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Getbig Bodybuilding Boards => Steroids Info & Hardcore => Topic started by: Beyond Genetics on November 02, 2005, 06:10:53 PM

Title: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 02, 2005, 06:10:53 PM
How big of a difference do you guys think insulin alone makes in bodybuilding if not used with GH, only AAS?
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: muscle19 on November 02, 2005, 08:03:51 PM
alot of guys use it as a  bridge, which can help with keeping gains from that cycle. even with aas, if used right can benefit ur gains but in my opinion, it is just too dangerous to even try to mess with it. if u feel like u have enough experience or knowledge on it, try it out, get a glucose monitor, and know how many carbs to take in after the shot.


muscle
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: wannabehuge on November 02, 2005, 09:55:52 PM
I like using it by itself mainly because its so cheap. You just have to eat real clean. I personaly think the gains are like GH sloooow and steady. (28 days on and 28 days off)
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 03, 2005, 03:34:26 AM
Yeah, I've taken it before but I was takin so much other shit that I couldn't tell what was doing what. I did grow pretty good though,,,  maybe I'll give it another "stab."
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 03, 2005, 07:43:52 AM
Yes it is cheap, and Ive used by itself and did see progress. Strength went up and pumps were good. But yes I think unless you use higher doses gains are slow and steady if you use higher doses thatforce yourself to use higher carbs then you will get bigger faster, you will fill out, but then you get adjusted to do that does and have to layoff, that is what happend with me, without AS
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: wannabehuge on November 03, 2005, 07:08:20 PM
Youandme how much were you taking?
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 04, 2005, 08:09:16 AM
started off with 2 iu, worked up 1 iu per day, did not take after leg workouts though that is my best bodypart. Dont think 2 iu wont knock you down being a first timer either. I got up to 10iu, very very full feeling. You can feel your body adapt to it also, so you go off,Bill phillips suggested 3 weeks on 3 weeks off so Ive been doing that. And it will past your through your breaking points, be careful, and have some sugar on hand, but wen you get started using it you will require less and that is when you will start getting cut while on it.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 04, 2005, 08:28:32 AM
started off with 2 iu, worked up 1 iu per day, did not take after leg workouts though that is my best bodypart. Dont think 2 iu wont knock you down being a first timer either. I got up to 10iu, very very full feeling. You can feel your body adapt to it also, so you go off,Bill phillips suggested 3 weeks on 3 weeks off so Ive been doing that. And it will past your through your breaking points, be careful, and have some sugar on hand, but wen you get started using it you will require less and that is when you will start getting cut while on it.

I took 10-15 iu,,  I will try again,,,  i think it was working...
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: freakfestMD on November 04, 2005, 11:50:57 AM
Sorry guys, but I just don't see the need to take insulin.  Just my opinion.  You are playing Russian roulette with this one.  Besides the obvious risk of inducing a hypoglycemic coma and possibly death, do we know anything about what happens to the system after we come off?  Is there a "PCT" plan for insulin, if you will? 
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 04, 2005, 03:43:10 PM
I took 10-15 iu,,  I will try again,,,  i think it was working...
You took that on your first time? Damn bro back off get back down to lower doese keep the BF down also, you need to build your way up and see what dose is right, so you get the most effects burning fat,building muscle and increase in veins
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Negative05 on November 05, 2005, 12:20:37 PM
Someone post a sample 3 or 4 week insulin plan
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: O on November 06, 2005, 08:47:27 PM
Why in the f**k would you have a PCT plan for insulin? That doesnt make any sense what so ever. What are you going to do restimulate your pancreas? You shouldnt be taking enough insulin to shut your pancreas down, thats not going to happen anyways.

Insulin is safe and effective to use, just dont be retarded and take a whole boat load of it when you havent eaten anything or before your workout.

Insulin is NOT safe, especially for an ill-researched user.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: O on November 06, 2005, 08:49:19 PM
You took that on your first time? Damn bro back off get back down to lower doese keep the BF down also, you need to build your way up and see what dose is right, so you get the most effects burning fat,building muscle and increase in veins

An increase in veins??

