Getbig Bodybuilding, Figure and Fitness Forums
Getbig Main Boards => Gossip & Opinions => Topic started by: hipolito mejia on June 17, 2011, 12:02:11 PM
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Was watching a dvd seminar of Mike Mentzer back in 1998 in Canada ...
While talking about his HIT, he would criticize the Weider principles and make fun of it, he would say things like "According to Weider more is better" cause Joe only wanted to make money and "100 dollars are better than one". lol
(http://www.mikementzer.com/images/semin_s.jpg)
He was the only pro, who would go on seminars bashing Arnold too, "Arnold likes to say If you train hard you eventually will get there" you know how many people has failed following Arnolds bodybuilding advices? every Failure! ".
Well, last week was the 10th anniversary of his passing ...
(http://www.drdarden.com/img/photos/dardensBookBullets/image008.jpg)
was he alone on his quest to proof that Both Arnold and Joe were selling "dreams" and nothing more?.
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???
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Yes he was..........built his main bulk on high volume for decades, and lots of gear.
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Yes he was..........built his main bulk on high volume for decades, and lots of gear.
THIS !
Took the words right out of my mouth, Wes. :)
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Yes he was..........built his main bulk on high volume for decades, and lots of gear.
He called his volume "warm up sets"...those didn't count.
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Here's some of it, Fast forward to 1:12
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He called his volume "warm up sets"...those didn't count.
I mean since he was a kid and long before he met Arthur Jones......he was very big from training the traditional high volume way.
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He was truthful about some things, but for some reason bitter towards Arnold & Weider apparently.
And yes his training advices when he retired were crazy.
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He was truthful about some things, but for some reason bitter towards Arnold & Weider apparently.
And yes his training advices when he retired were crazy.
Most people that used his training method just got injured. ;)
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was he alone on his quest to proof that Both Arnold and Joe were selling "dreams" and nothing more?.
No, Mike Mentzer was not alone. There were also Arthur Jones, Casey Viator, Sergio Oliva and Dorian Yates.
(http://slowburnfitness.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/arthur_jones-muscle.jpg)
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/viator.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/Oliva14.jpg)
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/yates/dy186.jpg)
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He was truthful about some things, but for some reason bitter towards Arnold & Weider apparently.
And yes his training advices when he retired were crazy.
Exactly,and everyone who went against his dogma was wrong no matter how great they looked.
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was he alone on his quest to proof that Both Arnold and Joe were selling "dreams" and nothing more?.
what makes you think he wasnt doing the same?
"have your best body evr by working out 20 minutes a week, eat -whatever- because calories are calories and protein is overrated!"
weiders had the lockdown on volume training...in order to break into BB money they needed something different to get attention.
and dorian worked out 4 times a week, something mentzer was against, at least in his crazed later years. dorian also did a body part split, not the fullbody workouts jones advocated.
funny how any mention of HIT failures is never because it sucks, its because the trainee wasnt 'tough enough' or some such nonsense.
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The guy on Mentzer's HIT workout movie is still struggling to deadlift 405. ;D
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Most people that used his training method just got injured. ;)
I always hear this but it is just patently wrong. Although I've injured virtually every part of my body beginning from my big toe, ankle, calf, knee... all the way to my skull I have never ever injure myself training with weights and I've been using and following the general principles of Jones and Mentzer for 30 years.
Explosive movements and sloppy form will injure you no matter what training protocol you follow. In fact, provided you don't compromise form, you are less likely to injure yourself as the set progresses and gets more difficult. Though intensity increases with each succeeding rep force output is reduced. You get weaker with each rep until you can no longer complete another one.
With explosive movements: Take your fist and press it against a brick wall as hard as you can.
No matter how hard you press you won't injure yourself. Now give that brick wall a good punch.
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ya but explosive is fine so long as its controlled with good form.
in fact explosive is the way every positive contraction should be executed, with every negative being slow. but this is common knowledge i thought?
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ya but explosive is fine so long as its controlled with good form.
in fact explosive is the way every positive contraction should be executed, with every negative being slow. but this is common knowledge i thought?
We actually are in agreement dude!!
Totally fucking shocking!!
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We actually are in agreement dude!!
Totally fucking shocking!!
;D
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mentzer at 19 long before he bucked the system to make more bucks. coe said mentzer made over a million dollars the year that he died.contoversy creates cash.
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Thank you for clarifying my point funk 51.
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Reminder, what's HIT?
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Reminder, what's HIT?
Not sure if serious?
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Yes,
Arnold was/is probably prime example of kind of person that you can buy by promising him enough in return (money, power etc.)
He is a kind of person that ignores his own principles if someone give him benefits for talking the other way.
Your typical nothingness-politician; preaching the words of the one who pays the bills :-\
And yep, it worked for him. It made him rich compared to average people.
But in the end, one Russian is cruising the seas of the world in a private boat more expensive than Arnold has ever made in his lifetime...
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It is true Mentzer was addicted to heroin or something?
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Mike was addicted to coke zero. THe aspartame fucked his head up somethign wicked.
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It is true Mentzer was addicted to heroin or something?
Meth
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mentzer at 19 long before he bucked the system to make more bucks. coe said mentzer made over a million dollars the year that he died.contoversy creates cash.
I find that hard to believe. I lived near Mentzer at the time of his death and he lived in a fairly modest two bedroom apartment in Redondo Beach. I don't remember the make and model of his car but I can assure you it was not a luxury model nor was it very new.
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I find that hard to believe. I lived near Mentzer at the time of his death and he lived in a fairly modest two bedroom apartment in Redondo Beach. I don't remember the make and model of his car but I can assure you it was not a luxury model nor was it very new.
i'm just going by an interview with boyer coe where he is asked about mike mentzers last days.
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I find that hard to believe. I lived near Mentzer at the time of his death and he lived in a fairly modest two bedroom apartment in Redondo Beach. I don't remember the make and model of his car but I can assure you it was not a luxury model nor was it very new.
LOL
Not everybody want to show off if they have money.
Look at Warren Buffett. Would you believe that dude is in top 3 of world's richest people? And was actually the world's richest man at one year.
Pretty average and old house. Always had used (not luxury) cars.
Would you think this is a house of world's richest man?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6mJugzVlsTk/TK9TxqpZBNI/AAAAAAAAAHs/IFaDqrUVFjc/s1600/buffett.jpg)
He bought it back in 1956 for 31 500 dollars if I remember correct. Still lives in it.
Newsflash: Not everyone tries to mimic the lifestyle shown in rap videos on MTV (which are not real life BTW) :o :o
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HIT influenced the way nearly everyone trains now. Most people train each bodypart once per week, which really began with Dorian. Of course, Dorian was influenced by Arthur and Mike. Not many use HIT intensity or volume, but HIT frequency is commonplace.
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LOL at Mentzer making a million dollars the year he died. Complete horseshit.
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HIT influenced the way nearly everyone trains now. Most people train each bodypart once per week, which really began with Dorian. Of course, Dorian was influenced by Arthur and Mike. Not many use HIT intensity or volume, but HIT frequency is commonplace.
HIT has its place...no doubt.. the recovery aspect of BBung is pretty much HIT inspired....which is great if you are a Natty trainer.....on Gear you can work out every day for two hours and still grow....So its pretty much useless for a pro. Dorian didn't even use a real HIT program. It was conventional training with less sets but heavier weights. And I love the way a "warmup set" with 315 isn't considered a "set".....puh-leeze ::)
I notice hit is employed by guys who think they "know better"....to this day Dorian thinks "his workout" is mythical ...
On the other end of the spectrum......dj181 is a HIT er.....nuff said :D
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LOL
Not everybody want to show off if they have money.
Look at Warren Buffett. Would you believe that dude is in top 3 of world's richest people? And was actually the world's richest man at one year.
Pretty average and old house. Always had used (not luxury) cars.
