigger is not always better. quality counts.
agreed
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^
smart man
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^
smart man
Dorian kills Ray.
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It's not even comparable.
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Dorian kills Ray.
[/quote]
:o really?! and has the police caught him :-X :-X
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these pics r from 1995, and he should have won then.
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23200&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23204&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=22772&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
Wao You can beat anybody with a built like that.
Hard to believe that Judges thought Yates was better.
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Wao You can beat anybody with a built like that.
Hard to believe that Judges thought Yates was better.
I agree
Wau!
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Wao You can beat anybody with a built like that.
Hard to believe that Judges thought Yates was better.
Ray looks great in some poses and completely disappears in others, bottom line.
Also, standing beside others he often looked like an insignificant gnat. No height, no width.
Never looked anywhere near dry.
And as someone said, he had no standout areas.
Wheeler had more muscle, deeper cuts and definitely more dryness, and even he was not big enough until the late 90s to beat Yates.
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Dorian kills Ray.
most of those shots are from 93.
we are not talking about 93.
94 and onwards was post tear and dorian never looked the same as he did pretear.
thats where shawn overtook him:
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most of those shots are from 93.
we are not talking about 93.
94 and onwards was post tear and dorian never looked the same as he did pretear.
thats where shawn overtook him:
your posting 97' shots of yates and comparing them to 94' shots of ray
hardly fair
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your posting 97' shots of yates and comparing them to 94' shots of ray
hardly fair
I am illustrating the point that post tear yates sucked compared to pretear yates.
oh, and here is a 97 shot, and guess what? shawn owns him! ;)
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your posting 97' shots of yates and comparing them to 94' shots of ray
hardly fair
Hardly fair, ...to Shawn because he still couldn't hang. Good bodybuilder, but too narrow and too small to take it all the way. It's not as though in 1994 Shawn's physique was so different from other years, anyway. He looked very good, but he never changed much year to year. Even when he placed runner up, he still wasn't close to the title.
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Even after 93 Dorian had too much size and was too complete for Ray to have a chance. If anything, 94, was the closest. Ray was awesome, but simply too small to compete with the likes of Dorian, Kevin, Nasser, or Ronnie.
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A lot of people give you shit about being an idiot , I never joined them but with this statement I'm gonna have to agree
1995 Dorian was untouchable to utter anything to the contrary is lunacy
ND: I have a question. There is a quote from you... (I can re-post it if you like). Where you said that you feel that Dorian never should have been an "O" based on his gut alone. It also said that you were a wheeler fan, and would have had him first if it were up to you.
Speak on this!
M
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ND: I have a question. There is a quote from you... (I can re-post it if you like). Where you said that you feel that Dorian never should have been an "O" based on his gut alone. It also said that you were a wheeler fan, and would have had him first if it were up to you.
Speak on this!
M
I never agreed with a Mr Olympia having a gut and I said they should have stopped it with Yates and we wouldn't have had this problem today and I was rooting for Flex to win in 1993 and was dumb founded when he lost I just couldn't comprehend it , and then I learned how contests were judged and then realized just how far Dorian was above everyone in 1993 , Dorian's gut in 1993 wasn't that bad compared to 1997 but I don't think it should be part of the Sandow but it's not up to what I think the Mr Olympia should be obviously , I don't think Ronnie should have won with bitch-tits in 1998 regardless of how great he looked but that's the way it goes.
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I never agreed with a Mr Olympia having a gut and I said they should have stopped it with Yates and we wouldn't have had this problem today and I was rooting for Flex to win in 1993 and was dumb founded when he lost I just couldn't comprehend it , and then I learned how contests were judged and then realized just how far Dorian was above everyone in 1993 , Dorian's gut in 1993 wasn't that bad compared to 1997 but I don't think it should be part of the Sandow but it's not up to what I think the Mr Olympia should be obviously , I don't think Ronnie should have won with bitch-tits in 1998 regardless of how great he looked but that's the way es goes.
Ok...so whats wrong with just saying that the judging is wrong? Even the IFBB has issued several mandates that distended guts would be penalized, (which has yet to really happen). There is nothing wrong with holding out for more asthetic judging....and in the case of this paticular comparision Ray was a far more Asthetic bodybuilder then Yates could ever hope to be. I would have personally had him first in 94, and 96.