Come on folks, insulin has nothing to do with increased vascularity.  It may fill you out and give you a good pump, but it will not increase "veins."  Jesus.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: O on November 06, 2005, 09:00:33 PM
Someone post a sample 3 or 4 week insulin plan

Week one.  W/O, 2 ius Humalog, 40 grams protein, 50 grams simple carbs.  (Apple juice works great)

                    25 min later, one cup white rice, 10 ounces white fish or two chicken breasts.

                     one hour after meal: 8 egg whites and one serving oatmeal.

Week two.  W/O, 4 ius Humalog, 60 grams protein, 60 grams simple carbs. (Apple juice)

                    25 min later, 1 1/2 cup rice, 12 ounces fish or two breasts of chicken.

                     one hour after meal: 8 egg whites and one serving oatmeal.

Week three. W/O, 6 ius Humalog, 60 grams protein, 80 grams carbs(apple juice.)

                     25 min later, 2 cups rice, and fish or chicken.

                     one hour after meal: 8 egg whites and one serving oatmeal.

Note: do not ANY sources of fat within four hours of taking the slin, or it will get shuttled like a rocket along with the protein......having a real soda (not diet) is also recommended with the first meal after the shake.....

There is an exact calculation for the carbs/slin ratio however some of you still think slin will increase your "veins" so I will only confuse you upon request......
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 06, 2005, 09:03:09 PM
An increase in veins??

Come on folks, insulin has nothing to do with increased vascularity.  It may fill you out and give you a good pump, but it will not increase "veins."  Jesus.

Oh sorry vascularity, not like I said it created new veins, other than the ones bulging out your ass ::)
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: O on November 06, 2005, 11:41:27 PM
Oh sorry vascularity, not like I said it created new veins, other than the ones bulging out your ass ::)

The right words sometimes mean all the difference...

Either way, you are still wrong. 
Insulin will NOT increase vascularity.

Contribute with some sort of help or your posts will began to dissapear.  If you wish to challenge your knowledge against mine then proceed.  Obviously you think you know more than I do.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 07, 2005, 08:31:06 AM
Have you taken insulin before? I don't think so, it does increase vascularity, for me at least when on a strict diet.
And yes judging by your sample outline, thatis great for a newb to do but for someone with more muscle or at least wanting to use slin ina way that will help their body look better, that is way to many carbs for 2 ius, if he is more advnaced it would better suite him to take the slin wait 15 mins or till he feels it hit then get then get the high gi carbs in, then wait another 10 mins for protein. But damn if you can get all that food in after slin that is great, sometimes it will either make your appetitie go away or make it switch into high gear
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: freeagain on November 07, 2005, 09:54:34 AM

why you guys even think about f'uckin with somethin like slin is beyond me.

its not like roids where any health problems take years to manifest...... this shit can kill your ass dead with one pin.  ::)

best leave it to the pros who have a callous disregard for their own safety.

Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: O on November 07, 2005, 10:02:17 AM
Have you taken insulin before? I don't think so, it does increase vascularity, for me at least when on a strict diet.
And yes judging by your sample outline, thatis great for a newb to do but for someone with more muscle or at least wanting to use slin ina way that will help their body look better, that is way to many carbs for 2 ius, if he is more advnaced it would better suite him to take the slin wait 15 mins or till he feels it hit then get then get the high gi carbs in, then wait another 10 mins for protein. But damn if you can get all that food in after slin that is great, sometimes it will either make your appetitie go away or make it switch into high gear

I have taken slin on several occasions and that is why I recommended a first time user to take his carbs and meals immediately after pinning.  If you have ever taken slin then you know it can hit you like a freight train and you can go hypo really quick.  First time users dont know their body that well, so they won't feel the initial onset, and it will be too late by the time they figure it out.....

A friend of mine died in the locker room at the gym after 10 ius, because he failed to get his complex carbs in before the hypo set in.  I respect the insulin vial more than any other.