Would you think this is a house of world's richest man?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6mJugzVlsTk/TK9TxqpZBNI/AAAAAAAAAHs/IFaDqrUVFjc/s1600/buffett.jpg)
He bought it back in 1956 for 31 500 dollars if I remember correct. Still lives in it.
Newsflash: Not everyone tries to mimic the lifestyle shown in rap videos on MTV (which are not real life BTW) :o :o
Understood, but by the implication in the post I was responding to Mentzer sold out for money. He "bucked the system to make more bucks." If he was all about money then it's not a stretch to imagine he'd want to show he was so successful.
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HIT influenced the way nearly everyone trains now. Most people train each bodypart once per week, which really began with Dorian. Of course, Dorian was influenced by Arthur and Mike. Not many use HIT intensity or volume, but HIT frequency is commonplace.
I think Mentzer/Jones principles are used widely but just not given credit. The frequency in training has dropped considerable since Arnold's days. I believe that guys like Branch and Coleman train with incredible intensity. The main bone of contention is the amount of volume but even then bodybuilders (not all) don't use the 20 sets per body part for major groups like chest, back, quads and maybe 9-12 for arms, hams.... that was common in the 1970s.
When I say I follow the basic fundamental principles laid out by Mentzer it doesn't mean I do one set per bodypart every two weeks. But I still follow the principles of intensity and less frequency and sets than the normal bodybuilding routine. For example, I did legs yesterday, I did one set of squats with a weight that I could barely get 9 reps out of. I stop when I really start bending over. I rack it and stand there and take 5 deep breaths and bang out as many more as I can, in this case 4 reps, rack it again, 5 deep breaths, got another two reps, drop the weight 50lbs did another 10, racked it and did body weight squats until I was on my back sucking wind. Has my quads grown any? Not in the last 20 years. Do I think it would grow if I did a more bodybuilding routine? No, because I tried that. I find that doing a more traditional bodybuilding routine where I rest a minute or two between sets much less intense and much easier. Pushing yourself so that you're gasping for air is no fun. But I do it simply because it keeps me in much better condition. Much better shape to do other things where conditioning is at a premium. To me resistance training isn't always about getting bigger muscles. In fact, at my age it hardly even an issue.
BTW, after I got my breath it was one drop set of leg curls, one set on the hacks to failure with force reps (I force them out pushing on my knees), followed by another set of bodyweight squats and then a set of stiff leg dead lifts, all without a break to complete the leg routine.
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And yes his training advices when he retired were crazy.
In his "consolidation routine" he advocated doing one set every two weeks! This advice would only be recommended for an extreme ectomorph recovering from surgery who is doing physiotherapy and that's it. It is severe undertraining for everyone else.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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I find that hard to believe. I lived near Mentzer at the time of his death and he lived in a fairly modest two bedroom apartment in Redondo Beach. I don't remember the make and model of his car but I can assure you it was not a luxury model nor was it very new.
Near that time Mike had a White 1996 Jaguar XJ6. I know because I had one too.
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Pellius,that`s not HIT bro,that`s a Giant-Set.
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I think Mentzer/Jones principles are used widely but just not given credit. The frequency in training has dropped considerable since Arnold's days. I believe that guys like Branch and Coleman train with incredible intensity. The main bone of contention is the amount of volume but even then bodybuilders (not all) don't use the 20 sets per body part for major groups like chest, back, quads and maybe 9-12 for arms, hams.... that was common in the 1970s.
When I say I follow the basic fundamental principles laid out by Mentzer it doesn't mean I do one set per bodypart every two weeks. But I still follow the principles of intensity and less frequency and sets than the normal bodybuilding routine. For example, I did legs yesterday, I did one set of squats with a weight that I could barely get 9 reps out of. I stop when I really start bending over. I rack it and stand there and take 5 deep breaths and bang out as many more as I can, in this case 4 reps, rack it again, 5 deep breaths, got another two reps, drop the weight 50lbs did another 10, racked it and did body weight squats until I was on my back sucking wind. Has my quads grown any? Not in the last 20 years. Do I think it would grow if I did a more bodybuilding routine? No, because I tried that. I find that doing a more traditional bodybuilding routine where I rest a minute or two between sets much less intense and much easier. Pushing yourself so that you're gasping for air is no fun. But I do it simply because it keeps me in much better condition. Much better shape to do other things where conditioning is at a premium. To me resistance training isn't always about getting bigger muscles. In fact, at my age it hardly even an issue.
BTW, after I got my breath it was one drop set of leg curls, one set on the hacks to failure with force reps (I force them out pushing on my knees), followed by another set of bodyweight squats and then a set of stiff leg dead lifts, all without a break to complete the leg routine.
your admitting your training is for cardio, not muscle gain
muscle gaining is done by long rest between sets, high volume, high frequency,and staying far away from failure.
of course the flipside is that if you do go to failure, then yes mentzers training is the way to go. cuz your body cant handle multiple sets to failure and it will need time to recover from the damage inflicted by going to that point. one set to failure sparks growth for sure though.
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muscle gaining is done by long rest between sets, high volume, high frequency,and staying far away from failure.
There are so many wrong things with this statement.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Pellius,that`s not HIT bro,that`s a Giant-Set.
I define HIT as having the following attributes: lower frequency (in comparison to traditional routines: 3-4 days max/week), lower duration (not going over an hour), progression (trying to exceed your previous performance and varying the stimulus) and lastly, and most importantly and most neglected, is intensity -- training hard, pushing yourself, stimulating an adaptive response. I just don't understand how one can think they will improve if they are continuously doing things that are relatively easy. When I reach positive failure on a set, defined as not being able to complete another full rep in good form, that's when the set really begins for me. Often times when eeking out the last rep and I will say to myself, "OK, now it begins."
Often one gets caught up in semantics. If you are not doing one set per body part and training each muscle group once every 10-14 days then you are not doing HIT. To me volume training is anything over 9 sets/body part. Jones use to say "Train your muscles anaerobically and train your body aerobically." That why he had Casey jump from one exercise to another with little or no rest. You call it giant sets. When I did shoulders last Saturday, after warming up, I did dumbbell laterals starting with a weight that I got six good reps on, followed by some partials, and worked my way down the rack without stopping until I hit the 15 pounders. You call that giant sets and I call it drop sets. Same thing in my mind. I almost always do partial on my last set. It use to be called burns. The fellas over on IronMan call it X-reps. Whatever.
BTW, I am of the belief that training in this manner, training your muscles anaerobically and your body aerobically, is NOT the idea training protocol for muscle hypertrophy. Boyer Cole commented that moving so fast you didn't give your body enough time to recover so that you can really push the muscles (not the cardiovascular system). He also mentioned, and this may be even more important, is just spend a bit of time psyching up. Focusing and visualizing. Winding up and building momentum. If you got 8 reps the last time you want to get the 9th rep or die trying.
I believe that circuit training, giants set, or whatever; is best for athletic conditioning and the most productive use of your time for general health and fitness. No need to separate strength training and cardiovascular conditioning. For strength and muscle hypertrophy you have to slow down the pace some and really focus on moving weight.
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your admitting your training is for cardio, not muscle gain
muscle gaining is done by long rest between sets, high volume, high frequency,and staying far away from failure.
of course the flipside is that if you do go to failure, then yes mentzers training is the way to go. cuz your body cant handle multiple sets to failure and it will need time to recover from the damage inflicted by going to that point. one set to failure sparks growth for sure though.
Finally, something we can agree on.
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Mentzer, while no genius was a very smart man as was Arthur Jones before him. If you think about it, HIT makes perfect sense. Doing the most with the least is an economically sound way to train but you have to realize that with HIT you are essentially doing the most intense workout in an effort to economize your time while maximizing your gains.
