Getbig.com: American Bodybuilding, Fitness and Figure
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: Royal Lion on October 03, 2009, 09:50:13 AM
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It seems like every year there are a couple of European Gran Prix shows in which the Mr.O contenders compete. Are there none this year?
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i think there were no shows last year as well.....seem to have been cancelled
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That's too bad....with everyone in shape for the Mr.O, it would be nice to seem them compete a couple more times. >:(
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Last year there was just the Romanian Grand Prix which Dexter won, this year there will be the Sacremento pro i november
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The only men's pro IFBB show remaining this year is in Sacramento, California, November 7
If you want to see pro bodybuilding in Europe you have
UPBF (http://www.upbf-pro.com/) Battle of Giants, Ciampino, Rome, October 18 (http://www.puntofape.com/battle-of-giants-tour-upbf-2009-italia-3142/)
UPBF Battle of Giants, Larvik Norway, October 24 (http://www.diariodeunfisicoculturista.com/2009/08/battle-of-giants-tour-2009-upbf-2009.html)
NABBA Pro Universe, Southport , UK, October 24 (http://www.worldfitnessfederation.de/nabba/frame1/na_int2_6_1.html)
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The only men's pro IFBB show remaining this year is in Sacramento, California, November 7
If you want to see pro bodybuilding in Europe you have
UPBF (http://www.upbf-pro.com/) Battle of Giants, Ciampino, Rome, October 18 (http://www.puntofape.com/battle-of-giants-tour-upbf-2009-italia-3142/)
UPBF Battle of Giants, Larvik Norway, October 24 (http://www.diariodeunfisicoculturista.com/2009/08/battle-of-giants-tour-2009-upbf-2009.html)
NABBA Pro Universe, Southport , UK, October 24 (http://www.worldfitnessfederation.de/nabba/frame1/na_int2_6_1.html)
NAC Mr and Ms Universe, Hamburg, Germany, December 5th, have a new pro division this year :D
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i think there were no shows last year as well.....seem to have been cancelled
Is it the economy? Bah!
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NAC Mr and Ms Universe, Hamburg, Germany, December 5th, have a new pro division this year :D
Forgot about WABBA World's too, November 7, Budapest, Hungary
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Forgot about WABBA World's too, November 7, Budapest, Hungary
who needs the grand prix tours, plenty of good bodybuilding in Europe this winter
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Are any of the top Mr. O contenders competing in Sacramento? It just seems that there should a couple of more shows following the Mr. O (like the Euro Gran Prixs used to be) because everyone is in shape.
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Are any of the top Mr. O contenders competing in Sacramento? It just seems that there should a couple of more shows following the Mr. O (like the Euro Gran Prixs used to be) because everyone is in shape.
there should be but Chick says when you cross the I's and dot the T's the numbers dont add up ::)
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Well that sucks from a fan's perspective -- that is what is lame about this "sport", the top guys only compete once per year.
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Well that sucks from a fan's perspective -- that is what is lame about this "sport", the top guys only compete once per year.
X2
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Is it the economy? Bah!
Rich Gaspari said his company is doing better than ever:
http://videos.bodybuilding.com/watch/28261/2009-olympia-expo-gaspari-nutritions-rich-gaspari-interview
He also sponsors 85 shows every year. If there is an economic incentive [increased exposure, sales] to sponsor or promote shows, the companies will do it. If they aren't doing it, presumably that is because there is no such incentive.
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If they aren't doing it, presumably that is because there is no such incentive.
or maybe there is a dis-incentive, an overpriced sanction fee
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chick says bodybuilding is bigger than ever.
no euro tour = bigger than ever ?
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chick says bodybuilding is bigger than ever.
no euro tour = bigger than ever ?
He is being scrcastic.
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chick says bodybuilding is bigger than ever.
no euro tour = bigger than ever ?
Here is a hint for you....The state of pro BB has never rested on whether or not there was a Euro-tour.
They come and go as promoters do...if the economy dictated it (or the fan base/ response/ vendors, etc)...then there would certainly be more shows in Europe...
That said, there are new shows slated for 2010, like the Arizona Pro, 2 more Europa Pro's, Sac pro, and others...
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Here is a hint for you....The state of pro BB has never rested on whether or not there was a Euro-tour.
They come and go as promoters do...if the economy dictated it (or the fan base/ response/ vendors, etc)...then there would certainly be more shows in Europe...