You and me, you're killing me bro.  Ok, Slin may cause your body to absorb carbs and fill you out, giving your veins a healthy appearance......but only gear can actually increase vascularity.  It was probably your strict diet which dropped body fat and water allowing your veins to become more prominent.

Increased vasularity is the result of androgenic compounds which increase red blood cell count.  The increase in blood volume causes vascular hypertrophy which makes veins look "bigger."  The average gear user often has three times the amount of blood a normal person has......This causes the increased vascularity.......Period .
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 07, 2005, 11:34:26 AM
Oh well that was what I was hitting at, bro, I use insulin only when I'm cutting(sorry been typing and reading fast) I use it while using clen which yes is dangerous.
Damn he took 10 iu and died. Was he dieting or something? I know when I'm restricting my carbs it hits me very hard, but when I have had more carbs during the day the onset is slow, I've heard people hitting the floor after 2 units before though, shows just how different people react to things.
Damn that story reminds me of when a bro was getting ready for a contest did slin pre workout and went hypo, you could just see him slowly dropping and he even tried to refuse us to give him simple carbs( he to was only going to go for complex) finally got some oj in him, he could not even tell us his phone number
The price of muscle ::)
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 07, 2005, 06:26:17 PM
Oh well that was what I was hitting at, bro, I use insulin only when I'm cutting(sorry been typing and reading fast) I use it while using clen which yes is dangerous.
Damn he took 10 iu and died. Was he dieting or something? I know when I'm restricting my carbs it hits me very hard, but when I have had more carbs during the day the onset is slow, I've heard people hitting the floor after 2 units before though, shows just how different people react to things.
Damn that story reminds me of when a bro was getting ready for a contest did slin pre workout and went hypo, you could just see him slowly dropping and he even tried to refuse us to give him simple carbs( he to was only going to go for complex) finally got some oj in him, he could not even tell us his phone number
The price of muscle ::)

dead from 10iu, shit I've taken 20iu several times...   Did the guy weigh 100lbs or something...
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 07, 2005, 06:37:10 PM
20 ius several times as in a day?
Yeah I once took in 20iu once to before a contest but that was just on one occasion.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 07, 2005, 06:51:33 PM
20 ius several times as in a day?
Yeah I once took in 20iu once to before a contest but that was just on one occasion.

no, probably more like 15 in the morn, 20 around lunch and 10 in the afternoon...
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 07, 2005, 07:41:27 PM
What is your diet like bro?
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 08, 2005, 05:01:16 AM
What is your diet like bro?

Well, I pretty much would eat as many carbs as possible,,,   1,000 cal Protein shake (CytoGainer or NLarge) followed up with a bowl of ice-cream...  mmmmmm  offseason...
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: swoll on November 12, 2005, 11:07:42 AM
you guys should only be useing humalog post workout
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: wannabehuge on November 12, 2005, 03:06:22 PM
I use Humulin-R because I can't get with out prescription.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Greekzilla on November 14, 2005, 11:11:44 AM
Should someone whose using insulin by itself also take the eca stack to offset possible fat gain?
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: wannabehuge on November 15, 2005, 07:21:21 AM
If you use it buy itself you have to be very careful or you will get fat.(meaning eat clean) I like taking it with test suspension and or GH.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: mem on November 15, 2005, 03:36:45 PM
Insulin ALONE makes NO SENSE! WTF?

why you guys even think about f'uckin with somethin like slin is beyond me.

its not like roids where any health problems take years to manifest...... this shit can kill your ass dead with one pin. ::)

best leave it to the pros who have a callous disregard for their own safety.

DITTO!!!!

I want to try it - am very scared - too much to loose (to f**k around)

I would O N L Y  do it with HgH - period. Of course AAS.
I wonder why all of the seeming despiration related to Insulin
Lack of access of just because its cheap

I would rather see others do the right thing . . .
NOT something right away . . .