It is pretty much a fact that you can train long or train hard, but not both. This is not to say that volume training is not difficult, but rather that it is not as intense as HIT.
There may well be no right or wrong way to train, but for many there is a better way and that would be HIT. For many... Not "all".
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he also benefited from the fact that the workouts in the magazines where so far over training for a natural bodybuilder his system would at least give reasonable gains where the weider system would not before I touched a steroid in my youth I even went as far to get pre 1960s training info to see exacty what some one not juicing would train like. I am even convinced some one one low dose juice would be almost better served on a full body routine or a b split
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I define HIT as having the following attributes: lower frequency (in comparison to traditional routines: 3-4 days max/week), lower duration (not going over an hour), progression (trying to exceed your previous performance and varying the stimulus) and lastly, and most importantly and most neglected, is intensity -- training hard, pushing yourself, stimulating an adaptive response. I just don't understand how one can think they will improve if they are continuously doing things that are relatively easy. When I reach positive failure on a set, defined as not being able to complete another full rep in good form, that's when the set really begins for me. Often times when eeking out the last rep and I will say to myself, "OK, now it begins."
Often one gets caught up in semantics. If you are not doing one set per body part and training each muscle group once every 10-14 days then you are not doing HIT. To me volume training is anything over 9 sets/body part. Jones use to say "Train your muscles anaerobically and train your body aerobically." That why he had Casey jump from one exercise to another with little or no rest. You call it giant sets. When I did shoulders last Saturday, after warming up, I did dumbbell laterals starting with a weight that I got six good reps on, followed by some partials, and worked my way down the rack without stopping until I hit the 15 pounders. You call that giant sets and I call it drop sets. Same thing in my mind. I almost always do partial on my last set. It use to be called burns. The fellas over on IronMan call it X-reps. Whatever.
BTW, I am of the belief that training in this manner, training your muscles anaerobically and your body aerobically, is NOT the idea training protocol for muscle hypertrophy. Boyer Cole commented that moving so fast you didn't give your body enough time to recover so that you can really push the muscles (not the cardiovascular system). He also mentioned, and this may be even more important, is just spend a bit of time psyching up. Focusing and visualizing. Winding up and building momentum. If you got 8 reps the last time you want to get the 9th rep or die trying.
I believe that circuit training, giants set, or whatever; is best for athletic conditioning and the most productive use of your time for general health and fitness. No need to separate strength training and cardiovascular conditioning. For strength and muscle hypertrophy you have to slow down the pace some and really focus on moving weight.
Good stuff bro,I feel the same way..............my work ethic in the gym is second to none.
I train as heavy as possible for the reps I`m shooting for,very little rest between sets,,extend sets by doing half reps at the end and at times static holds,lots of intensity techniques,etc. etc.
Getting old is a bitch but training hard is not for the faint of heart.
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I always hear this but it is just patently wrong. Although I've injured virtually every part of my body beginning from my big toe, ankle, calf, knee... all the way to my skull I have never ever injure myself training with weights and I've been using and following the general principles of Jones and Mentzer for 30 years.
You're a stuntman or what ? ???
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You're a stuntman or what ? ???
Or just runs his mouth too much :D
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Yes he was..........built his main bulk on high volume for decades, and lots of gear.
In the DVD he made for GMV "Mike & Ray Mentzer: In The Gym", he said that some of the protocols prescribed to people only work for genetics freaks on steroids. Well...what was Mike exactly? ???
My review for the DVD is on my site, Bodybuilding Pro. Just Google Mike & Ray Mentzer: In The Gym DVD review and it will be on the first page. Good DVD to be honest, but I objected to that comment as Mike was kind of selling a fantasy to some people while denouncing others who do so.
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was he alone when he died?
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In the DVD he made for GMV "Mike & Ray Mentzer: In The Gym", he said that some of the protocols prescribed to people only work for genetics freaks on steroids. Well...what was Mike exactly? ???
My review for the DVD is on my site, Bodybuilding Pro. Just Google Mike & Ray Mentzer: In The Gym DVD review and it will be on the first page. Good DVD to be honest, but I objected to that comment as Mike was kind of selling a fantasy to some people while denouncing others who do so.
Matt, are you trying to be the next Ron? ???
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It must feel good to be an industry insider huh Matt?
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I think Mentzer/Jones principles are used widely but just not given credit. The frequency in training has dropped considerable since Arnold's days. I believe that guys like Branch and Coleman train with incredible intensity. The main bone of contention is the amount of volume but even then bodybuilders (not all) don't use the 20 sets per body part for major groups like chest, back, quads and maybe 9-12 for arms, hams.... that was common in the 1970s.
When I say I follow the basic fundamental principles laid out by Mentzer it doesn't mean I do one set per bodypart every two weeks. But I still follow the principles of intensity and less frequency and sets than the normal bodybuilding routine. For example, I did legs yesterday, I did one set of squats with a weight that I could barely get 9 reps out of. I stop when I really start bending over. I rack it and stand there and take 5 deep breaths and bang out as many more as I can, in this case 4 reps, rack it again, 5 deep breaths, got another two reps, drop the weight 50lbs did another 10, racked it and did body weight squats until I was on my back sucking wind. Has my quads grown any? Not in the last 20 years. Do I think it would grow if I did a more bodybuilding routine? No, because I tried that. I find that doing a more traditional bodybuilding routine where I rest a minute or two between sets much less intense and much easier. Pushing yourself so that you're gasping for air is no fun. But I do it simply because it keeps me in much better condition. Much better shape to do other things where conditioning is at a premium. To me resistance training isn't always about getting bigger muscles. In fact, at my age it hardly even an issue.
BTW, after I got my breath it was one drop set of leg curls, one set on the hacks to failure with force reps (I force them out pushing on my knees), followed by another set of bodyweight squats and then a set of stiff leg dead lifts, all without a break to complete the leg routine.
I also like training with short rest periods, I don't notice any less muscle stimulation from it than when I did longer rest periods and I'm in better shape. Antagonistic supersets are great.
In his "consolidation routine" he advocated doing one set every two weeks! This advice would only be recommended for an extreme ectomorph recovering from surgery who is doing physiotherapy and that's it. It is severe undertraining for everyone else.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
I agree completely.
Personally I like training each body part twice a week, doing onely 1 set every 2 weeks would be severe undertraining.
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Yes he was..........built his main bulk on high volume for decades, and lots of gear.
Exactly. I've heard he had a set up in his home and would go to the gym and do a hit style workout in front of people but would then go home and do his real workout with Arnold posters on his wall. Strange dude.
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Exactly. I've heard he had a set up in his home and would go to the gym and do a hit style workout in front of people but would then go home and do his real workout with Arnold posters on his wall. Strange dude.
This is obviously a lie made up to stain his image. He went home and did his real workout with Arnold posters on the wall? That sounds completely over-the-top and far fetched.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
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Exactly. I've heard he had a set up in his home and would go to the gym and do a hit style workout in front of people but would then go home and do his real workout with Arnold posters on his wall. Strange dude.
that's what tommywishbone said too.
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was he alone when he died?
he lived with his brother ray who died two days later.
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This is obviously a lie made up to stain his image. He went home and did his real workout with Arnold posters on the wall? That sounds completely over-the-top and far fetched.
SUCKMYMUSCLE
Hate to agree with Sucky but when you're right you're right. This notion that he built his physique on volume and then promoted Heavy Duty (That's what he called it at the time. Not HIT) as a marketing ploy to distinguish him from the crowd and contradict Weider and Arnold is simply made up. Most of you weren't even born or still in diapers when Mentzer came on the scene in the late 1970s. The first article that I read of his where he describes his journey literally spoke to me. He describe how he made great progress when he first started training as a teen using the typical beginner program of doing a full body workout 3x/wk. Then how he progressed (regressed?) to breaking up body parts so he could do more sets per body part and going to a 6 day/wk program like everybody else did. How he spent literally all his free time training doing set after set after set and going nowhere. No matter what he did he couldn't progress. Then he described his meeting up with Casey Viator and from there being introduced to Author Jones. And the rest is history.