M!
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Ok...so whats wrong with just saying that the judging is wrong? Even the IFBB has issued several mandates that distended guts would be penalized, (which has yet to really happen). There is nothing wrong with holding out for more asthetic judging....and in the case of this paticular comparision Ray was a far more Asthetic bodybuilder then Yates could ever hope to be. I would have personally had him first in 94, and 96.
M!
You can argue all you want on what the sport should be but I'm focusing on what the sport is ! it reminds me of this quote from Mike Christian on Yates at the 93 Olympia
Mr Olympia comeptitor Mike Christain
Quote
I think Dorian meet all the IFBB terms. He had mass , he was symmetrical and he had lots of definition. I thought he won. Can he be beaten? That depends on how you look at it. I say yes. But under the IFBB terms of juging -no. Number one is mass, He has that. Number two is symmetry. He is symmetrical Under the IFBB rules , he'll keep winning and winning."
Dorian simply meet the criteria better than anyone else regardless if I think it should be different .
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You can argue all you want on what the sport should be but I'm focusing on what the sport is ! it reminds me of this quote from Mike Christian on Yates at the 93 Olympia
Mr Olympia comeptitor Mike Christain
Quote
I think Dorian meet all the IFBB terms. He had mass , he was symmetrical and he had lots of definition. I thought he won. Can he be beaten? That depends on how you look at it. I say yes. But under the IFBB terms of juging -no. Number one is mass, He has that. Number two is symmetry. He is symmetrical Under the IFBB rules , he'll keep winning and winning."
Dorian simply meet the criteria better than anyone else regardless if I think it should be different .
I understand the argument you are making, but I think it lacks validity, only becuase I really think that this is a matter, of the practical vs. the ideal. Mike Christian is correct in his observation, but not because the judging standards actully held up to the asthetic values that the IFBB puts forth, but rather what actully works in a practical manner. If contests were actully judged according to standard, then Bob Paris, Lee Labrada, Shawn Ray, and, (possibly) Kevin Levrone would all have a Sandow in their possession. The posing round would actully mean something, and so would other factors, (skin tone, presentation, the symmetry round would actully be looking at symmetry, as opposed to just being another muscularity round most of the time, etc).
This may just be a matter of semantics, but I think that the ideal that most getbiggers/bodybuilding fans espouse, is the same as the supposed ideal of the IFBB. To me it isnt unreasonable to call bullshit on the IFBB's lack of upholding their own standards.
M!
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I understand the argument you are making, but I think it lacks validity, only becuase I really think that this is a matter, of the practical vs. the ideal. Mike Christian is correct in his observation, but not because the judging standards actully held up to the asthetic values that the IFBB puts forth, but rather what actully works in a practical manner. If contests were actully judged according to standard, then Bob Paris, Lee Labrada, Shawn Ray, and, (possibly) Kevin Levrone would all have a Sandow in their possession. The posing round would actully mean something, and so would other factors, (skin tone, presentation, the symmetry round would actully be looking at symmetry, as opposed to just being another muscularity round most of the time, etc).
This may just be a matter of semantics, but I think that the ideal that most getbiggers/bodybuilding fans espouse, is the same as the supposed ideal of the IFBB. To me it isnt unreasonable to call bullshit on the IFBB's lack of upholding their own standards.
M!
The thing is ALL rounds are physique rounds , not many people know this. I've always asked this of people ever wonder how Dorian won the symmetry round despite not being the most symmetrical? answer all rounds are physique rounds , meaning ALL of the criteria is assessed at once .
Symmetry is NOT judged as a separate entity unto itself ....muscular bulk , balance development , density & dryness are ALL judge without judging symmetry alone . A very symmetrical guy should NOT win the symmetry round if he's lacking in muscular size and density , same goes with the muscularity round ( that is NOT judged on muscularity alone ) a guy should not win this round he's he's very muscular but lacks in balance & proportion and symmetry , the same holds true for the posing rounds which is exactly why Dorian always won with straight firsts. It's the guy who meets ALL of the criteria the best should be awarded the title
and people have been crying that Paris represented what bodybuilding should be or used to be and Haney shouldn't have been Mr Olympia , replace Paris with Labrada , Ray with Yates , Kevin with Ronnie , so technically the IFBB is adhering to it's own rules it's the physiques who are changing the game .