Big picture planning - longevity
and healthy productive lives . . .
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: DIVISION on November 16, 2005, 11:25:44 PM
How big of a difference do you guys think insulin alone makes in bodybuilding if not used with GH, only AAS?

With AAS is will have some effect.

To what degree, I have no idea.

Pros will not say.

Combined with Gh and AAS it has a synergistic effect enhancing the effects of all three....






DIV
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 17, 2005, 05:30:42 AM
My question was how well does it work when just used with AAS, and not GH.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: freeagain on November 20, 2005, 12:01:59 PM
Look at it like this, without insulin AAS and GH wouldnt work, you wouldnt be able to grow at all..ofcourse you would die without it, but strictly speaking about muscle gains, it is tied for being the most important aspect of it all.

Its very effective alone, its just more effective when combined with GH and AAS.

but your body produces insuline , you numbnut.

if you ingest 100 grams of simple carbs for instance... your pancrease pumps out enough insulin to deal with that blood sugar .

whats the point of takin a hormone that your body naturally produces in qauntitys that is needed for each carb payload?

just eat the carbs and let nature take its course !!  ::)

Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 20, 2005, 12:11:39 PM
but your body produces insuline , you numbnut.

if you ingest 100 grams of simple carbs for instance... your pancrease pumps out enough insulin to deal with that blood sugar .

whats the point of takin a hormone that your body naturally produces in qauntitys that is needed for each carb payload?

just eat the carbs and let nature take its course !!  ::)



This has been "the" question for a while. 

But if it doesn't work any better than the natural slin your body makes then why is it believed that this is one of the main reasons for the Pro's increase in size in the 90's.  From what I understand it may be a matter of speed, If you eat carbs post workout your blood sugar goes up then insulin is released from the pancreas, if you inject it, you immediately have the slin in your system and the carbs when you need it most.

FitDV: What are some of the differences in drug use between pro and amateur levels?

Pro: The main difference is the amount of growth hormone used. For example, as an amateur I used 4 to 6 iu of GH nightly. As an IFBB Pro, I use up to, and sometimes more than 12 iu's nightly. It seems like the more GH you use, the fuller your muscles stay. I'm not sure if 6 iu does the same thing as 12 iu, but as a pro you just do not want to take the chance. Steroid drug use is about the same. Twelve weeks on steroids and four weeks off. Another thing that the pros are doing is insulin after they are done training. The concept is to break the muscle down and then force glycogen into the muscle immediately after training with the use of insulin. Insulin is the most anabolic hormone known to man and it is one of the most dangerous. I've known many bodybuilders that have taken insulin after training and then not eaten enough carbohydrates to cover the insulin. This causes severe nausea and your blood sugar will drop rapidly. The result is a very sick person, until he gets some simple sugars into his system.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: DIVISION on November 20, 2005, 01:17:23 PM
but your body produces insuline , you numbnut.

if you ingest 100 grams of simple carbs for instance... your pancrease pumps out enough insulin to deal with that blood sugar .

whats the point of takin a hormone that your body naturally produces in qauntitys that is needed for each carb payload?

just eat the carbs and let nature take its course !!  ::)

^Concur with Free.

This is the same thing as saying your body naturally produces testosterone in quantities that is needed.. so why inject test? Hell why even take steroids?

Insulin is a highly anabolic hormone.. it dramatically increases protein synthesis and fuel storage.

NO.  It's not the same.

More is not better when it comes to Insulin, do not compare the mechanism of action between it and AAS and try to draw some inference.

People like you are the ones who start these "myths" resulting in people doing all kinds of crazy shit.

Insulin is one drug you do not fu.ck with.  Make a mistake and you may be dependent on it for the rest of your life.

Mu-Mu, it sounds to me like you don't know what the fu.ck you are talking about in terms of the overall scope of what insulin does and what possible consequences manipulating it could have on the body.




DIV
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: freeagain on November 20, 2005, 02:55:27 PM
This is the same thing as saying your body naturally produces testosterone in quantities that is needed.. so why inject test? Hell why even take steroids?