That said, there are new shows slated for 2010, like the Arizona Pro, 2 more Europa Pro's, Sac pro, and others...
Is Joe Weider's Pro World cup expect to happen in 2010? That has been shelved twice now, hence i don't think anyone will believe it until they see it .
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who's doing the sacramento pro show?
is there a competitor list yet?
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Zona Pro - hope there is fig and bikini cause it will be all bottom feeders as far as pros.
as far as gasp with 85 shows...what is that in $s and cents? 100-150k write off?
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Is Joe Weider's Pro World cup expect to happen in 2010? That has been shelved twice now, hence i don't think anyone will believe it until they see it .
Twice? Not to my knowledge...
It's tougher than you think to stage a show overseas...venue location, pricing, sponsor considerations, etc...when you're not actually THERE, it makes it much more challenging.
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Twice? Not to my knowledge...
It's tougher than you think to stage a show overseas...venue location, pricing, sponsor considerations, etc...when you're not actually THERE, it makes it much more challenging.
It has been shelved after the 08 and 09 Olympias.
It is 'supposed' to be on for next year (well, it was advertised as such). Do you know if it is still going ahead?
You must also admit, the webcasts have taken a big elbow too, with comparison to the 07 season (say)?
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Twice? Not to my knowledge...
It's tougher than you think to stage a show overseas...venue location, pricing, sponsor considerations, etc...when you're not actually THERE, it makes it much more challenging.
The IFBB doesn't cancel shows, only the incompetent promoters do..........
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It has been shelved after the 08 and 09 Olympias.
It is 'supposed' to be on for next year (well, it was advertised as such). Do you know if it is still going ahead?
You must also admit, the webcasts have taken a big elbow too, with comparison to the 07 season (say)?
It wasnt even a consideration in 08, I would know, as I work with Roin Chang...
The webcasts have nothing to do with the IFBB, it's BB.coms decision to webcast or not based on budget, etc....they elected to webcast less shows this year....not my personal choice, but I am only one voice among many at the front office
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It's tougher than you think to stage a show overseas...venue location, pricing, sponsor considerations, etc...when you're not actually THERE, it makes it much more challenging.
what does that mean? IFBB pro shows, whether in the US or not, are always put on by local promoters. The IFBB only 'sanctions' them.
The Battle of Giants guys seem to be doing quite well in Europe, having had successful shows in Norway, France, UK, and now this year Rome too. I believe these are stand-alone shows, not part of any big expo. That means they're able to put on a show based solely on the ticket gate. IFBB shows use to be that way too. They need to figure out how to do that again.
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what does that mean? IFBB pro shows, whether in the US or not, are always put on by local promoters. The IFBB only 'sanctions' them.
The Battle of Giants guys seem to be doing quite well in Europe, having had successful shows in Norway, France, UK, and now this year Rome too. I believe these are stand-alone shows, not part of any big expo. That means they're able to put on a show based solely on the ticket gate. IFBB shows use to be that way too. They need to figure out how to do that again.
get Wayne Demilia back
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Chick, is there really no potential for profit in Gran Prix shows? From an outsiders perspective it seems like there is plenty of interest overseas for post-Olympia shows. Perhaps there aren't enough promoters willing to take the risk?
It's just a shame that Jay, Dex, Ruhl, Branch, Phil, Kai & Co. get into such great shape and yet won't compete again for many months or even a year.
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what does that mean? IFBB pro shows, whether in the US or not, are always put on by local promoters. The IFBB only 'sanctions' them.
The Battle of Giants guys seem to be doing quite well in Europe, having had successful shows in Norway, France, UK, and now this year Rome too. I believe these are stand-alone shows, not part of any big expo. That means they're able to put on a show based solely on the ticket gate. IFBB shows use to be that way too. They need to figure out how to do that again.
Define "successful"...what were their profit/ loss ratio? how many paying fans did they have? What % of money was taken in from sponsors? What were the costs (i.e.- Venue/ hotel/ purse/ etc)
I'm sure you have this info, as you are quick to point out how they seem to be successful...
So lets hear it
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Define "successful"...what were their profit/ loss ratio? how many paying fans did they have? What % of money was taken in from sponsors? What were the costs (i.e.- Venue/ hotel/ purse/ etc)
well, I can answer some of those questions.