The point is you could see the progress that he made under the tutelage of Jones. Mentzer was already a pretty advance young bodybuilder but you see how he thickened up and put on muscle mass over the years after meeting Jones. And I know there are those who say he still did volume if you count the warm up sets. But you don't count those sets. If your work set is 405 lbs on the squat for 10 reps you are not going to jump right on that after just getting out of bed or getting off work. But those warm up sets are not the same as what a typical bodybuilder did at the time.
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we all die alone. even if youre surrounded by family, stacks of money, or drunken whores... it's your own little journey and nobody can do anything but try to make you feel good about it.
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that's what tommywishbone said too.
I did indeed know Mike reasonably well in his last few years. Strange cat all the way- but cool IMO. I can not confirm or denied Arnold posters in his home gym. LOL!
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Hate to agree with Sucky but when you're right you're right. This notion that he built his physique on volume and then promoted Heavy Duty (That's what he called it at the time. Not HIT) as a marketing ploy to distinguish him from the crowd and contradict Weider and Arnold is simply made up. Most of you weren't even born or still in diapers when Mentzer came on the scene in the late 1970s. The first article that I read of his where he describes his journey literally spoke to me. He describe how he made great progress when he first started training as a teen using the typical beginner program of doing a full body workout 3x/wk. Then how he progressed (regressed?) to breaking up body parts so he could do more sets per body part and going to a 6 day/wk program like everybody else did. How he spent literally all his free time training doing set after set after set and going nowhere. No matter what he did he couldn't progress. Then he described his meeting up with Casey Viator and from there being introduced to Author Jones. And the rest is history.
The point is you could see the progress that he made under the tutelage of Jones. Mentzer was already a pretty advance young bodybuilder but you see how he thickened up and put on muscle mass over the years after meeting Jones. And I know there are those who say he still did volume if you count the warm up sets. But you don't count those sets. If your work set is 405 lbs on the squat for 10 reps you are not going to jump right on that after just getting out of bed or getting off work. But those warm up sets are not the same as what a typical bodybuilder did at the time.
I hate to disagree bro,but Mentzer came on the scene at the AAU Mr. America as early as 1971 and was not a small guy by any stretchh of the imagination............. won or competed as a teen in lots of contests in the late 1960`s- 1970 also.
Sure he progressed under Jones but he would have progressed anyway as he was young,hungry,and a gentic elite on juice!!
Not saying Jones sucked but I don`t give Mike and Ray or Casey all the credit for their builds just because of Jones HIT program.
I use some of Jones` principles in my training..........oddly enough,they are very similar to Girondas ideas as far as intensity and training fast,ie. less rest between sets goes.
Anyway,I still luv ya` my brother............. even if your ideas are skewed!! LOL ;D
Just kidding bro,and you better know it!! :)
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I hate to disagree bro,but Mentzer came on the scene at the AAU Mr. America as early as 1971 and was not a small guy by any stretchh of the imagination............. won or competed as a teen in lots of contests in the late 1960`s- 1970 also.
Sure he progressed under Jones but he would have progressed anyway as he was young,hungry,and a gentic elite on juice!!
Not saying Jones sucked but I don`t give Mike and Ray or Casey all the credit for their builds just because of Jones HIT program.
I use some of Jones` principles in my training..........oddly enough,they are very similar to Girondas ideas as far as intensity and training fast,ie. less rest between sets goes.
Anyway,I still luv ya` my brother............. even if your ideas are skewed!! LOL ;D
Just kidding bro,and you better know it!! :)
THAT'S IT! One week from today. Internet pose down. Glute shots required!
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He didnt have a home gym- at least in the 90s when I knew him. How do Iknow? Wel I was at place for a New years Party- wheme he lived in Marina Del Ray (He moved later). It was a cool tri level and I am nosy so I scoped out the whole palce with my wife. No gym euipment or roid dispensers on the wall. Beer and wine in fridge. Lots of DVds. Pretty normal overall for a bachelor in LA making bank. Where do people come UP with some of this shiit I dunno..
PS Tim is right- he used volume for years- but started out three times a week 3 sets each exercise and gained much of his early gains that way- from 95 lbs to 165- age 12 to 15. He then was doing so well, he INCREASED the volume- 6 days a week 2 hours a day or so and went from 175 to 185 from age 15 to age 19- not bad- but note, a much slower rate of progress.
He went to the 1971 A around this time, and met Casey...
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we all die alone. even if youre surrounded by family, stacks of money, or drunken whores... it's your own little journey and nobody can do anything but try to make you feel good about it.
since when where you the fucking poet
nice
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we all die alone. even if youre surrounded by family, stacks of money, or drunken whores... it's your own little journey and nobody can do anything but try to make you feel good about it.
Not so. My friend is Christian and says that so long as we have memories we will never die alone. I believe him.
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we all die alone. even if youre surrounded by family, stacks of money, or drunken whores... it's your own little journey and nobody can do anything but try to make you feel good about it.
no one is ever alone :)
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no one is ever alone :)
Yea, porn has gotten me through some rough times. ;)
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He didnt have a home gym- at least in the 90s when I knew him. How do Iknow? Wel I was at place for a New years Party- wheme he lived in Marina Del Ray (He moved later). It was a cool tri level and I am nosy so I scoped out the whole palce with my wife. No gym euipment or roid dispensers on the wall. Beer and wine in fridge. Lots of DVds. Pretty normal overall for a bachelor in LA making bank. Where do people come UP with some of this shiit I dunno..
PS Tim is right- he used volume for years- but started out three times a week 3 sets each exercise and gained much of his early gains that way- from 95 lbs to 165- age 12 to 15. He then was doing so well, he INCREASED the volume- 6 days a week 2 hours a day or so and went from 175 to 185 from age 15 to age 19- not bad- but note, a much slower rate of progress.
He went to the 1971 A around this time, and met Casey...
Please continue.
Mike admitted he was at a stand still and was even thinking of hanging it up. It was after to met Casey and Jones when it opened up a whole new world for him. He made considerable progress after meeting up and training with Jones and adopting to the system. Progress that he himself admitted he wouldn't have made since he was stuck doing volume. And he did train as he preached and didn't do volume in "secret." It was verified by those that were there. Even our own Reeves trained at Gold's during Mike's hey day and confirmed his "Heavy Duty." So fuck that noise.
Intense, I think I remember you from IronAge. Are you on that board?
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THAT'S IT! One week from today. Internet pose down. Glute shots required!
Immediately starts doing more lunges in preperation for "Old Guy Battle Of The Glutes Champioships"!!
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He didnt have a home gym- at least in the 90s when I knew him. How do Iknow? Wel I was at place for a New years Party- wheme he lived in Marina Del Ray (He moved later). It was a cool tri level and I am nosy so I scoped out the whole palce with my wife. No gym euipment or roid dispensers on the wall. Beer and wine in fridge. Lots of DVds. Pretty normal overall for a bachelor in LA making bank. Where do people come UP with some of this shiit I dunno..
PS Tim is right- he used volume for years- but started out three times a week 3 sets each exercise and gained much of his early gains that way- from 95 lbs to 165- age 12 to 15. He then was doing so well, he INCREASED the volume- 6 days a week 2 hours a day or so and went from 175 to 185 from age 15 to age 19- not bad- but note, a much slower rate of progress.
He went to the 1971 A around this time, and met Casey...
Hey James drop by my board.............got it back up and running again bud!! :)
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(http://oi53.tinypic.com/29cmfeb.jpg)
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Please continue.