Insulin is a highly anabolic hormone.. it dramatically increases protein synthesis and fuel storage.

no muiverse ... the body only produces small quantitys of test and cannot go beyond it.

the pancrease pumps out as much insulin as needed to deal with the carb intake.

big carb intake= big insulin output.

i cant see the reason for usin it at all....... if you ingest simple carbs ... sugar hits the blood stream within 3 minutes .... and the pancrease starts to output the good stuff like a lawn sprinkler to deal with it immediately.
and will continue to do so untill the sugar has been deposited as glycogen and the blood levels return to safe normal levels.

so someone tell me again... why the need to take synthetic insulin??  ::)

dangerous and unnecesary!  ;)

Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: DIVISION on November 20, 2005, 05:03:38 PM
My girlfriend is a type 1 diabetic and is writing a book that talks a lot about diabetes... yeah i dont know nothin  ::).. geez.. all those discussions with her, ( she was a nurse too, and has many nutrition certs)...was all just bullshit

Mu-Mu, it's not worth the risk to inject insulin and risk hypoglycemia.......all for what?   ???

For the sake of muscle?

Your intentions are misplaced.

no muiverse ... the body only produces small quantitys of test and cannot go beyond it.

the pancrease pumps out as much insulin as needed to deal with the carb intake.

big carb intake= big insulin output.

i cant see the reason for usin it at all....... if you ingest simple carbs ... sugar hits the blood stream within 3 minutes .... and the pancrease starts to output the good stuff like a lawn sprinkler to deal with it immediately.
and will continue to do so untill the sugar has been deposited as glycogen and the blood levels return to safe normal levels.

so someone tell me again... why the need to take synthetic insulin??  ::)

dangerous and unnecesary!  ;)

^Concur w/ Free.....




DIV
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: mem on November 20, 2005, 06:25:55 PM
I am almost reluctant to jump in on this thread . . .
may be off (grumpy) track . . . direction of thread.

I have considered Insulin use combined with HgH and
thought that it would benefit HgH users by supplying Insulin
as a *substrate* to drive and further enhance IGF production.

That ultimately, the **pancreas can't produce enough Insulin
to both manage calories and for the liver to make sufficient IGF,
indirectly undermining HgH benefits. (**thus the rise in blood sugar
levels over time with HgH usage).

I confirmed this notion with an MD. They felt it to be plausible . . .
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: DIVISION on November 20, 2005, 09:58:30 PM
I confirmed this notion with an MD. They felt it to be plausible . . .

I'm sure it's plausible, though what Doc would stand behind that prescribed use of Insulin?

Very few......



DIV
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 21, 2005, 04:03:12 AM
My girlfriend is a type 1 diabetic and is writing a book that talks a lot about diabetes... yeah i dont know nothin  ::).. geez.. all those discussions with her, ( she was a nurse too, and has many nutrition certs)...was all just bullshit

Its you type of people that blow everything out of proportion and exaggerate everything..

the only reason people f**k up with insulin is if they take too much/too long and they dont check their blood sugar levels with a glucometer.. there is nothing else to it dont make it more complicated than it is.

what are you trying to tell me that injecting more insulin into your body (ofcourse with the correct diet and proper precautions) isnt going to benefit your bodybuilding? ::) You go tell that to the professional bodybuilders and national level athletes...

INSULIN IS SO SCARRYY!!! OMGOSH AHHH!!!! LETS HAVE A PANIC ATTACK!

Its scary ONLY FOR MORONS that dont know what they are doing, JUST USE IT RIGHT, FOLLOW T HE PRECAUTIONS ITS NOT HARD! LIKE MAYBE, WHEN YOU USE INSULIN, ACTUALLY BUT A GLUCOMETER AND MONITOR YOUR BLOOD SUGAR LEVELS? OR HOW ABOUT TAKING THE PROPER AMOUNT OF GRAMS OF CARB PER I.U.? OR HOW ABOUT, NOT TAKING IT BEFORE YOUR WORKOUT SO YOU DONT DIE?