The Battle of Giants Norway is so successful that they're having a second one this year. Not sure how I'll record that at musclememory yet. When Sami won the first one in 2007, the prize money was
1. US $12000
2. 7000
3. 5000
4. 3000
5. 2000
6. 1000
What difference does it make what percentage came from sponsors? Or the cost of the hotel?
My contention all along has been that it should be possible to put on an event and not lose money based solely on the ticket gate. The IFBB promoters try to make things into to big of a weekend. Rent a theater and the crew to run it. Rent hotel rooms for the athletes and judges. Advertise, especially locally. Rent out a banner or two. Forget about everything else.
getbig's ibfasport should be able to tell us more about the logistics of the Rome show, as he's involved with the event.
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here is a hint for you
canceled shows (tokyo, dubai, joes cup, euro tour) does not equal
the "bodybuilding is bigger than ever" line of BS that you puppets like to repeat over and over.
If it was "bigger than ever" then there would be enough of a fan base, as their used to be.
Here is a hint for you....The state of pro BB has never rested on whether or not there was a Euro-tour.
They come and go as promoters do...if the economy dictated it (or the fan base/ response/ vendors, etc)...then there would certainly be more shows in Europe...
That said, there are new shows slated for 2010, like the Arizona Pro, 2 more Europa Pro's, Sac pro, and others...
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forget Tim,
Bobby is interested only in saving face for the IFBB/AMI, he can't respond intelligently to your ideas.
well, I can answer some of those questions.
The Battle of Giants Norway is so successful that they're having a second one this year. Not sure how I'll record that at musclememory yet. When Sami one the first one in 2007, the prize money was
1. US $12000
2. 7000
3. 5000
4. 3000
5. 2000
6. 1000
What difference does it make what percentage came from sponsors? Or the cost of the hotel?
My contention all along has been that it should be possible to put on an event and not lose money based solely on the ticket gate. The IFBB promoters try to make things into to big of a weekend. Rent a theater and the crew to run it. Rent hotel rooms for the athletes and judges. Advertise, especially locally. Rent out a banner or two. Forget about everything else.
getbig's ibfasport should be able to tell us more about the logistics of the Rome show, as he's involved with the event.
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well, I can answer some of those questions.
The Battle of Giants Norway is so successful that they're having a second one this year. Not sure how I'll record that at musclememory yet. When Sami won the first one in 2007, the prize money was
1. US $12000
2. 7000
3. 5000
4. 3000
5. 2000
6. 1000
What difference does it make what percentage came from sponsors? Or the cost of the hotel?
My contention all along has been that it should be possible to put on an event and not lose money based solely on the ticket gate. The IFBB promoters try to make things into to big of a weekend. Rent a theater and the crew to run it. Rent hotel rooms for the athletes and judges. Advertise, especially locally. Rent out a banner or two. Forget about everything else.
getbig's ibfasport should be able to tell us more about the logistics of the Rome show, as he's involved with the event.
The fact that it's being put on for second year dont mean squat....the PDI had a second year as well.
What difference does it make? ALL. If the money being put out is from someones pocket, then taking a substancial loss for a year or two will take its toll, and the very reason you dont see shows for a 3rd or 4th time...if the money is sponsor driven, then its certainly more likely that a show can be around for a while while it gains momentum...this of course, is subject to the turnout/ gate...as sponsors also need to see a return for their dollar. A sparcly attended event will shy companies from coming back, as there is no ROI.
This answers your next comment as to if contests are based "soley" on the gate...they're not..IF there are enough sponsors to cover the up front costs.
I like how you so candidly explain it out...rent out a hall, pay for the rooms...etc, etc...sure, and pay the sanction fee and put up the prize moey, and pay for the awards, and pay the help, and pay the union fees, etc.
If it were that easy, or that profitable....there would be a lot more shows/ promoters.
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The fact that it's being put on for second year dont mean squat....the PDI had a second year as well.
the second time in the same year, two shows in Norway this year
this is the same group in europe that did the PDI shows
I like how you so candidly explain it out...rent out a hall, pay for the rooms...etc, etc...sure, and pay the sanction fee and put up the prize moey, and pay for the awards, and pay the help, and pay the union fees, etc.
maybe that's why these Battle of Giant shows are doing well, no over priced sanction fees
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bodybuilding is a niche in north america, its an even smaller niche in europe...
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as usual Chick chimes in with lame old excuse " the numbers dont add up" yet bodybuilding is as big as ever ::)
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what happened to "bodybuilding is bigger than ever" ??