Mike admitted he was at a stand still and was even thinking of hanging it up. It was after to met Casey and Jones when it opened up a whole new world for him. He made considerable progress after meeting up and traininqg with Jones and adopting to the system. Progress that he himself admitted he wouldn't have made since he was stuck doing volume. And he did train as he preached and didn't do volume in "secret." It was verified by those that were there. Even our own Reeves trained at Gold's during Mike's hey day and confirmed his "Heavy Duty." So fuck that noise.
Intense, I think I remember you from IronAge. Are you on that board?
Not to be a dick....but did You ever think he was getting paid to say that? You know...like every other BBer on the planet that pushes bullshit for money
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Immediately starts doing more lunges in preperation for "Old Guy Battle Of The Glutes Champioships"!!
Old guy + glutes = :-X
/what's the prize? box of depends? prescription for flomax? ;D
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was he alone when he died?
Hard to confirm since no one was there to witness it.
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There have been sightings since his "death". He has been seen doing drop sets of BBcurls with Arthur Jones and Elvis..
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Please continue.
Mike admitted he was at a stand still and was even thinking of hanging it up. It was after to met Casey and Jones when it opened up a whole new world for him. He made considerable progress after meeting up and training with Jones and adopting to the system. Progress that he himself admitted he wouldn't have made since he was stuck doing volume. And he did train as he preached and didn't do volume in "secret." It was verified by those that were there. Even our own Reeves trained at Gold's during Mike's hey day and confirmed his "Heavy Duty." So fuck that noise.
Intense, I think I remember you from IronAge. Are you on that board?
Yep. still go there, as one of my stops.
Yeah, he said he was getting pretty frustrated, had gonene ffrom 2 hours a day 6 days a week to 3 hours- even 7 days I think, and his progress had ground to a halt- even for a genetic freak in his prime that is alot. Especially add in that he was working 12 hour days in the Air force and seeing some girl. He reasoned that if he had to go to 4 hours a day to make more progress, giving up what was left of his free time, then it just was not worth it..
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When Casey told him he was only training three times a week an hour a day it seemed like a breath of fresh air.. that makes sense to me, put yourself in his place, workinglong bours, training long hours , tired and to exhausted to even see your girlfriend, and you can get better results and have alot more free time, why wouldnt that seem good?? I think thats the best apppeal of it, even if the results are the same, if you can do it in less time, and have more of an outside life, that seems like a good deal. An hour day every other day, if you train as hard and heavy as he did, in good form, is Plenty. I am doing less than that right now, working a graveyard shift, which leave me with sleeping during the day if I can, and feeling like crap, 5 days out of the week, so I cut back to two days- half on my off day off, and the other half a few days later. Honestly, its enough with that and trying to rebuild us economically.. I DON't need more to do, lol.
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Hey James drop by my board.............got it back up and running again bud!! :)
\
I will do that !!
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I think people here are confusing what Menzter advised in training when he retired with how he actually trained in his competitive days. I have no problem believing his gains came from his variation of HIT and not traditional volume, because his actual training was pretty good actually..2 day split, training 4 days a week, body parts hit 2x week, more volume than just one set per bp, etc.
Now, what he recommended in his latter days, the whole one set per body part once every full moon and the such was just bullshit.
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I think people here are confusing what Menzter advised in training when he retired with how he actually trained in his competitive days. I have no problem believing his gains came from his variation of HIT and not traditional volume, because his actual training was pretty good actually..2 day split, training 4 days a week, body parts hit 2x week, more volume than just one set per bp, etc.
Now, what he recommended in his latter days, the whole one set per body part once every full moon and the such was just bullshit.
Exactly. I tried that and lost conditioning and strength didn't go up faster either. Some guys had strength gains, but few looked more muscular. Worked great for guys with no recovery ability.
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Not to be a dick....but did You ever think he was getting paid to say that? You know...like every other BBer on the planet that pushes bullshit for money
He WAS getting paid to say that as he was a writer for Weider and published his courses and books. But you don't want to put the cart before the horse. It's not like Weider came to Mike and asked him start preaching some alternative theory to Arnold and him to promote controversy and sell more mags and give him a cut. No, Mentzer first started winning shows as a competitive bodybuilder and that got the bodybuilding public and writers of magazines (which was really the only venue at the time) interested in him. It was then that Mike related his experience with Author Jones. And remember, Jones didn't just work with bodybuilders. Before he started inviting guys like Sergio, Arnold, Franco...., he was doing studies on students at West Point using the type of training protocol he preached and had Mentzer and Viator do.
And I really don't think Weider would want to do anything to directly or indirectly contribute to the success of Jones. At the time they lambasted his Nautilus machines and, along with Arnold, preach the efficacy of good old fashion free weights. Weider detested Jones and admittedly, from everything I've ever heard and read, Jones was not the easiest person to get along with. He was an eccentric, no nonsense, hard ass that didn't suffer fools -- or anybody really. But he did like young girls and always had one on hand.
Does this look like a face that gave a crap?
(http://www.arthurjonesexercise.com/Photos/Nautilus1.jpg)
(http://www.arthurjonesexercise.com/Photos/Gators1.jpg)
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Dude looks creepy
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jones was defintely a eccentric character, really someone you won't want to mess with. made what's probably the worst movie ever voodoo swamp starring bill pearl.
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(http://www.drdarden.com/img/photos/artJones.jpg)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_2gu7dLmFphk/TPqON1UgQBI/AAAAAAAAeXI/3JIvu8Sohy8/s1600/arthur%2Bjones.jpg)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_2gu7dLmFphk/TPqONkEx2KI/AAAAAAAAeXA/4biyA7UBqoE/s400/l_a2ddb650e6719bf8c5850ce839648b43%2B%2Barthur%2Bjones.jpg)
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jones and mentzer - both head-cases.
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Nothing that a juice head says about sets or reps is going to make much sense to a natural bodybuilder. When you're not on the juice, you need rest between sets, otherwise you won't be doing very many sets at all I'm afraid. And Mentzer was as full of it as anyone, you think he broke his plateau by doing less sets? How about injecting more anabolics? That sounds better actually.
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As far as Arnold and Weider, they would stoop to anything to sell products and magazines. In truth Arnold could not have achieved his look without steroids, Mentzer's training philosophy was perhaps more appropriate for the natural.
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jones and mentzer - both head-cases.
Like everyone else in the "sport". ;D
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why in every photo he has a gun or is near wild animals?
I'm impotent too but there's no need to sit on a croc to feel better.........
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why in every photo he has a gun or is near wild animals?
jones said a gun is like a tornegette, you don't often need one but when you do, you really need it. pearl said during the filming of the movie voodoo swamp he had to stop jones from shooting one of the locals.
I'm impotent too but there's no need to sit on a croc to feel better.........
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What is a tornegette?
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I think people here are confusing what Menzter advised in training when he retired with how he actually trained in his competitive days. I have no problem believing his gains came from his variation of HIT and not traditional volume, because his actual training was pretty good actually..2 day split, training 4 days a week, body parts hit 2x week, more volume than just one set per bp, etc.
Now, what he recommended in his latter days, the whole one set per body part once every full moon and the such was just bullshit.
YOU ARE 100% RIGHT!
BELOW I POSTED 3 VIDEO OF THE GREAT PROGRAM THAT MENTZER WAS ADVISING WHEN HE WAS COMPETING AND SANE IN MIND , THEY ARE VERY GOOOD HEAVY DUTY WORKOUT ESPECIALLY FOR A NATURAL, SINCE THE RECOVERY IS LIMITATED FOR NATURALS!
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BELOW I POSTED THE VIDEO OF THE WORKOUT THAT MIKE MENTZER WAS ADVISING IN LATER YEARS AFTER HE STOPPED COMPETING!
THIS ARE ROUTINE THAT WILL UNDERTRAIN EVEN A NATURAL AND NOT HAVE ENOUGHT VOLUME AND FREQUENCY FOR OPTIMAL GROWT!