 There is SO much information out there on how to use insulin the right way.. its really shocking how stupid people can be about the whole thing.. especially in buying specific Types of insulin..

Heres a tip, try not to use a long acting insulin when you have a normal functioning pancreas  ::)...idiots...

I used it for a couple months no problem,,,  You just have to know how many carbs to get in,,  if you start feeling weird or light headed eat more carbs,, It really isn't a big deal if you know what your doing. I put on size, I just couldn't tell what was doing what because of the other stuff I was taking.
 It seems like I was stronger when I took it.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 21, 2005, 07:44:08 AM
exactly... although the pancreas does put out insulin for a certain amount of carbs, it can NOT put out enough for everything that you eat. If this were true you would never have high blood sugar levels...


I believe this is false, and believe that the pancreas often actually secretes too much insulin, not too little as you implied.
Your blood sugar gets high because you ingest too much sugar, of course the insulin has to be released after the ingestion and this takes time. So, for a bit of time, yes, your blood sugar is high. But, Low blood sugar is caused when the body cannot process these carbohydrates fast enough, too much sugar and carbohydrate consumption causes the pancreas to overcompensate and produce too much insulin, which lowers blood sugar levels too quickly. This is why people often become Hypoglycemic after eating large amounts of refined sugar.

This is why you may experience these symptoms 45 minutes or so after eating large amounts of very sweet foods, i.e. Gallon of Kool-Aid.

Hypoglycemic Symptoms:
    * hunger
    * nervousness and shakiness
    * perspiration
    * dizziness or light-headedness
    * sleepiness
    * confusion
    * difficulty speaking
    * feeling anxious or weak

Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: freeagain on November 21, 2005, 07:47:55 AM

no muiverse.. the main reason for obesity is insulin resistance .... a loss of sensitivity to effects of insulin cuz the pancrease pumps out so much of it when a person over-eats 24/7!

if you start shootin large amounts of synthetic insulin you are askin to devlop insulin rsistance... then you really are f'ucked!

Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: youandme on November 21, 2005, 09:26:30 AM
OR HOW ABOUT, NOT TAKING IT BEFORE YOUR WORKOUT SO YOU DONT DIE?

 
Whoa now your talking crazy, the pumps and positive benefits of abusing it before a workout are crazy, if your cutting up, and you take it and burn off the glycogen in your muscles as you workout and just monitoryourself, your already in fat burning mode., But yeah i dont suggest it either, it is stupid and I did say abuse
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 21, 2005, 01:51:05 PM
The pancreas puts out enough insulin for normal sized portions, whatever that may be its individually based, but if you are eating way too much there is no way your body can put out that much insulin to push all the nutrients into the cells.

I disagree, it is well proven that the pancreas as a rule will actually create more than enough insulin, especially when consuming large amounts of simple carbohydrates.. If it was incapable of doing so your blood sugar would get too high and you would go mad. Ever watch cops when they start chasing someone down who didn't get their insulin.

http://www.whittier.org/pages/what_type2.html
http://www4.tpg.com.au/users/sallen/Bloodsugar.html
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/core5.htm
http://www.drlam.com/opinion/insulin_and_aging.cfm
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: JamesD on November 21, 2005, 04:04:59 PM


The concept is to break the muscle down and then force glycogen into the muscle his system.

Force "glycogen" into the muscle? Glycogen is made in the muscle NOT forced into it..

He has lost all my respect..
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on November 21, 2005, 04:37:40 PM
Force "glycogen" into the muscle? Glycogen is made in the muscle NOT forced into it..

He has lost all my respect..

Do you know who wrote it, it just said a Pro in the interview and I was wondering the same...
But yes, glucose is what he should have said.


FitDV: What are some of the differences in drug use between pro and amateur levels?