I would have had no problems with Flex Wheeler beating Dorian in 1993 from a personal preference standpoint but I know according to the criteria Yates was the better man
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Ok...so whats wrong with just saying that the judging is wrong?
nothing.
but
its funny since ND also says that the judges are always 100% correct.. ::)
thats why he shoves scorecards down our throats when the pics and vids tell a far different story than the numbers on the page do... ::)
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He had no flaws?, yeh he was smaller then Yates, but Yates had flaws..
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=24027&g2_serialNumber=3&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
(http://www.muscletime.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=23602&g2_serialNumber=4&g2_GALLERYSID=36c2ecbbeff859e358d44c6b3e274547)
The only thing I think was his delts were not stand-out in an era where delts were becoming increasingly important. Also his back wasn't freaky massive, but still good.
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only to the untrained eye...for those in the know, well, lets just say there is a reason why the shadow has such a poor post tear rep as far as physique goes...and shawn is widely believed to have been kept from winning the olympia when he really should have won.
lets not forget the whole reason this thread was started, shall we?
Ok lets see if you answer this time. How are you an expert? Do you compete? Have EVER competed? Are you a judge? Have you EVER judged? Are you employed as a bodybuilding magazine writer? Are you a Pro Trainer or nutritionist? If you say no to all these (I'm sure you will) then you prove my point that you are nothing but a schmoe with a fantasy of kneeling in front of Big Ron's little Ronnie.
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nothing.
but
its funny since ND also says that the judges are always 100% correct.. ::)
thats why he shoves scorecards down our throats when the pics and vids tell a far different story than the numbers on the page do... ::)
Yeah I never once claimed 2001 was fixed or 2002 , contests are ONLY correct when they fit your biased way of thinking
and stop claiming pics & video agree with your position , you're the idiot who claimed after looking at the pics & video Dorian lost the 1993 Mr Olympia and Ronnie has more detailed calves than Dorian , or Shawn Ray beats Dorian in the front latspread , and Ronnie dominated the 2001 Mr Olympia and Ronnie more even more grainy than Dorian , shut up already you dummy you see what you want and 99% of the time in directly contradicts REALITY
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Ok lets see if you answer this time. How are you an expert? Do you compete? Have EVER competed? Are you a judge? Have you EVER judged? Are you employed as a bodybuilding magazine writer? Are you a Pro Trainer or nutritionist? If you say no to all these (I'm sure you will) then you prove my point that you are nothing but a schmoe with a fantasy of kneeling in front of Big Ron's little Ronnie.
Hahahahahhahahahaha Hulkster just got owned
he has the balls to type a ' trained eye ' ? he claimed Dorian lost the 1993 Mr Olympia to Flex Wheeler , after reviewing all the pics & videos , his ' trained eye ' lead him to the conclusion , Ronnie has more detail in his calves than Dorian did
he never even knew the judging criteria until I posted it and he still doesn't know how to apply it.
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Hahahahahhahahahaha Hulkster just got owned
he has the balls to type a ' trained eye ' ? he claimed Dorian lost the 1993 Mr Olympia to Flex Wheeler , after reviewing all the pics & videos , his ' trained eye ' lead him to the conclusion , Ronnie has more detail in his calves than Dorian did
he never even knew the judging criteria until I posted it and he still doesn't know how to apply it.
Settle down there princess. You both are a couple of weird little schmoes.
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whats wrong with just saying that the judging is wrong?
I understand the argument you are making, but I think it lacks validity
To me it isnt unreasonable to call bullshit on the IFBB's lack of upholding their own standards.
She can't admit politics, both because she's a shill for both the IFBB and ironage and because it completely undermines the fantasy that these are always legit above-board "competitions" that ND somehow understands the judging of more than other mere mortals here. His heroes have "won" these fair and square.. ::)
In a nutshell, ND has expended far too much time defending this crap to back down now-too humiliating. ;D
Hope this helps.