I guess in your world, that mantra doesn't apply to canceled shows
The fact that it's being put on for second year dont mean squat....the PDI had a second year as well.
What difference does it make? ALL. If the money being put out is from someones pocket, then taking a substancial loss for a year or two will take its toll, and the very reason you dont see shows for a 3rd or 4th time...if the money is sponsor driven, then its certainly more likely that a show can be around for a while while it gains momentum...this of course, is subject to the turnout/ gate...as sponsors also need to see a return for their dollar. A sparcly attended event will shy companies from coming back, as there is no ROI.
This answers your next comment as to if contests are based "soley" on the gate...they're not..IF there are enough sponsors to cover the up front costs.
I like how you so candidly explain it out...rent out a hall, pay for the rooms...etc, etc...sure, and pay the sanction fee and put up the prize moey, and pay for the awards, and pay the help, and pay the union fees, etc.
If it were that easy, or that profitable....there would be a lot more shows/ promoters.
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If it costs so much more to run a IFBB Pro show OS why don't the IFBB drop the Huge Sanction fees???????
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as usual Chick chimes in with lame old excuse " the numbers dont add up" yet bodybuilding is as big as ever ::)
Yeah...what a lame excuse.
The numbers not adding up should be of no consequence...
As for BB being as big as ever, the last two years has seen an increase of numbers of both competing athletes and attendance, shows have been dropped and shows have been added...as they have throughout the years, just business.
Obviously, the concept of Business 101 has you stumped...I suggest you stick with something you pride yourself on...talking nonsense.
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It wasnt even a consideration in 08, I would know, as I work with Roin Chang...
The webcasts have nothing to do with the IFBB, it's BB.coms decision to webcast or not based on budget, etc....they elected to webcast less shows this year....not my personal choice, but I am only one voice among many at the front office
Chick the IFBB should be doing the fucking webcasts it's their show.
::)
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Chick the IFBB should be doing the fucking webcasts it's their show.
::)
1. They are not cheap
2. I agree, if the IFBB put on their own shows
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It's certainly a shame we can't see these guys in a few more shows while they're in shape, including the one here in England.
Tim Fogarty, as an impartial observer you seem quite uninterested in actual facts to do with the profit of certain shows, surely the defining factor of whether they can carry on or not?
Method101, you are famously incredibly stupid.
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Yeah...what a lame excuse.
The numbers not adding up should be of no consequence...
As for BB being as big as ever, the last two years has seen an increase of numbers of both competing athletes and attendance, shows have been dropped and shows have been added...as they have throughout the years, just business.
Obviously, the concept of Business 101 has you stumped...I suggest you stick with something you pride yourself on...talking nonsense.
The one who talks nonsense is you, you are just full of excuses and one line crap, when people disagree or have a different opinion you just resort to the same lame insults, you are beyond insecure, how many times have you used the line "the numbers dont add up" when someone asks about more shows,masters olympia,grand prix's etc, but yet you use the contradictory line "bodybuilding is bigger than ever", the only thing bigger than ever is your insecurities and need to insult people to make yourself feel special ::)
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The one who talks nonsense is you, you are just full of excuses and one line crap, when people disagree or have a different opinion you just resort to the same lame insults, you are beyond insecure, how many times have you used the line "the numbers dont add up" when someone asks about more shows,masters olympia,grand prix's etc, but yet you use the contradictory line "bodybuilding is bigger than ever", the only thing bigger than ever is your insecurities and need to insult people to make yourself feel special ::)
The only thing bigger than ever is Joe Weider's wallet.
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The one who talks nonsense is you, you are just full of excuses and one line crap, when people disagree or have a different opinion you just resort to the same lame insults, you are beyond insecure, how many times have you used the line "the numbers dont add up" when someone asks about more shows,masters olympia,grand prix's etc, but yet you use the contradictory line "bodybuilding is bigger than ever", the only thing bigger than ever is your insecurities and need to insult people to make yourself feel special ::)
You're too stupid to even understand the most basic of business...just because BB is "bigger than ever" doesnt mean demographically, that certain areas are suddenly a cash cow...
There are plenty of places here in the states that the numbers dont add up either...thats why some places work better than others.
If the Masters Olympia was profitable, we would still have it. GP shows come and go as promoters do...if they were making money hand over fist, then they too would still be viable.