Pro: The main difference is the amount of growth hormone used. For example, as an amateur I used 4 to 6 iu of GH nightly. As an IFBB Pro, I use up to, and sometimes more than 12 iu's nightly. It seems like the more GH you use, the fuller your muscles stay. I'm not sure if 6 iu does the same thing as 12 iu, but as a pro you just do not want to take the chance. Steroid drug use is about the same. Twelve weeks on steroids and four weeks off. Another thing that the pros are doing is insulin after they are done training. The concept is to break the muscle down and then force glycogen into the muscle immediately after training with the use of insulin. Insulin is the most anabolic hormone known to man and it is one of the most dangerous. I've known many bodybuilders that have taken insulin after training and then not eaten enough carbohydrates to cover the insulin. This causes severe nausea and your blood sugar will drop rapidly. The result is a very sick person, until he gets some simple sugars into his system.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: JamesD on November 21, 2005, 04:50:28 PM
Do you know who wrote it, it just said a Pro in the interview and I was wondering the same...
But yes, glucose is what he should have said.


FitDV: What are some of the differences in drug use between pro and amateur levels?

Pro: The main difference is the amount of growth hormone used. For example, as an amateur I used 4 to 6 iu of GH nightly. As an IFBB Pro, I use up to, and sometimes more than 12 iu's nightly. It seems like the more GH you use, the fuller your muscles stay. I'm not sure if 6 iu does the same thing as 12 iu, but as a pro you just do not want to take the chance. Steroid drug use is about the same. Twelve weeks on steroids and four weeks off. Another thing that the pros are doing is insulin after they are done training. The concept is to break the muscle down and then force glycogen into the muscle immediately after training with the use of insulin. Insulin is the most anabolic hormone known to man and it is one of the most dangerous. I've known many bodybuilders that have taken insulin after training and then not eaten enough carbohydrates to cover the insulin. This causes severe nausea and your blood sugar will drop rapidly. The result is a very sick person, until he gets some simple sugars into his system.



I know you didnt write it, i wasnt refering to you, i was refering to the pro..It just goes to show how uneducated some people are.. I see this all the time on the net..People write articles and posts and act as if they have any sort of chemical knowledge..
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: DIVISION on November 21, 2005, 05:37:39 PM
I believe this is false, and believe that the pancreas often actually secretes too much insulin, not too little as you implied.

But his sister has Diabetes, so he knows EVERYTHING about it..... ::)




DIV
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: S.W.A.T. on December 26, 2005, 11:17:46 PM
Week one.  W/O, 2 ius Humalog, 40 grams protein, 50 grams simple carbs.  (Apple juice works great)

                    25 min later, one cup white rice, 10 ounces white fish or two chicken breasts.

                     one hour after meal: 8 egg whites and one serving oatmeal.

Week two.  W/O, 4 ius Humalog, 60 grams protein, 60 grams simple carbs. (Apple juice)

                    25 min later, 1 1/2 cup rice, 12 ounces fish or two breasts of chicken.

                     one hour after meal: 8 egg whites and one serving oatmeal.

Week three. W/O, 6 ius Humalog, 60 grams protein, 80 grams carbs(apple juice.)

                     25 min later, 2 cups rice, and fish or chicken.

                     one hour after meal: 8 egg whites and one serving oatmeal.

Note: do not ANY sources of fat within four hours of taking the slin, or it will get shuttled like a rocket along with the protein......having a real soda (not diet) is also recommended with the first meal after the shake.....

There is an exact calculation for the carbs/slin ratio however some of you still think slin will increase your "veins" so I will only confuse you upon request......

So do you do this after every work out like 3 to 4 times a week. Or Just once a week. Can you take in too many carbs and calories after a insulin injection. Or would that just make you fat? I'm a really hard gainer who gets random drug testing so this seems to be the best route.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Beyond Genetics on December 27, 2005, 08:17:53 AM
So do you do this after every work out like 3 to 4 times a week. Or Just once a week. Can you take in too many carbs and calories after a insulin injection. Or would that just make you fat? I'm a really hard gainer who gets random drug testing so this seems to be the best route.