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She can't admit politics, both because she's a shill for both the IFBB and ironage and because it completely undermines the fantasy that these are always legit above-board "competitions" that ND somehow understands the judging of more than other mere mortals here. His heroes have "won" these fair and square..
I thought I had a working knowledge of this sport, but I must be one of the uneducated masses.
Rather than constantly touting the existence of politics, please provide some examples. Show us a competition where one competitor who lost should have clearly won. Then provide proof of the incorrect decision and tell us the gains the "fixers" got from doing so.
I'll give you Arnold's last show, because you can see why that might happen.
Pick an Olympia from Haney on.....
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please provide some examples. Show us a competition where one competitor who lost should have clearly won. Then provide proof of the incorrect decision and tell us the gains the "fixers" got from doing so.
Already provided examples, plenty of anecdotal evidence and some times frames. Learn some history, i read about these debacles at the time as opposed to revisionist history visited here daily. ;D
Also spend some time here.
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=297227.0
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Already provided examples, plenty of anecdotal evidence and some times frames. Learn some history, i read about these debacles at the time as opposed to revisionist history visited here daily. ;D
Also spend some time here.
http://www.getbig.com/boards/index.php?topic=297227.0
That thread has more compelling arguments for contests NOT being fixed.
As stated before, I've followed the "sport" since '85. I asked you for an example from the Haney period on forward, since I haven't read about too many controversial decisions on the major level. I don't need to learn some history.
Also, you haven't given any explanation to your statement why Fox should have beaten Haney in Haney's first Olympia, other than a quote from Sergio. That hardly screams "fix".
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Shawn had the perfect personality for an Olympia winner , smart , articulate , handsome , awesome physique .
There WAS an arrogance about him that did not fit the Olympia criteria. Dorian, Hany and Ronnie had it....Shawn and Flex didn't.
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She can't admit politics, both because she's a shill for both the IFBB and ironage and because it completely undermines the fantasy that these are always legit above-board "competitions" that ND somehow understands the judging of more than other mere mortals here. His heroes have "won" these fair and square.. ::)
In a nutshell, ND has expended far too much time defending this crap to back down now-too humiliating. ;D
Hope this helps.
As usual your posts have no content just personal attacks and cries of racism and politics , you can't and never have defended your ' position ' and are reduced to posting shots of Dorian not even flexed and have the balls to claim he didn't deserve to win :o
you don't know how contests are judged hence you always come to the conclusion they're fixed when you can't even comprehend how they work , it must be the system , speaks volumes on your ignorance .
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Settle down there princess. You both are a couple of weird little schmoes.
And you're the fan-boy following the schmoes around what's that make you? ;)
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And you're the fan-boy following the schmoes around what's that make you? ;)
Actually it's not easy to avoid "ND" with all the blabbering and various thread hijacks lol
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(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2434/3704614002_5b52b1fd90_o.jpg)
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WE WILL AL DIE
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WE WILL AL DIE
yes
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Actually it's not easy to avoid "ND" with all the blabbering and various thread hijacks lol
You can't avoid it because you follow me around to every single thread ironically hi-jacking them with spam pictures and conspiracy theories and cries of politics , whenever anyone presses you on your ridiculous claims you run away only to return when the heat dies down
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GOD CREATED THE UNIVERSE AND IS THE CAUSE OF IT...THE UNIVERSE COULD NOT CREATE ITSELF....GOD COMMUNICATED TO US THROUGH TORAH, THEN BIBLE THEN QURAN TO GUIDE US TO WHAT OUR TRUE PURPOSE OF LIFE IS...tHAT IS TO FORM A RELATIONSHIP WITH HIM BASED ON GOOD DEEDS AND PRAYER...YOU CAN STILL BODYBUILD AS A HOBBY BUT YOUR ULTIMATE PURPOSE OF LIFE IS THE SAME AS THE EVERY OTHER HUMAN....EXISTENCE OF GOD IS THROUGH LOGIC....THE WAY TO OBEY HIM IS THROUGH REVELATION.............. ..............EVERYONE WILL DIE IN THE END SO DONT JUST THINK FOR NOW