The Olympia and Arnold had record numbers this year, as did the USA / NA and soon to be Nationals...I've personally hosted many shows that were sold out or near capacity and the NPC has the most competitors ever...the major supp companies have all reported business up approx 20-25% despite the economy.
I dont need to insult you, your posts speak for themselves
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You're too stupid to even understand the most basic of business...just because BB is "bigger than ever" doesnt mean demographically, that certain areas are suddenly a cash cow...
There are plenty of places here in the states that the numbers dont add up either...thats why some places work better than others.
If the Masters Olympia was profitable, we would still have it. GP shows come and go as promoters do...if they were making money hand over fist, then they too would still be viable.
The Olympia and Arnold had record numbers this year, as did the USA / NA and soon to be Nationals...I've personally hosted many shows that were sold out or near capacity and the NPC has the most competitors ever...the major supp companies have all reported business up approx 20-25% despite the economy.
I dont need to insult you, your posts speak for themselves
again Chick the meathead with insults, always calling people,gay,stupid etc ::)
so the 202 showdown is more profitable than a masters showdown? if you are going to let the midgets have a division why not the masters? this is a legit question so i would hope for a real answer not an insult,a question, or a skirting of the issue please!
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so the 202 showdown is more profitable than a masters showdown? if you are going to let the midgets have a division why not the masters?
its not like you could buy tickets for specific events, like only the women's fitness finals. You could buy a ticket to the Friday night event: Fitness Olympia Finals, Ms. Olympia Finals and Mr. Olympia Judging. And you could buy a ticket to the Saturday night event: Figure Olympia Finals, 202 Showdown and Mr. Olympia Finals. So how do you determine that a Masters Olympia is not profitable?
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Twice? Not to my knowledge...
It's tougher than you think to stage a show overseas...venue location, pricing, sponsor considerations, etc...when you're not actually THERE, it makes it much more challenging.
Yea.. twice. The first year when the bailed on it but at the same time it was announced that it was going to be on the next year instead (2009). So that makes it shelved twice.
What happened?
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its not like you could buy tickets for specific events, like only the women's fitness finals. You could buy a ticket to the Friday night event: Fitness Olympia Finals, Ms. Olympia Finals and Mr. Olympia Judging. And you could buy a ticket to the Saturday night event: Figure Olympia Finals, 202 Showdown and Mr. Olympia Finals. So how do you determine that a Masters Olympia is not profitable?
Real simple...the Maters O was held seperately for many years and even combined with Jan Tana's shows...it never lived up to the expectations or brought in any additional fan base...thats why it was scrapped to begin with. When they tried to revive it in 06 with the MWC...it didnt generate any additional attendance either, certainly not enough to justify purse and sanction fee....so it was scrapped again.
The 202 has proven itself and makes much more sense as 3/4 of the class winners at the amateur level are eligable for it
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again Chick the meathead with insults, always calling people,gay,stupid etc ::)
so the 202 showdown is more profitable than a masters showdown? if you are going to let the midgets have a division why not the masters? this is a legit question so i would hope for a real answer not an insult,a question, or a skirting of the issue please!
Your answer is posted above...
you're still an idiot
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Chick--serious question---do you know whats happening on the timeout board regarding you and your wife? Elite Lifter wanted me to post this message,...I want no part of this trouble, I am merely the messenger
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I have no idea what you're talking about
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What is a Timeout board??
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it didnt generate any additional attendance either, certainly not enough to justify purse and sanction fee....
what is it with these sanction fees? Chang pays a sanction fee to Manion to hold the Olympia. then he has to pay another to hold the women's physique Olympia, another for the women's figure, another for the women's fitness, another for the women's bikini, and another for the men's under 202? if he decided that there wasn't enough money in women's physique to pay the sanction fee, then would Manion just allow there not to be a women's physique Olympia that year? If no, the contract requires the promoter to hold both men and women's bodybuilding, then they could do the same with the masters. It's Manion who's decided not to have a Men's Masters Olympia.
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It's not like the sanction fees are much :-\
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what is it with these sanction fees? Chang pays a sanction fee to Manion to hold the Olympia. then he has to pay another to hold the women's physique Olympia, another for the women's figure, another for the women's fitness, another for the women's bikini, and another for the men's under 202? if he decided that there wasn't enough money in women's physique to pay the sanction fee, then would Manion just allow there not to be a women's physique Olympia that year? If no, the contract requires the promoter to hold both men and women's bodybuilding, then they could do the same with the masters. It's Manion who's decided not to have a Men's Masters Olympia.