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I REALLY LIKE MIKE MENTZER! BUT FROM WHAT I HEAR FROM PEOPLE THAT KNEW HIM, THE GENERAL CONSENSE IS THAT HE WAS NOT STABLE MENTALLY AT THE END OF HIS LIFE AND THE WORKOUT HE PRESRIBED IN LATER YEARS DID NOT GIVE THE RESULT HE WAS SUGGESTING!
THAT IS THE REASON WHY I POSTED THE 2 SEPARATED SERIES OF VIDEO OF THE WORKOUTS THAT HE WAS PRESRIBING TO HIS STUDENT DURING 2 DIFFERENT TIME OF HIS LIFE!
MENTZER OFTEN SAID THAT HEAVY DUTY 2 WAS A BETTER PROGRAM THAN THE ONE HE WAS PRESCRIBING WHEN HE WAS COMPETING AT HIS PEAK, BUT THAT IS NOT TRUE BECAUSE AT THE TIME OF THE HEAVY DUTY 2 HE WAS NOT MENTALLY SANE!
I NEVER HAD THE CHANCE AND THE PRIVILEGE TO MEET HIM IN PERSON BUT PEOPLE THAT I KNOW USED TO KNOW HIM PERSONALLY THEY TOLD ME THAT.
ANYWAY I LIKE TO REMEMBER HIM FOR WHAT HE WAS AT THE TIME OF COMPETITION DAYS WHEN HE HAD A ONE OF THE MOST POWERFUL PHYSIQUE OF ALL TIME!
R.I.P. MIKE MENTZER !
(A TRUE GREAT BODYBUILDER THAT WENT TROUGH SAME HARDSHIP LATER IN LIFE) :'(
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why in every photo he has a gun or is near wild animals?
I'm impotent too but there's no need to sit on a croc to feel better.........
lolz
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I REALLY LIKE MIKE MENTZER! BUT FROM WHAT I HEAR FROM PEOPLE THAT KNEW HIM, THE GENERAL CONSENSE IS THAT HE WAS NOT STABLE MENTALLY AT THE END OF HIS LIFE AND THE WORKOUT HE PRESRIBED IN LATER YEARS DID NOT GIVE THE RESULT HE WAS SUGGESTING!
THAT IS THE REASON WHY I POSTED THE 2 SEPARATED SERIES OF VIDEO OF THE WORKOUTS THAT HE WAS PRESRIBING TO HIS STUDENT DURING 2 DIFFERENT TIME OF HIS LIFE!
MENTZER OFTEN SAID THAT HEAVY DUTY 2 WAS A BETTER PROGRAM THAN THE ONE HE WAS PRESCRIBING WHEN HE WAS COMPETING AT HIS PEAK, BUT THAT IS NOT TRUE BECAUSE AT THE TIME OF THE HEAVY DUTY 2 HE WAS NOT MENTALLY SANE!
I NEVER HAD THE CHANCE AND THE PRIVILEGE TO MEET HIM IN PERSON BUT PEOPLE THAT I KNOW USED TO KNOW HIM PERSONALLY THEY TOLD ME THAT.
ANYWAY I LIKE TO REMEMBER HIM FOR WHAT HE WAS AT THE TIME OF COMPETITION DAYS WHEN HE HAD A ONE OF THE MOST POWERFUL PHYSIQUE OF ALL TIME!
R.I.P. MIKE MENTZER !
(A TRUE GREAT BODYBUILDER THAT WENT TROUGH SAME HARDSHIP LATER IN LIFE) :'(
I think you're exactly right. Mentzer used some some rec drugs and amps that had life changing effects. He was not the same person after he had his break down.
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I think you're exactly right. Mentzer used some some rec drugs and amps that had life changing effects. He was not the same person after he had his break down.
GB broke you down when you first joined.
.....but you recovered into an owning machine when needed 8)
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This is a good thread..fascinating
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(http://oi53.tinypic.com/29cmfeb.jpg)
It would even better if a close up of the screen showed him as gh15
'Don't lie about juicing Coach or I will cut off your supply!'
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GB broke you down when you first joined.
.....but you recovered into an owning machine when needed 8)
I was just a young pup naive to the harsh realities of GetBig.
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Nothing that a juice head says about sets or reps is going to make much sense to a natural bodybuilder. When you're not on the juice, you need rest between sets, otherwise you won't be doing very many sets at all I'm afraid. And Mentzer was as full of it as anyone, you think he broke his plateau by doing less sets? How about injecting more anabolics? That sounds better actually.
Perhaps. So if it's just a matter of drugs, meaning no matter how you train (within reason), progress only comes to an advance bodybuilder from drugs, then his training will still be more efficient since it requires less time and frequency and more time for guest posing and dancing naked on the freeway (Sorry Mike, still shocked and stunned that you did this).
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.
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mentzer was awesome
I wonder who joe got to off him
body by science poves 1 weight workout a week is all anyone needs for fountainof youth
:)
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mentzer was awesome
I wonder who joe got to off him
body by science poves 1 weight workout a week is all anyone needs for fountainof youth
:)
I'm sure Joe has offed a few people here and there..LOL...he was the original gangsta ;)
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LOL
Not everybody want to show off if they have money.
Look at Warren Buffett. Would you believe that dude is in top 3 of world's richest people? And was actually the world's richest man at one year.
Pretty average and old house. Always had used (not luxury) cars.
Would you think this is a house of world's richest man?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6mJugzVlsTk/TK9TxqpZBNI/AAAAAAAAAHs/IFaDqrUVFjc/s1600/buffett.jpg)
He bought it back in 1956 for 31 500 dollars if I remember correct. Still lives in it.
Newsflash: Not everyone tries to mimic the lifestyle shown in rap videos on MTV (which are not real life BTW) :o :o
i love buffett.....huge fan of the guy....but you never hear him talk about his multi million dollar home in cali.....and he does use a private jet and drives a new caddy. again....huge fan of the man.....but he doesn't exactly live like the media would have you believe.
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LOL at Mentzer making a million dollars the year he died. Complete horseshit.
No and in fact his company is making a decent load of cash although Joanne has closed it temp due to some personal issues. Mentzer was making well over a million dollars a year however he had a number of medical issues and he was taking care of his brother was getting dialysis.......
Hospital bills will eat you alive but for 2 people, its pretty diasterous....That's why Mentzer was working night and day and it likely contributed to his early demise
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buffet is a fraud like all multi billionaires who pretend to care
how the fuck can you say you are giving your money away when you are always in top 10 richest people?. what an amazing failure of imagination
it takes less than one year to giveaway ur billions properly and retire with a couple of million
but no one will ever do it
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buffet is a fraud like all multi billionaires who pretend to care
how the fuck can you say you are giving your money away when you are always in top 10 richest people?. what an amazing failure of imagination
it takes less than one year to giveaway ur billions properly and retire with a couple of million
but no one will ever do it
Many billionaires give generously to various charitable causes.
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fuck you
the guy has had tens of billions for years now. what the fuck does he need that money for?
how many peoples lives could he have saved if he had built a few hospitals providing treatment for free to 1000s of people year after year?
people are dying now, disease and hunger is not waiting for this fraud to die. and anyway after he dies there will be 600 people administering an estate and consuming 60% of anything that is given out, which will be peanuts
it is all bs, wake up
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mentzer at 19 long before he bucked the system to make more bucks. coe said mentzer made over a million dollars the year that he died.contoversy creates cash.
man if this is true wut did he do with it? I person lay think this is bullshit. I saw mentored all the time before he died. He was a psycho and looked homeless. No muscle to speak of. Was kicked out of golds Venice fir a bit cuz he was just acting like a rambling homeless guy. This thread is so long maybe it's already been mentioned. I didn't read it all
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LOL
Not everybody want to show off if they have money.