It's usually, if taken at all, done after every workout,,,  some do it at other times in addition,,

Taking in too many carbs is not dangerous, if you take in too few your body will let you know,,,  you will start feeling shaky and hot,,,  eat some carbs and it goes away.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Lostboy on May 31, 2006, 11:09:40 PM
Hello everyone,

I've been a BB fan for about 2 years now.  I'm 37 and I've been diabetic since I was 2.  Only last week I found out how BB use insulin to improve gains.  It's funny, but BB has caused me to understand insulin better than being diabetic for 35 years.  I think I was litterally in shock that anyone would risk their life like that simply to make muscle faster.  Now that I understand the importance of insulin after a workout though, I have a question.  Why would a BB take external insulin when the body will produce it on it's own if you're not diabetic, when you eat your post workout meal?  Is it because the body won't produce it fast enough for gains?

At least now I understand why I train so hard without much gain.  I train as hard as real BB's do, but I barely grow at all.  It takes me 6 months to accomplish what a normal person does in 1 month.  I've always assumed it was a side effect of my diabetes, but now I know that it's a side effect I can correct with a properly timed dose of insulin and a meal. 

Advice for anyone else out there:

Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Captain Equipoise on June 01, 2006, 12:13:21 AM
Wow, after reading all this I'm not even sure I want to chime in, but I was going to spill the secret of using insulin properly to gain like crazy... at least from what I've experienced personally, some people have gotten it (seems most of the pro's have) but for those want to know... it's dangerous and it's already been bashed in this thread, but hey.. it works (just make sure you have plenty of glucose tabs on you in case!)  It's not about taking the insulin RIGHT AFTER training like most of you seem to believe, the real trick is taking it (if possible) either in the middle of your workout or in the beginning , the timing here is crucial. Humalog has an onset of 5-15 minutes, but does not peak for an hour or so and the residual effects are ~1:30-2h. I've been using this method lately and I've made gains faster then ever before, of course you have to remember to ram a ton of carbs as soon as you finish your workout :)


Like I've said before, I know it's dangerous, and definetly not for a first timer, but goddamn it works.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: ignorance on June 02, 2006, 12:43:17 PM
I have taken slin on several occasions and that is why I recommended a first time user to take his carbs and meals immediately after pinning.  If you have ever taken slin then you know it can hit you like a freight train and you can go hypo really quick.  First time users dont know their body that well, so they won't feel the initial onset, and it will be too late by the time they figure it out.....

A friend of mine died in the locker room at the gym after 10 ius, because he failed to get his complex carbs in before the hypo set in.  I respect the insulin vial more than any other.


First you don't need more then 10 iu per shot at anytime
Second 'O' is right and wrong, you need to eat before and after you pin, but complex carbs isn't it.
For every 1 iu you need 10 simple carbs to  attack it. 10 iu you need 100 simple carbs [ sugar ] it is as simple as that with the math.
And yes building up to 10 iu is good, but taking complex carbs after pinning is got to be one stupid idea. The effects of insulin last for 2 hours. So you better be downing simple carbs for two hours. Having a meal an hour after is good, but that sugar better be sitting on the tip of your tongue.

Now 'O' I can see where your getting your complex carbs idea from, but if taking complex and simple at the same time, it is not going to work. You can't predict how your body will take the complex carbs. Just too risky. IMO.

And for taking slin.  sure. Just Do 2 hours a day of research on the topic/subject and then after an exam and do a cycle of steriod for the pinning   ... youre good.. sure.  ::)
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: ignorance on June 02, 2006, 12:51:15 PM


Insulin doesnt have to be prescribed either, its totally legal to walk into the pharmacy and buy it.

In canada it is legit but I'm not to sure about the states.

Better Question, Which type of Inuslin do you take?

Humulin N
Humulin R
Humulin U
Humalog

Like come on... Plus it is dirty cheap in Canada.
Title: Re: Insulin on its own
Post by: Mark1 on June 10, 2006, 09:17:42 PM
A mate of mine just dropped some insulin off. I was going to give it a shot (no pun intended) but after reading this I'm going to bury that shit.