No...it's the FANS that have decided not to support a Masters O
As for the FBB, it has operated at a huge loss for years, and they have kept it in, and there are no sanction fee's for FBB...it's a freebee for any promoter that wants to pony up the prize money
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So if I put up 10k I can run a FFB show with full IFBB support without any sanction fees???
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No...it's the FANS that have decided not to support a Masters O
kind of like with Men's bodybuilding in Colorado and Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. Fans didn't support those but that doesn't mean you give up on all men's pro bodybuilding.
As for the FBB, it has operated at a huge loss for years, and they have kept it in, and there are no sanction fee's for FBB...it's a freebee for any promoter that wants to pony up the prize money
so do the same for Masters. give it a chance to develop a fan base.
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Wouldn't Chick win the Masters Olympia???
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kind of like with Men's bodybuilding in Colorado and Bethlehem, Pennsylvania. Fans didn't support those but that doesn't mean you give up on all men's pro bodybuilding.
so do the same for Masters. give it a chance to develop a fan base.
Give it a chance??
They did...9 years. Plus the MWC in 06 and the AC pro recently...
We havent given up on all mens BB, it's called learning from your mistakes and realizing that there are areas that are more/ less condusive for support....
colorado tanked, Europa Orlando was created.
PA tanked, Arizona Pro was added this year.
etc
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Seems like everyone should be Promoting IFBB Womens Pro shows esp without having any IFBB Sanction Fees.What it's not like 10k is much for prize money to find.
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10K plus all the other expenses with a net return of 0, not exactly rocket science...
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bob, I realize that logic is not your forte,
but how does
"bodybuilding is bigger than ever" = no gran prix + canceled weider pro cup ??
10K plus all the other expenses with a net return of 0, not exactly rocket science...
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bob, I realize that logic is not your forte,
but how does
"bodybuilding is bigger than ever" = no gran prix + canceled weider pro cup ??
If you want to debate logic...how does a show that has yet to be put on, and a GP which has ebbed and flowed for years, dictate the state of BB?
Not too bright, are you?
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Hey Chick how many people go to see a womens BB show??
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few
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Give it a chance?? They did...9 years. Plus the MWC in 06 and the AC pro recently...
yet the Masters Nationals gives out 4 pro cards, including one to the overall 40+, one to the runner up, one to the overall winner of the 50+ and one to the winner of the 60+. why bother if you're not going to have masters pro contests?
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yes the Masters Nationals gives out 4 pro cards, including one to the overall 40+, one to the runner up, one to the overall winner of the 50+ and one to the winner of the 60+. why bother if you're not going to have masters pro contests?
Agreed. Not my call...I personally wouldnt give out pro cards to Masters
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Euro gran prix shows "ebbed and flowed" ??
maybe being the uncultured person that you are, who a hasn't left the US shores, explains your lack of knowledge.
The euro tour as promoted by Wayne was well attended by fans and pros alike back in its heydey.
But you wound't know anything about that, despite being an INTERNATIONAL fedration rep.
btw -the I in IFBB stands for International.
Also, your AMI buddies joe weiders world cup was canceled because
bodybuilding isn't bigger than ever.
hate to burst your bubble. but it must be quite embarrassing to contradict yourself all the time.
you never did answer the question. Maybe its because the answer is you lied?
If you want to debate logic...how does a show that has yet to be put on, and a GP which has ebbed and flowed for years, dictate the state of BB?
Not too bright, are you?
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the MAsters world cup 2006 was poorly received because the outcome was predetermined.
the IFBB rep got the win.
what a surprise.
Give it a chance??
They did...9 years. Plus the MWC in 06 and the AC pro recently...
We havent given up on all mens BB, it's called learning from your mistakes and realizing that there are areas that are more/ less condusive for support....
colorado tanked, Europa Orlando was created.
PA tanked, Arizona Pro was added this year.
etc
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The euro tour as promoted by Wayne was well attended by fans and pros alike back in its heydey.
Euro grand prix shows
1987 - three
1988 - seven
1989 - eight
1990 - six
1991 - six
1992 - four
1993 - eight
1994 - seven
1995 - six
1996 - six
1997 - seven
1998 - two
1999 - one
2000 - two
2001 - two
2002 - three
2003 - four
2004 - three
2005 - zero
2006 - three
2007 - zero
2008 - one
2009 - zero
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Euro gran prix shows "ebbed and flowed" ??