Look at Warren Buffett. Would you believe that dude is in top 3 of world's richest people? And was actually the world's richest man at one year.
Pretty average and old house. Always had used (not luxury) cars.
Would you think this is a house of world's richest man?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6mJugzVlsTk/TK9TxqpZBNI/AAAAAAAAAHs/IFaDqrUVFjc/s1600/buffett.jpg)
He bought it back in 1956 for 31 500 dollars if I remember correct. Still lives in it.
Newsflash: Not everyone tries to mimic the lifestyle shown in rap videos on MTV (which are not real life BTW) :o :o
true enuff. But listen, there's a big difference between warren buffet n mike mentzer. I didn't see him right before he died so mayb he straightened out. He was improving near the time that I moved away. I too lived in Redondo beach. When I left he wasn't as crazy as before and was personal training people at golds.
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scam artists who were on steroids..all of them.
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fuck you
the guy has had tens of billions for years now. what the fuck does he need that money for?
how many peoples lives could he have saved if he had built a few hospitals providing treatment for free to 1000s of people year after year?
people are dying now, disease and hunger is not waiting for this fraud to die. and anyway after he dies there will be 600 people administering an estate and consuming 60% of anything that is given out, which will be peanuts
it is all bs, wake up
wtf, how is he responsible for these people illnesses or problems? why should he solve them? what would he get in return? You sound like a frustrated poor jealous asshole.
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scam artists who were on steroids..all of them.
mike who?
this thread is about warren buffet for gods sake
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mike who?
this thread is about warren buffet for gods sake
HA!
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wtf, how is he responsible for these people illnesses or problems? why should he solve them? what would he get in return? You sound like a frustrated poor jealous asshole.
ubberman it is pretty clear from your post that the gulf between your beliefs and mine is too large for a rational discussion to be possible
so i will just manifest my desire for a long painful death for you, and anyone you care about.
that should hopefully end our 'discussion'
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fuck you
the guy has had tens of billions for years now. what the fuck does he need that money for?
how many peoples lives could he have saved if he had built a few hospitals providing treatment for free to 1000s of people year after year?
people are dying now, disease and hunger is not waiting for this fraud to die. and anyway after he dies there will be 600 people administering an estate and consuming 60% of anything that is given out, which will be peanuts
it is all bs, wake up
bro...read up on what buffett has done with his money......you sound a little bitter.....by the way.....don't ever say "fuck you" to me!
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wtf, how is he responsible for these people illnesses or problems? why should he solve them? what would he get in return? You sound like a frustrated poor jealous asshole.
it is not about getting something in return......it is about doing something positive for society......to help mankind out is the greatest thing in the world.
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let's get back on topic......mentzer was one hell of a bodybuilder......some of the best damn triceps of all time.
very good poser.....excellent stage presence.
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let's get back on topic......mentzer was one hell of a bodybuilder......some of the best damn triceps of all time.
very good poser.....excellent stage presence.
Warren Mentzer
Mike Buffet
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mike mentzer on exercise science and nutrition
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bro...read up on what buffett has done with his money......you sound a little bitter.....by the way.....don't ever say "fuck you" to me!
point one- how much money does he have today after all this giving? $44B. Man the guy is one incompetent giver.
point two- fuck you, your wife/gf/bf, mother, father, shit all your loved ones-
point three- when you come to my door, please buzz 3 times in a row
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Warren Mentzer
Mike Buffet
put down the pipe......lol
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put down the pipe......lol
are you avoiding me?
fuck you again
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bro...read up on what buffett has done with his money......you sound a little bitter.....by the way.....don't ever say "fuck you" to me!
point one- how much money does he have today after all this giving? $44B. Man the guy is one incompetent giver.
point two- fuck you, your wife/gf/bf, mother, father, shit all your loved ones-
point three- when you come to my door, please buzz 3 times in a row
you are one stellar human being.......negative.... .. jealous......unaware.... ...never done shit with your life......i hope for your sake you wake up one day and get a new lease on life.......many negative dudes here......but you might take the cake.
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put down the pipe......lol
Warren Mike
Mike Warren
Mentzer Buffet
Buffet Mentzer
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you are one stellar human being.......negative.... .. jealous......unaware.... ...never done shit with your life......i hope for your sake you wake up one day and get a new lease on life.......many negative dudes here......but you might take the cake.
hahahhaha
is that all you got?
fuk me that is lame. You come out saying "DONT EVER SAY FUCK YOU TO ME"
and when i tell you and all ur family to go fuk urselves, this is your answer???
oh lordy lordy
just leave man
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i love buffett.....huge fan of the guy....but you never hear him talk about his multi million dollar home in cali.....and he does use a private jet and drives a new caddy. again....huge fan of the man.....but he doesn't exactly live like the media would have you believe.
This^^^And he didn't really give most of his billions away. He just re-invested it into one of Bill Gates de-population agendas. And i'm not bitter over these two people...They are both Misers who can't have enough money and power.
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(http://www.mikementzer.com/images/semin_s.jpg)
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hahahhaha
is that all you got?
fuk me that is lame. You come out saying "DONT EVER SAY FUCK YOU TO ME"
and when i tell you and all ur family to go fuk urselves, this is your answer???
oh lordy lordy
just leave man
get an attitude adjustment......man
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No, Mike Mentzer was not alone. There were also Arthur Jones, Casey Viator, Sergio Oliva and Dorian Yates.
(http://slowburnfitness.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/arthur_jones-muscle.jpg)
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/viator.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/Oliva14.jpg)
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/yates/dy186.jpg)
That picture of Sergio is the greatest Bodybuilding shot ever!
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No, Mike Mentzer was not alone. There were also Arthur Jones, Casey Viator, Sergio Oliva and Dorian Yates.
(http://slowburnfitness.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/arthur_jones-muscle.jpg)
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/viator.jpg)
(http://digilander.libero.it/mikementzer/Oliva14.jpg)
(http://www.schwarzenegger.it/mro/yates/dy186.jpg)
Viator in his best condition ever was the Olympia where Dickerson won. He was doing 15 sets per body part. Sergio trained for a couple of weeks in Florida with Jones and every HIT guy says he is the result of HIT. He trained with conventional equipment and plenty of volume prior to visiting Jones and after. Don't believe the propaganda.
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Good thread.
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These are all opinions. Was Casey better back in the early 1970's under Jones or years later when he made him comeback. I'd say he was better when he was taking the bodybuilding world by storm in 1970.
Did Mentzer make tremendous progress using HIT? Yes, absolutely.
They both used drugs. Their results were dependent on that fact, just as Arnold, Columbu, etc, all made great results with high volume.
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Exactly,and everyone who went against his dogma was wrong no matter how great they looked.
I have found by both observation and personal experience that a good debate of ideas can be educational, enlightening and respectful, and that someone who spends their time trying to prove everyone else wrong leaves a person bitter, alone(except with negative minded folk who share your pessimism)and limiting as to fulfilling potential because of the closed minded thinking.
I am certain from other people here who have known Mike that he was a nice guy, but that he also was probably the second category of the type I pointed out above.
I recall seeing that YOUTUBE vid here a while back where he is sitting around with a couple of people, they were filming those training videos of his at the time, and the scene reminded me of those blithering idiot old drunks you see at a shady bar who chain smoke and ramble on like the know it alls they think they are. To me that was pretty sad to see one of the people I looked up to in weight training, especially a man who had success and smarts like Mike did,to be carrying on like that. Never mind the fact that he preached a weight training theory that had people in the gym less frequently, preached about how it gave you more time to enjoy life yet the guy himself could not even find the 30 minutes a few times a week to workout like he preached the last what 10-20 years of his life. Not pissing on his grave, just saying how I see it.
I don't know just me, but real intelligence comes from an open mind, and one side of that you have the too smart for there own good(see most political/race threads for an example), and on the other side you have the retard who cares about learning everything, being everything, takes/gives loads of advice and never follows it(think your average Jason Genova video.)