Yeah...ebb and flow...look it up, or look at Tim Fogertys list above. Even in Waynes era, there were as many as 7 and as little as 1.
maybe being the uncultured person that you are, who a hasn't left the US shores, explains your lack of knowledge.
The euro tour as promoted by Wayne was well attended by fans and pros alike back in its heydey.
Attended...yes. And some attended poorly, which is why they arent around today
But you wound't know anything about that, despite being an INTERNATIONAL fedration rep.
btw -the I in IFBB stands for International.
Also, your AMI buddies joe weiders world cup was canceled because
bodybuilding isn't bigger than ever.
It was canceled because the numbers werent adding up, plain and simple...the Arnold and Olympia had record numbers
hate to burst your bubble. but it must be quite embarrassing to contradict yourself all the time.
you never did answer the question. Maybe its because the answer is you lied?
Nothing to lie about...you're just ignorant
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Yeah...ebb and flow...look it up, or look at Tim Fogertys list above. Even in Waynes era, there were as many as 7 and as little as 1.
I wouldn't call it ebb and flow, which would mean many shows then a few, then many again. There were lots of euro shows between 1988 and 1997, and then very few since. When was Wayne kicked out of the IFBB?
and can't you spell my name right?
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I wouldn't call it ebb and flow, which would mean many shows then a few, then many again. There were lots of euro shows between 1988 and 1997, and then very few since. When was Wayne kicked out of the IFBB?
and can't you spell my name right?
Cant remember when Wayne was ousted...Maybe 03?
BB was also at it's height betwen 88-97, and im sure it seemed like a great idea to put on a pro show...but it doesnt mean many of them were profitable, and every indication has been that they werent...
New areas get a show...expects a first year loss, tries to break even a second year, assuming they are still game for the profitable 3rd year...you can see where a show can be around for 3-4 years.
Point is, given the economic landscape of the 2000's, the decreased travel abroad, ability to find good promoters in Europe, etc...cant say I'm surprised at th decline of the shows there.
We also see baseball and football teams pack up and move onto a new town more economically viable...doesnt mean the MLB/NFL isnt doing well
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The only thing ebbing and flowing are the number of shows that actually come to fruition.
What happened to the dubai, japan , germany shows???
Are those considered "ebbs" ?
Again, I'll pose some complicated logic for you
Numbers weren't adding up for a nmultiple shows (cancelled) = bodybuilding bigger than ever
If you are ignorant, then you will find the above statement to be true.
Being an AMI lackey it is no surprise that you are quick to discount/lie about the success of Demillia's shows.
It was canceled because the numbers werent adding up, plain and simple...
Nothing to lie about...you're just ignorant
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Point is, given the economic landscape of the 2000's, the decreased travel abroad, ability to find good promoters in Europe, etc...cant say I'm surprised at th decline of the shows there.
Pro Battle of Giants people are doing well. 3 shows in Europe this year, 3rd year in a row for the one in Norway. Maybe those IFBB sanction fees are the tipping point.
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Pro Battle of Giants people are doing well. 3 shows in Europe this year, 3rd year in a row for the one in Norway. Maybe those IFBB sanction fees are the tipping point.
We've been down this road beforeTim...and you had nothing to show as proof that they are doing well, other than they exist...could be losing a ton
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We've been down this road beforeTim...and you had nothing to show as proof that they are doing well, other than they exist...could be losing a ton
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whats up, stalker?
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whats up, stalker?
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We have no proof that Wayne's Euro gran prix did so poorly, as you claim.
hell you weren't even there, let alone left the USA at all.
pathetic.
but remember, bodybuilding is bigger than ever
We've been down this road beforeTim...and you had nothing to show as proof that they are doing well, other than they exist...could be losing a ton
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We have no proof that Wayne's Euro gran prix did so poorly, as you claim.
hell you weren't even there, let alone left the USA at all.
pathetic.
but remember, bodybuilding is bigger than ever
It wasnt Waynes anything..it was individual promoters, and if they were making money, they would still be around
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I guess "bodybuilding isn't bigger than ever" as you claimed, otherwise they would still be around.
It wasnt Waynes anything..it was individual promoters, and if they were making money, they would still be around
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Bobs full of shit, its almost like a bot creates his posts.