To me Mike was too smart for his own good and had he kept a more open mind rather than being dogmatic I suspect he would have made millions, kept those millions, and would probably be still alive today and not self medicating himself to death with first speed and later jack daniels.
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great thread
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I have found by both observation and personal experience that a good debate of ideas can be educational, enlightening and respectful, and that someone who spends their time trying to prove everyone else wrong leaves a person bitter, alone(except with negative minded folk who share your pessimism)and limiting as to fulfilling potential because of the closed minded thinking.
I am certain from other people here who have known Mike that he was a nice guy, but that he also was probably the second category of the type I pointed out above.
I recall seeing that YOUTUBE vid here a while back where he is sitting around with a couple of people, they were filming those training videos of his at the time, and the scene reminded me of those blithering idiot old drunks you see at a shady bar who chain smoke and ramble on like the know it alls they think they are. To me that was pretty sad to see one of the people I looked up to in weight training, especially a man who had success and smarts like Mike did,to be carrying on like that. Never mind the fact that he preached a weight training theory that had people in the gym less frequently, preached about how it gave you more time to enjoy life yet the guy himself could not even find the 30 minutes a few times a week to workout like he preached the last what 10-20 years of his life. Not pissing on his grave, just saying how I see it.
I don't know just me, but real intelligence comes from an open mind, and one side of that you have the too smart for there own good(see most political/race threads for an example), and on the other side you have the retard who cares about learning everything, being everything, takes/gives loads of advice and never follows it(think your average Jason Genova video.)
To me Mike was too smart for his own good and had he kept a more open mind rather than being dogmatic I suspect he would have made millions, kept those millions, and would probably be still alive today and not self medicating himself to death with first speed and later jack daniels.
X2 (times two).. At the end of the day, there is really no wrong way to train provided that muscles are thoroughly stimulated..
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These are all opinions. Was Casey better back in the early 1970's under Jones or years later when he made him comeback. I'd say he was better when he was taking the bodybuilding world by storm in 1970.
Did Mentzer make tremendous progress using HIT? Yes, absolutely.
They both used drugs. Their results were dependent on that fact, just as Arnold, Columbu, etc, all made great results with high volume.
.. Had Casey Viator under Art Jones, and Mike Mentzer- swapped workout regiments with Arnold & Franco; they would have probably all achieved the same results with the same physiques ..
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mentzer is a whore, did he use HIT to build his competition physique
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I have found by both observation and personal experience that a good debate of ideas can be educational, enlightening and respectful, and that someone who spends their time trying to prove everyone else wrong leaves a person bitter, alone(except with negative minded folk who share your pessimism)and limiting as to fulfilling potential because of the closed minded thinking.
I am certain from other people here who have known Mike that he was a nice guy, but that he also was probably the second category of the type I pointed out above.
I recall seeing that YOUTUBE vid here a while back where he is sitting around with a couple of people, they were filming those training videos of his at the time, and the scene reminded me of those blithering idiot old drunks you see at a shady bar who chain smoke and ramble on like the know it alls they think they are. To me that was pretty sad to see one of the people I looked up to in weight training, especially a man who had success and smarts like Mike did,to be carrying on like that. Never mind the fact that he preached a weight training theory that had people in the gym less frequently, preached about how it gave you more time to enjoy life yet the guy himself could not even find the 30 minutes a few times a week to workout like he preached the last what 10-20 years of his life. Not pissing on his grave, just saying how I see it.
I don't know just me, but real intelligence comes from an open mind, and one side of that you have the too smart for there own good(see most political/race threads for an example), and on the other side you have the retard who cares about learning everything, being everything, takes/gives loads of advice and never follows it(think your average Jason Genova video.)
To me Mike was too smart for his own good and had he kept a more open mind rather than being dogmatic I suspect he would have made millions, kept those millions, and would probably be still alive today and not self medicating himself to death with first speed and later jack daniels.
He was obviously bitter and fed up with bbing initially, and then life's problems compounded with depression, drugs, alcohol contributed to his mental demise
Never mind HIT vs volume, he needed mental help and care and assistance
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Viator in his best condition ever was the Olympia where Dickerson won. He was doing 15 sets per body part. Sergio trained for a couple of weeks in Florida with Jones and every HIT guy says he is the result of HIT. He trained with conventional equipment and plenty of volume prior to visiting Jones and after. Don't believe the propaganda.
Viator was involved in "colorado experiment", he got paid to get out of shape, stop steroid use, and then resumed steroid use after "before" pics. Some staged nautilus pics, and "after" pics
Sergio was there for a couple weeks, few pics while there and with nautilus machines, and automatically he's a Jones disciple. Also got paid. Sergio was huge then, massive bloat around face, really huge. Not fat, huge
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High Intensity Training or HIT, is passe.......I have since moved on to Super High Intensity Training....or SHIT. ;)
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Viator was involved in "colorado experiment", he got paid to get out of shape, stop steroid use, and then resumed steroid use after "before" pics. Some staged nautilus pics, and "after" pics
Sergio was there for a couple weeks, few pics while there and with nautilus machines, and automatically he's a Jones disciple. Also got paid. Sergio was huge then, massive bloat around face, really huge. Not fat, huge
I heard he also had a bad infection from having a finger severed prior to that "experiment." That and not being on juice could have been the before pictures. Some suggested that they knew he did more than the Nautilus workouts too.
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High Intensity Training or HIT, is passe.......I have since moved on to Super High Intensity Training....or SHIT. ;)
LMAO!
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Mentzer claimed to be logical and scientific but his approach demonstrated that he understood little of how science actually works.
What he relied on was not science but instead, the logic of language.
What's more, he could only get away with it because an audience made up of teenagers and bodybuilders isn't exactly the most intellectually discriminating one.
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Mentzer claimed to be logical and scientific but his approach demonstrated that he understood little of how science actually works.
What he relied on was not science but instead, the logic of language.
What's more, he could only get away with it because an audience made up of teenagers and bodybuilders isn't exactly the most intellectually discriminating one.
its called broscience
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I think he referred to the studies obliquely in a few of his articles, but didn't use MLA or APA style footnoting etc.
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These are all opinions. Was Casey better back in the early 1970's under Jones or years later when he made him comeback. I'd say he was better when he was taking the bodybuilding world by storm in 1970.
Did Mentzer make tremendous progress using HIT? Yes, absolutely.
They both used drugs. Their results were dependent on that fact, just as Arnold, Columbu, etc, all made great results with high volume.
His all time best condition was at the London Olympia where Dickerson won. It's so drastic the change in his physique from the 70's where he was big but was not ripped. In London he was big and insanely ripped. David Young said he trained in the same gym as Viator and he said he used 15 sets per body part.
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His all time best condition was at the London Olympia where Dickerson won. It's so drastic the change in his physique from the 70's where he was big but was not ripped. In London he was big and insanely ripped. David Young said he trained in the same gym as Viator and he said he used 15 sets per body part.
Crazy big at 19 yrs old!
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His all time best condition was at the London Olympia where Dickerson won. It's so drastic the change in his physique from the 70's where he was big but was not ripped. In London he was big and insanely ripped. David Young said he trained in the same gym as Viator and he said he used 15 sets per body part.
I remember reading an interview with Casey just before the show and he mentioned that he had been on a 1500 calorie diet for a while.
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I remember reading an interview with Casey just before the show and he mentioned that he had been on a 1500 calorie diet for a while.
Which is entirely possible when you are using amphetamines as a diet aid..
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Which is entirely possible when you are using amphetamines as a diet aid..
Which Casey is known for being a heavy user of. Along with the Mentzer bros
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High Intensity Training or HIT, is passe.......I have since moved on to Super High Intensity Training....or SHIT. ;)
lol